When's the last time Hillary was out front on a progressive issue?

[jgraz]

I'm not talking about her padded voting record -- I'm talking about leading the charge: sponsoring or co-sponsoring a bill, speaking out on the Senate floor before a bill leaves committee or showing up on the Sunday bobble-head shows to advocate for a particular issue.

I see Biden, Edwards, Dodd, Kucinich, Gravel and even Obama and Richardson sticking their necks out on important topics. Where has Hillary been?

[YOY]

1. Sush you horribly sexist person with a right-wing agenda!

:sarcasm:

[jgraz]

2. Oh no!! You caught me!

I expect to be tombstoned any minute now. What a poor disruptor I am.

[YOY]

5. You're just pointing out little things that aren't important!

Her voting record on progressive issues!

That's just like all the other flurry of recent new posts about her toenail clippings and camel toe and other stupid shit.

:sarcasm:

[jgraz]

7. Never. EVER. mention "Hillary" and "camel toe" again.

:puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke:

[YOY]

57. You're just a powerful vaginaphobe. The fear of her mighty female genitalia is what rules you!

It's so OBVIOUS!

:sarcasm:

[peacebird]

3. she has to pander to the right in order to get elected, but trust her to lead as a true progressive!

:sarcasm:

[mrreowwr_kittty]

4. Yes, god, I'm so tired of the "voting record" thing

Saying someone 'votes with the party 97% of the time' tells you very little. Most votes are non-controversial and uncontested, for one thing. And it tells you nothing about what bills didn't come up for a vote or how that person helped, stalled, or amended particular bills.

[BootinUp]

6. She went to the floor on Iran

to say Bush has to get approval for any attacks on Iran from Congress, that the IWR does not authorize it. According to her campaign she was one of or the first Senator to speak on the floor about it.

[redqueen]

8. Wasn't that true of the IWR as well?

So... she'd trust him this time why, exactly?

[BootinUp]

9. I don't buy the "trust" meme

The Iraq War Resolution was not about trust. It was about forcing completely unfettered inspections. It was also about making it clear that the Senate placed conditions on support for a war. Conditions that were not met. In other words the blame for the war goes to one asshole, not the Dem party.

You may now reply and divert blame from Bush as is typical in the netroots world.

[redqueen]

14. Look you just admitted that the conditions in the last "get your war on for free" card

were ignored.

So why would any sane person expect that the conditions in this one would not also be ignored?

[BootinUp]

16. So who ya gonna call

Ghostbusters?

Stop blaming democrats who would never have ordered an invasion for christs sake! :mad:

[redqueen]

20. Where am I blaming ANYONE?

Jesus Christ... read the words I'm fucking writing will you?

Are you just refusing to answer the question? Cause if so just say you're not going to answer and I'll leave you to simmer in your rage.

Here is the question... it is a simple one, even:

Given the fact that the conditions in the LAST resolution were ignored... WHY would anyone expect that the conditions in THIS one mean ANYTHING?

[BootinUp]

27. I don't understand the question

There is zero similarities if I understand the two pieces of legislation you are referring to.

Consider that to be my only answer and save me the time to reply to another bullshit question.

[redqueen]

29. ...

:rofl:

All righty then!

[jgraz]

21. Yes, stop blaming Democrats! They would have never ordered an invasion

They would have NEVER written the USAPATRIOT act
They would have NEVER nominated John Roberts
They would have NEVER nominated Samuel Alito
They would have NEVER nominated Alberto Gonzales
They would have NEVER spied on American citizens
They would have NEVER tortured prisoners of war


Yet, somehow, all those things --and more -- were allowed to take place while DEMOCRATS had the power to stop them.

[redqueen]

24. Don't for get when they joined with the GOP to stop the Fair Trade amendments!

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x2227016

Oh no... is pointing out uncomfortable truths bad manners? Am I bashing Dems?

:banghead:

[BootinUp]

30. Are you equating that to an invasion?

I just want to make sure.

[redqueen]

32. Are you fucking kidding me?!

Jesus, dude!

