TPM: Bush "thinks the problem is .. people have too much health insurance"

[Pirate Smile]

From Josh Marshall's Talking Points Memo:

Sometimes the key to good politics (and good policy) is simply to say out loud what your opponents are saying amongst themselves. And that's just the case with these new health care proposals the president is set to unveil in his state of the union.

I'll leave it to the good folks over at our new health care blog to get down into all the details. But the core premise of the policies the president is about to lay out is that Americans are over-insured when it comes to health insurance. Over-insured. Got too much insurance.

These aren't my words. These are the words used by the conservative policy-wonks who came up with the president's proposals. Just hop over to Google and start googling the phrase 'over insured' along with 'health' and 'conservative'. This what they think; and what the president thinks. It's why he's behind these ideas.

So the president thinks the problem is that people have too much health insurance. People are over-insured.

I don't think that's how most Americans see the problem, do you? I'm confident that they don't. Really confident.

But let's let them decide.

The president wants to make health care his political issue this year. No Democrat should open their mouth this year on this topic without first saying this: The president thinks the problem is that Americans have too much health insurance; we don't.

Health care policy is an immensely complicated issue. And that complexity can sometimes be a cover for politicians pushing policies that would screw most families. In this case, however, the president and his supporters have done everyone the favor is simplifying what they're up to and what they want to do.

The president thinks you're over-insured. He thinks you have too much health insurance.

http://www.talkingpointsmemo.com/archives/week_2006_01_22.php#007555

I hope Bush campaigns on this as much and as broadly as he did his Social Security Privatization, oh, I mean Private Accounts, no, I don't, I mean Privatization plans last year.

Get to it Bushie Boy.

Fly everywhere.

Have town-halls with your hand picked sheep.

Let them get up and say "I have too much health insurance, Mr President, please help me solve this problem".

:evilgrin:

edit to add a link to a NYT article with some snips:

Health Care, Vexing to Clinton, Is Now at Top of Bush's Agenda

-snip-
But some policy experts, Republicans and Democrats alike, say the Bush proposals, which are built around tax breaks, may further drive up health spending and costs by fueling the demand for health care. Such unintended effects show how difficult it is to apply economic theory to the complexities of the current health care system.

-snip-
Regina E. Herzlinger, a professor at Harvard Business School, said: "Insuring the uninsured is a fine objective, but how will this control the health costs that are hobbling our global competitiveness? Health savings accounts will increase coverage, and that's great. But they are being touted as a way to control costs, and I very much doubt that claim."

-snip-
People use health savings accounts to pay routine medical expenses and buy high-deductible insurance policies to cover larger expenses. Mr. Bush says this arrangement encourages people to take more responsibility for all aspects of their care, including its cost.
"It's the opposite of federal control," Mr. Bush told a group of small-business owners this month. "It is patient control."

The White House had been hoping to highlight the new Medicare drug benefit as a model, showing how private health plans could deliver better benefits at lower cost than the government. But if Mr. Bush mentions it in his State of the Union address, he will invite catcalls from Democrats.


http://www.nytimes.com/2006/01/29/politics/29health.html?hp&ex=1138510800&en=faa43fdccef4b4c2&ei=5094&partner=homepage

Nothing to help the uninsured.

They want us to only have catastrophic coverage and to pay for everything else out of our own pockets.

They are doing the opposite of HMO's preventive care. People wont go until they are seriously ill and then it COSTS MORE.

They also are ignoring the fact that the costs to the systems from the large number of uninsured is passed onto the insured and the hospitals, doctors, insurance companies, etc.

I can't believe what dumbasses these people are - it is mind-boggling.

[elehhhhna]

1. Rec'd for Andy... He's surely laughing his ass off right now.

[Maggie_May]

2. Oh I so hope here comes to my state for a town hall meeting.

But you see I live in a Blue State so thats likely not to happen.

[cornermouse]

3. I guess all of us who do have health insurance better run right

out and drop our coverage then. :eyes: Typical Bush stupidity.

[spindrifter]

4. Okay--

I invite * to speak to my daughter's boyfriend who can't afford to go to the doctor, even though he badly dislocated his toe. Part of the problem is no portability of insurance. Another family member is racking up health care debts because his insurance is so crappy--and he has no choice about it.

[stray cat]

5. Bush wants to eliminate your employer health insurance

so you can own all the expenses yourself! Bush's ownership society plan.

[TahitiNut]

34. I want to know HOW MUCH THE PUBLIC HAS PAID FOR DICK CHENEY'S HEALTH CARE!

If we're going to eliminate employer health insurance, start with EVERY ELECTED AND APPOINTED POLITICIAN!

