For those seriously curious about Wes Clark

[CarolNYC]

Oops, I think I did something wrong the last time around.

Here it is again, hopefully acceptable this time.

I know the positive Clark threads drive some people nuts here. It seems it is much more frowned upon by some to post something informative about Gen Clark than it is to go into threads about him (or even not about him) and attack him and I know there are folks who don't want to know more about Gen Clark for fear they will find something to like about this careeer military man. But I do believe that there are some folks who are seriously curious about the General. The following list is for those who genuinely want to know more about Gen Clark.

First, the books...
Wesley K. Clark - A Biography - Antonia Felix. This is a short biography of Clark, an easy read and a nice overview of his life and accomplishments.
http://search.barnesandnoble.com/booksearch/results.asp ...

Winnning Modern Wars: Iraq, Terrorism and the American Empire - Wesley K. Clark. Clark's latest book, his views on the "war on terror" and the Iraq War.
http://search.barnesandnoble.com/booksearch/isbnInquiry ...

Waging Modern War - Wesley K. Clark . Clark's first book, about the Kosovo campaign, quite long and detailed.
http://search.barnesandnoble.com/booksearch/isbnInquiry ...

These books feature Clark prominently:
The Mission: Waging War and Keeping Peace With America's Military - Dana Priest
http://search.barnesandnoble.com/booksearch/isbnInquiry ...

A Problem From Hell: America and the Age of Genocide - Samantha Power (Samantha Power became a big fan of Clark's, as you can tell from the wonderful intro she gave the General at a press conference after his testimony at the Hague, which you can read here http://www.kiddingonthesquare.com/2004/01/the_subtle_ar ... )
http://search.barnesandnoble.com/booksearch/isbnInquiry ...

To End A War - Richard Holbrooke. Holbrooke's account of the negotiations to end the war in Bosnia. This is a great read. It was the first "Clark book" that I read and my admiration and respect for both men grew as I read it. It contains the "rappelling down the cliff face to try to save his colleagues" incident.
http://search.barnesandnoble.com/booksearch/isbnInquiry ...

War in a Time of Peace: Bush, Clinton and the Generals - David Halberstam, an interesting read, as are all Halberstam books, IMHO.
http://search.barnesandnoble.com/booksearch/isbnInquiry ...

Magazine and newspaper articles:
Esquire: The General - This, I think, is the article that put me over the top on Clark. I had been researching him thoroughly before taking the step to try to convince him to run as I thought it was a great and terrible thing that I was going to ask him to do and I better be sure I could support him if he did. I came to see, through my research, that not only was this a guy that I thought could win, but that here was a really good man. After I read this, I jumped fully on board.
http://www.esquire.com/features/articles/2003/030801_mf ...

This is a great article Clark wrote in the Washington Monthly concerning how Bush is messing up his war on terror.
Broken Engagement
http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/features/2004/0405.cla ...

Gen Clark's cover story interview with The Advocate:
http://www.advocate.com/html/stories/907/907_clark.asp

Pretty in depth article about Clark's life and career:
http://www.boston.com/news/politics/president/clark/art ...
from_little_rock_chooses_military_path/

Wonderful, wonderful article by Elizabeth Drew called Waiting for the General. This addresses some of the "issues" that others in the military had with Gen Clark.
http://www.nybooks.com/articles/16795

Then there is a truly marvelous article in the December 2003 issue of GQ called "General Electric" and a quite nice profile called "What About Wes" from Elle that I can't find links to. Anyone know of links to either of these pieces??


Couple of online things:
Josh Marshall's Interview with the General shortly after he announced:
http://talkingpointsmemo.com/old/oct0301.html


David Hackworth's column, in which he explains how his opinion of Clark changed after he read the General's book and actually met the man:
http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_I ...