:rofl:

[jgraz]

33. Seriously, RQ. Quit while he's behind

:rofl:

[BootinUp]

40. I'm satisfied that you failed to make a valid point. nt

[jgraz]

41. Sorry, were we talking to you?

[redqueen]

43. ...

And here I was thinking this couldn't get any funnier.

[jgraz]

31. Actually, I'd love to forget that...along with all the other betrayals

I wonder how the Hillary supporters manage it? Some kind of eastern mysticism I suppose. Or maybe high doses of GHB...

[redqueen]

34. Maybe something like this...

[jgraz]

42. Yeah, she might work...

:rofl:

[jgraz]

15. There's more than enough blame to go around on that one

If you hand a toddler a book of matches, don't you share some of the blame for the resulting fire?


But nice try on the "divert blame" meme. Too bad none of us are buying it.

[BootinUp]

19. I suggest you bookmark

my post and read it occasionally.

[jgraz]

23. Sorry, I already have a prescription for ambien

:boring:

[JackORoses]

73. then she voted for Kyl-Lieberman, she's definitely out front on the March to Iran

[bvar22]

139. She voted FOR IT...

before she spoke out AGAINST IT?

[BootinUp]

142. Sorry

your post make absolutely no sense.

[bvar22]

147. Of course it makes sense. Standard Hillary DoubleSpeak.

She stands on both sides of this issue!

[MGKrebs]

10. I don't know, when's the last time Edwards won an election?

[jgraz]

13. Hmm...he's won one fewer election than Hillary has

But we're not talking about him, are we?

[hijinx87]

17. no. we aren't. because we are constantly talking about hillary

she could win the nobel peace prize, and some people
here would roundly condemn her because it wasn't the
prize for medicene.

[jgraz]

36. I promise. If Hillary wins the Nobel Peace Prize, I'll support her in the primaries

Assuming the Nobel Committee decides to hand out another before the end of the year. :rofl:

Seriously, you should stop now. You're making my sides hurt from laughing.

[hijinx87]

47. I'm sorry if my analogy was lost on you.

besides attacking hillary, do you have anything constructive or worthwhile to
say?

I see Biden, Edwards, Dodd, Kucinich, Gravel and even Obama and Richardson sticking their necks out on important topics.

can you name three progressive legislative accomplishments for each?

[jgraz]

52. No, I understood it completely. I just thought it was really really stupid.

[hijinx87]

56. you aren't fooling anyone.

being obnoxious is no substitute for being informed. and
just because people stop responding to you doesn't make you
right; sometimes, it just isn't worth the effort.

but you seem to rule your little delusional world, so I will
leave you to it.

[jgraz]

58. Mission Accomplished

:patriot:

[MGKrebs]

18. Bzzzt. The correct answer is 10 years.

We're talking about carefully crafting criteria designed to make a particular candidate look bad, right? :shrug:

[jgraz]

28. Yes, that whole carefully crafted "leadership" criteria

That "rigged" metric where I sneakily ask her to actually take a stand on an issue or demonstrate a single core principle. How unfair!!! :rofl:

[MGKrebs]

54. Can you name one thing that Edwards hasn't changed his mind on

over the past 4 years? We don't even have to get into whether he has apologized or not.

[jgraz]

55. Good point. You can't flip-flop if you have no core convictions to start with

Maybe Hillary's on to something. :shrug:

[MGKrebs]

68. Ah, so you DO have a point to make. Let me ask you,

instead of masturbating in public, why don't you just tell us what evidence you have that Clinton has no core principles?

[jgraz]

71. Dude, if you haven't figure that out by now, nothing I say can help you

[MGKrebs]

122. I see. No evidence? This isn't really a discussion is it.

You're just feeling feisty and wanted to tweak some people?

[jgraz]

128. This is an area of strong division. I doubt I can convince you at all

I see Hillary's craven silence on the Roberts, Alito, Gonzales and Mukasey nominations as examples of this. Also her support for the PATRIOT act, the IWR and the Kyl-Lieberman amendment.

This is the whole point of my OP. I think that someone with a moral compass would be out front on many progressive issues, especially since her supporters often point to her voting record as an example of her sterling progressive credentials.

