"Girls shouldn't play football"

[xmas74]

One mother informed me of this tonight, not realizing that one of the four girls out there was my daughter.

Interesting how a mother, a young mother at that, would be so steadfastly opposed to a six year old girl playing flag football w/ other children her age. She stated that there would be too much "inappropriate touching" from the boys and girls. What kind of person sexualizes six year olds?

Best part of the whole conversation: this was the first night of practice. A little girl on the field threw a beautiful pass-the only decent pass out there. The mother's comment? "I feel sorry for her parents. That's the kind of girl you know is gonna grow up and be a lesbian."

What did I do when she said that? I called my daughter over from practice and told her to introduce herself to that mother. I thought she'd like to meet the girl who passes better then her son-my baby girl.

[liontamer]

1. women wouldn't be oppressed

if some women didn't internalize it and oppress others in turn. You can be grateful that your daughter will never grow up to be that kind of person. :hug:

[xmas74]

4. That's my plan.

She'll become the woman she wants to be and not the woman that society dictates her to be. She's always been told that she can do whatever the boys do, except for peeing standing up. That's a hard skill to master for a woman.

[liontamer]

14. not really

they have little devices to help when you need to use a urinal or a bush

http://www.s-k-i-n-t.co.uk/content/p-mate.asp


now you can tell here that she can do whatever the she wants :)

[xmas74]

18. But the idea of a device sucks.

That's a skill she'll learn when she's older and sneaking out to keggers in the middle of a cornfield, unfortunately.

That's how I learned it. It was that or swat and pee on my shoes.

[LostinVA]

64. Being a trail runner, often miles from anywhere, let alone a toilet

I have mastered the art of peeing standing up, fully clothed, no "she funnel" needed. It is totally doable.

[xmas74]

65. It is.

Just takes some practice.

I've told her that she cannot learn it right now for one good reason: I learned how while attending keggers in cornfields. I have to pretend to be a "Just Say No" kind of mom for now and hope that she doesn't learn it the same way.

Nothing like getting your own urine on the Eastlands that you saved your babysitting money to buy to make you learn how to pee standing up.

[LostinVA]

76. Hehehehehe

It is almost impossible to pee in a field while wearing jeans and not get pee all over you... guys have no idea.

[xmas74]

78. Especially when you're falling over drunk.

Makes it that much harder and a skill that women can cherish all the more.

[LostinVA]

82. Hehehehe -- ahhhh.... memories!

[xmas74]

87. Small town girls learn this skill in their youth.

It's hard to hold a six pack in your bladder when you see all the guys around you relieving themselves. You decide that it's just not fair and find the tallest cornstalks in the area.

With some practice it can be done. I'd just prefer my daughter not have to learn that skill the way I did.

[Oeditpus Rex]

2. 'Inappropriate touching'?

Has she seen where a quarterback puts his hands to receive the snap?

:rofl:

[MiniMandaRuth]

5. And the butt touching after good plays in baseball?

ZOMG *GASP*

[xmas74]

6. You know,

I had a similar thought when she said that.

Were we reading each other's minds at about 7:30 Central tonight?

[MoseyWalker]

3. a couple of years ago

there was a story about a young woman in college going to Colorado State? who had to transfer to (I think) New Mexico. She was a kicker. She made accusations against the Colorado football team, and the stupid bastard coach at the time backed up his rapist players.

sorry I don't have more info about this, but it just came back into my mind because of your post.

She was a very good kicker, or obviously wouldn't have been on a major college team.

Anyone who thinks sports interest equates with lesbianism is nuts.

That's like saying if a boy likes writing poetry, he's gay.

Stupid shits.

Thanks for the story

[xmas74]

10. I think I vaguely remember the story

but couldn't remember the schools. And it's "boys playing girls sports" that equated the lesbianism around here. In my area, if a boy wrote poetry then yes, they would wonder if he happened to be gay.

Small towns in the Midwest aren't always open to different ideas. At least the league organizer smiled when they called her name for team assignment and said something about being happy to see women get involved in sports.