There's this incredible speech by Gen Clark to the Center for American Progress in October of 2003. Wes was keynote speaker for their conference on New American Strategies for Security and Peace. I believe it was in this speech that he first voiced the thought that Bush should be held accountable for 9/11 happening on his watch, which sent the more timid ones into a frenzy (How could he dare say such a thing! Oh, the horror!)
http://www.cfr.org/campaign2004/pub6493/wesley_clark/ne ...
_for_security_and_peace.php


Some stuff, lectures and Q&A type things he did before becoming a candidate. Some are quite long and redundant as he recounts his life and thoughts on the world in a couple of them, but interesting nonetheless.

Speaking in February of 2003, he says "we've got to understand that in America foreign policy, force is the last resort. Yes, you may have to use it. You may even have to use it preemptively. But the use of force is not the guiding principle of American foreign policy. Military might is not the guiding foreign policy principle. Our principle is that disputes and problems should be resolved peacefully if at all possible," among lots of other things:
http://www.cfr.org/pub5632/wesley_k_clark_carla_a_robbi ...

Here, he speaks at the 2003 Morgenthau Lecture at the Carnegie Council on Ethics and International Affairs, June 5, 2003:
http://draftthegeneral.blogspot.com /

Here he explains how the military works from the bottom up (for those of you afraid a military man would only know how to work from the top down):
"The military works from the bottom up. If you're a general, you go out and talk to the troops. You say, what's it look like out there and what do you think is over the next hill. Generals aren't supposed to know that. How bad is the artillery falling on you, this is World War I stuff. The general then goes back to his headquarters well out of artillery range. But occasionally he comes up and talks to the troops to find out what's really going on. World War I stuff -- from the bottom up. When military commanders give orders -- maybe it's not true in the Navy and the Air Force as much -- but in the Army we always know that ultimately the commander on the ground is going to be left with the order. He may have to come back and modify it. You can't go that way, you told me to go on this trail, this trail shows on a map, boss, but there is no trail there. Give me a bigger sector, give me more artillery, give me engineers to clear the trail. It works from the bottom up."
http://wesleyclark.h1.ru/military_reform.htm (The Civi Military Affairs and U.S. Diplomacy: The Changing Roles of the Regional Commanders-In-Chief(CINCs) May 2001 link)

I like this quote from a June 2001 guest commentary in Armed Forces Journal International:
"It makes me a little bit sad to hear some of our young officers complaining that they are doing peacekeeping instead of warfighting. Have these officers ever been in a warfight? Have they ever seen men die? Have they ever felt the fear from artillery pounding in on them? What is this great glory that they see in warfighting that they don't see in keeping the peace in a place like Bosnia or Kosovo? Isn't it far better to be there preventing the outbreak of conflict and contributing to the resolution of an urgent international problem without bloodshed than it is to be called in at the last minute in desperation and chaos and thrown into a fight?

I think it is. "
http://www.armedforcesjournal.com/AFJI/Mags/2000/june/g ...

Here is the transcript of the General's testimony before the House Armed Services Committee in Sept 2002:
http://commdocs.house.gov/committees/security/has269000 ...

And here is link to audio of his brilliant testimony before the same Committee last week:
http://hasc3.house.gov/04-06-05FullComm.asf

Finally, video:

You can find tons of good stuff in the media section of www.u-wes-a.com .

And you can watch this wonderful film made for his campaign "American Son", here:
http://www.clark04.com/americanson /

I hope that's not too much. I didn't mean to post so many links when I started but there is just so much good stuff out there. This just covers the tip of the iceberg.

And, thanks, Nancy! :)

[Clark2008]

1. Dunno what you did wrong the last time, but here's a kick for this time.

:kick:

[senseandsensibility]

2. Thanks for the informative post

I hope that our fellow DUers take the time to read what you've put together. In addition, I'd like to read a thread about your personal experiences with Clark. To me, those really show the essence of the man. Maybe someday you could share those, too.:)

[CarolNYC]

12. Ahhh, a personal encounters with Clark thread...

I would love to start one like that one day. I'm sure there are others here who could contribute also...

[Last Lemming]

3. if you have any contact with Gen. Clark

tell him thanks for saving my husband's life (as well as the rest of his family.) Said husband from Kosovo--at the start of the war he sat drinking a beer and watching TV in his home in Gjakova. He watched the fighters take off from Aviano, Italy, and 25 minutes later, there they were overhead--bombing the local post office (Serb military headquarters.)