[MGKrebs]

134. Yes but you are forgetting the fact the this is presidential politics and

the country is divided. People who want to be ideologically pure should probably find another way to advance their agenda. Politicians have to win. A certain amount of compromise is necessary in order to win, and it's pretty much demanded by democracy.


The arc of the moral universe is long,
But it bends toward justice.

Theodore Parker

[jgraz]

136. Ideological purity is a classic straw man

If I wanted ideological purity, I'd never be able to support any candidate. What I'm objecting to is ideological vacancy. A candidate has to clearly demonstrate that they stand for SOMETHING beyond their own ambition.

[hijinx87]

11. at least she HAS a voting record

that is older than a couple of years *ahem*, and hasn't been
abandoned for nearly four years *cough*.

[jgraz]

12. She also has a pulse (allegedly). What's your point?

[hijinx87]

22. A PULSE!! OMFG!! SHOOT THE CORPORATE WHORE!

it's too fast, or it's too slow, or it isn't regular
enough.

or it didn't beat just right on one particular vote on one
particular day 5 years ago! (neither did several other
important pulses, but we give them a pass)

:eyes::eyes::eyes:


my POINT is that if voting record is your criteria, then
you wash out obama and edwards long before you can lay a
glove on hillary, because at least she has one.

[jgraz]

25. So does Duncan Hunter

And Tom Tancredo, and Fred Thompson, and John McCain. I'm guessing you'll be supporting one of them if they turn out to have MORE votes than Hillary.

Yeah, you win the Dumbest Argument of the Day award. At least until another Hillary supported replies to this thread... :rofl:

[hijinx87]

37. none of whom are running for the democratic nomination

reality just doesn't seem to get in the way of the rabid
anti-hillaryites. they will turn every sleeve inside out,
or ignore any fact, pertinent or not, to make their increasingly
bitter and hateful mendacity take on some semblance of sense.

and I won't dignify the last fragment of your already fragmented
silliness with a response.

[dflprincess]

26. The focus group will get back to you about that

n/t

[wyldwolf]

35. "padded" voting record? Ha ha! Is this going to be another goal post moving thread?

[hijinx87]

38. of course.

it's all over the field already. :eyes:

[jgraz]

39. My "goalposts" have been pretty steady. I've always called bullshit on the voting record canard

It's absurd on its face -- an obvious attempt to put lipstick on the pig of Hillary's dismal Senate record.

[wyldwolf]

44. so your contention is she didn't really cast the votes she's on record for casting?

:shrug:

[jgraz]

45. Yes, that's exactly what I'm saying

She's hired lookalikes to go into the Senate and cast fraudulent votes. :eyes:

You really can't be this incapable of parsing simple English, can you?

[wyldwolf]

49. how else would you define "padded" voting record?

You can't really be so conspiracy minded to think somehow someway she didn't really cast the votes.

[jgraz]

50. I've defined it very clearly. You just prefer to feign illiteracy

It's your trademark schtick. And it's getting pretty damn tired.

[wyldwolf]

51. No you didn't. You're avoiding answering the question

A "progressive"* trademark. :shrug:

[jgraz]

53. Yes, I generally avoid engaging with time-wasting sophists

Though I'm not above jerking them around for a bit.

[YOY]

59. I assure you. It provides many of us entertainment!

Not really Don Rickles' graduate-level offspring, are you?

[wyldwolf]

60. so you think it's a waste of time to define "padded voting record." It is the meat of your OP

Without a definition, your OP is meaningless shit.

[LoZoccolo]

63. You really should just answer the question about how her voting record could be "padded".

The avoidance is straining your credibility.

And that's...

lame.

[wyldwolf]

66. ** crickets **

[jgraz]

70. Lame n/t

[hijinx87]

77. you haven't even attempted to answer a single question

in this entire thread. being obnoxious is the only tool
you have got, and every time a question does rear it's ugly
head, you rather artlessly dodge it.

real life must piss in your wheaties a lot for you to be
this bitter.

