What Do You Think Will Actually Happen If The "Nuclear Option" "Succeeds"?

[Dinger]

I think there WILL be a revolt. It will be the American Revolution Part II

[LSdemocrat]

1. What makes you think anyone but the most ardent activists care about this?

[stevedeshazer]

2. What makes you say that?

Seems like a reasonable question.

[Deja Q]

3. Because the sheeple, many who voted *, are BRAINWASHED:

brainwashed to believe the media is liberal. STILL LIBERAL. (which is an utter and outright LIE.)

Amongst other things.

Ignorant, indolent, brainwashed, stupid, or genuinely evil, the sheeple won't give a fuck. It's been that way for YEARS.

Even in the 1983 miniseries "V" (and its 1984 followup), as the media had been taken over by the alien fascists, the rebels cynically commented how the people would buy it. Seems strange how they were right, but 21 years too early.

[stevedeshazer]

7. Sure, I understand that

Though I detest the term "sheeple".

I don't agree that it won't get a lot of attention if it happens, however.

Not sure how an '80's sci-fi miniseries has any bearing on this reality.

:shrug:

[0007]

39. Great photo!

[BattyDem]

4. I mentioned the "nuclear option" to someone recently ...

The person is intelligent and tries to stay informed, though she's not an "activist" type. She had no idea what the f*ck I was talking about.

Let's face it ... the average person hasn't got a clue that this is happening and the few who have heard something about it, don't understand why it's important.

We're f*cked. :-(

[renaissanceguy]

11. The media won't help us either.

They'll just label the Dems as obstructionists.


http://www.cafepress.com/liberalissues.15010804

[amjucsc]

21. Unfortunately I have to agree...

To most people a 'filibuster' is just a funny word. (Just go up to someone, point at their fly, and say, 'your filibuster is showing'. See what happens.)

We'll f-word this into the ground of course. I suspect the Reps are just trying to manufacture some mud for the '06 elections. Who wins the spin on this is anybody's guess.

[stevedeshazer]

5. I don't know what will happen, but the Dems should walk out if it does

The Senate needs 51 (or 50 plus Dick Cheney) for a quorum.

We've got just 44 plus St. James Jeffords (I-VT), so they could overcome this rule http://rules.senate.gov/senaterules/rule06.htm if they want to.

[Emit]

20. End unanimous consent...

Pepperbelly discussed it here, and the article on this thread explains a lot:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=1713585&mesg_id=1713952&page=

[annabanana]

24. no more "accepted as read"

All the proposed bills, in all their glorious bulk, will have to be read aloud.

[Fescue4u]

44. That should be done anyway

At least that way SOMEBODY will have read it.

And if its to damn long to read, then its proably even more difficult to implement.

[annabanana]

25. no more "without objection"

I object!

[stevedeshazer]

38. thanks, I missed this earlier

[borg5575]

6. I doubt it.

I am Democrat who opposes Bush's court nominations, but let's face it, the so-called nuclear option is perfectly legal and if they use it there will be nothing we can do about it.

But I still don't think they'll use it. They may be evil but they're not stupid, and they know if they use it then when the Democrats regain the Senate majority they will use it too.

[napi21]

13. I've thought about that too, BUT...

I'm really afraid that the kooks who head the Senate are really convinced that they will NEVER loose power! I think they really believe that. Their arrogance in their statements and attitude indicates that.

I disagree. I think Shrub, his Admin, and Frist, DeLay, Hastert, and about 10 others have grossly over-reached already, and they're continuing to do so. I think, by the time another 3 1/2 years pass, a strong majority of our country will be upset enough to want a drastic change.

I just hope total disaster doesn't happen before that!

[mtnester]

26. I not only think they will use it, but they will do so repeatedly

After all, once you get the courts appointed with conservative fundamentalists, you win...and who is going to do anything to you? The people? And you cannot undo the appointments. And a judicial system favorable to your cause will thwart a liberal congress at every turn...so you don't even have to be in "control" of congress to win...you just have to be a lawyer or plaintiff. Once you climb through the ladder of "friendly judiciary" and get to the Supreme Court, you win.

