I'm seriously thinking about making my own biodiesel

[OmahaBlueDog]

http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_make.html#water

If I can get a good deal on a used diesel truck or SUV, I think I'll take the plunge and try this. I'm in a job where I drive, and I get IRS mileage reimbursement (currently $0.505/mile). If I can find a reliable source of used fryer oil, I can drive for about $1 a gallon; even in something really piggy on fuel economy, I could make out well.

What am I missing here?

[SallyMander]

1. SWEEEET!!!

We are planning on converting our 1982 VW Vanagon this spring. Then the plan is an eco-friendly road trip honeymoon in the fall!

I have a bunch of good WVO links on my blog if you want to check 'em out... we're going to go with the Greasecar kit: http://www.veggievanagon.blogspot.com/

PM me or IzaSparrow if you have any questions we might be able to help out with! :hi:

[OmahaBlueDog]

5. Thanks for the info!

Based on what I saw, you're not doing biodiesel in the sense that you won't be using lye and methanol to separate the glycerine out of veggie oil; you will use the diesel hot-start/hot-stop method, and then switching to filtered, dehydrogenated (I hope I said that correctly) used veggie oil.

COOL!!!!

Actually, from what I read, that might work for me too.

Was your Vanagon originally a diesel, or did you all put in a diesel Rabbit engine?

[SallyMander]

7. Yeah, the plan was to do the 2-tank conversion

Although our wacky mechanic is making big plans to concoct some of the biodiesel that you're talking about. We're game for either, but i want to keep a tank that will just be diesel, since we'll be driving all over the place and may not always have access to biodiesel and/or veggie oil. Don't want to get stranded! :D

The Vanagon was always a diesel... we got an amazing deal, bought it last year from its original owner with only 75,000 miles on it! :wow:


Good luck! Keep me updated :D :hi:

[Capn Sunshine]

8. You know what's cool about that?

If you run out or get hard up there's a can out in the back behind every restaurant with a fryer.

Or you can carry a bottle of Wesson oil in the van as a backup and not worry about a fire hazard or fumes, just trans fats.

[SallyMander]

9. Yeah! The only problem is filtering the used oil

We've looked into an on-board filtration system, but it's EXPENSIVE and i guess it can be almost impossible to deal with in cold weather. But you're right, Wesson should be good to go! :D

:hi:

[Capn Sunshine]

10. Carry coffee filters

in a pinch, newspapers.
Oh and hey, OP, don't overlook old Mercedes diesels. There's guys on the west coast that do conversions, and I think there's guys doing it nationwide

http://www.noendpress.com/caleb/biodiesel/

[mike_c]

2. this was done fairly commonly around here until just a few years ago...

...when one of the garage scale producers began scaling up to commercial operation, so now biodiesel is available for sale here. I'm sure there are probably still some folks mixing their own. As always, be cautious with tanks of flammable chemicals in your garage, barn, whatever!

[DarkTirade]

3. I've known a few people who wanted to dabble in it.

The only reason one of them didn't was because he was renting at the time and his landlord wouldn't have appreciated him fooling around with funny chemicals. That, and he didn't have a garage to do it in.

[harmonicon]

4. just don't have too high of hopes

My brother tried making up a batch of biodiesel a few years ago (with the help of our mother, who's a professional chemist), and wound up with something a lot more like soap. Some ratio in the mixture was off. This gunked up the container and tubing used to make it, and noone's had the time or energy to get it cleaned up and try again. I'm sure if you're really determined you can make it work no problem. Just don't count on it working like magic. Also consider that it can take a fair amount of time. If you're doing this for cost, try to budget what your time is worth for making the diesel, getting it stored somewhere, collecting the oil, etc. and figure that into the cost.

[OmahaBlueDog]

6. I've read about that

I'm told to treat it like beer making. Start with really small batches and work up to being able to make something like 5 gallons at a time. Once that's been mastered, work up.

The alternative is to do what the first responder suggested, which is not to make biodiesel, but run a modified diesel engine on SVO ("straight vegetable oil"). The principal, from what I'm told and have read, is simple; you install a second fuel tank, so you end up with a tank of regular diesel and a tank of vegetable oil (which you obtain as a discard from food vendors, and filter and remove the water); then your car starts on regular diesel, and once it gets hot, you switch to the SVO. The trick is that before you shut down, you have to switch back to the diesel, or your vehicle won't start.

Remember the words of JFK: "We don't do these things because they are easy, we do them because they are hard."