[jgraz]

94. My OP is a question, which you have no response for

So you kick up a bunch of dust, hoping that nobody will notice the fact that your candidate is about as trustworthy as Cheney with a shotgun and a fifth of Chivas.

[hijinx87]

119. no subject

"hoping that nobody will notice the fact that your candidate is about as trustworthy as Cheney with a shotgun and a fifth of Chivas"

what? you want her to shoot a republican in his fat ass? that can probably be arranged.

[dionysus]

46. when was the first?

[jgraz]

48. In fairness, she did stick her neck out on giving health insurance companies our money

But that was way back in 1993.

[hijinx87]

106. speaking of 1993 . . .

how old were you in 1993?

[wyldwolf]

61. here's a few highlights of Sen. Clinton's "padded" voting record in 2007

Bill she has sponsored:

A few highlights:

A concurrent resolution expressing the sense of Congress that Harriet Tubman should have been paid a pension for her service as a nurse and scout in the United States Army during the Civil War.

A bill to amend the Internal Revenue Code of 1986 to expand the work opportunity tax credit for small business jobs creation.

A bill to express the sense of the Senate concerning a new drinking water standard for arsenic.

A bill to amend title XXI of the Social Security Act to expand the provision of child health assistance to children with family income up to 300 percent of poverty.

A bill to amend the Federal Food, Drug, and Cosmetic Act to add provisions regarding protecting the United States food supply.

A bill to provide additional resources to States to eliminate the backlog of unanalyzed rape kits and to ensure timely analysis of rape kits in the future.

A bill to amend the Public Health Service Act to establish a program to assist family caregivers in accessing affordable and high-quality respite care, and for other purposes.

bill to amend title 38, United States Code, to provide that remarriage of the surviving spouse of a veteran after age 55 shall not result in termination of dependency and indemnity compensation.

A bill to amend the Atomic Energy Act of 1954 to establish a task force to identify legislative and administrative action that can be taken to ensure the security of sealed sources of radioactive material, and for other purposes.

A bill to strengthen our national food safety infrastructure by increasing the number of inspectors within the Food and Drug Administration to enable the Food and Drug Administration to inspect high-risk sites at least annually, supporting research that enables us to meet emerging threats, improving surveillance to identify and trace the sources and incidence of food-borne illness, and otherwise maintaining at least current funding levels for food safety initiatives at the Food and Drug Administration and the United States Department of Agriculture.

A bill to provide for the conduct of a study concerning the health and learning impacts of sick and dilapidated public school buildings on children and to establish the Healthy and High Performance Schools Program.

[Tejanocrat]

81. How about these "moment of triangulation greatness" votes:

Hillary has been out front in saber rattling about Iran,

she led the way to reauthorize the Patriot Act,

she has been a leader on the effort to build a wall on the border with Mexico,

she was out front in the efforts to cut capital gains and dividend taxes,

she was way out front in refusing to redeploy our troops out of Iraq,

she voted against a Senate Office on Public Integrity,

she's for Chinese MFN status and for "free" trade with Asia and Latin America and the Middle East, and

she has been a leader in support of the "three strikes" imprisonment law.



Which of these votes should we progressive voters be the happiest about?

[wyldwolf]

124. that wasn't what the OP asked, but since you're adding your own spin, answer these...

HOW has Hillary been out front in saber rattling about Iran? By voting for a non-binding resolution that would freeze financial assets?

HOW did she lead the way to reauthorize the Patriot Act?

come to think of it, HOW has she LED on these things you've listed?

[Tejanocrat]

126. Headline: "Hillary Clinton calls Iran a threat to U.S., Israel"

Hillary Clinton calls Iran a threat to U.S., Israel from the International Herald-Tribune

NEW YORK: Calling Iran a danger to the U.S. and one of Israel's greatest threats, U.S. senator and presidential candidate Hillary Rodham Clinton said "no option can be taken off the table" when dealing with that nation.

"U.S. policy must be clear and unequivocal: We cannot, we should not, we must not permit Iran to build or acquire nuclear weapons," the Democrat told a crowd of Israel supporters. "In dealing with this threat ... no option can be taken off the table."