And if you get it all done before the campaigning starts for 2006, you win because the American public has a short memory, and is ill-educated on the cause and effect of what you have permanently enacted.

Rehnquist can only wait so long you know.

[judgegina]

8. Revolt?

So many things have already happened that are much more worthy of a revolt. Theft of an election? Going to war on a pack of lies?

No, I'm afraid that most Americans will continue enjoying their Big Macs, super-sized, of course, and waiting for the next episode of American Idol.

Sorry.

[mmonk]

40. Other things are worthy of a revolt

but the fundamental change in the US that will occur with this does not put ths behind anything. For instance, once they determine that ADA is not viable under the constitution or 14 th amendment, my son loses his legal protections for the remainder of the lives of these so called appointments. Imagine if you suddenly had no legal protection. Once they determine congress overstepped its bounds with social security, lets see how people feel about losing their meagar safety net. Who's going to protect the minority from the tyranny of the majority? Nothing in the rhealm of law in the US if they get this.

[knight_of_the_star]

9. I doubt there will be widespread revolt

Although I will like seeing the GOP play chicken with Harry Reid.

[Nikki Stone 1]

10. Is the term "nuclear option" desensitizing us?

With the recent plans for "mini-nukes", I can't help wondering if this term for getting rid of the all important filibuster can make us blase when it is used for real attacks with real weapons.

Just a thought.

[renaissanceguy]

12. Damn good point.

They are big into their vocabulary, as there is a strategy behind every word they use.


http://www.cafepress.com/liberalissues.15010804

[AndyTiedye]

14. Good-Bye Democracy -- Hello Theocracy

The "nuclear option" would hand control of the Supreme Court over
to the Dominionists.

Once the Dominionists control the Supreme Court, it's all over.
There can be no way back for the Democrats after that.

With all three branches of government firmly under Dominion control,
they call the shots. They count the votes. They decide who won.
The political process as we used to know it would cease to exist.

I think there WILL be a revolt. It will be the American Revolution Part II

No popular revolution has ever prevailed against a theocracy.
Not in all of recorded history.

[Yupster]

15. My guess?

on what will happen.

The Senate will be shut down for a while as the minority will vow to stop everything.

Then the majority will bring up a few bills that are necessary to keep the government running and the minority will let them quickly pass so they won't look like horses asses.

Then some pretty innocuous stuff will be let through and only the controversial stuff will get hung up, and then the senate won't be shut down any more.

Remember when Newt shut the government down?

Clnton was smart to highlight necessary things that were being needlessly hurt by it. So the Republicans voted to open that part of the government, then this part, then that part.

Pretty soon, they were getting the blame for the government being shut down when most of it wasn't even. That's when they gave up.

I'd expect the same thing to happen here.

[More Than A Feeling]

18. Reps only got the blame when Newt started whining

about how Clinton made him sit in the back of Air Force One.

We stand on principle this time, we win. If the media call us obstructionist, fuck them.

There has to be something worth fighting for, even if we lose all the way down the line, and get run out of town for it. The filibuster is one of those things.

[0007]

28. Are you supporting the Democratic party in your area, Yupster?

I never see you at any of the functions or the Democratic meetings here in Midland.

Please read my Post #27 on this thread and observe how your assumptions may be wrong.

.....Why do you ignore fellow Midland DUers and fail to response?

[Yupster]

31. Apologize 0007

but I don't want to be known by what I say on DU. I say things about my family and job that I wouldn't want spoken of around town. I'm sure you understand that Midland is a very small town, especially for Democrats and I'd rather if I didn't have to watch everything I say because someone might tell someone who knows my customer or mother-in-law, etc.

I was going to ask that you say who you are, and I would tell you if you know me or not, but I really don't even want to do that and get into some sort of guessing game. So, apologies, but I relly don't want to say who I am. Hope you understand.

[0007]

34. I've never ever heard you talk about your family or your job here on

DU. So how can you be known by what you say here on this site?

