New Osama Bin Ladin Video from December 2001...

[JackRiddler]

[JackRiddler]

1. Preemptive Note: I saw this and copied the image link...

Have not followed on to the site, don't endorse the site and don't care.

[jberryhill]

3. It's cute

It's irritating when folks jump on one for having found a useful image without checking the rest of the origin site, and draw conclusions from it.

I, for one, wouldn't read anything into that.

I used a photobucket image once that came from an account that had other, and unknown to me, offensive things in it.

The notion of a kidney dialysis patient still hiding or on the run does seem farfetched. How much was known about the specific diagnosis way back when?

[JackRiddler]

4. Dialysis

Like with so much about OBL, it's shrouded in secrecy and apocrypha. But he's said to have this crippling kidney condition.

Two items I find very interesting:

CBS News reported that on 9/10/2001, Bin Laden was in a Pakistan Military Hospital
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2002/01/28/eveningnews/main325887.shtml

Recalling reports of CIA-Bin Ladin meeting in Dubai, July 2001
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=125x197990

Just for kicks, a photo someone posted there:

[KDLarsen]

5. Except there's no evidence of him having said kidney condition

There is, however, anecdotal evidence of him suffering from low blood pressure.

By the way, interesting photo. Steve Coll has the same one in his book on the bin Laden family, and he mentions that there's no evidence of Osama bin Laden being on that trip at all. Mind you, he was 12 at the time.

ETA: Bad memory; Steve Coll wrote, that several sources close to the family stated that Osama was not on the trip. Also, The Sun isn't exactly the most trustworthy of sources either..

[JackRiddler]

6. What qualifies to you as evidence?

The reports of his 2001 hospital stays as delivered and sourced by Le Figaro and CBS are evidence. They aren't proof, they may be wrong, but they are evidence.

So are these reports:

July 2, 2001: Osama bin Laden Periodically Undergoes Dialysis with Approval of the ISI

Indian sources claim that “bin Laden, who suffers from renal deficiency, has been periodically undergoing dialysis in a Peshawar military hospital with the knowledge and approval of the Inter-Services Intelligence (ISI), if not of Musharraf himself.” (SAPRA (New Delhi), 7/2/2001) While one might question the bias of an Indian newspaper on this issue, highly respected intelligence newsletter Jane’s Intelligence Digest later reports the story, and adds, “None of (these details) will be unfamiliar to US intelligence operatives who have been compiling extensive reports on these alleged activities.” (Jane's Intelligence Digest, 9/20/2001) CBS will later report bin Laden had emergency medical care in Pakistan the day before 9/11. (CBS News, 1/28/2002) If these stories are true, it appears Pakistan could have captured bin Laden for the US at any time. The Jane’s Intelligence Digest article adds, “It is becoming clear that both the Taliban and al-Qaeda would have found it difficult to have continued functioning—including the latter group’s terrorist activities—without substantial aid and support from Islamabad (Pakistan).” (Jane's Intelligence Digest, 9/20/2001)

http://www.historycommons.org/context.jsp?item=a070201renal

Here's a collection of partly conflicting claims:
http://www.doctorzebra.com/prez/a_binladen.htm

Among others, Peter Bergen leans one way, Lawrence Wright another.

This claim cites a PBS Frontline hour and sounds like evidence to me:

"A journalist who visited bin Laden's camp in the 1990s reported camp members saying that bin Laden had a kidney problem requiring him to drink large amounts of water. The journalist witnessed bin Laden constantly sipping water and green tea in the time they spent together."

[JackRiddler]

8. kick

[rollingrock]

2. Dead men tell no tales

I doubt he lived very long after that "photo" was taken.

[Bushknew]

7. Hee Hee : - )