[harmonicon]

12. yeah, I've heard about that

The big trade-off there is space. Maybe you're not a person who uses their car to move things much, but I always have. If it's a truck, it can take up a sizable amount of the truck bed. I'm not trying to talk you out of it though.... maybe I'm just jealous, because I want one.

[Boudica the Lyoness]

11. My husband makes it

He's the co-founder of a very successful bio-diesel plant. They run 6 days a week, maybe 7. He did all the design and inventing of stuff. It's a really big operation now. Ask me any thing and I'll have him answer.

[Boudica the Lyoness]

13. We've used biodiesel for years in our rigs

For four years we've heated our whole house with 100% biodiesel.

[OmahaBlueDog]

15. Does he sell the stuff commercially...

or has he formed a buyers/users group?

Also, I just read an article about independent truckers hanging it up because diesel is so high; why aren't they jumping on this? I was stunned to find out that restaurants are STILL paying companies to take their used fryer oil away; I'd have figured that ship had sailed at 2.50.

Since your husband did the invention/design -- does he have a website?

[Boudica the Lyoness]

16. From Mr. English Lady

My husband is writing the following so don't blame me.
****************************************************
This is Mr. English Lady. Please indulge me while I offer this Biodiesel 101 short course.

As for the people wanting to use waste fryer oil (yellow grease of unknown origin and loaded with free fatty acids as well as floor sweepings and plugged drain contents) I have yet to analyze (GC or gas chromatograph analysis)a sample from these processors using a do it your self system that would pass the free and bound glycerin amount allowed under ASTM 6751. Generally they are 3 to 6 times the levels allowed and most likely could cause engine or injection component problems if run at high levels (B20 or greater)for a long period of time and that doesn't even address the other contaminates or properties such as sulfated ash, low flash point, high sodium content, water & sediment or cold soak plug point to mention a few. Then we get to the problem of disposing of methyl alcohol contaminated by products (glycerin, soaps and wash water). One of the main problems using yellow grease is the poor yield (sometimes less than 50% biodiesel per gallon of oil) resulting in large quantities of poor quality glycerin, loaded with soaps, that can be highly flammable from the 25%+ alcohol content (has been known to blow up a plant or two) that is regarded by the EPA and most state DOE's as toxic and hazardous requiring hazmat procedures. Not to mention the dangerous use of pure methyl alcohol (and associated vapors) in ones garage with NEMA 1 wiring, light fixtures, pump motors and other spark sources, and access to open drains. Someday somebody is going to send their neighborhood into orbit (in small pieces) and that is going to hurt the biodiesel movement. That is not to say that it can't be done, however great care, diligence and awareness of the hazards must be observed. Do your homework first (lots of it) and have contingency plans ready so you can deal with some of the process issues. The biggest concern over using waste oil is the high FFA's and high moisture content which can kill the reaction, producing even more soap.

As for distribution, our output is measured in rail car's per day and we have no direct access to the end user. It would cost far more to establish a distribution system than the refinery plant itself. This is extremely frustrating as producers like us have to enter the petroleum system at the pleasure of the oil distribution companies, not to mention big oil. We have to sell in truck load quantities (9000-10,000 gal) in order to move that kind of volume. Typically the distributors demand a discount (below #2 distillate rack price posted on OPIS) then add a premium to the biodiesel blend price at the pump. What assholes! And that is if they are willing to handle biodiesel at all. Most won't. Without a doubt the main obstacle to providing retail biodiesel blends to the end user is the oil distributors. There excuses are centered around adequate handling facilities, tank storage, etc and lingering quality issues. To further complicate issues the price for refined soybean oil (sometimes referred to as RBD) has gone through the roof and has made it unavailable as a feedstock. Fortunately other feedstocks can be used however most plants were designed for processing degummed oil or RBD. Using the waste oils described above is definitely doable but it is more complicated with greater quality issues and processing expense. Then there is all of that shitty glycerin to deal with.

There you have it. We don't have a website at present as we have focused on other concerns. Good Luck.

[OmahaBlueDog]

17. Thank you for the course

I'm getting an education. One thing I'm discovering is that the notion that there are restaurants with oil they're paying to get rid of isn't as true as it used to be.

Another thing I'm learning is basic chemistry with regard to biodiesel, and the pros and cons of bio diesel versus so-called "greasecar" systems, whcih use diesel to bring the cylinders to temperature, and simply burn filtered used veggie oil.

Obviously, your operation is in a whole different realm than what I'm looking at. I am curious about one thing; is your plant in Nebraska (we have at least one major plant that I know of)?

[LynzM]

14. Awesome :)

Good for you, dude! :bounce: Would love to see/hear the story when you get it going!