I was in and out of the Balkins throughout the civil wars. . .and if an opinion from an American on the ground during that time counts for anything...we did too little too late but what good we did do was under Clark command of NATO forces.

My nephew, three years old when the war started. . . His father would say: "Ardit. . .who do you love? Who do you love?"
and Ardit would shout "NATO! NATO! NATO!"

But we were a much different nation then

[CarolNYC]

13. Thanks for that post.

Too little, too late....if you read the Samantha Power book I mentioned above, you'll see that through the years we've mostly done too little too late, if anything at all.

I'm glad your husband and his family are OK. I'm sorry so many had to suffer and die during the wars there.

If I ever do get the chance to talk to the General again, I will tell him. You can email him yourself from the contact link at the WesPAC page, www.securingamerica.com. I'm sure that the folks picking up the mail would forward it on to Gen Clark.

Thanks again for telling your story.

[Totally Committed]

17. If you, yourself, would like to leave him a message,

go to:

www.securingamerica.com

There is a way to contact him through WesPAC there, as well as leave him a public message on his blog at the site (WesBLOG). I'm sure he'd be thrilled to hear from you.

Thsnk you for the post, and God Bless you and your husband. Glad you are both well and safe.

TC

[Adelante]

21. Lemming

You can copy and paste into this form:

http://www.securingamerica.com/?q=feedback

You can ask that it be submitted as a "WesNote" for the site or privately for him, as you wish.

Thank you so much for telling us this story. Yup, too little, too late. But I am very glad they did come around in time for your husband and his family.

[Boo Boo]

4. Thanks Carol!

I've already read this stuff, but it's great to have it all layed out here in one place. I bookmarked it! :-)

The Washington Monthly piece is excellent. Some of the folks that think Clark is somehow a secret supporter of the New American Century folks should read it. Clark is a defender of "Old America," someone that doesn't believe that "everything changed" on 9/11. A confirmed multilateralist.

As Richard Perle said the other day, "What are you talking about!" Not exactly a ringing endorsement from the PNAC.

[KoKo]

5. Thanks for all those links. I've bookmarked and will check out..

Had a post here last night asking why so many DU'ers liked Wes Clark but mentioned "trolling" and it was deleted. :D That word is against the rules and that's why it was deleted.

I was going to reformulate my post at some point to be within the DU rules guidelines, but your informative post has saved me the trouble.

:-)'s

[bobthedrummer]

6. One Clark poster's reactionary thread suggested that you and I are

part of a neo-conservative conspiracy against Wes Clark, KoKo01.
I don't even know you although I've read some of your posts over the years. Now we're being bandied about as RW operatives of some sort by some Clark supporters here at DU.

That reeks, doesn't it?

[Clark2008]

8. KoKo's not being considered a RW operative.

I think Clark supporters found being called "trolls" objectionable, though, in an earlier thread, and justifiably so. However, KoKo's wish to actually learn more about Clark and the fact that he/she has posted about a variety of subjects in the past makes it easier for me, at least, to understand his/her question was innocent.

What reeks is this "Roving" band of anti-Clarkers who post smears about him and rarely make a post about ANYTHING else. Kind of makes one wonder what their ultimate goal is.

[KoKo]

9. Thanks for the "heads up."

I don't post on Clark threads usually...so don't know why Clark supporters would think I was part of a conspiracy but I've been called worse in my years on DU. :eyes:

I really did want more info about Clark and the "trolling" comment was unfortunate in that I didn't mean it the way it was taken..but the word has a bad connotation on DU and is against the rules so it can't be used in any way.

[Adelante]

22. Oh, hi, Bob

"For those seriously curious about Wes Clark"

I thought you were over him? :shrug:

[CarolNYC]

25. Yeah,

funny he should show up in a thread with that title, no? :shrug:

[CarolNYC]

14. You're welcome Koko

I hope you find something that explains things a little to you there.

