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Need links proving Venezuela "exit polls" showing Chavez losing were bogus

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Commie Pinko Dirtbag Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-16-04 02:10 PM
Original message
Need links proving Venezuela "exit polls" showing Chavez losing were bogus
Besides the vheadline link. Need to clobber someone (in another forum) with facts. Whining fraud, saying results were reversed, you know the drill.
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madrchsod Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-16-04 02:12 PM
Response to Original message
1. alot of them posted yesterday
Edited on Mon Aug-16-04 02:13 PM by rchsod
in lbn`s and gd. how is the south american press reporting this story?
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ChavezSpeakstheTruth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-16-04 02:16 PM
Response to Original message
2. searching myself
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Commie Pinko Dirtbag Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-16-04 02:23 PM
Response to Reply #2
6. What I want is something about those bogus e-mail messages,
sent from the US and BEFORE voting started. If I show the vheadline link they'll just say "that's the commies' site, commie!" I want to know if some "big" news organization picked up THAT particular aspect of the story.
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ChavezSpeakstheTruth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-16-04 02:42 PM
Response to Reply #6
8. OK = will search
what thread are you debating in?
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Commie Pinko Dirtbag Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-16-04 03:17 PM
Response to Reply #8
11. Not DU. Some totally unrelated site. (nt)
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KurtNYC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-16-04 02:17 PM
Response to Original message
3. Sounds like they need to "Get over it"
They should quit being such a 'sore loser man' (apologies)
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movonne Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-16-04 02:19 PM
Response to Original message
4. Here: http://www.vheadline.net/readnews.asp?id=22438
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ChavezSpeakstheTruth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-16-04 02:20 PM
Response to Original message
5. more
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Union Thug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-16-04 02:32 PM
Response to Original message
7. I'd ask them for proof that exit polling showed chavez losing.
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papau Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-16-04 02:48 PM
Response to Reply #7
9. Seems exit poll was not scientific-just a PR job to justify more CIA games
According to Súmate, there are forty-five thousand of these volunteers all over the country-at least one at every single voting station, and at those voting stations deemed more important, there are as many as twenty.

Altamira, apparently, is one such location. Twenty conscripts stand around outside the voting center, clipboard in hand waiting for unsuspecting citizens to emerge, fresh from having voted. "Good afternoon," they purr, "would you mind telling us if you voted 'Yes' or 'No'?" and "Yes, yes, yes," is the most common response.

"How many 'No' votes have you received?" I asked, playing the naïve reporter.

"Let's see," she offered, tapping her tennis shoes, "there are no 'Nos' on this page, and one on this page. I have one 'No'."

"Just one?" I persisted.

"Well, I don't know about the others, but I have just one," she answered, then, spotting some emerging voters in the distance, she scampered of to collect more "Yeses."

According to co-director Maria Corina Machado, Súmate is an objective non-partisan civil association. When asked why Súmate has worked exclusively with the Venezuelan opposition since its inception in 2002, Machado said that their overtures to the government were regularly rebuffed. Machado neglected to mention that one of the reasons the government may have been hesitant to work with her group is because she was a participant in the 2002 coup that briefly overthrew Chávez-she signed the infamous decree of dictator-for-a-day Pedro Carmona. She is currently being investigated for treason, for having received funds from a foreign government (the U.S.) earmarked for ousting the Chavez government.

Due to Súmate's infamy as an arm of Venezuela's opposition umbrella group the Democratic Coordinador, Machado noted that volunteers stationed in Chavista neighborhoods would not reveal their identities. Since campaigning ended on Thursday, and political groups are not permitted to solicit votes at voting centers on Sunday, Súmate has instructed its volunteers to pose as 'good samaritans'.

The role of the volunteers, according Machado, is to help citizens to resolve any problems they may encounter during the voting process. For example, "if someone comes to a voting center to vote and their name's not on the list…that will happen."

According to one of Súmate's Altamira volunteers, "we are here to provide food for the people in line, to provide them with water, to help them in any way we can to facilitate the voting process. And to do exit polls, to see if they voted 'Yes' or 'No'."

"And you have volunteers providing food in all the lines all over the country?"

"Yes, absolutely. Everywhere," responded another white-clad Súmate pollster.

"But I was just in Petare, a very Chavista neighbourhood, and I didn't notice anyone from Súmate handing out food or water," I said coyly.

"That's because the people in those neighbourhoods don't like the Coordinadora, not because the Coordinadora doesn't want to help them," she exclaimed, visibly perturbed.

"So if you can't get into Chavista neighborhoods, you can't do exit polls there, right?" I asked.

"No…" she hesitated, "I'm sure they are doing exit polls everywhere." End of interview.

In light of Democratic Coordinator leader Enrique Mendoza's pronouncement last week that he would be releasing his exit poll results this afternoon, Súmate's less than representative polling may be cause for concern.

At this point, the opposition seems to be more or less aware of the likelihood that they will lose today's vote. And with the optimistic attitudes of both the Carter Center and the Organization of American States regarding the transparency of the voting process, it would appear that a Chávez victory will have to be grudgingly accepted by at least those sectors of the opposition nominally committed to the democratic process.

In that case, perhaps the best that they can hope for is to cast some doubt on the process; to exaggerate some irregularities, to create others. That way, they can refer in passing to problems with the referendum results for the rest of Chávez' tenure as President, never going into any detail, but perpetuating the international stereotype that Chávez has authoritarian tendencies. And releasing exit polls that directly contradict the official results may be the best way of accomplishing this.

http://www.venezuelanalysis.com/articles.php?artno=1248


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ChavezSpeakstheTruth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-16-04 02:57 PM
Response to Original message
10. getting closer - not as specific as you might want but its from a source
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Swamp Rat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-16-04 03:23 PM
Response to Original message
12. Has Lula said anything publicly yet?
What is Globo TV saying about Chavez?

Brigado com antecedência.
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Commie Pinko Dirtbag Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-16-04 03:35 PM
Response to Reply #12
13. Only saw the Globo site.
Very unemotionally stating the facts, Chavez wins, record turnout, observers endorse result, etc.

One headline there says: OAS and Carter shut up opposition, saying no sign of fraud

And this:
SANTO DOMINGO - Brazilian foreign minister Celso Amorim said this Monday in the Dominican Republic, that Brazil is "very satisfied" with how the recall referendum in Venezuela took place. President Lula, according to aides, should phone Chávez later today. (...) (Amorim goes on) "Brazil hopes the result will be accepted by the opposition and by the United States."
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