Clinton FINALLY Regrets Her War Vote, Sort Of...

[Stephanie]

Here's a new Hillaryism to parse. What does she mean this time?

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/wn_report/2007/08/20/2007-08-20_hil_i_regret_giving_bush_okay_for_war.html

Hil: I regret giving Bush okay for war
Monday, August 20th 2007, 4:00 AM

Sen. Hillary Clinton assured Democrats yesterday she's the one who can whip Republicans on the right, even as she edged left by saying for the first time she regrets voting for the Iraq war.

The New Yorker's rivals who also voted for the war all have called their votes mistakes. She has said repeatedly she only regrets how President Bush used his authority to wage war.

Yesterday, she joined her party's chorus at a debate in Des Moines. "I, too, regret giving George Bush the authority that he misused and abused," she said. As recently as February, she told Politico.com she did not regret her vote. She also has refused to call her vote a mistake or apologize for it.

Clinton adviser Howard Wolfson said she's sticking to those two positions, and downplayed her new regrets, saying the distinction was so small, it could fit "on the head of a pin, dancing with the other angels."

[msongs]

1. if she ripped chelsea's heart out live on stage would that satisfy you enough? nt

[Stephanie]

4. um...

hostile much? :shrug:

I'm a constituent. We begged Clinton to vote no on the IWR, like the the 23 Senators of conscience who did so. We've repeatedly asked her to repudiate her vote. She has refused. I'm glad to see her FINALLY acknowledging, albeit obliquely, how WRONG she was.

[wyldwolf]

2. not really different than anything she's previously said

:shrug:

[Colobo]

3. Did you like yesterday's debate?

[wyldwolf]

8. I always enjoy the debates.

[Colobo]

10. I'm glad you enjoyed it. I loved it. :)

[jmp]

5. It means that her vote was based on the information she had at the time.

And she feels her vote was the right one based on the information she had (about Iraq and about Bush) at the time.

Obviously things didn't turn out like she thought they would.

[Stephanie]

6. I think she means, "if only someone COMPETENT had been in charge of the invasion..."

then I would not be here with egg on my face NOW. We need COMPETENT imperialists in Washington!

[Elidor]

42. Spot on

She made a cynical decision to let George have his war. Now she doesn't want to be held accountable for it.

[Larkspur]

7. Gee, Nancy Pelosi saw that same data and voted against IWR

as did two thirds of the Democrats in Congress.

[zulchzulu]

11. Now you're talking about a woman I would vote for President

Thanks for the reminder.

[jmp]

14. Nancy "the war in Afghanistan is over" Pelosi?

Reauthorizer of the Iraq war and unconstitutional wiretapping.

Isn't that going just a bit overboard with the whole "anyone but Hillary" thing? :eyes:

[zulchzulu]

19. Pelosi voted against the "Protect America Act"...

She is against secret wiretapping and voted against the war originally. She has voted for the troops since she doesn't just want them to die in the streets holding a cardboard box for protection...and she wants to end the war.

Sheesh...

[jmp]

48. Pontius Pelosi scheduled the vote ...

that legitimized the wiretapping. She can try washing her hands of her deeds, but some of us aren't buying it.

[knight_of_the_star]

25. Funny how the logic works

Even though Nancy voted against those things she gets the blame for them passing because of actions of the GOP and the Blue Dogs. Will wonders never cease?

[ripple]

12. No, it was a political calculation.

And one that has backfired badly. That isn't the sort of judgment I look for in a president.

[jmp]

17. It was a mistake ...

That may yet get her elected President.

[dflprincess]

35. I just wish someone would tell us what the 23 senators who voted against the IWR

knew that those voting for it didn't know.

[Stephanie]

37. They knew they weren't running for president in two years?

They knew they had to vote on principle, and not cynical political calculations? Just guessing...

[dflprincess]

39. That would be my guess as well

n/t

[zulchzulu]

9. That's what "experience" does for you...

Don't expect apologies. Don't expect admitting a mistake. That's what you learn when you've proven you've been in the Beltway too long.

Real leaders admit to mistakes and move on. Others....not so much....

[jmp]

16. "Real leaders admit to mistakes and move on."

Or don't and then duck out of debates where they will be forced to defend their positions.

