The "everyone does it" defense doesn't cut it in Hillary's planted question controversy

[ruggerson]

Hillary's staff are appallingly stupid to have done this.

Town hall meetings are supposed to be the people's chance to question the candidates. Not the candidate's chance to question themselves.

Aside from the political stupidity, which alone raises competence questions, this orchestration smacks of a small subversion of the democratic process; a small one yes, but is it the steady drip of small subversions that eventually lead us down a very dangerous road.

Senator Clinton either made a very stupid mistake herself or has been ill served by her own campaign staffers.

[ElizabethDC]

1. Well, the campaign seems to acknowledge that it was a mistake

because they've said that they won't do it again, and that Sen. Clinton didn't know about it to begin with.

http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5ibDaM5Uxy4A4EqU8WOm_ygQ-TXjwD8SQIK4O4

[jgraz]

Sure she didn't know about it

:rofl:

[ElizabethDC]

14. Well, I'm just going off what they're saying. I have no idea whether she knew or not.

But the fact that they're saying she didn't know about it means that they recognize that it's a bad policy. Hopefully it's something that they won't repeat in the future.

[jgraz]

24. Are you sure they recognize it was bad policy, or is this just damage control?

And why do you think they had to learn that disgusting chicanery was bad??? :shrug:

[ElizabethDC]

28. I don't know the details.

I don't know whose idea it was to plant the questioner (ie, what level staffer it was), or who else knew about it, etc. Frankly, it's not something that's going to keep me up at night. It wasn't the greatest idea, but I'm not exactly horrified by it.

[jgraz]

30. For them to say that Hillary didn't know about it is a transparent lie

How the hell would she know to call on the plant if they didn't tell her what was going on?

We've just lived through 7 years of this shit. Do you really want more?

[Yael]

13. And some questioned Obama's leadership because his plane landed at the wrong airport

Just sayin...

[Mz Pip]

2. Of course it doesn't

She's supposed to be perfect. Her staff is supposed to be perfect and anyone who sends her money is supposed to be perfect too. Anything else just doesn't cut it.

Mz Pip
:dem:

[jgraz]

10. I'd be happy if they just avoided gross violations of ethics

She's engaging in dishonest, undemocratic, Bush-lite tactics. That's pretty fucking far from perfect.

[Islander Expat]

3. LOL, that was Nixons excuse too....

"They all do it, he just got caught"

LOL!

[BleedingHeartPatriot]

4. Why haven't candidates, not just Sen. Clinton, figured out that transparency and spontaneity

are that which most citizens desire of a leader who would govern this country?
:shrug:

MKJ

[burythehatchet]

5. for the same reason that cellphone makers change the size of the

battery every time a new model is released.

(Though logical and sensible, ultimately they think it is more profiatable not to do it).

[JeffR]

8. That's the $64,000 question right there

I think the problem is to be found in that peculiar breed described as "Democratic campaign strategists". They may not all suck, but those who suck, suck bigtime. One would swear their mission is to get Republicans elected. Let's hope they don't succeed.

[BeyondGeography]

6. Does everyone do this, too?

==Oct. 13, 2007 | PLYMOUTH, N.H. -- President-in-waiting Hillary Clinton says she has come for a "conversation," a candid give-and-take, a sharing moment to connect the politician with the people while the television cameras roll.

She sits with two New Hampshire voters, Kim Beauregard and 16-year-old daughter Ashley, on a stage under bright lights. Beauregard explains how hard it will be to pay for her daughter's college education.

"You would think about taking out a home equity loan?" the presidential candidate asks, as if in disbelief.

"Yes," says Beauregard.

"You'd sell your house?"

"Yes."

The New York senator seems stunned, crestfallen. "Well, Kim, as a mom myself, that really touched me," she says, turning now to the cameras and the crowd. "Like most mothers, Kim wants to do whatever it takes to help Ashley live out her dream. I just don't think that a hardworking family like yours should be in that position."

..."She's boring as can be, but she's competent," explains Joshua Gordon, a voter from Canterbury, N.H., effectively summing up the current Democratic contest in New Hampshire. "Barack Obama was exciting, but she's competent." Then, almost with exasperation, he adds, "I think she would do a good job."

In this context, the blatant artifice of her campaign shtick hardly registers for many voters, who brag afterward about having just shaken the hand of the next president of the United States. Who cares if Clinton's shock and emotion at the Beauregard story was planned and forced? Does it matter that Kim Beauregard volunteers at the Clinton campaign in Laconia, where Ashley works as an intern? So what if Clinton held a card laying out the details of the Beauregard story even as she expressed astonishment at the details? For the Clinton campaign, what matters is that the day's message came through: Hillary Clinton cares...==

http://www.salon.com/news/feature/2007/10/13/hillary /

[calteacherguy]

7. Where is the evidence that "everyone does it?" nt

[MethuenProgressive]

9. Seven. n/t

:rofl:

[calteacherguy]

12. I do not believe everyone does it.

Do you?