As for the removed posts, I guess we both needed to read the rules a little more closely, eh? ;)

[Adelante]

20. That's what you get KoKo

:spank:

But see how thoughtful we Clarkies can be? :D

[xkenx]

7. Here's One

Clark supporter feels called to duty
General made believer of wary aide
Thursday, November 27, 2003
By ANNMARIE TIMMINS
Monitor staff
________________________________________
As a junior Navy officer, Eric Massa had no choice the first time he went to work for Gen. Wesley Clark in 1996, as Clark's assistant in Panama. The Navy set up the interview, and Massa hoped to mangle it with blunt honesty.
"I didn't want the job, and I told him so," said Massa. "I was afraid of working for a pompous moron, of which there are several wearing stars. I had worked for senior officers who didn't care about people, and I didn't want to do that again."
It turned out Massa and Clark had something in common there, and Massa spent the next four years attached to Clark, first in Panama and then in Europe, during Clark's stint as supreme allied commander in Europe.
When Massa left Clark in 1999 it was under protest and only because Massa had been diagnosed with advanced cancer. Now, years later, Massa - recovered and retired from the Navy - is working for Clark's army again, this time as a campaign staffer trying to get Clark elected to the White House.
Massa wasn't looking for the job this time, either. Clark asked him to come on board after learning a month ago that Massa had "involuntarily resigned" from his government job at the urging of Republican bosses. They were upset that Massa had visited Clark at a Democratic campaign event.
"They said I was a political liability and that if I liked Wes Clark so much I should go work for him," Massa said. A lifelong Republican, Massa just re-registered as a Democrat. Massa is the son of a Navy man, and as such grew up outside America and with a respect for the military. The family came to the United States when Massa was 16, and after graduating from high school in Louisiana, Massa attended the U.S. Naval Academy in Annapolis, Md.
In all, Massa spent 25 years in the Navy, 16 of them on sea duty. In the mid-1990s, Massa's commanding officer told him it was time to decide how he wanted to fulfill his joint duty, a requirement for officers to spend part of their service with another branch of the military.
When Massa said he wanted to do something out of the ordinary, he was told an Army general by the name of Wes Clark was looking for a Navy aide. All he knew about Clark was that he had stars on his Army uniform, and that didn't carry much weight with Massa.
Their 50-minute interview, however, convinced Massa to withhold judgment.
"He had questions I didn't expect from a military man," Massa said. "He asked me if I was familiar with Greek literature, if I read Homer, what I thought about the Illiad.
"And the last 20 minutes were devoted to people questions," Massa said. "He asked me what I would do if a young soldier came to me and told me his wife had died. Or a homosexual soldier told me he was being harassed. His whole thing was treating people with dignity and respect."
Three hours later, Massa was on a plane with Clark to Panama, where Clark was commander in chief of the U.S. Southern Command. Massa described his job as Clark's executive assistant and deputy chief of staff.
Once there, Massa asked Clark what the Homer question was about. Massa remembers the answer: "He said he was looking for someone who was well-rounded enough to talk about issues beyond military terms."
For about 13 months, Massa shadowed Clark, keeping notes of his meetings and drafting follow-up letters to the people Clark had met. Massa said Clark forbade his staff to begin any of his correspondence with "I" because Clark wanted the emphasis on the recipient, not himself.
________________________________________
A show of support
When Clark was promoted to supreme allied commander in Europe in 1997, he asked Massa to stay on and be his advance man. Massa agreed and moved his wife and kids, who had been waiting for him back in San Diego, to Brussels, Belgium. After Clark arrived, Massa was again a close assistant and became one of Clark's main liaisons to Washington, D.C.
Massa had every intention of staying in Europe as Clark's assistant until he got sick in late 1999. He hadn't recovered from running a half-marathon but chalked it up to the flu. He blew off a doctor's appointment his wife had made for him, thinking he'd work it off.
On Nov. 9, 1999, Massa looked up from his desk to find Clark standing there. Clark told Massa that his wife had called worried about his health.
Clark had arranged another doctor's appointment for Massa, and when Massa protested, Clark gave him the only direct order Massa recalls receiving in four years. "I think we have lost the fundamental relationship between a four-star general and a Navy commander," Clark told him. "You will go to the doctor."
The doctor diagnosed Massa, who had never smoked, with advanced lung cancer and gave him four months to live. Clark cut through red tape to get Massa and his family back to the United States for treatment.
Just before Massa left, Clark convened the staff and tearfully awarded Massa the Legion of Merit medal for his work. Clark had received the same medal in the 1970s when he was a speech writer for the then-supreme allied commander.
It's one of the few times Massa saw Clark cry.
"Everyone thought that was goodbye, that I was dying," Massa said.
Back home in San Diego, doctors were more optimistic and diagnosed Massa with non-Hodgkins lymphoma, not lung cancer, and began aggressive treatment.
Unknown to Massa, Clark had a soldier tracking Massa's surgery. As soon as Massa came to in recovery, staff told him he had a call. It was Clark. At the time, he was overseeing the bombing of Kosovo.
________________________________________
A different kind of service
Massa retired about three years ago; he waited so that the last thing he did in uniform was attend Clark's retirement. Now he's living in a hotel in Manchester, trying to avoid a fast-food diet and bringing his family in from New York when he can.
He talks wistfully about the job he lost to get here. Massa was in Washington overseeing part of the Navy budget as a member of the House Armed Services Committee. His departure was reported by the press and has since become fodder for online political sites.
But he doesn't regret where it got him. On the trail, Massa is helping get Clark the veteran vote - and whatever else needs doing.
"If Wes Clark asked me to jump off the Brooklyn Bridge, I'd ask him if he wanted it done in the summer or the winter," Massa said.
________________________________________