[TheFriendlyAnarchist]

29. If that is the case, I guess I'm gay then. . .

I never knew that about myself :shrug: :P *See the avatar*

[Abies]

90. Katie Hnida

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2004/writers/rick_reilly/02/16/hnida/

[LeftyMom]

7. Oh good god.

My sister played football for years. She's quite good at it and as an adult won a slot on the Sacramento Sirens women's pro team (she decided she didn't have time, they went on to several championships.)

She is most assuredly not a lesbian. For that matter, she's almost too feminine and actually on of the most pampered, girly women you'll ever meet.

PS She played Little League for years, too.

PPS She inadvertantly sent a few opposing players to the ER over the years. The one guy who touched her inappropriately went there on purpose.

[xmas74]

13. I know examples like this and you know them

but small town women sometimes...

I wouldn't care if my daughter were a lesbian but who thinks about that with a six year old? When it comes to clothes, my daughter is a girly-girl. She loves dresses and bows. She also likes to play sports of all kinds.

Hope her son never does swim team when he's older. She'll really be crying when my daughter kicks his ass in the pool. She's good at most sports but is fantastic at swimming.

[MiniMandaRuth]

8. Someone's hiding something...

:eyes: I say that if you have such a problem, you're obviously hiding something.



(The woman, that is, not you. :hi:)

[xmas74]

15. I personally think she was jealous

because her son has benchwarmer written all over his face while my kid shows promise and lots of playing time in her future.

You know that a woman shouldn't be better than a man at sports!:sarcasm:

[MiniMandaRuth]

17. Just like girls should play flute and clarinet...

Leave saxophone to the big boys. :sarcasm:

[xmas74]

20. My high school had more female sax players then

male.

At least I made a big stink about wanting to learn the tuba. Now it's not as uncommon.

[MiniMandaRuth]

23. We had a girl tube played in marching band.

All the while, the two boys were complaining how heavy it was. She carried two from bus to bus. She was great.

There's only two guy sax players in my school... however, I'm the only girl.

[xmas74]

27. Sounds like a really small school.

Our sax section had twentysomething members, the clear majority being girls.

[MiniMandaRuth]

32. We had about fourteen people in band.

And we were 7/8 combined this year. ALl the 7 graders sucked. They could play their music... but not our level of music.

[xmas74]

40. That's right-

I forgot you were in jr high.


Our junior high had fifty in each grade.

[Broken_Hero]

57. Hey, I played clarinet!...:) nt

[reyd reid reed]

9. Some people just need to be slapped...

And she sounds like one.

My oldest son's girlfriend's sister plays JV football for her high school. I think it's Great!!!

[xmas74]

21. I think it's fantastic too.

And you're right: some people need to be slapped. Another mom was upset about there being girls on her son's team.

Too fucking bad!

[nytemare]

11. Check out "Divas of the Gridiron" about Women's tackle football.

I played a year up in Daytona, and it was great. Some of these women can really play. The pace is slower, but you still have great hits, passes, catches, etc.

This video from the post is great.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/custom/2005/07/06/CU2005070601691.html?nav=lb

[xmas74]

22. Thanks for the link!

I'll check it out later.

[HarukaTheTrophyWife]

12. I guess girls shouldn't be in the martial arts.

I've been in the martial arts since I was 10. I'm pretty sure there's a whole lot more 'inappropriate touching' there than in football. Of course, I never considered any of it inappropriate. You should be thinking about how to protect yourself/harm your opponent, not whether your hand is in a "good touch" or a "bad touch" zone.

Then again...I did grow up to be a lesbian. All the other women in my dojo are straight though.

[liontamer]

16. that's how it was like on the wrestling team

people couldn't understand how very not sexy wrestling really is

[MiniMandaRuth]

19. Yeah. Ringworm. Ewwww....

[HarukaTheTrophyWife]

25. Wrestlers smell bad.

One year the wrestling team was on the other side of the gym divide as the fencers.

[liontamer]

28. just the boys

but the football team smelled far worse, their locker rooms stunk up a whole wing of our school :scared:

[HarukaTheTrophyWife]

31. Yes, but the one female wrestler was not enough to balance out the boys.

I swear the team wasn't washing their singlets for the season or something.