[stillcool]

11. There are just so many blatant lies...

that I can handle...and I really need to prioritize. This one is same old, same old to me. Now...Congress playing 'Baghdad Bob' on the military spending bill...and the over a million Iraqi's killed...that's something worth some time spent 'divining' a little truth.

[PurityOfEssence]

15. It's a sign of amorality or justified retaliatory privilege for people to say there's no problem

It's not acceptable. I'm speaking about the Clinton supporters who minimize or dismiss this: didn't their mommies and daddies teach them anything?

Screening questions is one thing, coaching or creating them is another thing entirely.

Those who dismiss this as "to be expected" or "part of politics" or "something they all do" have a moral failing; perhaps it's a form of amorality instead of immorality, but it's a failing nonetheless.

It's wrong.

It's also flabbergasting to hear it excused by saying that Senator Clinton didn't know about it; she DEFINITELY knew which questioner to call on, so that's a deception in itself. Admittedly, this is considerably less of a deception, and more or less barely within the last gasp of the bounds of ethical comportment: she may have thought that the person was asked ahead what she'd say and assessed for whether she'd be sincere; if this was the case, it'd be an example of pushing the envelope and making something that's touted as impromptu "facing the people" a little more staged and safer, but it's still deceptive.

Considering the "hands on" image and one of thorough competence she's cultivated, if she DIDN'T know about this, it's mighty hard to believe. It's also a species of trying to have it both ways, which is the heart of her problems of late.

Shame on all of you.

[Bitwit1234]

16. Golly at the last debate

25 questions were asked of Hillary 22 were hostile. This is according to a post at CrooksandLiars from a commentator who is not in Clinton's camp. S.O.B if I were planting all those questions I sure would plant hostile ones. Or maybe she planted the one where they asked Obama what Halloween costume he was wearing this year...boy that was a hostile one wasn't it.

[Kurt_and_Hunter]

17. As with so many campaign stories, Clinton supporters should just say

"Yes, it is a rotten story. I would prefer my candidate not pull that kind of shit."

Defending the indefensible sometimes seems to be job one in GD: Politics

[ElizabethDC]

19. As a Clinton supporter, that's exactly how I feel about this

I'm not in favor of planted questions, but I'm also not horribly outraged by it, either. It just seems an unwise thing to do.

[Redneck Socialist]

18. It's called smart campaigning

and everyone does do it. Those that don't don't get elected.

[Gman]

20. "Everyone does it" is NOT a defense because there's nothing to defend

planting a question is a way to be sure something gets asked. It's just good, smart politics. You don't leave it to chance that someone will ask the question.

Do you know what a campaign is? From Miriam-Webster:

Main Entry:
1 cam·paign
Pronunciation: \(ˌ)kam-ˈpān\
Function: noun

1 : a connected series of military operations forming a distinct phase of a war
2 : a connected series of operations designed to bring about a particular result

[ruggerson]

21. It's not good, smart politics

if reporters find out about it (which they inevitably would have) and it becomes a distraction from her campaign for a series of news cycles.

[Gman]

26. You can't run a campaign like this

worrying about what some petty story-starved reporter is going to try to make a story our of. You'll be chasing your tail for the rest of the campaign. I frankly don't want anyone elected to office that is that skittish. How would he/she handle the Russians?

I wonder if this "reporter" will now have it on his/her resume that they were the one to "break" this story. What a loser.

[usregimechange]

22. Something Bush would do

[pnwmom]

23. In the broad scheme of things, this controversy seems trivial to me.

Her positions on Iraq, health care, employment, etc. matter a lot more than this does.

[madrchsod]

25. if everyone "planted" this might result

or this

even worse

god help us

[guruoo]

27. This thing's beginning to grow hair...

[Basileus Basileon]

29. This is just absolutely offensive, yes.

We attacked Bush for it. We should hold our own to the same standards.

[Jim Sagle]

31. The "nobody gives a fuck" defense just might do it, though.

[cuke]

32. Nothing was "planted" That's just media spin

A staffer SUGGESTED. The questioners were free to ask whatever they wanted to ask

[Karmadillo]

37. But as progressive Democrats we must take Corporate Media spin and repeat it over and over again

until we've convinced ourselves it's true.

[Perry Logan]

33. If Obama did it, you'd be saying what a brilliant strategy it was.

[ruggerson]

36. haha

I don't think so.

[JackORoses]

34. Looks like sHillary's taking lessons from the FEMA guy who ran the fake news conference

what a surprise...

[gulliver]

35. Time to grow up and stop obsessing.

Seriously. No leader is going to be perfect. No staff is going to be perfect. No information is going to be perfect. The course has to be set for the long term. The moves have to be inspired and large. The outrages and panics of the day are for children. We need a large subset of the Dems to get it and stay cool. Nothing will ever get done if we spaz every time the media films our navel.