[CarolNYC]

15. That's a good one too ken.

Thanks for adding this.

I met Eric at a Charlie Rangel fundraiser some time back. He's a great guy who obviously has a very high regard for "The Boss" as he called Wes that night. He (Eric) is running for congress in the 29th congressional district of New York.

[sharonking21]

10. I dunno either

what was wrong with the first one, but thank you for posting this. I know how much work it takes. I am bookmarking it and suggest that others do so also.

[sharonking21]

11. I think this is the Esquire article

http://www.esquire.com/cgi-bin/printtool/print.cgi?pages=9&filename=%2Ffeatures%2Farticles%2F2003%2F030801_mfe_clark.html&x=60&y=13

[CarolNYC]

16. Yep, that's it.

My link doesn't work any more...I wish someone had a link to the GQ article...That was very good also.

[CarolNYC]

18. Also,

the June 2003 Meet the Press appearance is a keeper but I don't know where to find a working accessible link to that. It was that appearance that really got the draft thing going, I think. I wasn't part of it then but I know he made a lot of people sit up and take notice when he was on.

[Tom Rinaldo]

19. Carol, please duplicate your lead post here in the DU Clark Group

Threads drop so quickly in this forum, understandably, but this is a great resource in the future for anyone wanting more information on Clark. It will easier for people to find later if it is also stockpiled at the DU Clark Support Group and we can always refer people who might be interested in it over there to find.

[CarolNYC]

24. Will do...

...with a fixed link to the Esquire story and the Massa story added.

I just wish I knew where to find an accessible link to that GQ story and the June '03 Meet the Press transcript.

[Gold Metal Flake]

23. Thanks for this thread!

:kick:

[CarolNYC]

26. Oh, and here's one more I'd meant to put in the original post...

Watch this video of Wes being aggressively questioned by Democracy Now about his role in Kosovo:
http://www.democracynow.org/article.pl?sid=04/01/26/1632224

I don't believe this was meant to be complimentary to Clark but I know more than one person who was quite impressed with him after seeing the way he handled the questions. You may not agree with everything he says, but you've got to appreciate the way he conducts himself here. I think the interviewer was so impressed. It's one of my favorite videos from the campaign actually. It would have been very easy for him to blow this guy off but he doesn't.

[MoonRiver]

27. Thanks so much for this informative thread!

People need to learn as much as possible about this incredible man!