[liontamer]

35. it's the mats

unless someone actually washes them, you have rubber that's soaked in the sweat of dozens of people.

[laheina]

60. I could never get our karate mats clean.

They were always nasty.

[MiniMandaRuth]

30. Three of my guy friends did wrestling.

One of them needed to shower more. It's getting more and more common to not bathe and just douse yourself with ax these days.

Are you a fencer? I think I've read some stuff from you in zee lounge about being a fencer.

[HarukaTheTrophyWife]

34. I was a sabre fencer in HS.

It's way too expensive to do outside of the school paying for it. Classes and equipment are insanely expensive.

[Reverend_Smitty]

37. Ewwww don't they realize that's how you get ringworm

and other assorted skin diseases...cripes shower to protect yourself from disease if nothing else. Their coach should know better, especially if he doesn't want to lose any of his athletes for something dumb like ringworm :puke:

[liontamer]

54. you don't lose an athlete for ringworm

you just put liquid bandaid stuff over it. boys are pretty gross.

[Reverend_Smitty]

55. When I was in HS

I worked with all the athletic teams I'm pretty sure that they couldn't wrestle until they had a doctor's note saying they had anti-fungal treatments for it

[liontamer]

52. don't forget cauliflower ears

:scared:

[HarukaTheTrophyWife]

24. The best wrestler one year at my HS was a girl.

In the off-season, she was also a cheerleader.

[xmas74]

26. My aunt did martial arts.

Not a lesbian. Been married twice, second time over 35 years now.

A second cousin is now a black belt. She picked it up after her first husband beat the crap out of her . She left him, took up martial arts and met her now husband in her class. Also not a lesbian.

Classic small town answer: if a girl is a good athlete, she must be a lesbian.

[HarukaTheTrophyWife]

36. My mom's a brown belt and she is definitely straight.

Man...I can't wait to test her for her black belt. :evilgrin:

[xmas74]

39. I just hate that cop out bs.

Whenever a girl is better at a boy at something they "must be a lesbian". Come on-there have got to be quite a few lesbians out there who are just average or even suck at anything sports related.

I've just never understood why it's so wrong for a girl to be good at athletics?

(And good luck to your mom. I've thought about taking up martial arts for the exercise for a time now.)

[HarukaTheTrophyWife]

41. There are plenty of out-of-shape lesbians out there.

I never understood it either. Can't they just admit that there are girls who can beat the boys and they're not gay. I think it relates to the stereotype of lesbians being like men. So, if a girl can beat a boy, then obviously she's going to end up being a dyke.

It's never too late to start the martial arts. My mom started when she was 45. Now she's 53 and should be testing for her black belt next summer (she's put it off for the last two summers). Martial arts instructors can work with whatever your physical abilities are, so don't worry if you're out of shape or anything. It will get you into shape and boost your confidence. Be very wary of tae kwon do schools though. They're not good for self-defense and many of them just to part you for your money. If it takes only a couple years to get a black belt, then it's a black belt factory and stay away.

[xmas74]

43. I've heard that about tae kwon do before

but right now that's all that's offered in my area.

I'm just looking for something to get me in shape and to enhance my flexibility. I've lost some flexibility since I had my daughter.


(And I know an extremely out of shape lesbian IRL. I've been telling her that we need to get together and work out for our health. She just hasn't done it yet.)

[ForrestGump]

67. Tae Kwon Do is all that's offered (or close enough to it)

in many American towns, even quite big ones, and in cities that have a diversity of different styles available they are also usually the most prolific. Also, most American schools that bill themselves as 'karate' are, in reality, TKD.

