If you had a sibling who was dying

[Dangerously Amused]

Poll question: If you had a sibling who was dying

...in another state, and your resources (either time or money or both) were such that you could make only one trip there, would you go before the person died, even though there was a chance that due to the person's condition, s/he might not even know you were there, and then skip the funeral? Or would you wait until after the person died so as to attend the funeral?

More importantly, why?

For the record, the sibling is one to whom you have been neither especially close nor especially distant.

Thanks.

[FloridaJudy]

1. Definitely while she was still alive

Even if there was only a remote chance of her being conscious. I'd want a chance to say good-bye, and thank her for everything she's done for me over the years. Funerals are for the living, not the dead.

[Dangerously Amused]

5. Thanks; that is the choice I would make, too.

Same reasons.

[flvegan]

2. Before my loved one died, I'd want to visit.

If they don't remember it, that's okay. Know why? Because the chance that they will exists. We don't really know what folks realize when they're in the final stages of death.

Visiting after death is a very kind form of respect, but the person is gone at that point. You're visiting a body (sorry if this sounds really shitty).

I watched my father wheeled past me while still alive, but on Death's door. The sentiment I expressed then and the sorrow I felt at the time trumps my thoughts at the funeral. Never got to speak to him, never got to say good bye. But, somehow, I know that he knows I was there. That's my "more importantly, why?" answer. It's selfish, as it is all about my thoughts and feelings.

[Dangerously Amused]

7. I know, I felt the same way when my Dad was dying. He knew I was there.

I think that most dying people would rather have their family and friends gather around at the end, than die hoping those people will at least come to the funeral. You know?

The situation at hand is with Mom's sister. Mom was crying because she said she will never see her sister alive again. I told her, "Go now! See her now!" But Mom wants to wait for the funeral. I really don't understand her decision, and to be honest it kind of upsets me. Then I thought, well, maybe there are reasons for wanting to wait that I have never considered and that might change my mind. So I thought I'd ask here. But so far... no new insights in that direction.

=sigh= I wish she would go now.

Thanks.

[flvegan]

11. IMO, some folks can deal with death, but not with dying.

I hate to sound like this, and I'm sure I'll get shit for it, but death is an occurrence and dying is a process. For some, I think it's easier to deal with the sudden, immediate thing than it is to participate.

Yeah, again, I know I'm an asshole for saying that.

I wish the best for you and your family.

[Dangerously Amused]

13. Thanks and no,

...you are NOT an asshole for saying that. I'm trying to work through this whole thing and different perspectives is what I asked for, so I thank you for providing an important one. In fact, I think you are right and it will be helpful for me to think more about how people handle the "death vs. dying" issue. Keen insight; thanks.

[enigmatic]

3. Go now

Do it, or you'll regret it for the rest of your life.

:hug:

[Dangerously Amused]

8. Thanks, I would... but it's Mom's decision to make.

I wish she would go now, but for some reason she wants to wait until the funeral. I just don't understand her thinking on things like this. (Or most major life things, but I digress.)

:hug:

[Lil Missy]

4. That is an extremely personal decision. I would not fault anyone either way.

Just do what your heart tells you to do. And, you are NOT obliged to explain yourself or your decision to anyone.

I am sorry for your loss.

:pals:

[Dangerously Amused]

12. Aw, thank you for your kindness. But the decision is my Mom's to make.

She wants to wait until the funeral. And you're right, she owes me no explanation and I haven't asked for one. Right now I am just trying to reach a level of enlightenment and acceptance of her decision, because to be honest with you (my perception of) her stated desire - but actual unwillingness - to "be there" for her family in difficult times confounds me.

:hug:

[CaliforniaPeggy]

6. My dear Dangerously Amused...

For myself?

I'd go while my sibling was still alive.

I'd want to say my farewells...

And see him while he still was alive, even if only technically...

I'm just that way...

Hugs for you, sweetie...:hug: :hug:

Safe passage to him, at long last...

On edit: Ah, I see it's not about your brother, but your mom's sister...

Well, my feelings are the same.

She should go NOW.

[Dangerously Amused]

14. Thanks Peggy.

Some will think me a horrible person for saying it, but I dearly wish it WAS my brother who was leaving us. The constant, inconceivable mental and physical abuse that poor man is forced to endure... at the direction of Guess Who. "For his own good." But I digress.

I am just trying really, really hard right now to be all Zen and non-judgmental with my Mom, because honest to god there are times when her callous "Fundy-Christian Republican" neglect of her "loved ones" and indifference to their suffering utterly consumes me with rage. To the point where I know that sometimes I let it hold me back in life. And I don't want to be that person.

