We must prepare to run a Southerner in 08

[Thrill]

A governor would be ideal.

Phil Breseden and Mike Easley would be my choices.

Stop with this Hilary crap. We must run one of these guys.

[Teaser]

1. Yeah...but even then...

They are still Democrats. That might be enough, anymore, to insure their defeat in the South.

[ShaneGR]

2. There really is no question... Mark Warner

Without a doubt.

[aldian159]

7. Absolutly

No doubt about it. Warner needs to run.

[theHandpuppet]

9. Oh yeah... Mr Republican Lite

Remind me again why I'm a DEMOCRAT.

[greenohio]

14. Apparently so you can lose....

If all you care about is principle then you should have voted for nader. The idea is to win. We need a moderate... or we lose. Learn it or live it.

[theHandpuppet]

23. So in order to WIN...

... we have to lose our principles in the process. No thanks. that's not "winning" in my book.

[Joe the Revelator]

27. How does Mark Warner "go against your principals"?

He's a good,strong democrat.

[ShaneGR]

51. The bottom line is the guy isn't Dennis Kucinich, so he's Rep Lite

Poster doesn't know one thing about Warner, except he's a southern Democrat.

[SeanQ]

41. Agreed, that's not winning at all,

[Nazgul35]

37. we ran a moderate....

At least one who ran from the liberal label..

and we lost....

Tell me again when this strategy is supposed to work?

We are 0-3 now, quite a losing streak.

Your response is to be even more to the right?

What was that comment about digging a hole and knowing when to stop.....

[Joe the Revelator]

18. Oh horse shit....

Mark Warner would be a strong choice to move the country back to the left

[ShaneGR]

46. Explain to me why he's Republican Lite....

Please

[formernaderite]

81. Warner is too pretty and not really southern.

..if that matters....where's he from..Kansas?

[Richardson08]

3. Does Bill Richardson count?Clinton democrat

[KitSileya]

4. Why must we pander to them?

Why must we become more republican than the republicans to have a chance? If Michael Moore is right, what we need to do is expose the Cheney fear campaign, and run a proper liberal! Nail the issues, expose the republicans, and *make* people understand what's at stake, even if you have to starve them first!

[Richardson08]

6. Clinton and Carter were southern democrats,LBJ was a southerner

keep running the liberals and you feel this way again in four years

[Thrill]

8. Its not pandering to them

We are giving our best chance to win. Easley may be the closest thing to Bill Clinton. He's a charming guy. We win with Southern guys. Face it. The JFK's of the world won't win with the hate being spilled from the right. We must go with a moderate

[theHandpuppet]

19. It IS pandering

I'm tired of bending over to grab may ankles in order to woo the "Southern vote". If some southerners won't vote for a good man simply because he (or she) is from north of the Mason-Dixon line, then they're idiots and what we'd have to give up in order to buy their vote isn't worth it -- NOT TO ME.

[Thrill]

21. Yeah then you must be happy with losing

[theHandpuppet]

5. WHY?

Notherners would vote for a Southern Dem candidate and have in many recent elections. Why is the reverse not true? Are you hinting that Southerners are bigoted? I don't give a flying fuck where a candidate comes from as long as they're a GOOD candidate that represents the ideals of my party. If that's not good enough for Southerners (including my fellow WVirginians), then SCREW THEM!

[KitSileya]

13. I agree, Handpuppet!

We cannot win if we become republicans in order to win!

[TriMetFan]

29. Man I left the Republican Party 1988 and I'm not ready to go back!

[K8-EEE]

10. Fuck That!!! Pandering To The South

won't work. The utter failure of Shrub's policy's, which Dumbya America for some reason believes will work, will be the death of the GOP. Iraq will be the death of them, but unfortunately, death of a lot of others to :o(

[davepc]

17. lets keep running northeaster liberals

and wonder why next time we cant even win Wisconsin and Michigan.

[theHandpuppet]

36. You really consider Kerry a "liberal"?

Jeezus! He was actually too conservative for me, but I was willing to concede that within the party he would be considered a moderate.

[Nazgul35]

39. news flash....

we won those states.....