Clinton spoke at a Manhattan dinner held by the largest pro-Israel lobbying group in the U.S., the American Israel Public Affairs Committee. Some 1,700 supporters applauded as she cited her efforts on behalf of the Jewish state and spoke scathingly of Iran's decision to hold a conference last month that questioned whether the Holocaust took place.

...

[wyldwolf]

129. John Edward and Barack Obama must have "led" on this, too

[Tejanocrat]

132. Neither Obama nor Edwards voted for or supported the Kyl-Lieberman Amendment which Hillary voted for

[wyldwolf]

137. but they did say everything was on the table or some such similar thing

...and I'll ask again since it was avoided the first time - how is voting on a non-binding resolution "leading" on saber rattling against Iran? :shrug:

[Tejanocrat]

141. I've heard more saber rattling on Iran from Hillary than any other Democrat? Can you name a hawkish

Democrat whose further out on the Iran conflict than Hillary? I can't.

Be glad that your candidate is showing such strong leadership on the Iran war issue. At least she's not on both sides of this issue.

[wyldwolf]

145. Then you have selective hearing

You haven't heard Edwards say that "all options must remain on the table," in regards to dealing with Iran, whose nuclear ambition "threatens the security of Israel and the entire world."

You haven't heard Obama say to the American Israel Public Affairs Committee on 2 March 2007 that he regards Iran's government as "a threat to all of us," stating that the US "should take no option, including military action, off the table.

[Tejanocrat]

146. Facts are facts: "Edwards, Obama Assail Democratic Frontrunner Over Iran, Iraq, And Consistency ..."

Edwards, Obama Assail Democratic Frontrunner Over Iran, Iraq, And Consistency Of Positions:

Edwards, drawing a link between Iraq and Iran, pressed on. "What I worry about is, if Bush invades Iran six months from now, I mean, are we going to hear: 'If only I had known then what I know now?"' He was alluding to comments Clinton has made about her 2002 vote to authorize military action against Saddam Hussein.

“Edwards and Obama achieved at least some of what they wanted to do coming into this debate and that was to exploit some of Clinton’s vulnerabilities with the Democratic base, especially on Iran and Iraq,” said CBSNews.com Senior Political Editor Vaughn Ververs.

Hillary is the most hawkish candidate -- with respect to both Iraq and Iran.

[Tejanocrat]

127. Hillary: "the Patriot Act contains provisions that provide law enforcement with important tools in

the War on Terror. Because we cannot afford to be without these tools, I am supporting bipartisan legislation that will extend the sunsetting provisions of the Patriot Act by three months."

Statement of Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton on December 16, 2005

[wyldwolf]

130. What did Barack Obama say when he voted for it?

[hijinx87]

62. support your statement

I see Biden, Edwards, Dodd, Kucinich, Gravel and even Obama and Richardson sticking their necks out on important topics.


name a few for each. and appearing on a talk show is simply not being
"out front", however you want to define that.

name specific progressive legislative accomplishments, which are ultimately
the only things that matter.

[wyldwolf]

64. this is where jgraz makes a smart ass comment or just disappears

[jgraz]

72. No, I just know who the honest, intelligent posters are. No point in debating the others

Guess which bin you're in...

[cuke]

78. So why didnt you answer the question?

Name one time Biden, Edwards, Dodd, Kucinich, Gravel Obama and Richardson have stuck their necks out on an important issues?

[hijinx87]

82. because he can't answer the question

if he exerted half the effort just answering the damn thing as
he has avoiding answering, it would be since done by now.

[jgraz]

85. OK, here it is in a nutshell.

If you don't understand the references, I'm not going to help you do your homework:

Biden: Iraq partition and many foreign policy issues
Edwards: Poverty, labor, trade
Dodd: FISA
Kucinich: Impeachment
Gravel: Iraq War, tax policy
Obama: Iraq War
Richardson: He's almost as bad as Hillary here, but at least he's been a leader on indigenous rights. You could argue that he's as bad as Hillary, but he's pretty much a non-issue in the campaign.