Thanks again.

:hug:

[GoddessOfGuinness]

9. I would go while they were still alive...

because there's a chances/he would know I was there.

[Dangerously Amused]

15. I would too, GoG, I would too.

Just trying to reach out and understand another mind set. If I can.

I got to wondering if I was in the minority in my thinking and reasoning that way, but I can see from the poll that I'm not.

Thanks.

:hug:

[Manifestor_of_Light]

10. What I did when my sister died.

She had brain cancer and was in a coma immediately preceding her death. A formerly vibrant young woman of 42, who was my best friend in the whole world.

I couldn't handle visiting her every day. She was in the same town I was.

So I went over there while she was in a coma for three days, once or twice, and sat on the bed and held her hand and said, "I love you. I'll always love you" while trying not to cry too much.

I don't know what she perceived.


Before she was sick, we talked on the phone nearly every day and said "I love you" when we said goodbye on the phone.


As far as siblings you are not terribly close to, I cannot tell you what to do.

Do what your heart tells you.

[Dangerously Amused]

18. Thanks.

I think you did perfectly right by your sister. I guess what is getting me frustrated is Mom crying and telling us that she "wishes" she could see her sister one more time before she dies, when there is absolutely no reason that Mom cannot do exactly that.

Anyway.

:hug:

[Left Is Write]

16. I would go while the person was still alive.

If the death were imminent, I'd stay as long as I could.

[Dangerously Amused]

21. Yeah, that's what I would do too.

Go now, stay as long as I can, spend time with the sib and try to help the family in any way I could.

Thanks.

[Haole Girl]

17. It makes more sense to give flowers to the living

I'd definitely go before the family member died. I've been in this situation, btw, with an Uncle and a Grandmother. I don't regret for one second seeing them alive instead of attending their funeral(s).

[Dangerously Amused]

22. I agree.

I think it is what the dying person would want on all counts. But I'm frustrated, it seems like Mom can't even grasp that concept.

=sigh=

Thanks.

[Blue Diadem]

19. Skip the funeral and go while the person is still here.

I would have loved to have seen my brother before he passed. I know he would have loved to have seen me or at least sensed my presence. Unfortunately, his wife didn't inform us of how serious his illness had become until his death.

I also didn't go to his funeral. While we were trying to make arrangements during an ice storm to get from Michigan to Ga., his wife called and said she wasn't having a funeral or a memorial service and not to bother to come. She had him cremated and his and eventually her ashes will be mixed and spread on their land.

Even if the person is not aware or not conscious, I'm a firm believer they sense the presence of their loved ones.

edited to add:

I've read that it's your Mom's sister. May I ask your Mom's age? If she's older and is financially limited, could it be she's wanting to wait for the funeral so she can see other loved ones too? I sometimes think older siblings realize the lifelong love they share for each other and experience their deaths differently than younger siblings.

[Dangerously Amused]

24. I'm sorry that you didn't get to see your brother before he died.

I think it is very unfair to you the way his wife handled the matter. It's hard when you don't get closure like that.

:hug:

To answer your questions, Mom is in her 80s and frankly there is no real reason that she couldn't go down both now and for the funeral if she really wanted to. She is giving reasons why she doesn't want to travel there more than once, but those are just rationalizations so that she doesn't have to do it.

Also, she can't be waiting to see other family members at the funeral because it is her last remaining sibling: the only other (extended) family member in that state is her niece (the sib's daughter), whom she hasn't seen in probably thirty years and to whom she is not close.

So I am just frustrated at her unwillingness to put (IMO) her sister's greater need to see above her above her own desire to avoid an uncomfortable situation.

Thanks for sharing your thoughts!

[Jamastiene]

20. Think about an issue the sibling really cared about (a charity),

don't go at all, but instead send a nice donation to a charity in the siblings memory/honor.

My reasoning is if you tell the family you can come before or after but cannot afford to make two trips, depending on your family (they might not be as incredibly stupid as my family) the first thing they'll ask is why you can afford it this time but not the next time.

Then again, you may want to completely disregard my reply:
I guess I'm making my decision based on my family, because my family is brain damaged/willfully stupid and I loathe being around them any at all. I do care about my step brother and my stepsister and basically like them, but they would understand and appreciate the donation to something they care about.

[Dangerously Amused]

25. Sorry about your family situation.

Dysfunctional families are no fun, eh? x(

I think my Mom will probably buy masses for her after she's dead. That's what she has done in other cases. I don't understand it, I guess it makes her feel better/less guilty.

[Mad_Dem_X]

23. While she was still alive

I would take the chance that she might not recognize me, just to see her and tell her I loved her one last time.

