Just imagine if the gun wasn't invented yet.

[MrPerson]

We'd be using swords in our serial killings and citing the second amendment.

[Xipe Totec]

1. jawbones and slingshots n/t

[Tuesday Afternoon]

2. Sticks and Stones

matter of fact they still use Stones in Some Places....

[Mojorabbit]

3. Staves and spears

or perhaps machetes. Human history is full of violence.

[Caliman73]

4. You are exactly right...except about the 2nd amendment

If guns were not invented, people who are inclined towards violence would find another to kill as many people as possible. Guns are a tool. The person using the tool to harm others is the problem whether that be a sword, a knife, their hands, poisons, home made explosives, or any other tool. Solve the reason for the violence and the violence will abate. That is the point you always seem to miss.

[spin]

5. Few people realize how deadly swords were...

watch this video of a samurai sword...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4BnxVu335xI

There are basically three types of Japanese samurai swords. The longest samurai sword that is over 24 inches is the Katana that is preferred for use in outdoor combat. The Wakizashi is a samurai sword that is slightly shorter than the Katana and is about 12 to 24 inches long. This samurai sword is usually used for indoor combats. The Tanta is a samurai sword, which is a small knife, and is used for indoor combat too.

To make sure the samurai sword is up to the mark, sword testers pass the blade through the bodies of corpses. First the small bones are cut through, and then the large bones. The results of the test are recorded on the nakago, which is the metal piece that joins the samurai sword blade to its handle. Your guarantee on the authenticity of the samurai sword is confirmed with these recordings.
http://ezinearticles.com/?Samurai-Swords-Can-Cut-Through-Bones&id=378865

[Dont_Bogart_the_Pretzel]

8. Only 24 inches long?

O'boy...on teevee they looked longer. :silly: I guess that's props for ya.

[spin]

11. What they don't show you...

is that the katana in skilled hands could slice right through your body like the Gonza rolls in the video. Many people have been shot with a .45 auto and survived but a samurai sword could definitely deliver a devastating blow as could other swords.

So, first things first. Could historical swords cut clear through somebody? We're fairly sure at least some samurai swords -- katana, they're called -- were tested on the bodies of convicted criminals as part of the practice of tameshigiri, or test cutting. One Japanese sword made in 1662 is inscribed "Two persons completely cut into two pieces (one stroke)," a scholarly article informs us, and reportedly blades bearing five-body ratings can be found in Japanese museums. I'm skeptical -- honestly now, five? -- but in any case, remember we're talking about stationary, unarmored targets. Remains found at old Japanese battle sites don't suggest that combatants were routinely cut in two. Furthermore, while we lack adequate comparative data on how many human bodies a good modern sword can slice through, a perusal of the photos in trauma journals indicates a common knife can make surprisingly deep cuts. So don't get an exaggerated idea of the intrinsic lethality of Japanese swords.

For more we turn to the Association for Renaissance Martial Arts, which goes the extra mile in testing modern-day swords. These guys have a section on their website where you can watch footage of folks cutting through bamboo poles, pieces of armor, and hunks of dead animal. We contacted ARMA Director John Clements, who told us the group has experimented with "accurate replicas of medieval and Renaissance European war swords on freshly culled deer carcasses and pig carcasses and seen first hand that these weapons easily shear and cleave through flesh and bone with basic cutting blows." He said historical swords used in combat weren't necessarily as sharp as many assume. "There are videos on our website of fairly blunt blades achieving the same effects as notoriously sharp samurai katana. So, edge sharpness is not nearly as important as a hard and well-honed edge hitting forcefully with the correct geometry and energy."
http://tampa.creativeloafing.com/gyrobase/how_deadly_are_samurai_swords_/Content?oid=537334

The comment about the remains found at old Japanese battle sites ignores the fact that combatants routinely wore armor.

[rwheeler31]

6. Fewer senseless deaths why make killing easy?

[rucky]

7. Our Army would be made of ninjas.

that would be bad ass

[customerserviceguy]

9. When you consider the technology available at the time of the Second Amendment

Guns needed to be laboriously reloaded each time you wanted to fire one. With a sword, even a miss of the target leaves you free to take another swipe and have a chance at being successful.

In 1787, a madman with a sword could have killed far more people before being stopped than a madman with a firearm. Yet we still had the Second Amendment anyway.

[MrPerson]

16. Swords are arms. It did not say firearms.

[rl6214]

10. I would think

We would be using bows, arrows, crossbows, spears. We would have drive-by spearings. Fully automatic crossbows, which I actually believe the Japanese developed in the 1800's.

[MrPerson]

20. And people would be defending their right to own them.

And calling me a troll for thinking its dumb.

[rl6214]

33. But according to your logic in other threads

If we did away with guns, there would be no more mass killings. Now you are saying we would have to ban bows and arrows and crossbows and slingshots and spears and spearguns and...

[MrPerson]

46. No. There would be mass killings. They used machetes in Rwanda.

Just not many here.

[Name removed]

12. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[MrPerson]

13. Yeah. Just imagine.

[Name removed]

15. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[MrPerson]

17. I don't understand why you have to adopt that tone with me.

I have as much right to post here as you do.

Who do you think you are?

[pipoman]

19. Your repeated off topic posts violate the rules of this forum

Since we re-organized our forums, DU now has two forums for discussions relating to Guns and 2nd Amendment issues. Each of those forums has a specific purpose. Help us keep posts on-topic in each of those forums.