:grr:

[stray cat]

6. I want Bush's insurance plan - the one he is covered by!

or at least the plan the senators have.

[Johnny Noshoes]

7. TOO MUCH Health Insurance?!

You know these - I can't say it it would be too much profanity - what friggin planet do they come from, what reality do they inhabit?

:wtf: :grr:

[serryjw]

31. HOW can you have TOO MUCH........

when you have NONE??? Does he have any idea what it cost to go to a Dr for a woman's annual pap smear exam and a mammogram? Has anone on board paid for it our of pocket themselves? ..My guess $500!

[PA Democrat]

8. Yes, that's why so many people declared bankruptcy due to medical bills

Oy vey! The problem was they had TOO MUCH health insurance. The GENIUS of this man is just astounding isn't it? :sarcasm:

[Lorien]

28. Yeah, I've got 20 thousand dollars in medical debt-and I have (crappy

but affordable) health insurance. Gee, if I would have known all along that my debt is all due to being "over insured".... :eyes:

[MichiganVote]

9. He's right. Dick Cheney is WAY too over insured

[Dirty Hippie]

10. Oh now I see!

That must be why my disabled son who suffered a serious head injury and now has seizures cannot find a Neurologist in our city who accepts Medicaid or why he was turned away by a facial pain specialist or why I'm having to fight like hell to get his reconstruction back on track because we cannot find a Plastic Surgeon who will take his case.

He has too much insurance!

Gee, thanks Mr. Prezident for splainin' it all to me.


Asshole

[newportdadde]

11. People are just now getting this years premiums - this will only hurt Bush

Nobody in the real world is buying this garbage. My healthcare has DOUBLED since 2004!

Overinsured my ass, this will hurt his polls another few percentage points.

[SmokingJacket]

12. Yep, he wants corporations to be freed up from having to pay

for health care. :grr:

I can't believe the cruelty of this administration. Doesn't want govt to pay for it, doesn't want business to pay for it either -- nevermind the fact that people are doing their JOBS to get these benefits --

[Democrats_win]

13. The healthy American initiative. When does clear cutting begin?

Am i mixing my metaphores? Maybe it's the clear America initiative. WTF, it's beginning to sound like a holocaust.

[Pirate Smile]

19. People will be sooo pleased when they are notified by their employers

that they will now only have catastrophic coverage with a HIGH deductible but they (and their families) are on their own for office visits, minor injuries, etc. because we know those don't cost much.:sarcasm:

Hey, maybe the Dr.'s and Hospitals can even charge the people the "normal" (higher) cost for those visits instead of those negotiated lower rates the PPO's and HMO's get to pay.

[mac56]

14. Oh, pleeeeeze, let Bush say this.

I want every Democrat to be able to rub his smarmy little nose in it.

K & R.

[Disturbed]

16. The Silverspoon Sociopath and his Criminal Cabal...

are Hell bent upon destroying the Amerikan Midlle Class and turning Amerika into a Fuedal State. All Dems should turn their backs on this fool at the SOTU and then walk out en mass.

[0007]

29. I'll drink to that!

[Yavin4]

15. Here Comes The "Market Forces" Arguments Again

Bush wants all of us to go out and buy health insurance on our own. The right-wing-talking-points will be, "hey, your employer doesn't buy car insurance for you. why should they buy health insurance for you." Bank on hearing that a million times.

Market forces won't work in the health care industry because people do get sick, and when they get sick, they get treated whether they can pay or not. Even people with health insurance have all kinds of payment levels because of deductibles. Thus, a hospital administrator has to sort patients out based on whether they can pay at all, whether their HMO will pay some or all of the bill, whether the patient can pay some or all of the bill, etc. This payment complexity is what causes the overhead on health care to skyrocket.

A single-payer, national health insurance fund where everyone pays into one fund and gets coverage no matter what works the best. Just eliminate the words, "over 65" from medicare and everything will be okay.

[pop goes the weasel]

23. Yes!

"A single-payer, national health insurance fund where everyone pays into one fund and gets coverage no matter what works the best. Just eliminate the words, "over 65" from medicare and everything will be okay."

I don't see why it is so hard to do this. I already have to pay for both my own insurance and a tax for Medicare. Just make everyone eligible for Medicare, make it mandatory, with payment on a sliding scale based on income. Private providers could still offer Medi-gap coverage. This is the only sensible solution.

[Yavin4]

35. The Key To Controlling Health Care Costs Is To Insure The Unisured

The large and growing pool of uninsured and under-insured are the reasons why health care costs are skyrocketing.