Perhaps we could continue with the strategy of running right leaning Dems and wonder why we lose everywhere....maybe we could try that for a change...

[ShaneGR]

52. You mean....like Clinton?

Just wondering.

[Nazgul35]

64. Clinton didn't win because he was from the south...

he won because he is the ultimate politican....he has game!

If he came from Mass he would have done just as well.....

The problem with the democrats is that they think the Clinton success was on the rightward move (which he didn't do until 1995 BTW...he won in 1992 be running as a left-center candidate until Perot forced him to the center).....

Clinton won because he was Clinton. Until you find another one you better get over this idea of moving to the right.

[greenohio]

11. Forget the South, the battle is in the Midwest...

We need a new democrat from the midwest.

[The Chronicler]

25. The problem is that the 'Southern Syndrome' is beginning

to bleed into the midwest.

[Bush was AWOL]

12. Yes. Mark Warner, Easley, Rendell, Richardson, Bayh

If we want to win, that is who has to run.

[amandabeech]

70. Not Rendell.

He's governor of Pennsylvania, but he comes off as a northeastern city type. I believe that he grew up in New York and of course was the mayor of Philadelphia.

I'm from a small town in the midwest and now I live in the Alabama section of Pennsylvania. Rendell doesn't fly in either place.

[Name removed]

15. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[WI_DEM]

16. How tiring this is

We in the North can vote for southerners but southerners can't vote for a northerner. I'm tired with that mindset. We had Gore a southerner on the ticket in '00 and not one southern state was won, we had a attractive southerner on the ticket this time and he couldn't even win his own state along with a bonafide war hero.

[JPJones]

20. No. The whole party has to change. We have

to win back the red states on a national level. This fighting over Ohio and Florida is a losing game.

[Blaukraut]

22. The south is lost

Even to a Dem FROM the South. Look at what happened to Max Cleland. I honestly believe that it makes no difference as to where our next candidate comes from. We won't be carrying southern states for a long time to come - until their demographics change drastically.

[Cobalt Violet]

31. Or we secede.

Which I have been in favor of since the contract on America. I just keep seeing it as the only way to end the fascist rule. The south clearly wants a Theocratic Fascist country. I say let them have it. Take the money from the Northeast and West Coast away from them and see what they have left.

[TriMetFan]

24. Well the only true choices here are people like:

Hilary and Obama. We also need to get some of the Republicans out of congress in 2006. Now is the time to roll up our sleeves and work for any and all elections between now in 2006. Even if they are just for a school board! Its time to take over!

[Doohickie]

32. Those two are unelectable

Even moreso than Howard Dean. Dean's problem was the gay marriage in Vermont thing. Hillary, aside from having two many X chromosomes, is to closely linked to that other President Clinton. There's no reason to drag up all that history again. Obama may be a future president, but not in that near of a future. He only just entered national politics and could be a shooting star. Even if he looks strong in 2008, he may be too pigmented. I hate to sound bigoted, but it isn't whether you think he's a good guy, it's whether he is electable. I don't think the country is ready to electe a female or minority president. Think what the Rove Machine would do with them (remember he deals in perception, not reality).

[Onlooker]

26. Maybe Jim Hightower, but otherwise it won't work

Don't you get it, the conservatives WILL NOT vote Democratic. We need some real change in the Democratic Party. It needs to be the party for the poor and middle class, not for the middle class alone. We need a well of new voters that's equal in size the fundies.

[Hello_Kitty]

28. Who? Zell Miller?

[Cobalt Violet]

30. Oh, Do we have a Democrat Southerner?

Isn't that a oxymoron.

[theHandpuppet]

48. Even Max Cleland...

... wasn't "Southern enough" or conservative enough for Georgia!

[HootieMcBoob]

33. General Wesley Clark

Hands Down.

[Kat45]

72. I agree on Clark

[MinnesotaMike31]

83. Bring on the General! General Clark on the ticket in '08

[Borgnine]

34. Don't you see? There's not going to be a 2008.

It doesn't matter what we do. BBV has ensured we'll never win. I won't be surprised if they don't just drop the whole election pretense all together and make Bush emperor for life.