TKD is a martial sport, more than anything else. Although it can trace its Korean genesis (in 1945) back to more ancient styles, it's not a style with a great deal of real tradition. Some claim it dates back to ancient Korean martial arts, but it really has little in common with any of them, as can certqainly be seen by watching practitioners of the few extant of these old styles.. TKD's basically a derivation of Japanese karate (Shotokan, I think, itself at that time a relatively new thing..) which in turn is based on Okinawan styles of karate that were basically subsets of certain southern Chinese kung fu styles, like white crane and hung gar, that were either originated in or at some point passed through the Shaolin temple school. So, yeah, its roots are in Shaolin and in old Korean combat styles, but not very meaningfully and certainly not deeply. It's more Japanese than Korean

Although training in it can be beneficial in terms of many aspects common to more traditional martial arts (self-discipline, physical development and improvement, etc) and it can provide an edge in self-defense, it's not a good choice for either. As most often taught now, especially, it's heavily oriented toward winning in tournaments, but only tournaments with TKD-friendly rules (a TKD fighter is liable to come at you with his or her back turned, which is suicide on the street but helpful in the ring because the back is an illegal target in TKD bouts) and kicks are often taught in a manner detrimental to joints, tendons, and ligaments. I am not up on TKD politics, but when I studied the style at age 21, before concentrating just on kung fu because TKD was causing my knees to hurt and the forms just weren't appealing to my aesthetic sense, I learned ITF style and I believe the more modern, more sport-oriented WTF style really took over once they got the Olympics in their camp. Now most TKD is overwhelmingly sport oriented.

And, yes, a great many of those TKD schyools that are everywhere are likey to be 'belt mills.' TKD outlets are famous for that. There are good -- great instructors out there (whether teaching as traditional martial atists, or as traditional as TKD gets, or as essentially sports coaches) -- but TKD's where you find many of the fly-by-nighters and even reputable, capable teachers who are moneygrubbers and hand over belts in exchange for cash. For some reason, Korean styles -- TKD and a couple of way-out styles that are probably bogus -- seem to be host to the few true personality cults that have been identified within the martial arts community. Shoot, maybe it's a 'Reverend' Moon thing, though North Korea's leader also qualifies as head of a personality cult, really....weird.

A good TKD stylist's kicks will knock you across the room if they connect, but the style traditionally barely works the hands and heavily stresses high kicks and jump-spinning kicks, etc -- those kicks are in the Chinese styles I'm more familiar with, for example, but in practice most kicks in combat are encouraged to be low and not as telgraphed or slow as these higher kicks (that also leave the groin and other parts of the body too open and the supporting leg vulnerable to a sweep...kick someone hard in the knee or shin and they won't be kicking you any time soon, or peraps even walking for a while). Catch one of those kicks before its full power is online and you've got yourself a helpless TKDer...put your elbow through the side of their knee and they're out of business. This is why I hope, if I'm ever attacked on the street by a kickboxer type as seems to happen all the time in the movies, I yhope he or she is a TKD black belt and not something else. :D It's not a good style for self-defense and traditional styles offer more in the areas of more metaphysical interest -- the heart of traditional martial arts -- as well as forms (prearranged sequences of moves performed almost as if a dance) and weapons forms. Tae Kwon Do is a very incomplete system, but it's been aggressively marketed worldwide and especially in the US. Like most martial arts it can offer a lot of benefits to children, if the instructor's good, but if the kid's got an enduring interest in martial arts he or she will probably benefit from entering a traditional, more complete style at some point and taking their strong kicks with them (though the teacher's inevitably going to have to untrain them in some aspects ("don't rise up on the ball of your foot when you kick...use your hands...hands!...you've got hands now!...grab that kick...lock that joint...and for Buddha's sake, don't attack with your back turned!!").

[xmas74]

70. I've noticed too many places around her that lend

credence to the term "belt mill" and have steered clear so far. But I am interested in finding something I can do again. I used to be very active in sports in my youth and sometimes I find myself missing it.

I don't give a darn about earning belts. That's just not my thing. I'm more into learning something new and getting active again.

(My daughter isn't that interested, though she said she'd like to take it if I could take it with her. This is more for me than anything. I'm tired of sitting on my butt at home!)