[MissWaverly]

25. also can I add we trade in our cars not our bodies

when the car becomes an old klunker or the repair cost exceeds the blue book, we run
to the dealer, that is not possible with our bodies, we expect them to last longer
than our mortgages.

[Telly Savalas]

36. It's more insidious than that.

He doesn't want us to buy insurance on our own, he wants us to have savings accounts to pay for health care. At least the screwed up system we have now is based on the idea of pooling risk. Bush's policy is so medieval it rejects even that.

But yeah, a single-payer universal system is ideal because it takes the idea of pooling risk to its logical conclusion.

[MissWaverly]

52. actually it's even worse

now that they have maxed out on big oil, the polluters, the big drug companies, they're
now trying to get money from the big corporations that want to jettison employee health
care as part of the benefits package. The only problem with all this cash that the
GOP finds is that it is always in the pocket of someone else, I just heard Jimmy
Carter say that thanks to George, the American taxpayer picks up the tab for
corporate polluters.

[Pirate Smile]

17. It needs one more vote for Greatest Page.

[CatholicEdHead]

18. Sec 125 "Health Savings Accounts" are misleading

they offer them where I work. You can put money in, BUT if you do not use up ALL of it, the employer takes back the funds. You cannot keep the money or roll it over into the next year. It is gone in thin air.

[DemonGoddess]

21. TOO MUCH???

How can they say we have TOO much health insurance, when I, and millions others just like me don't even HAVE health insurance??:mad:

[Pirate Smile]

30. Frankly, they've decided they don't care about the uninsured.

They aren't even trying to deal with that problem.

They are worried only about the costs to the businesses.

"Insuring the uninsured is a fine objective, but how will this control the health costs that are hobbling our global competitiveness?

-snip-
Stuart M. Butler, a vice president of the conservative Heritage Foundation, said Mr. Bush was focusing more on costs than on coverage for the uninsured.

-snip-
In his recent meeting with small-business owners, Mr. Bush said, "Government policy has got to aim at the increasing cost of health care." The number of uninsured is rising because health costs are going up, he said, "so the government needs to address the cost."

[ellenfl]

27. i think his plan allows you to roll the unsued monies over . . .

but it is still a totally crap plan.

oh well, once none but the wealthy can afford insurance, then the sh*t will hit the fan. the hospitals and doctors won't get paid and the emergency rooms will be filled with the uninsured. those who can afford insurance will pay for those who can't by an increase in their premiums. of course, there will be a great toll of suffering and death . . . then maybe the fundies will vote democrat.

ellen fl

[serryjw]

33. Not true if you buy it yourself

My HEALTHY brother has his own, but he has a financial safety net and he is healthy. It is impossible for most. I have no insurance and think that it makes MORE sense to spend $300/monthly on vitamins/nutritional products to keep me healthy than spend ( WHICH I CAN'T!!!)$7000/annually on a high deductible/high premium and high co-pays as a cancer surviver, and get NOTHING for it BUT to make the insurance companies richer. IF I get sick; I will either get free medical help or I won't...I'll deal with that than.

[foreverdem]

62. And who can afford to put money in them?

They have them where I work too. How many people actually have extra funds to put into these accounts, and if they can, to know that if they don't use it all, they lose it?

[LondonReign2]

68. HSAs and Flexible Spending Accounts are two different things

Section 125 Flexible Spending accounts have been around since the 80's. They allow you to put pre-tax deductions into an account and then be reimbursed for health care expenses throughout the year such as co-pays, prescription costs, and even over-the-counter medications. They are actually a pretty good deal since you are not taxed on this money; the key is that you need to use it all within the plan year (actually under new regulations by March 15th)or you will forfeit any unused contributions.

Health Savings Accounts are another matter. They truly amount to another tax avoidance vehicle for the wealthy, since only the wealthy can afford to put money into these accounts and then pay medical expenses out-of-pocket, allowing these accounts to grow tax free. You are strictly limited as to how much you can put into these accounts, so one significant illness of injury will wipe out your entire account.

[Fox Mulder]

20. Over-Insured??? What the fuck???

How can a person be over-insured when he doesn't even have fucking health insurance??? (He = me) :grr: :grr: :grr:

[savemefromdumbya]

22. for someone who was born with a silverspoon in his mouth

mind you when he goes to prison will Bush get free healthcare?

[mzmolly]

24. My god. People didn't have 50 bucks to fill their gas tanks and leave

new orleans, but they most certainly have enough extra money to dump into a medical savings account. :eyes:

Does this president understand there are people in this country without a @!#% home, without enough $ to by their kids food? JC this man/party is out of touch!