Either way.

[zulchzulu]

20. Here we go with that garbage...

On the debate thing, Obama will participate in 15 debates as the primary season approaches. That seems like enough for me. It's not "ducking out"... it's using a better management of time thanks to the front-loaded primary season where you have the campaign the entire country, unlike past primary seasons where you could focus on smaller amount of states. Maybe you don't know about February 5th yet.

If you use the "ducking out of debates" ruse, you've run out of ammo in my view.

[AndyA]

13. One foot on the boat, the other foot on the dock.

She just shifted her weight to the other foot.

No biggie. :shrug:

[Captain Hilts]

15. She's said that before and that knowing what she does now, she wouldn't vote that way

but she should NOT apologize.

GWB did not act in good faith with the Senate or the US people. The war is his fault.

[HeraldSquare212]

18. Checks and balances

That's why we have three branches, to check one branch when it acts in bad faith, among other things. HRC failed in her main responsibility.

[ripple]

21. Who in the hell truly believed he would act in good faith?

Nobody I know.

And Hillary might have known at least some of what she knows now, had she bothered to read the National Intelligence Estimate.

[Dr Fate]

24. Only us geniuses at DU had the political insiticts to know Bush & his media were liars.

Apparently us Joe-shmoe bloggers are political GENIUSES, while Hillary and the rest are easily "fooled" by Bush: the "slick used car salesman."

Hillary was "fooled" into trusting someone who was already a proven liar Bush-no one should be made to apologize for being "fooled"- they should be rewarded with leadership postions.

[Dr Fate]

23. Funny, *I* knew what she knows now WAYYY back then. I must be a political genius.

But then again, It takes a GENIUS like me to know that Bush & the media were lying. I mean, the case was SOOOO iron clad.

Even after it was proven by GENIUSES that Powell lied to the UN, she had no choice but to continue to agree with trusted sources such as FOX News, Rush Limbaugh, Wolf Blitzer and George Bush. No choice I tells ya!!!

Not everyone can be a rocket-scientist like me.

[knight_of_the_star]

27. Correction on that

We knew even less than they did and still knew better than to support the war, allegedly they had information we didn't. I guess they ignored the Mossad report released prior to the vote that "Iraq is not a threat."

[Dr Fate]

28. So they say. I dont believe them anymore. n/t

n/t

[Dr Fate]

22. Ah, DLCers. They "used to" support Bush & his war, "used to" support Lieberman ( I )...

..."used to" trash the anti war crowd as "crazy, far left nut-roots loonies", "used to" be against the Alito filibuster, "used to" say "we dont have the votes" as an excuse for not fighting Bush (Oh, wait...they still do that...)

Just wait- in 2009 they will say they "used to" be against impeachment.

[IndianaJones]

26. Rush? nt.

[Stephanie]

29. is that directed toward ME?

Are you comparing ME to Rush Limbaugh because I don't forgive Hillary her politically calculated, cynical, unforgiveable vote for war?

[IndianaJones]

30. Sounds like more Limbaughisms to me. nt.

[Stephanie]

31. Yes, because Limbaugh was SO OPPOSED TO THE WAR.

He's out there every day demanding accountability from our electeds on this illegal, immoral war, just like me, Right?

[IndianaJones]

32. Pat Buchanan opposed the war, would that be a better comparison? nt.

[Stephanie]

33. Wow, it's nasty over here in GDP.

Clinton isn't really getting her money's worth if that's the best you can do.

[IndianaJones]

34. I'm sure "Hillaryism" rolls off their tongues just as easily. Whats the problem? nt.

[Stephanie]

36. The problem is I'm sick of her bullshit.

And I'm a constituent who campaigned for her the first time around. I've been greatly disappointed, as has most everyone I know.

[Skip Intro]

38. Sheesh. Here's the full quote. She basically says she was misled and she regrets the vote.

I don't know what more people want. bush and cheney and rice and rumsfeld and the rest of their criminal gang took us in to that war. I have every reason to believe the congress was lied to, and little reason to believe otherwise. At any rate, here's what she said at the debate...