[Dangerously Amused]

26. Me too, MDX, me too.

Thanks.

[billyskank]

27. Go while they're alive.

You can't tell them you love them when they're dead. :hug:

[Dangerously Amused]

29. Thanks, billy. I agree.

There has been this longstanding pattern of avoidance behavior with my Mom that frustrates me no end.

:hug:

[Guava Jelly]

28. I would go now

and skip the funeral :hug:

[Dangerously Amused]

30. I do think that is the best approach, for many reasons.

Thank you.

:hug:

[bigwillq]

31. Go now.

I would rather see them alive...so I can say my goodbyes, even if we weren't close.

[Dangerously Amused]

35. I agree. It is my Mom's decision though, I don't understand why she wants to wait.

Thanks.

[GreenPartyVoter]

32. Alive. My mother always regretted not being with her Great Aunt (who raised her) one

more time before she passed.

[Dangerously Amused]

36. That is definitely the decision I would make.

It is comforting to know that I am not alone in my reasoning. Thank you.

[Danger Mouse]

33. Alive. Otherwise I would never forgive myself.

[Dangerously Amused]

37. I would feel the same way.

I think Mom will regret her decision to wait.

Then she will probably try to pray the guilt away. =sigh=

Thanks.

[Danger Mouse]

46. She will regret it, and prayer will not take the guilt away.

When my stepfather was dying, my mother insisted on waiting until all the siblings/children could be gathered together before they took him off life support.
It was the right thing to do, for all of us.

[Ptah]

34. How recently had I seen the sibling?

Tough decision, friend.

I'd probably go while sib is still alive.

:hug:

[Dangerously Amused]

38. Thanks, Ptah.

She saw the sib only a handful of times over the course of many years, although they lived only 30 miles apart and both of them were driving. Then in the last year started to see the sib more frequently recently (once a month or so) as the sib began having more health problems. Just a few weeks ago the sib was moved by her only child out-of-state (to be near the child) due to her declining health.

:hug:

[Flaxbee]

39. Alive. Definitely while s/he is alive. Funerals are only for those

left behind - it won't mean a damn thing to your sibling to see him/her buried or whatever.

I also think YOU will feel better going to see him/her during this last illness. Whether or not s/he can tell you are there (and I do believe that at some level, a person knows), you will know you made the effort to give him/her some comfort while s/he was alive. And that is important to your relationship with yourself going forward. Not to sound too airy-fairy about it all, but you have to live with yourself, and I KNOW I'd feel better going while my sibling was alive. I suspect you'll feel better doing that, too.

I'm sorry you have to make this decision. :hug:

(edited for clarity)

[Dangerously Amused]

48. Thanks, Flaxbee.

It's my Mom's situation. I agree with you on all counts, I wish she would go now. I think she will regret the choice she seems to be making.

[pitohui]

40. as a general rule see the person while they are alive, they won't care when they are dead

if the real issue is the money you don't have to spend for more than one trip, i would definitely visit BEFORE the person died

a dead person will not know or care if you are at the funeral so if money is tight i would never travel to a distant location just to attend a funeral, it makes no sense, spend your resources on the living not the dead

reading between the lines (admittedly dangerous) if the person is already too ill to understand that i'm there, and i am already struggling financially, i might opt not to visit at all and i would not let others who do not have to pay my bills guilt-trip me about not attending the funeral -- if there is no benefit to to the sick person as a result of my travel and there IS harm to myself because of my shaky financial status, it seems foolish to make such a trip only because it is somehow expected of me

okay, now that i've read the whole thread -- i'm pretty sure there is some reason that your mom doesn't want to share why she isn't making the trip, i have a few ideas but i think for a change i'll keep them to myself since this appears to be your mother's wish

[Dangerously Amused]

49. Yeah, it's her choice and she has issues.

=sigh=

I'll probably never understand her way of thinking.

[cynatnite]

41. Funerals are for the living...Go now. n/t

[Dangerously Amused]

50. Agreed, going now would be best.

Thanks.

[quakerboy]

42. I will be the asshole pragmatist

I don't see the point.

If they wouldn't know I was there, unless I had some unresolved issues that I had to deal with, I wouldn't go. If lucidity or consciousness is intermittant, better to make a call when you know the time will be effective in connecting.

And since I have absolutely no belief that the dead are paying attention to funerals, having more pressing concerns at that time, I probably wouldn't commit my resources to that either.

My best advice is to commit those resources to where they will do the most good. You have to decide what that is. For me, it would likely be something more immediate and proximate. Perhaps it is the field I work, or the family I have lived in, but that is how I am wired.