[Telly Savalas]

39. You said it.

Bush is hanging a curveball over the plate with this, and if the Democrats don't hit it out of the park, they might as well quit and give one of the third parties a chance.

[stickdog]

26. Bush says, "$1000 of ignorance is cheaper than $100 of prevention."

Everyone from Ben Franklin to HMO executives knows its cheaper to MAINTAIN health than to RESTORE health.

Except Bush and his Faux News watching legion of gullible Gomers, of course.

[Lefty48197]

32. Unbelievable, but I heard a few Republicans say 1 or 2 years ago

that the rising costs of health care would take care of the problem of Americans overusing the system. They called it a market solution. It was an excuse to do nothing about the skyrocketing costs of medical care.

[ArmchairMeme]

37. There is NO thought involved

If there had been thought involved we, our children and grandchildren would not be paying billions to kill people in Iraq and guarantee long term illness from DU. This amount of money could have paid for health care for everyone.

When thoughtfulness becomes involved humanity is considered.

[WinkyDink]

38. Leave No Sick American Behind.

Control Your Own Health.
Who Knows Your Health Needs Better: You, or a Government Bureaucrat?

(Insert Sarcasm emoticon.)

[Vinca]

40. The only way to get control of health care costs is for the

government to take it over: universal care. Insurance companies, drug companies and health care providers all take consumers for every dime they can, just because they can. Take a CT scan at a local hospital, for example. After the equipment is paid for, why do they have to charge the same or more for the procedure? Why? Because they can. They sock it to the insurance companies who in turn sock it to the consumer. I can't afford insurance at the moment. When I go to the doctor, cash in hand, I'm usually given a 50% discount because I don't have insurance. Generosity or are they sticking it to the insurance companies? You be the judge.

[Maru Kitteh]

41. I haven't any health insurance since 1989

Two and a half years ago I busted a bone in my foot (and probably my tailbone) in a bike accident. I'll have foot pain for the rest of my life because I couldn't afford to go and get it set properly so I just have a slightly crooked foot. I've been lucky as hell that this along with a pretty bad back/pelvic injury is the worst thing that's happened to me during this time. If I was in a car accident or came up with cancer I'd be SCREWED.

But hey, at least every company I worked for got to keep a little more money, get a little richer. I guess we should just all have more sympathy for our CEO's and "owners" in the brave new ownership society. :sarcasm:

[jbnow]

42. How could they possibly try to push this

after the fiasco of Medicare D? It will be really hitting the fan as people sink into the donut hole.

He couldn't get social security privatized despite his "town meetings" and campaigning for it,

Plan D is privatized and it's chaos. People are angry?

Who will listen to this idea?

[Lars39]

44. They're probably counting on a lot of people stroking out when they

hear it.
I know I still want to heave something thru a window. :grr:

[Maru Kitteh]

43. Why the HELL didn't Kerry make this a talking point every single time his

face was in fromt of a camera? George W. Bush thinks you have TOO MUCH HEALTH INSURANCE and he WANTS TO TAKE IT AWAY FROM YOU.

Read this article in the National Review from September 28 2004. http://www.nationalreview.com/comment/gratzer200409280828.asp

[donco6]

45. US CANCER SURVIVORS CANNOT GET HEALTH INSUR!

I've already had lymphoma - at 39. If we had to switch from group plan at work to individual plan - I'M TOTALLY SCREWED! I have no possibility of finding a company to cover me!

So much for all those heartwarming "cancer survivor" stories on TV. Once you've had it, you might as well be dead.

[Lars39]

48. I was very fortunate that my husband found a job with

insurance that allowed pre-existing conditions like cancer.
I'm not sure even TennCare would have taken me.
It's a PPO policy by Principal Financial Group called Private Healthcare Systems.
So far, so good, even though the deductible just for me is $1000.
:hug:

[donco6]

49. I am truly glad for you, but I cannot get married.

And can't get on my partner's insurance.

I just have no options at all.

[Lars39]

50. I'm sorry. I didn't mean to be insensitive.

Healthcare just shouldn't be tied to a job.
Left on my own I'd be up shyte creek, too. As it is, he's effectively now tied to his job.
Good thing he enjoys working there.

[donco6]

54. No NO No problem - please.

Just - this is just such a scary issue for me. If I lose my job, I'm toast. It's one thing to at least have access to treatment - even if it doesn't work. But another to not even have the possibility of getting a referral, chemo, scan, *ANYTHING. I know there must be many many others like me out there.

We cancer survivors have SURVIVED. We're not just trash to let go of because we got sick. And yet, that seems to be the direction we're going in this country. It just makes me so mad I could BUST!