[ibegurpard]

35. Oh for chrissake!

You think we can get more conservative than Brad Carson in Oklahoma? He lost. We could clone Tom Delay and run him as a Democrat and he would LOSE because a LARGE group of MOTIVATED FANATICS are convinced that Democrats are immoral, devil-worshipping satanists who want to eat their children.
We're looking at years of toiling in the muck to build an infrastructure that can counteract the Republican/christian fundamentalist propaganda machine. The deck is stacked against us because the fascists are now in a position to shut down all avenues of resistance.
That's what we're looking at. It's not like some romantic movie where we ride in to save the day in one battle. It's going to be ugly, boring, and unrewarding in the short term.

[pstokely]

38. Oklahoma isn't a Southern state

it's a Great Plains state

[ibegurpard]

57. Culturally, Oklahoma is about as "southern" as you can get

Speaking about it in the sense that many here do.

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

40. Yeah, maybe someone anti-abortion, pro-gun and anti environmental

would help :eyes:

[theHandpuppet]

43. I'm only surprised they haven't thrown...

... Zell Miller's name into the ring, if WINNING the South is the only thing that matters.

[americanwomanone]

54. TED NUGENT!! Oh nevermind he's a Repug.

In fact he was hanging out in Crawford. Now if we could just get him to leave Michigan totally!

[Nazgul35]

42. Perhaps if we stopped fucusing on regions

and started focusing on appealing to specific groups of voters....we may start winning elections again....


Nah....who am I kiding, that would be smart.

[SeanQ]

47. Here here

[RummyTheDummy]

44. Sen. Mark Pryor (D-Arkansas)

That's the kind of guy (sadly) we will need to win it.

[SeanQ]

45. Or someone from the mid-west.

Someone with solid Dem values, good fiscal record, good speaker, but shows willingness to compromise and work with centrist repub's. And has yards of backbone.

[Q]

49. Hayzeus! If you think all we need to do is run a 'Southerner'...

...then the party really IS in trouble.

- Why do we keep going after someone else's base instead of our own?

[rullery]

50. Democrats have lost touch with people in the heartland.

Too many people who live along the coasts consider the heartland as "flyover country", and those folks resent it. Democrats need to reach out to them and not sterotype them as country bumpkins, if we are ever to regain our majority status. Too many of us belittle evangelical Christians for instance, so they turn to Republicans.

Carter and Clinton were Democrats the people could relate to, but not Kerry. Progressives may find it painful to compromise, but if we want to win national elections it may be necessary IMHO.

[QC]

53. Good post.

There's a class dimension to recent elections, including yesterday's, that we have absolutely got to get a handle on if we are going to start winning again.

[amandabeech]

71. Yes. Class. The forbidden word in American politics.

Do you want to be accused of class warfare? And lose all your contributions? It'll take some guts, but maybe it is the thing to do.

[K8-EEE]

60. No, The "Heartland" Is Full Of Stupid Biggoted Dumbasses

Who will vote for the likes of GWB no matter WHO runs against him.

[realcountrymusic]

55. No!

I won't vote for a southerner unless s/he is black, gay, or atheist.

rcm

[Taverner]

56. No way

If the Dems are going back to the bible belt to win, than I want out.

Fuck the funides.

[Name removed]

58. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[RPM]

59. Great...

bend over for the southern shitheads - fuck that

[Carni]

61. I don't agree

I mean no disrespect to Southern Du'ers (I know you're normal)
but I just don't see the point of just slapping a person with a southern accent in place to try to lure some of bush's Christian values buffoons into the party (It won't work anyway.)

Now if there is some great candidate that just happens to be southern that would be different... but IMO southern/northern doesn't matter --the problem is this damned Christian coalition contingent and their whacked out so called "values"

I still think BTW that Diebold had a hand in these election results.

[realcountrymusic]

62. Bush is NOT a Southerner

Do not play into the Bush=Cowboy/Texan/goodoldboy BS. He's a Harvard, Yale and ANdover educated momma's boy from Connecticut. Real cowboys have honor, no matter what their politics.