[ForrestGump]

81. Tai chi could be good

It may not look it, but it really is the ultimate martial art...the catch here being that it takes far longer to get there than is the case through more obviously physical 'external' styles. And the further catch is that most tai chi is taught as exercise (it's a very good one...much like yoga) or for other reasons more than it is taught as a martial art. There're several traditional tai chi styles and all involve learning weapons as well as empty-hand stuff and sparring. The REAL catch here is that most tai chi teachers probably don't even know -- or, at least, are not qualified enough -- to teach the martial aspects. It tends to be easier to find qualified teachers of tai chi as a martial art in larger cities, especially on the coasts, but you never know where these people are living...there may well be one near you. Tai chi is far easier on the body, arguably far better FOR the body at any age, and it's worthy of its name ('tai chi,' which is also what the yin-yang symbol is known as, means 'Grand Ultimate').

I have done some tai chi -- not a lot, but some -- and I can testify to its effectiveness. I am and have long been primarily keen on the very external (exerting, flashy, kung-fu movie kinda thing) approach to Chinese martial arts, and I took to sparring pretty naturally and am a quick study who also happens to be 6' 5" and over 200 lbs, and so perhaps you can imagine my surprise when all I'd heard of tai chi (that I thought surely must be at least part hyperbole) was proven true the first time I went up against a practitioner.

My initiation was with one of my old kung fu teachers, in another country, who'd in recent years begun to really get into tai chi...he was an advanced student of his teacher, but not one of the upper-echelon types yet. He's a Chinese dude, maybe 6' but pretty slender and also a good 15-20 years older than me, and he wiped the floor with me (I was 33 when I visited him). He'd have me attack, and make sure I really was coming in with a real attack at near full speed that would connect and do damage, and then he -- literally -- threw me across the room. Over and over. And over.

His studio is very big (I helped him in its construction, years before) and when he deflected my attack and helped me on my way I'd travel a good ten to 20 feet and only stop by crashing into a wall. I couldn't touch him, and he didn't even seem like he was responding at all to my onslaught, though something sure as hell was sending me flying. I could feel him yield and then, within a fraction of that same fraction of a second, turn my force against me and effortlessly send me flying like I was shot from a cannon. Go up against a good tai chi person and you won't touch them because they're never there. It was cool beyond belief.

And when I began studying it as an adjunct to the Fukien white crane and Northern Shaolin kung fu other teachers were training me in, I got to see more of its power. It looks slow and wimpy when its practiced as a form, but it's anything but, in practice. I was always naturally good at sparring and my most recent teacher really honed me well, He was an excellent fighter and even managed to fight effectively while still showing pure elements of the traditional styles he'd learned, rather than just adopting the fairly generic jeet-kune-do-like kickboxing style that's so common. So when I sparred against him I often acquitted myself quite well and gave him a real run for his money, sometimes getting him a few good ones (a good teacher isn't afraid to be bested by his or her students...in fact, they should WANT to be, in some ways), but then he'd smile and go all tai chi on me and it was always over then. :-)

I love the aesthetics and challenge of the external Chinese styles, and all the traditional weapons and cool moves, but I know that tai chi is, really, where it's at in the end. At high levels, complete martial systems of any origin tend to converge to look like tai chi. That's handy, too, because tai chi (and some of the related Chinese 'internal' styles) are perfect for people past retirement age who have trained for decades in 'harder' styles and have come to themselves naturally adopt the efficiency and use of the other's momentum and energy that tai chi exemplifies. Like I said, if you study a karate style or ju-jitsu, or some Chinese kung fu style, or whatever from wherever, you'll begin to get an edge in self-defense before too long and maybe after three or so years you'll be at least potentially able to put the odds in your favor in a real fight, whereas in tai chi you might take decades (a lot shorter time if you have extensive martial arts background on the 'external' side, if only because of having trained your mind to problem-solve at sparring speed, improving muscle memory and memory memory, grasping the ideas of biomechanics, and learning how to learn) to reach the same level of pragmatic application but (a) you won't break a sweat dispatching the bad guys and (b) you also won't injure yourself and you won't look outwardly violent in response. And, of course, self-defense really is the least of what martial arts is, or should be, about...the defense angle is a vehicle for far more important things.