Now, if I had just made my statement about Richardson, you might have a legitimate gripe. However, to feign ignorance about all of the other issues strains credulity. Hence my charge that the posters are not arguing in good faith.

[cuke]

87. Absurd

Biden: I doubt if more than 10% of americans even know who Biden is, nevermind his partition plan

Edwards: I see a list of three issues. I see no neck sticking out. His policies, if anything, are pandering, not courageous

Obama: No neck sticking out. More pandering. Nothing courageous

Richardson: No neck sticking out

[jgraz]

91. See? Bad faith, feigned ignorance

I don't know why I even bother. :banghead:

[hijinx87]

96. you didn't bother. you ran away from the entire issue for about an hour

then you posted a few 3rd grade talking points. then you started
calling everyone that didn't agree with you stupid . . . again.

go away, dude. we're already stocked up on pompous ignorance here.

[jgraz]

100. See, melvin, when you post bullshit distractions to the OP, it's YOU who are running away

And, BTW, I wasn't calling everyone stupid. You're special.

As in "olympics".

[hijinx87]

107. it wasn't a distraction. it was a question. one that you have YET to answer. n/t

[cuke]

103. He wants us to believe that "poverty" is something Edwards stuck his neck out on

If it weren't for poverty, we would never have heard of Edwards. Poverty MADE Edwards

[hijinx87]

92. my horoscope is more specific than that.

not to mention more accurate and more impressively presented. :eyes:

come back when you have your shit together.

[jgraz]

95. Like I said, I'm not here for your remedial education

If you haven't picked up a newspaper, watched a single debate or even turned on CNN in the past six months, I can't really help you.

[hijinx87]

101. you aren't here for anything that I have been able to discover.

are you older than 15?

[jgraz]

105. Yes, your lack of perception has been quite obvious

Nice to know you're finally tuning in to the problem.

[hijinx87]

108. was there a lot of lead paint where you grew up, princess? n/t

[jgraz]

110. Nice to see you breaking out the homophobia

Didn't think my opinion of you could go lower, but there it is.

[hijinx87]

112. think what you like

my use of the term "princess" was intended to illuminate
your age (or lack thereof), which I put at about 15.

but I stand firm on the lead paint allegation.

[jgraz]

114. Wow, you can't even get insults right

:rofl:

[hijinx87]

117. I thought it went pretty well

it had you chased on top of a chair screeching "homophobia", and
hell, it was inadvertent.

[wyldwolf]

65. ** crickets **

[hijinx87]

67. that is actually the second time I asked the question

I posed the same challenge well upstream in this same thread. he
ignored it then, too.

[wyldwolf]

69. well, I have a meeting to attend. I'll check back in later

[jgraz]

74. I'll make a deal with you

You demonstrate that you have a basic, third-grade-level understanding of what my argument is AND you post a good-faith rebuttal. Then I will happily answer your questions.

Edit: same goes for hijinx and LameZoccolo.

[hijinx87]

75. that is a cowardly response

but I already had you figured for having no substance.

you have been asked to back up your own statement that
appeared in your original post. quit answering questions
with more questions. you are shredding your already
threadbare credibility.

[jgraz]

76. Nice try, but not quite.

Go back. Read slowly. You'll get it eventually.

I hope.

[hijinx87]

80. you can't answer, can you?

dude, you aren't nearly as clever as you think you are.

just answer the damn question or STFU. take your choice,
but right now, son, you're just boring me.

[cuke]

83. Plan B

Hillary, along with two other Senators, put a hold on *'s nominee to head the FDA until he promised to make Plan B accessible over the counter.

Now it's your turn. You saiad that all of the other candidates have stuck their neck out on important issues. Please list these or have your argument revealed as phony BS double standard

[jgraz]

89. Hah! Thank you for reminding me of that

Another example of Hillary trusting the * admin, caving on her "principles" and then acting shocked, SHOCKED, when they went reneged on the agreement.