Discussion of gun-related public policy issues or the use of firearms for self-defense belong in the Guns Forum.

Personal-interest discussion about guns and weaponry should be posted in the Outdoor Life Group. By "personal interest" I mean, any discussion that is unrelated to public policy, such as: Posting pictures of guns or discussing the leisure activities of hunting or shooting.

Currently, the outdoor life group hosts discussions related to a number of outdoor activities, including hunting, fishing, skiing, hiking, climbing, and camping. Members are reminded to be respectful of individuals that engage in any of these activities.

DU moderators have the authority to move threads which are placed in the wrong forum or group.

Your posts violate the rules of DU.

4. Content: Do not post messages that are inflammatory, extreme, divisive, incoherent, or otherwise inappropriate. Do not engage in anti-social, disruptive, or trolling behavior. Do not post broad-brush, bigoted statements. The moderators and administrators work very hard to enforce some minimal standards regarding what content is appropriate. But please remember that this is a large and diverse community that includes a broad range of opinion. People who are easily offended, or who are not accustomed to having their opinions (including deeply personal convictions) challenged may not feel entirely comfortable here. A thick skin is necessary to participate on this or any other discussion forum.

[MrPerson]

21. Just because you disagree with me doesn't make me a troll.

Nothing in your post even approximates anything I've posted in this thread.

But calling me out does violate DU rules.

[pipoman]

22. Your OP is a troll post

There are plenty of people on this forum who I disagree with regularly and never call them anything. All 5 of your current posts are troll posts and none of them are "Discussion of gun-related public policy issues or the use of firearms for self-defense"...none of them.

[MrPerson]

23. All of them are discussion of gun policy.

I'm in favor of banning guns.

Like many countries have.

I hope you caught that.

You must disagree.

But pick on someone else.

[MrPerson]

24. BTW the shooting in Pittsburgh happened near me.

So maybe its on my mind.

[pipoman]

25. Maybe you should try posting some coherent post

based onyour beliefs then. These repeated oneliner, meaningless, silly, whatif posts constitute trolling. They have abosolutely not one single fucking thing to do with public policy, are you 12? If you are a youngster, you should make that known and I would likely cut you some slack.

[MrPerson]

26. Stop the insults or you get nowhere with me.

[pipoman]

28. Nobody is getting anywhere with you because you don't discuss

you post oneliners...1500 posts in 60 days. All of your posts in the gungeon are oneliners, and all are mindless, childish tripe.

[MrPerson]

30. Thats kind of a broad brush statement.

And whether it is mindless or childish is your opinion. I hope everything you post here is well thought out in the future. You don't know me, but I like being pithy. It helps keep me from boring people. Do you like long boring posts?

I can do boring.

[pipoman]

34. Pithy huh? O'Reilly much?

[MrPerson]

35. Just stop it. I watch KO when How I Met your Mother isn't on.

I can't stand O'Reilly.

I'm pithy because I'm trained to be. I'm a lawyer. A 50 year old one.

[pipoman]

36. "A 50 year old one." huh? LOLOLOLOL

[MrPerson]

37. What do you do? Frost cakes?

[pipoman]

Sometimes

[MrPerson]

39. Don't underestimate me.

[pipoman]

41. I'm sure you know how to run the google machine.

After all you're a lawyer...a 50 year old one..:D

[MrPerson]

45. WIth access to Westlaw too.

[MrPerson]

38. Look like 50. Feel like 30. Act like 20.

Nothing hurts. Everything works.

[pipoman]

42. Write like 12.

[MrPerson]

43. I win cases with that style.

[MrPerson]

47. Judges hate to read.

[rl6214]

40. A trained lawyer huh?

So when are you going to go before the supreme court and argue that the RKBA is not a civil right?

You'll let us all know how that works out for you won't you?

[MrPerson]

44. When someone pays me to. Or it comes up in a BK case.

[MrPerson]

27. Posts which have made several people think.

But apparently not you.

[pipoman]

29. There isn't anyone 'thinking' in this thread,

there isn't any brilliant revelations, or more importantly no discussion of "gun-related public policy issues or the use of firearms for self-defense".

[MrPerson]

31. You sound like Leonard "Pinth" Garnell.

[MrPerson]

32. I disgree. I've learned several things in the past few minutes.

[rl6214]

18. Now, now

Don't be calling mrperson a troll, he dosen't take very kindly to that.

[krispos42]

14. A kid in South Dakota killed 1, wounded 3 people with a sword about 2 years ago

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=389&topic_id=63253

[Euromutt]

48. We'd still be stuck in the Middle Ages

One of the nice things about guns is that you can train people to use them effectively in much less time than it takes to become proficient with sword, lance, mace, and fighting both from horseback and on foot wearing full armor. In other words, it allows a hastily trained peasant to shoot a professional parasite like a knight or samurai off his horse. That's why the Tokugawa shogunate banned guns for so long. Personally, I consider the gun to be one of the nails in the coffin of feudalism.

[Joe Steel]

49. Just Point and Pull

We'd be using swords in our serial killings and citing the second amendment.

Maybe not.

Hacking-away body parts with a sword is hard work. Some potential killers might not have the energy for the effort and might not want to deal with the blood and screaming.

That's why we have guns.

Guns make killing quick and convenient. You don't have swing a heavy sword and chop-away at your victim for maybe 5 minutes until you've butchered him. Just point and pull. Let Sam Colt do the rest.