If not tai chi (or aikido, a Japanese grappling stlye that has a lot in common with tai chi, or something like white crane kung fu), other styles may be around in your area that are worthwhile. To a very great extent, the teacher's more important than the style. If you dig some up, I'd be happy to have a look at their PR materials and see if I get any red-alerts that might suggest a fly-by-nighter or if I get (such as through the school's lineage) warmer and fuzzier feelings about them.

Martial arts can be incredible stuff, and you might find that, once you start, it becomes an integral part of how you define yourself.

[xmas74]

85. There's been talk of a tai chi class soon in town.

(Sounds funny, but this is a small Midwestern town) I've thought about it before for the exercise value and, from what I've assessed from watching it done in larger cities, what seems to be a bit more of a meditative value. (Which I really like.)

In high school I did yoga, along with my competitive athletics programs. I was self-taught from books that I had to special order since there were no programs within an hour's drive. I taught myself the poses with the help of a mirror, the breathing and meditative techniques, even followed the diet. In effect I made myself the town freak but I didn't care. I noticed the flexibility that I learned from yoga lengthened my running stride and the breathing helped keep my own in check, allowing me to run further lengths and not get winded as fast as some of the others.

I am a competitive person at times but right now that's not what I'm looking for. When I want something of that nature I'll go play some street hockey. Right now I'm looking for a discipline and regulated training, which I can find with the right martial arts program.

(Self-defense doesn't concern me either. I've worked in mental institutions and in jails. My overall instincts tend to be more honed than the Average Joe's when it comes to a dangerous situation and I tend to know how to stay clear of them. A bit more training is always nice.)

[ForrestGump]

91. If the teacher is good

(qualified and possessed with the good attributes any decent teacher should have, and few tai chi teachers are likely to be egomaniacal tyrants), it sounds like something you might really benefit from, even if the martial aspects aren't really stressed. Yes, tai chi is very much a moving meditation -- all martial arts are, really, but just as the 'external' styles are more obviously martial, so is tai chi more obviously and directly meditative. That's not to say it's not good exercise, though..your legs might vibrate a bit at first even if you're in shape from running or anything else. :D

And if the teacher's martially savvy, the martial nature of tai chi is valuable beyond the obvious. Every single move, you'll find, is not just good for stretching or as a meditative focus on perfection but is usually more than one attack or defense (or both, simultaneously) weapon. Every posture is likely to have several applications -- Chinese martial arts are very complex and multilayered like that. In fact, a lot of basic karate forms, that use closed fists or maybe open knife-hands or chops, are re-evaluated at higher levels and the real applications, often nerve attacks and other aspects of grappling with open hands, are shown...many applications are kept hidden, especially in public performance, as a result of the cultures and times in which these arts developed. That's actually one thing about TKD that makes it incomplete as an Asian martial art -- they don't have those hidden techniques any more, having kind of taken karate at face value, which puts them at odds with other Korean styles like hapkido and more ancient styles. And learning the tai chi sword, for example, may only have limited pragmatic value in defense in today's world, but in many ways its main point is not the obvious (a weapon) but in learning to project and focus your energy, intent, and power (in other words, your chi) more fully than you're able to learn solely by using your own body parts. In other words, what is obvious is often the least of it...crouching tiger, hidden dragon: very Chinese. :D

I'm sure that other DUers are more advanced in tai chi than I am, so maybe someone else can help but, again, I think you'd do well with tai chi and I hope this teachers hurries up and gets his or her yinyang to town. In teaching yourself yoga and in not being particularly competitive, you sound like an excellent student of any martial art, complete with well developed self-discipline. As might be obvious, I am a huge fan of tai chi -- it's impressed me on every level (you might find interesting, also, the work done by a prof at Emory University, who's a nice person and a senior tai chi dude, on how tai chi can literally save the lives of seniors) -- but I still have a burning need to train in more external forms of kung fu, as if I need to get it out of my system before I can concentrate on the more sedate (but not always...it only looks that way, and the older style I studied even includes very rapid movements in its forms) tai chi. It's not that I lack patience -- very much the opposite -- but even in my early 40s I just feel like I'm not really ready for it yet. The good news is that it's something you can take up at any age...