Your telling me indirectly that you don't want the folks in Midland to know that you MAY be a Democratic type of guy, because it may be bad light for you? And the folks in Midland wouldn't do business with a crummy rotten commie Dem, 'eh? I got news for you, I'm well respected in Midland among the many Republicans that know me. I am proud of what I am and that I belong to the Democrotic Party.

Don't you think you ought to come out of hiding and get to know some of the Democratic folks here in town? There are even a few here at DU. The "Veterans Rally for Kerry" drew three hundred people in the Midland Center last November. Doctors, Attorneys, and professionals of all sorts. Where were YOU?

I've sent you PM's and responded to your many post. Today is the first time I hear from you. WHY? Did I ever ask you who you were? NO! Did I ask you to play a guessing name game, NO! All I ever wanted from you was some acknowledgment that we had something in common to fight for. You've avoided me like the plague, for two years now.

Your sincerity is highly questionable, because I think I know where your coming from!

[enough already]

47. Agreed

Rove is smart enough to see how Clinton bashed their brains in on shutting down the government. Following through on a shut down will backfire big time, just like it did on Gingrich. This thing needs to be beaten back up front. Childish antics after the fact will only compound a loss.

[Strawman]

16. I wonder of they will go beyond filling vacancies

Assuming the Republicans fill every vacancy with the judges they want, I know that overall the courts will become more conservative, but how specifically does that influence each court that is affected?

What is scary is what will happen if the right is not satisfied and demands that they go even further and pack the SCOTUS and the federal courts.

I don't think that will happen. But that's where the ante gets raised to if this goes through. When the courts still aren't right wing enough for the fundies, that's what they'll want next.

I think that after the nuclear option is used, there will be some short term effort by the Dems to tie the Senate into knots, but ultimately the Dems will cave because they'll be afraid of being called obstructionists.

[Yupster]

19. I think honestly this issue

cries out for a compromise solution.

I expect there will be one.

Some reasonable time limit that everyone can live with after which a judicial nominee should get a vote on the floor of the senate.

To me that seems the right thing to do.

They'll probably have to be a fight before it's agreed to though.

[0007]

29. Yupster, are YOU supporting the Democratic Party in Midland Texas

where you live.

I never see you at any of the functions or the Democratic meetings here in Midland.

Please read my Post #27 on this thread and observe how your assumptions may be wrong.

.....Why do you ignore fellow Midland DUers and fail to response?

[fujiyama]

17. Who would revolt?

Even among activist liberal types, it's unlikely that they'll react. To many of those I've seen it'll just be seen as parlimentary procedures.

Although I'd say the nuke option itself will have disasterous consequences...I'd forsee a real nutcase being appointed to the SC but I expect to see a nurcase appointed regardless.

Most likely though I think what Yupster said will happen. Reid will follow through with his threats to shut down the senate. The only thing I'd wonder is whether pukes would be successfull of not in portraying Dems as "obstructionists".

[DearAbby]

42. When it happens and the Dems do successfully shut down the government

with their walk-out, the rest of us have to back them as well and shut down the country per-say. Show our support. If they make this move of solidarity...We have to stand with them. Getting out into the streets and standing with them.

[Benson]

22. Lots of MSM Coverage for a Month, and by 2006, it Will be Forgotten.

Thats why they want to do it now.

[rfkrfk]

23. if filibusters for judges is disallowed, filibuster something else

if the nomination for some corrupt judge comes to the floor
of the Senate, filibuster something else, perhaps some
unneeded dam or highway.

get the floor, and keep talking
WTF
have any of the Senate Dems seen the
1939 movie,'Mr Smith Goes to Washington'.?
WTF
When do we start fighting back?

edit, spelling

[0007]

27. 'nuclear option' is working and people are becoming aware!

Don't let anyone fool you. Here are the results for Texas.

Call on Your Senators to Protect the Courts

Our Progress So Far
So far, we've made 46,400 calls.

Great work! We've achieved 103.1% of our new goal of 45,000 calls.

Select your state: (Texas in my case)

Please call each Senator's office, then check the box if you were able to get through.