[Lars39]

55. .

I totally understand the feeling of anger. I just went ballistic when I read this OP.
I never used to cuss or rage like this, but this whole mess has gotten to me.
I was diagnosed with stage IIIB BC. It's going to come back.
I just hope I still have some kind of ins for when it does.
:hug:

[donco6]

46. dupe sorry

[donco6]

47. dupe sorry

[Ksec]

51. They want two classes- rich and poor

They are well on there way to getting that . The Fords and GM jobs are drying up, and we get WalMarts to replace them. The middle class is fast becoming a dinosaur. When are the idiots of this country gonna wake up to the nightmare they created by laying down and allowing the gov to jump in bed with the wealthiest few?

I fear its already too late to turn it around. Theyve got all the machinery gears in place to keep it going. A lapdog profit driven media. A party that disguises the truth and is busy turning the screws that are driving the vehicle of middle class destruction. A poor majority that are getting poorer and even more desperate, too busy trying to keep the heat on in their homes too bother with understanding whats happening.

[wellst0nev0ter]

53. Are You Suprised?

This is the same moron who said in the '04 debates that NCLB Act is a job-training program for the recently unemployed. If Democrats don't run with this every single time they are on the air (I'm looking at you Obama) I'll just have to start my own party.

[NMMNG]

56. It's official. He has lost his effing mind.

:crazy:

[Polemicist]

57. Isn't it easier to just inherit your health insurance?

Like Bush did? Doesn't that solve the problem?

Everybody should just inherit more health insurance from their millionaire Ex-President daddies.

[raysr]

58. His big idea

is health insurance savings accounts. The banks and Wall St love the idea.http://www.usatoday.com/news/health/2006-01-29-hsa-usat_x.htm Oh, and wealthy are truly thrilled.

[passy]

59. Isn't Michael Moore's new film about Health Care?

[foreverdem]

63. Last I heard it was about HMO's

And how wonderfully THAT system works. :sarcasm:

But it is better than nothing.

[Stand and Fight]

60. Going to have to read this tomorrow. n/t

[ananda]

61. I would simply expect the same kind of result as Medicare.

Less service for more money.

Remember that BushInc lives in upsidedown lookingglass world.

Everything that Bush and his corrupt, complicit Congress does
ends up doing exactly the opposite of what they claim.

If they do finally work something up for healthcare, it will definitely
mean that fewer people will be insured and that healthcare will
cost much more and be less available for more people... just like
all those drugs that people on Medicare can no longer afford.

Sue

[nickinSTL]

64. wtf?

:wtf:

Can he REALLY think that?

I mean, I hope he does campaign on this...I can't imagine ANYONE thinks they're OVER-insured.

I've got decent insurance...not great, but decent. I'm certainly NOT overinsured. And my fiancee has NO insurance...

This is just one more evidence of how out of touch * is...if he goes with this idea, he's finished...only the most hardcore supporters will be able to go along with this.

[Sapphire Blue]

65. Budget to Hurt Poor People on Medicaid, Report Says (NYT)

Budget to Hurt Poor People on Medicaid, Report Says

By ROBERT PEAR
Published: January 30, 2006

WASHINGTON, Jan. 29 — Millions of low-income people would have to pay more for health care under a bill worked out by Congress, and some of them would forgo care or drop out of Medicaid because of the higher co-payments and premiums, the Congressional Budget Office says in a new report.

The Senate has already approved the measure, the first major effort to rein in federal benefit programs in eight years, and the House is expected to vote Wednesday, clearing the bill for President Bush.

In his State of the Union address on Tuesday, Mr. Bush plans to recommend a variety of steps to help people obtain health insurance and cope with rising health costs. But the bill, the Deficit Reduction Act, written by Congress over the last year with support from the White House, could reduce coverage and increase the number of uninsured, the budget office said.

(snip)

The report gives Democrats new ammunition to attack the bill. But they appear unlikely to defeat it, since the House approved a nearly identical version of the legislation by a vote of 212 to 206 on Dec. 19.

(snip)

"About one-third of those affected would be children, and almost half would be individuals with income below the poverty level," the report said in addressing co-payments for prescription drugs.

Continued @ http://www.nytimes.com/2006/01/30/politics/30budget.html

The House will vote on these budget cuts Feb. 1.

Please call your Rep @ 1-800-426-8073 & tell them to vote NO!

For more info, please see this thread...

Rich get richer, poor get poorer, & House votes on budget cuts Feb. 1

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x2411549

[Pirate Smile]

67. Thanks for the article and heads-up, Sapphire Blue.

[lectrobyte]

66. Good God, is he really that far out of touch? nt