So I guess we need to slap some blue jeans and some y'alls on John Kerry and buy him a "ranch" in Oklahoma. Yeah, then we'll win.

rcm

[Stuckinthebush]

73. No, but his image is

And the fools bought it.

That is all that mattered.

[amandabeech]

76. He only played one on TV. n/t

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

63. Haven't we learned yet that pandering to the south doesn't work?

Did anyone notice how much good Edwards did us? Or, for that matter Clinton? Or, Carter? Or, (ugh!) Carville?

[QC]

67. Looks like writing off the south doesn't work too well either. n/t

[PROGRESSIVE1]

65. Jim Hunt/Mark Warner 08'!

[donhakman]

66. Proof we are still fighting the Civil War.

The south has been avenged.

[IrateCitizen]

68. Making the same mistake over and over again...

And before you start, I'm NOT referring to the simple idea of running a Southerner in 2008. If a Southerner wins the primaries, then he/she will be the nominee.

What I'm referring to is the idea that elections are somehow a SPRINT. What I'm NOT hearing in this post is just as important -- perhaps more so -- than what I am hearing. What I'm NOT hearing is anything about IDEAS. What I'm NOT hearing is anything about engaging these people in DIALOGUE. What I'm NOT hearing is anything about building a sustainable grassroots MOVEMENT.

I wonder if many of us actually learn anything at all from our mistakes. Our problem is not about what part of the country our nominee is from. Our problem is about the party, in its top eschelons, not fucking LISTENING to people anymore! That was the big contribution of Howard Dean this year -- the bottom-up campaign strategy. He didn't win, but he came out of nowhere to make an impact because he LISTENED to what people said, and tried to address their concerns. He obviously had some glaring flaws as a candidate too, otherwise he would have been the nominee. But we cannot discount the impact he had on steering progressives away from "politics as usual" and showing an alternative political model that can actually work.

Conservative activist Richard Viguerie told Bill Moyers on last week's NOW, "I get up every morning and think, 'What 5 or 6 things can I do to advance the conservative cause?' The liberals look at politics as a sprint that comes around every few years."

The success of the Republicans in the South is something that was borne out of YEARS of organizing. It didn't happen overnight. Expecting simply a nominee from the South to change things is the height of foolishness, IMHO. Gore was from the South and he didn't overcome this problem. Edwards was from the South and he didn't seem to help too much on this front, either.

[ibegurpard]

77. THANK YOU!

This scrambling about to look for the next "icon," is maddening.

[calico1]

79. Well said! I totally agree! n/t

[Beacho]

69. Maybe four more years of the GOP whip on southern backs

will wake southerners up to vote for their own interests, at least.

They need to wake the hell up first, before anything will happen.


Life's going to get very hard south of the Mason-Dixon, since even the pork is going to dry up under this administration. There won't be money for churches either, inder the 'faith based' give away program. Then it gets fun.

Sorry, suffering is the only way

[Droopy]

80. I'm beginning to think the same way

People won't wake up until they actually start suffering. Unfortunately that's going to mean a lot of lost jobs, foreclosed homes and a lot of kids not attending college. And possibly a draft.

[hatrack]

74. Doesn't matter if he's a Southerner - that's not the main point

To win southern states, he'd have to be an evangelical Christian who opposes abortion, gay marriages, civil unions, stem-cell research and the separation of church and state, and who favors the "War On Terror", the Patriot Act, tax cuts, loosening automatic weapon rules and a Constitutional ban on flag-burning.

In other words, he'd have to be a Republican.

Oh, and an uncanny ability to scare the shit out of people with vague terror threats would be an asset as well.

On Edit: It would also help to be a southerner.

[redstateblues]

75. Phil Bredesen is from Massachusetts- He's a good gov. for TN but he's not

a southerner

[LSK]

78. how would a southerner beat the Diebold machines??

[Touchdown]

82. Oh' god. Here it comes again.

:eyes: The south is the SAVIOR of the democratic party, once again. Listen to them, dem Southerners have SUCH SUCCESSES in their own states. Sonny Perdue anyone?

This calls for two..:eyes: