Doom and gloom fact or fiction.

[.... callchet ....]

Poll question: Doom and gloom fact or fiction.

The economy is either going to survive with problems or it is going to be a disaster.
Who do you believe ? Moderates or doom and gloomers.

[lostnotforgotten]

1. No Question - We Are In For A Rough Ride

eom

[mahina]

2. Depends- on what the mood of the nation is (clearly dark), and where you are.

Fundamentals are not sound, but we're not in Argentina. People who've have been buying survival gear and predicting Armegeddon will be dissapointed again. Though I'm surprised the impact of the last 8 years is so light, I understand that the consequences won't be felt for some time.

Sill, when you think things couldn't be worse, remember, we could have been watching McGoo's innauguration.

[GliderGuider]

3. The problem is global

Because of the degree of interconnection, all world economies influence each other. That means that even relatively healthy nations can't function in isolation, but are affected by the world's failing economies.

We're heading for a reset of the global economy, one that may last for decades and may or may not be recoverable. Doom and gloom? Yeah, I guess if your idea of a successful civilization is one that lets everybody drive a Hummer to WalMart I'm a doomer...

[.... callchet ....]

5. Call me in 6 months and I will tell you what to do.

Throwing a bone into the kennel and the dogs all fight each other. The picture is large and bleak. Is it possible for thoughts in a mansion fortress to be concerned about the street beggars in Bangladesh.

[.... callchet ....]

6. Pointing out that the problem is global

has given me a broader perspective. The condition the USA is in now is less than some and more than some. It is not a special position. It is changing. Pretty soon there will be fourth and fifth world economies. We will be making our way down there also. Not worrying about workers in India and China that have our jobs is also like our not worrying about the atrocities in Darfur et al. We just worry about what effects ourselves. The narrow mindedness may kill us all. I am using USA to include Canada. It is not the people that have taken our jobs, it is the system that has given our jobs away. Everybody should have jobs.

[.... callchet ....]

7. Did you notice that the

" Jubilee " issue went over like a lead balloon?

[GliderGuider]

10. Of course.

Jubilee would involve too much pain for the wrong people. The powers that be are still in control, and their interests are being carefully guarded. Radical measures like Jubilee will only become possible when their power base has been eroded sufficiently by the collapse, and the guardian institutions have begun to disintegrate.

My purpose in raising the idea was simply to let people know that option exists, and has been used in the past. Maybe when the time comes someone will say, "You know, I remember reading about this thing called Jubilee somewhere..."

[Hugin]

16. Excellent link GliderGuider. n/t

[leftofthedial]

4. I'm a doom and gloomer, but

I believe the President most assuredly can help.

[CoffeeCat]

8. I've come to the conclusion that I...

...don't know what the hell is going to happen, and I am growing weary of the uncertainty.

I see many horrendous economic indicators.

However, I feel like I'm constantly doing research to try and figure out what WILL happen in 2009. I'd like to make
sound financial decisions to protect my family and to insulate them from bad economic times.

I have yet to see anyone spell it all out--tell us that A,B,C,D are likely to happen and cause E,F,G,H...therefore
we should do I,J,K,L if we want to survive all of this.

Frankly, I'm sick of this. I'd like to know what is going on. I'd like to stop reading articles about the economy
that contradict each other and are so varied in their opinion of 1.) Where we're at; 2.) Where we're headed.

I know this is probably a very bizarre point of view to have, but I've been worried about the economy for
months. My husband and I saw the housing crisis three years ago. I've been concerned about our economy
being propped up on credit-card/home-equity spending. I knew it was unsustainable.

I'm drained. I've tried to do my best to prepare. We've been in "savings mode" for a couple of years. We
have no credit-card or car payments. I have a 6 months supply of essentials. Half of our money is in the
mattress. We pulled our 401k funds out of the stock market and into money-market funds. Are we complete
fools or geniuses? Who the hell knows.

I just wish we had more answers.

[.... callchet ....]

9. What action could most stabilize your position.

Do you have an investment in money market funds because that is the amount of money you feel you can safely lose . What would you lose by taking your money out of there. All of your other actions are based on a stock market crash. Are you counting on not bad of a crash? There are millions of millionaires in this country. They have enough money to buy the stock-market out of trouble. That hasn't happened. Who is buying most of the stock?

[GliderGuider]

11. The "millions of millionaires" can't buy the stock market out of trouble.

Millionaires don't have millions in loose cash lying around. It's all invested -- in the stock market.

[.... callchet ....]

12. I did an associative calculation.

I allocated $1.000.000 to each millionaire. That is 5 trillion dollars. In the USA alone. Do you think there is 5 trillion dollars in savings that belongs to USA citizens. I don't know. Just using empirical figures. I "know" that people write checks drawing on unbelievable accounts. Saying they could buy it of trouble was an argumentative point. "They have enough money to buy the stock-market out of trouble. That hasn't happened". My point is that there is no that money sees that as a wise investment. There is no solution. The market will collapse. The people that have the real money may see a change in plans, but they will not be hurt. They will then just have to position themselves to protect their savings from taxes and keep trying to tell the poor how bad social programs are. They will have support also, a lot of people will still have jobs and hope.

Do the " secret Swiss " Banks charge a fee for protecting money or do they invest money. My idea is that they charge a fee for storing money. Any transactions would point to the money.

[Hugin]

13. I'd love to make A,B,C,D + E,F,G,H = I,J,K,L...

But, TPTB keep pulling the rug out from under me before I can
put together a plan of action.

Sounds like you've done what you can to sit this out, which currently
is probably the safest course.

Austerity measures for everyone! Yeesh! :shrug:

[sendero]

14. The spiral of job losses...

.. that lead to lower consumption, that leads to job losses, and so forth, has begun in earnest.

What will stop this cycle?

Amazingly, the right wants to do the usual things, cut corporate and capital gains taxes. How is that going to help? The problem is not on the supply side, it is on the demand side. No one is going to invest in a business when there are NO CONSUMERS for the product.

Creating infrastructure jobs and taking other measures to get money in the hands of consumers is the best course of action IMHO and Obama seems to see that. But it is going to take a while, not 6 months, to turn this around.

[DemReadingDU]

15. This is exactly what we are doing too

Oh, and we did buy a generator, just in case of emergency. There have been many stories in the news with loss-of-power due to floods, snowstorms, blizzards. Gotta have electric to read the DU! :)


Also when you have time, read the primers that Stoneleigh has written at The Automatic Earth, located in the upper right section on the home page.
http://theautomaticearth.blogspot.com/

She has the best foresight "that A,B,C,D are likely to happen and cause E,F,G,H...therefore
we should do I,J,K,L if we want to survive all of this."