Ok, so, in five sentences, can anyone say why we need/don't need the AWB?

[NoodleBoy]

I'm nowhere near an expert on this, and I'll I've been able to find sounds like fluff.

[Trajan]

1. To please DU Gun nuts .....

Five words ??? ...

[derby378]

2. I'll try...

Why We Don't Need The AWB:

1. Too many Second Amendment issues to juggle.
2. Banned more than just 19 military semi-autos - also extended to some pump shotguns.
3. Kerry needs to win some Southern states.
4. Democrats champion freedom and civil rights - the AWB seems to run counter to this.

[Lefty48197]

12. Correction: Kerry doesn't need any southern states.

Not one.

[wtmusic]

3. Calling FatSlob

Resident AWB proponent

[mark414]

4. what i'd like to know

is that if it just bans "cosmetics" or whatever, then why is it such a big fucking deal if it was renewed?

[Fescue4u]

6. Were cosmetics worth the loss of the presidency?

The house, Senate, and several S.C appointees?

Thats the big fucking deal.

[Lefty48197]

11. Can you believe how stupid some of these people are?

They'll let their jobs be shipped overseas, their pensions be raided by the rich, and they'll let the tax code be rewritten to transfer the tax burden to themselves. They'll let the national debt hit record highs, indebting their unborn great grandchildren. They'll let millions of Americans be denied their Constitutional voting rights throught the Republican census undercount of African-Americans and several other modus operandi. They'll let their own Constitutional rights be repealed, including their first, fourth, and fifth amendment rights. They'll let corporate America write the very laws that regulate themselves, allowing the biggest rip off of the American consumer since the days of Upton Sinclair's "The Jungle". These misguided voters will even let millions of Americans live without health insurance. They'll let poor people starve, live on the streets, and die of untreated illness, all in the name of owning AK47's.
Some people just have a warped sense of priorities, don't they?

[MrBenchley]

14. By the way, speaking of stupid....

how about the people who want to pretend that it was a principled stand by Democrats that is to blame for the loss of power and not the multi-million dollar propaganda campaign against the Democrats by some of the scummiest right wingers around.

[Township75]

19. I can't believe how stupid some of these people are...

These people willll let their jobs be shipped overseas, their pensions be raided by the rich, and they'll let the tax code be rewritten to transfer the tax burden to themselves. They'll let the national debt hit record highs, indebting their unborn great grandchildren. They'll let millions of Americans be denied their Constitutional voting rights throught the Republican census undercount of African-Americans and several other modus operandi. They'll let their own Constitutional rights be repealed, including their first, fourth, and fifth amendment rights. They'll let corporate America write the very laws that regulate themselves, allowing the biggest rip off of the American consumer since the days of Upton Sinclair's "The Jungle". These misguided voters will even let millions of Americans live without health insurance. They'll let poor people starve, live on the streets, and die of untreated illness, all in the name of thinking they are banning an AK47. They insist our party adopt their anti gun fetish at the expense of our party.
Some people just have a warped sense of priorities, don't they?

[MrBenchley]

13. Because the "cosmetics" line is horseshit...

but then what about the RKBA cause isn't horseshit?

On the other hand, while the issue may be horseshit, it's got some of the scummiest public figures in the world pushing it.

[MsUnderstood]

5. Both sides?

We need the AWB because it bans some of the more dangerous guns. It doesn't do a complete job, but it does take several dangerous guns out of circulation/distribution. With a ban in place, using these guns in crime will result in harsher penalties. None of the guns banned will infringe on a person's right to protect his/her home or hunt because these guns are used for mass attack not personal defense.

We don't need the AWB because it is a poorly written legislation created to try to balance the second amendment and law enforcement protection but does neither. It does not ban guns that should be illegal and bans guns that have a legitimate purpose other than massacarring a neighborhood. If the gun ban was effective, wouldn't we have seen a drop in crime?

Well that is all I got with no research. . .

[jtb33]

7. I'll try...

Why we DON'T need the AWB:

1) Criminals don't obey laws.
2) It will only affect law-abiding citizens.
3) It doesn't affect those who don't obey the laws.
4) For clarification: Criminals don't obey laws.
5) Oh, and lastly; criminals don't obey laws.

[Lefty48197]

8. That kid from Clinton Township

(Michigan that is - The one who was stocking up on guns to do a Columbine imitation).

[MrBenchley]

9. How about that idiot in Illinois who was going "liberal hunting"?

You remember, the one who had the death list.

[MrBenchley]

10. Here's why we need it

1) There's no reason to let the gun industry market a public menace
2) There's no reason anyone needs an assault weapon
3) There's no reason to risk letting the sort of paranoid gump who is drawn to guns get his hands on assault weapons
4) There's no reason to risk having terrorists, criminals and lunatics get their hands on assault weapons.
5) The assault weapons ban is a thumb in the eye of the GOP, the NRA, and all sorts of other right wing nuts.

[-..__...]

15. What is best in life...

...To crush the gun-grabbers, see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentations of Sarah Brady!

Regaining "evil features" and "normal capacity" magazines at a reasonable cost is certainly a big plus.

The real benefit (reward), was watching the VPC/MMM/Brady Campaign have a
major set-back and cerebral meltdown.

[DHard3006]

16. the right to bear arms shall not be infringed!

The 2nd amend gives one reason and only one reason to bear arms. It is your right to do so. What reason do we give to exercise the 1st amend other then it is my right to do so.

[MrBenchley]

17. The nicknames come and go, the NRA propaganda endures...

"The 2nd amend gives one reason and only one reason to bear arms"
As part of a well regulated militia for the defense of the state....as the courts have affirmed again and again and again and again.

"We believe that the constitutional right to bear arms is primarily a collective one, intended mainly to protect the right of the states to maintain militias to assure their own freedom and security against the central government. In today's world, that idea is somewhat anachronistic and in any case would require weapons much more powerful than handguns or hunting rifles. The ACLU therefore believes that the Second Amendment does not confer an unlimited right upon individuals to own guns or other weapons nor does it prohibit reasonable regulation of gun ownership, such as licensing and registration. "

http://archive.aclu.org/library/aaguns.html

Incidentally, the assault weapons ban was challenged several times in court, most notably in Silviera v Lockyer...and found to be completely constitutional on Second Amendment grounds.

[DHard3006]

21. The nicknames come and go, but the gun hater propaganda endures...

These words ‘the right of the people” are used in some of the other amendments that are claimed to be individual rights. So how does it become a collective right in the 2nd amendment? They are the very same words.

The aclu is allowed to have their opinion.

If the AWB was so good why was it allowed to sunset? The AWB was only suppose to sunset if it did not lower crime, or the elected officials them there people called senators or representatives would bring it up for renewal.

Would you like to know why no elected official brought it up for renewal. Because per Clinton himself, at least 20 people that voted for the AWB lost their seats in the next elections.

[DonP]

18. FWIW, here's 4 points to try and make sense of the mess.

1. The "ban" didn't really ban specific weapons or even types of weapons. It banned a combination of two or more specific features like a bayonet lug, a pistol grip, adjustable stock, a flash hider (hides the flash from the shooter to prevent night blindness, not the target) and magazines of more than 10 rounds.

2. The so called "assault weapons" (invented term, trying to sound like an assault rifle which really is a machine gun) were mid-power (as opposed to higher powered rounds like a deer rifle at .30 caliber) semi-auto (one trigger pull - one shot) not "high powered", "machine guns", "bullet hoses" etc. in any way shape or form.

(And no they can not be easily converted to full auto with some gum and a paper clip, in spite of what some truly ignorant types that have never worked on them or used one try to pass off as fact. Besides, if you get caught with the parts trying to convert one it's called "constructive possession", and it's worth ten years in Club Fed and a $250,000 fine)

3. All of the guns involved were for sale with the "evil" features removed, complying with the law, for the entire 10 years of the ban. A muzzle brake replaced a flash hider, no bayonet lug, a fixed stock, ten round magazines etc.

4. The sunset has not seemed to put the "flood" of these guns on the street (at $600 to $900 each for the AR-15 versions and about $350 and up for the AK style semi autos) any more than the 46 (or is it 45 still ?) states now with concealed carry have resulted in the road rage shootings we were all threatened with.

That's my shot at explaining it.

[Paladin]

20. Try This Little Experiment

Go to the next big gun show in your area, and position yourself where you have a clear view of two exhibits: one table full of AK-47's, and another table of vintage sporting arms, like Belgian-made Browning over-and-under shotguns, or pre-64 Model 70 Winchester rifles. Spend several hours looking at and comparing the sort of people who show up and linger around each table. Then go have a beer to celebrate your new knowledge that the Assault Weapons Ban was a great idea........

[Wickerman]

22. Locking - for the last 8 days Gungeon policy is that all AWB topics

go in existing AWB topics. Please feel free to repost there.