Speaking of which, here's one article on the research focused on tai chi and seniors:

http://qi-journal.com/Taiji.asp?-token.SearchID=Emory

[LeftyMom]

33. The sister I mentioned upthread is a brown belt

She's still definitely into boys. A lot. :eyes:

[HarukaTheTrophyWife]

38. My mom met my stepdad indirectly through karate.

The major fucking asshole in the class set my mom up on a blind date with his friend & boss after my dad died. Now they're married. Fortunately, my stepdad is pretty cool, even though his friend is a major fucking asshole (and a fuck wuss too).

[tyedyeto]

42. I grew up with 4 brothers, born in 1952 and was a 'tomboy' all the way

Did that make me a lesbian? No way. Just made me more independent knowing I could beat the crap out of most of my brothers friends.

[xmas74]

44. That's my point exactly.

Sometimes I really think it's just jealous parents wanting to think of a putdown. Problem is that's not a put down IMO.

[tyedyeto]

45. Back then, there were NO sports for 'girls'...

they were cheerleaders or nothing.

What a difference a generation or two makes.

[xmas74]

46. A huge difference.

Even when I was in high school we didn't have girls trying out for the "boys" teams. Nowadays you hear about it all the time,whether successful or not.

Now when are the boys going to wise up and start trying out for the "girls" sports? I'd have no problems with that.

[tyedyeto]

48. In the 60's, during high school, the girls were ...

relegated to statisticians but could not participate in any of the 'sports'

Even swimming, which I was a member of a private swim team, but when it came to public school, only the boys were allowed to compete. We were timers, meet stats, etc. Makes no sense looking back on it.

[Telly Savalas]

47. I read this and wonder how we can have a housing bubble...

when so many people seem to be living in caves.

[xmas74]

71. You've got to wonder about the mentality sometimes.

[tinfoil tiaras]

49. I wouldn't personally play football

-im too much of a girly girl and plus, i hate most team sports (exept for cheerleading...hahaha i'm pathedic), but if a girl wants to play, then i'm not gonna stop her. More power to her.

But if a girl seriously tried to play football where I am, she'd probably be made fun of like crazy, but a guy joining the cheerleading squad wouldn't be made fun of. Double standards...grr...

[tyedyeto]

50. My son's HS team had a female 'kicker'

I say "More power to her"!!!

[tinfoil tiaras]

51. Thats interesting

What part of the country are you from? Because here in the south that would never happen in a million years. The gender roles are too strict. :( :(

[tyedyeto]

53. That was in CA back in the 90's

she didn't kick very often but when she did, she was spot on!!!

[tinfoil tiaras]

56. Hm, I figured a more progressive place than Mississippi

That's really cool that she kicked better thant the guys. If i were more of a tomboy, I'd probably try to be on the football team, but since i'm not...then I'm not.

[smtpgirl]

59. My sister graduated in 1980, her school

had a jr. varsity team had a female kicker, knew her well, sadly, she committed suicide in 1997

1978
Ida Fox, a 5-foot-4, 120 pound sophomore, won a spot on the junior varsity football team at Poolesville High School in the Washington, DC area. Ms. Fox got to be a second-string safety and a No. 5 tailback. (Washington Post. Sept. 17, 1978: E1, E5)

[xmas74]

66. That is changing.

The league organizer said that some schools are hoping to get girls involved in playing at an early age. They've noticed that some women make excellent players in specific positions. His examples were quarterback and especially as kickers.

He said that some coaches are realizing that women in sports are a force and that instead of fighting them they need to embrace them. He said that he knew girls when he was growing up that would have been fantastic players but never would have been allowed.

[smtpgirl]

58. DC Divas & Baltimore Burn ROCK

Women's professional football



http://www.womensfootballcentral.com/

The 2005 season saw the Divas march through another undefeated regular season that featured 7 shutouts in 8 games by the league's leading defense. The Divas defensive unit surrendered a league low 56 points. The offense continued to impress on a weekly basis averaging 30 plus points and 300 plus yards rushing per game. The Divas once again made it to the Northern Conference championship game and fell to the 4 time champion Detroit Demolition. The Divas are poised for another title run in 2006 that finishes with a Superbowl championship in August.