[Dangerously Amused]

51. No! Thank you for that opinion!!

I am trying really hard here to understand another point of view, and what you said helps. I really wish that all the people who put "wait and attend the funeral" in the poll would elaborate as to why.

Anyway, thanks.

[azmouse]

43. My oldest brother died unexpectedly last November.

No chance to see him before he died and since he died the day before Thanksgiving there wasn't any way I was flying back to PA from AZ for the funeral. I would have had to drive back and would have had to leave almost immediately to get there in time for the funeral. I chose not to go.
I was never close to my brother growing up and only saw him twice in the last 20 years. I can't say I miss him because I feel like I never knew him. I felt the sorriest for my mother for losing one of her children but I didn't feel sorry for myself.

[Dangerously Amused]

52. That makes sense to me, since you weren't close to him.

I would probably have done the same thing in those circumstances.

Thanks.

[harmonicon]

44. Damn, that's a tough call

It's a choice that I wouldn't want to make. I had a similar situation with both my grandmother and an aunt a few years ago..... I didn't go anywhere at all. I don't know if I regret it. I didn't go to see my grandmother, because I'm stubborn and thought that if I just wanted her to get better, she would - and my mom said that she'd rather I remember her not as a sick, bed-ridden person. I didn't go to the funeral, because it was clear that it wasn't really for my grandmother, and wasn't something that would have helped me grieve.

With my aunt, it all just happened too fast. Between the news that she had cancer, she died, and they had the funeral, there was just no time to even think.

I'm really sorry.

[Dangerously Amused]

53. Thanks.

Yeah, a tough call and thankfully not mine to make (it's my Mom's instead). I would almost certainly go now, though Mom is choosing to wait; it frustrates me and instead of getting mad I am trying to understand it.

I may never understand it, though, and just have to accept it.

Thanks.

[marzipanni]

45. Is your cousin going to have a funeral for her mother?

It sounds like no one else would know her where she was moved when she got sick. (Or maybe the funeral would be where she used to live, closer to your mom?)

If I were your mom, I would go to see her now, since your mom was seeing her about once a month before her health deteriorated.
Could you ask your cousin and/or your aunt's doctor if she probably has awareness of people being with her, and let your mom know if she does?

It's possible your mom may not want to see her sister in this condition, she faces her own mortality and fear of the process of dying, and makes her feel inadequate to help.

[Dangerously Amused]

54. Well, I think you nailed it with

"...she faces her own mortality and fears of the process of dying...." I think Mom doesn't want to go for reasons that she can't admit, so she is finding bogus reasons that she "can't" go and then complains about "not being able to" go.

So far Mom has been getting information from only the niece, who says that the awareness level appears to be nonexistent... but I know that people and doctors have different opinions of how awareness manifests (or doesn't) during the dying process, so I don't know how reliable those impressions are.

The funeral will be out of state. I hope she at least goes to that.

Thanks.

:hug:

[lizziegrace]

56. Fear and guilt

:(

[Dangerously Amused]

58. 'Zackly.

How to best respond to someone who has lived a lifetime being indoctrinated in/completely manipulated by fear and guilt? I think it is too late, honestly. I do feel sorry for her, even as she frustrates me.

=sigh=

Thanks.

:hug:

[Dangerously Amused]

55. Dupe

[dawgmom]

47. Voted that you should go now...BUT...

I voted that you should go now, before they die, but my real answer depends on when and how you may be of most comfort. For example, even if you sibling wouldn't be aware of your presence, does he/she have a family who would be comforted by your being there, and by your being available to help out in small ways? Watching the kids or stocking the fridge or just carrying in meals, for example? Those things can be very important when a family is sitting the death vigil (sorry to phrase it that way, but that's what it is.) On the other hand, I also think that the funeral is for the living, and not for the one who has passed, and you may want to assess whether your presence at the funeral would be of comfort to the family.

Regardless of whether you were close to them or not, my sympathies to you.

[Dangerously Amused]

57. Thanks so much.

It's Mom's sister who is dying, so it's her choice to make. I'm frustrated because Mom has been coming up with reasons why she "can't make it" down there, none of which are valid (I'll get her to the airport, I'll watch the house, etc. etc. etc.) and then complains because she isn't "able" to make it, and all of this without going through one bit of the empathetic analysis you just did. I would just like her, for once, to consciously own her feelings and her actions.

Anyway. Thanks.

[littlebit]

59. It would depend on which sibling it is.

If it was my baby brother I would be there everyday until he passed. If it was my older brother I wouldn't even fly there until the day of the funeral. If I even did that.