One of many articles that you appear to have missed on the issue:
http://www.villagevoice.com/news/0537,lombardi,67735,6.html

[cuke]

97. Bwahahaha!! Busted again!!!

Plan B is now available over the counter. You posted an article from before it got approved for OTC access

[jgraz]

111. Another example of Hillary getting punked

And don't forget that she also jumped on the Workplace Religious Freedom Act bandwagon to ensure that pharmacists could avoid stocking Plan B whenever Jeebus told them to.

Sorry, but it's sometimes hard to keep track given the depth and breadth of her perfidy.

[cuke]

116. Plan B is now accessible over the counter because of HIllary

You tried to misinform DU by posting an article from before the whole issue was resolved and got busted on it, so now you want to distract with another piece of legislation

You are so transparent

[cuke]

90. Immigration

[wyldwolf]

123. ha ha.

another "progressive"* dodge, divert, insult.

[jgraz]

131. Don't worry, nobody was expecting you to meet the challenge

Speaking of "divert", why are you so hesitant to actually answer the question in my OP?

[wyldwolf]

138. what challenge?

[jgraz]

140. You really need to learn a new trick

The feigned alzheimers is getting old. Don't worry, you still have straw men, ad hominems, violation of the null hypothesis and many other logical fallacies to choose from.

[wyldwolf]

143. oh, you mean the "padded resume" that you refuse to define yet demand people explain?

[MGKrebs]

125. Ooh, ooh, me, me!!

Since Biden, Dodd, Kucinich, and Gravel have a practically zero chance of winning, one must wonder about the things (whatever they are) that they are allegedly sticking their necks out on, let alone the wisdom of doing so. So, we reduce this argument to Obama and Edwards.

[Tejanocrat]

79. Hillary has been out front in saber rattling about Iran, led the way to reauthorize the Patriot Act,

she has been a leader on the effort to build a wall on the border with Mexico,

she was out front in the efforts to cut capital gains and dividend taxes,

she was way out front in refusing to redeploy our troops out of Iraq,

she voted against a Senate Office on Public Integrity,

she's for Chinese MFN status and for "free" trade with Asia and Latin America and the Middle East, and

she has been a leader in support of the "three strikes" imprisonment law.

How can you possibly question Hillary's leadership on progressive issues?

[elehhhhna]

84. 1992. DING DING I WIN!!!!!11!!!1

[Tejanocrat]

93. You NAILED it!

[elehhhhna]

133. thank you, fellow Texan, and a belated Welcome to DU!

[Diane R]

86. Her finger is always in the air, waiting for the wind to blow before she does anything.

[murbley40]

88. Kick

[jgraz]

98. Funny how we get so much sound and fury but not a single, coherent answer to the question

So much for Hillary being "ready to lead".

[cuke]

99. Keep pretending

The only one being fooled is yourself

[jgraz]

102. So your answer would be?

We're waiting...

[cuke]

104. I've given two. You've provided none

[jgraz]

118. Your one-word "Immigration" response counts as an answer?

I honestly thought you were joking given her meltdown in the last debate. But thanks for pointing out the depths of the Hillarites' delusions.

[cuke]

120. Yes

How much support is there for giving DL's to undocumented aliens? Dodd pandered and called DL's a privilige of citizenship, even though thousands of non-citizens get DL's every year legally

[hijinx87]

121. this thread began at 12:45. it's almost 3:45 now.

is three hours the DU record for "Irrational Hissy Fits"?

[hijinx87]

109. why are you replying to your own post?

that's just creepy.

strictly speaking, you are talking to yourself.

[jgraz]

113. Now we have to explain the basic tenets of DU to you?

Just sad. You really need to learn when to stop typing.

[hijinx87]

115. replying to your own lame post is a "tenet"?

and who is "we", and when did "we" set the rules? somebody
leave you in charge?

sigh

I've already chased you further down your rat hole than I
intended to go.

[JeffR]

148. I predicted that the minute you first posted the question

;)

[Evergreen Emerald]

135. You see the others sticking their necks out yet you don't see Clinton's ?

Where exactly are you looking?

[goodgd_yall]

144. You first---what are Biden, Edwards, Dodd, Obama, and Richardson sticking their necks out on?

And how?