----------------
CLINTON: Well, I, too, regret giving George Bush the authority that he misused and abused. It was a very difficult decision, and I tried to weigh it as carefully as possible, talking to a lot of different people and being assured, both publicly and privately, by President Bush and the people close to him that they would use the authority to go in and get inspectors and try to find out if there were weapons of mass destruction and pursue diplomacy.

So, you know, looking back on it, I wouldn't have voted that way again, certainly, because obviously President Bush had no intention of doing what he said he was going to do. And obviously for me that is a great regret.

STEPHANOPOULOS: But did you tell the whole truth when discussing it?

CLINTON: Well, as I saw it, yes, you know, similar to John. You know, when the president of the United States says, as he said publicly, and then as people around him said privately over and over again, "We're going to use this authority to get inspectors back in, "We're going to go to the United Nations," you know, at some point, you do have to make that evaluation.

And I thought that, based on what he had said and what we were talking about at the time in the Congress, that that would be an appropriate approach.

KUCINICH: Were you tricked?

CLINTON: I would never have diverted our attention to Iraq, and I never would have pursued this war. I think that has been a terrible mistake for our country.
----------------

I don't think this is the first time she's said that.


edited to add rest of her response (was on the next page of the transcript...)

[AtomicKitten]

40. She is no more or less guilty --

than the others that voted "yes" on the IWR.

Quite frankly I think this incessant demand for her to apologize is being used as a gratuitous wedge because when she does make her statements of contrition they are never of sufficient caliber to satisfy the horde.

I'm quite certain all the dead Americans and Iraqis don't give a damn about the opportunism that prompted the "yes" votes and then the retractions.

It's a bullshit dog and pony show that means squat.

[sandnsea]

41. Does she regret recommending the vote to others?

Does she regret saying we needed to 'stay the course' in Nov 2003? Does she regret all her 'win in Iraq' rhetoric of 2004? Does she regret opposing timelines in 2005? Does she regret being a big damn roadblock every single time anybody tried to stand up to Bush on this damn war?

Goddamn. Why is any anti-war Democrat supporting her.

:banghead:

[TeamJordan23]

43. How does she think Bush misused and abused his authority?

If it was by going into war with military actions, why didn't she speak up when that happened??

[killbotfactory]

44. "Fuck Saddam, We're taking him out" - Bush as reported in Time magazine

This was months before the war.

Anyone who was under the impression that Bush would act responsibly with the authority to wage war against Iraq is too stupid to be president. They all knew he wouldn't, they just wanted to look "tough" to voters. If looking tough means giving an idiot man-child who has two-way conversations with God the keys to our war machine, then I'd rather not look tough.

[Stephanie]

45. or too cowardly

We don't need a Democratic president who doesn't have the guts to stand up to a lying bully like Bush.

[Jax]

46. yeah, it's NEVER her fault

like the lying desertng terrorist in the Oval Office, she doesn't get it. She doesn't want to.

Clinton cares about Clinton. Period. The repukes will wipe the floor with this selfish corporate sellout.

She is as pro Iraq slaughter as b*sh.

[David Zephyr]

47. It was good that she addressed this. Now she has.

"I, too, regret giving George Bush the authority that he misused and abused." -- HRC

[FlaxieB]

49. This is a prime example of stubbornness and self righteousness

She cannot bring herself to admit that she made a huge mistake in her Iraq war vote. She only regrets it She is just like Bush?Chaney, accepting no responsibility but willing to blame others without taking any blame for herself. This war is a total disaster and Obama's questioning of her lack of judgment is spot on. Her slow, calculated answer to this question only , her decision, her actions and thus proves her ability to make bad decisions(just like Bush). She has this illusion that she is always right in her convictions and won't be swayed. Sound familiar? She says that she is change agent, but first you have to admit your mistakes and accept blame in order to move forward. We don't need 4 more years of this current 7.5 years of ineptitude.

I only wish that when the debate moderator asked her the question after her response "Were you tricked" that she would answer before she was interrupted by another candidates comment. I would have loved to heard that response.:thumbsdown:

[Raine1988]

50. Vote

She did vote, but she always saying that she did it with the knowledge by that time,
but she can simply say: If i knew what i know now i would have not voted

[NaturalHigh]

51. What she really regrets...

is being called to task for her vote. As far as she is concerned, people should just shut up and vote for her.