Love the Burgundy & Gold

DC DIVAS, Championship Bound!!

[xmas74]

68. I'd love to take her to something like this.

We have a local university and we attend all the women's games for various sports. I have nothing against men's sports but I'm trying to show her that yes, women can play too and just as well as men.

I'd love her to see something like that right now!

[Skittles]

61. better to play football than to be g.d.cheerleaders

women should be playing their own sports

[xmas74]

72. I was a cheerleader for about 2 weeks.

I got into an argument with the sponsor and I kicked the head cheerleader's ass. They escorted me out of practice that day and I was told to never return. I also got detention for two weeks over it.

I'd have no problems w/ her doing the competitive level of cheerleading-the kind that involves the heavy disciplines in dance and gymnastics. It's not my thing at all but I have to admit that it's very active and competitive.

I just don't want her sitting on the sidelines, rooting some boys on when she could do just as well if not better and thinking "What if..."

[GoddessOfGuinness]

62. Good for you!

You go baby Xmas74! :yourock:

There was a Helen Hunt movie out several years ago called "Quarterback Princess" that addressed this issue. My older boy enjoyed it a lot.

[xmas74]

73. She's just upset that they can't tackle.

That's what she really wants right now.

She's estimated to be six foot when she's done growing. I've had moms look at her and say "She'll be a heartbreaker. With her looks she'll be the Homecoming Queen."

Dumbasses don't know what I know. With her height and build (big shoulders, great build for lots of muscle) she'll be kicking the Homecoming Queen's ass instead. She'd probably take on the football team when she was finished with the Queen.

My kid's gonna be an asskicker.

[GoddessOfGuinness]

84. She may be homecoming queen too...

Nothing says you can't be tough AND beautiful! :D

[xmas74]

86. Good point.

I think she'd still try to kick someone's ass, just for fun.

I just want her to be well-rounded.

[LostinVA]

63. OMG -- what a sexist (and SICK) b-word!

Good for you and your daughter, Xmas! They made me quit playing flag football with the boys ar recess when I turned 12, because "nice girls don't play sports like that."

And, just remember two things if she does grow up to be gay: 1.) being a lesbian magnet, you'll understand things other mothers wouldn't, and 2.) At least she won't eb Allison from "Big Brother."

[xmas74]

74. I couldn't care less if she's a lesbian.

I just think it's silly to sexualize everything a little girl does.

When she's an adult all I really want for her is to have someone that will make her smile and will treat her well and I want her to do the same for them. Male, female-doesn't make a difference. Either way I'd eventually pin her and her SO down about making me a grandma someday.

(And you're right: at least she wouldn't be Allison. If she were I'd have to put her over my knee and beat her butt black and blue.)

[LostinVA]

77. It could be even worse -- she could be Toni

[xmas74]

79. That bug eyed bitch!

Then again, she just won that game w/o ever setting foot in the house.

You've gotta give her some love for that move.

[LostinVA]

80. I give her credit, not love

Her bug eyes and bad implants skeeve me out....

[xmas74]

88. She's scary to look at.

I almost feel bad for Diane since that was her former roommate.

[MissHoneychurch]

69. WTF???

you handled it great - as usual. What did this woman say when your daughter introduced herself?

[xmas74]

75. She stepped back and started talking to another parent.

Small towns are still territorial about their American football and the traditional roles in it. Women can cheer, be athletic trainers and maybe do the stats-if their dad is the coach.

Proves that she doesn't watch the news or she'd know that some towns do have women on their teams.

[electron_blue]

83. she's a homophobe and sexist. And clueless too, apparently.

[xmas74]

89. She's from a small town.

There's more of her around here than anyone wants to admit to.

I told a coworker about her last night. Interesting how girly the coworker is and her response. Turns out for all her frills and fussiness she was a kicker in high school for her school's football team and the comment made her angry. She now plans on bringing over some old pics of herself in her uniform and wants the game schedule so that she can root for my daughter.