You can just give a short statement to whomever answers (or the voicemail): such as, "Hello.
I live in Texas, and I would like to urge Senator Hutchison to oppose the 'nuclear option' to
eliminate the right to filibuster judicial nominations. I believe in fair judges, and checks and balances.
Thank you very much."
Sen. Kay Hutchison (202-224-5922)
Sen. John Cornyn (202-224-2934)

[Domitan]

30. The answer is simply this:

Make a powerful and vivid case for why this nuclear option really fucks up the ordinary American citizen, no matter what party he or she supports.

The more brief and concise, the better. The more visual and emotional, the better.

The masses already felt at a primal level how repulsive the gov't's attempted interference in the Schiavo case was. Let them feel the same primal revulsion at the GOP congress abusing power via the nuclear option!

[RUMPLEMINTZ]

32. It would really help if we

had some instances when judges were filibustered. Especially if they were some right wing nutjobs. Can someone give me some examples?

[rodeodance]

33. See this also

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x1715401

[RUMPLEMINTZ]

36. Rodeodance, I want

some names! Somebody has to have some names of judges who have been filibustered. The only one I have heard of Judge Fortas from the Johnson administration then I find out he never had the votes to be confirmed. It sure would be nice if we had a list of filibustered judges and the reasons why especially if they were right wing reactionaries.

[ticapnews]

35. There will be a massive revolt and...ooohh, "Lost" is on...

...nevermind.

[0007]

37. ....another note I forgot to add is;

In a poll dated March 17th, 2005, Newsweek magazine found that the general public disapproves of the Republican plan to eliminate the filibuster by a full 25 point margin.

[StudentOfDarrow]

41. Not big enough to cause a revolt.

But it is possible that a revolt will be caused by the fascist government the removal of the filibuster would inevitably cause. Crap, I used the word cause way too much there.

[Silverhair]

43. Not much.

They get the judges they want. Democrats make a bunch of noise for a few weeks, then back to business as normal.

[RedTail Wolf]

45. Revolution MUST happen if he Filibuster is taken away.

The right to protect the rights of the minority from being steam rolled by the majority. After all some pretty smart guys put the filibuster in the Rules of order in the Senate, (The Framers) It has worked for over 200 years and now we have a cowboy from Texas who thinks more like Al Sorensen on The HBO hit Deadwood...My way or the highway and sometimes the highway gets a bit bloody. If that happens, then Sen Reid must shut down the Govt.
Then it will become our charge and rest on our shoulders as citizens to support Sen Reid.
The marches must come together and become uniform and against the theocratic govt. that is forming in this nation. If we do not take this burden on our shoulders we are being lax as citizens and should also be ashamed if we do not shoulder our fair share. This is one about fundamental rights protecting the minority. If this is not worth marching to Washington for what is? The war didn't get this party off it's ass, the lies and BS about our candidate left us sitting pointing fingers a each other. We have got to learn that the Repugs are going nowhere but more right and we need to rise up off of our sofas and help our nation. Another failure to mobilize this Democratic Party, with Progs, and independent thinkers, we are not worthy of the title Americans. We may be too late but I'll be damed if I'll sit quietly anymore while more rights are stripped from us by the theoretical right wingers. We must rise up and stop this garbage, if not we will be eradicated by them and the country will go straight to hell on an express train!

RedTail Wolf

[MADem]

46. How many here have seen the filibuster ads on TV?

There's one with a republican who says "keep the filibuster" and one that has Jimmy Stewart as Mr. Smith Goes to Washington filibustering away. Hey, if Jimmy Stewart likes the filibuster, it's GOTTA be OK!

[0007]

48. bttft

:kick::kick::kick::kick::kick::kick::kick::kick:
:kick::kick::kick::kick::kick::kick:
:kick::kick::kick::kick::kick:
:kick::kick::kick::kick:
:kick::kick::kick:
:kick::kick:
:kick:

[Lone_Wolf]

49. A general strike...

We should seriously consider this if the Repukes try the "Nuclear Option."

Maybe pulling our money out of the banks? Not paying our taxes?