What? You can't conduct a campaign in Iowa from a home? How many have a home office here?

[MrMickeysMom]

Couldn't share my thoughts on another thread because it was locked. Here's the logic- Dennis Kucinich should have known better, or he would have had a real office. Huh?

My logic tells me that Kucinich's campaign is run in that state out of a home based office for good reason, the same one I understand is the method of choice for most entrepreneurs in the country. It's to run the campaign, America. Funny, Alan Keys doesn't seem to have a problem with getting his strange person involved with republican debate and he hass no office outside the home. Perhaps the real reason Dennis Kucinich is being excluded from this debate is that he stops getting any more of his message to the people so than can vote for him.

Anytime Kucinich has been asked debate questions, it's generally results in applause, and agreement, in retrospect. He is talking about the issues we want all the Democrats to engage in. Not that anyone on NPR, the general networks or cable (not even KO!) is doing their best to make it a 3 "man" race.

I'm so disgusted with this nonsense.

[msongs]

1. Iowa is pretty much a fraud against america - my city has more people than caucus in Iowa nt

[Bicoastal]

6. So then what do you care about an Iowa debate?

If Iowa is such a fraud, who cares how poorly DK does in that state? Obviously not Dennis.

[rurallib]

12. It is Gannet Company, not Iowa, running the debate.

I will thank you now for not beating Iowa up for something they had nothing to do with. Do you want us all to take off work and march in front of Gannet in NYC to protest for DK?

[MonkeyFunk]

2. You don't run a retail business

out of a home. And a candidate's office is like a retail business - people see it, walk in, get brochures, signs, pins, etc. They offer to volunteer.

Somebody working out of a home isn't a campaign office.

[MrMickeysMom]

7. "A candidate's office is like a retail business"? Huh???

:wtf: No, a candidate's office is NOT like a retail business. A retail business focus's on making a profit with whatever widgets they decide to hang in "the storefront" . This is not that. I don't walk by a (fill in the blank) running for Prez, enticed by their window dressing and come in, for God sake. What I do as a citizen with those brochsures and all the information contained within deals with getting my volunteers OUT TO THE COMMUNITY, not having the community try on a size fucking 6 and ring it up at the cash register.

My goodness, you need to experience what people are doing this very SECOND out of their homes to run candidates. That very process, probably as productive, and likely MORE productive out of a HOME is the part of WE, THE PEOPLE, do to get our candidate elected. It is integrel to running his, or anyone else's campaign.

[MonkeyFunk]

10. It's a place where

people can drop in uninvited.

Yes, many volunteers can work out of their homes - but there should be an office where people can drop in without notice.

Look, all the other candidates manage to do it, and this isn't Kucinich's first time running. He knows the game. Apparently he isn't making an effort in Iowa - and that's fair. He doesn't have to. But whingeing because he's not included in an IOWA debate is just silly.

[MrMickeysMom]

16. Well, I don't believe it's silly, and this response is a weak stance when you consider-

... how un level the playing field has been for candidates like DK. I don't care how long a person gathers steam and decides runs for office. Again, given the resources, and people who are out in the community pressing flesh and meeting with literature in hand, the literature is out there, it's just out in the hands of volunteers, not a storefront.

If you think a storefront will increase the number of brochures getting into the hands of college students, professionals, retired seniors, then you haven't been following his campaign. I guess you can't follow everyone's with the same fervor, can you?

Then, of course, there is the message.... it's the one message that is focused on restoring our constitutional rights and reversing the sucking sound of this economy, not to mention bring us back from the brink of destroying this earth. I think that may be a bit much for some people, but for the love of (God/Allah/Buddah), I cannot figure out why.

[drexel dave]

11. Yup! It's gotta' be just like Wal-Mart to have credibility in America nowadays

that has to be one of the most uninformed statements I've ever read here.

None of this office nonesense has anything to do with anything but exclusion of views that are dangerous to our corporate beast.

[MonkeyFunk]

15. nah

not Walmart - just a simple storefront wil do.

If DK can't even have an office in Iowa, there's no reason to include him in an Iowa debate.

[drexel dave]

24. If his organization is working in Iowa

that's plenty. Storefront stuff is garbage, plain and simple.

Sounds like he's smart with a dollar.

Of course, that would eliminate him from any consideration.

What a bunch of fascist nonsense.

[MonkeyFunk]

26. LOL!

Fascist?

DK knew the rules - this isn't the first thing he's been excluded from because he didn't have an active campaign in Iowa. The whining is just stupid.

[drexel dave]

43. from what I understood from reading

that this was an arbitrary thing.

If it was ALREADY in the rules, I stand corrected.

[slipslidingaway]

3. I cannot find a rented office in Iowa for Keyes either...

and Kucinich brings up issues that most would prefer are ignored.

Have you ever heard a follow-up question on the draft Iraq Oil benchmark that Kucinich has raised at a few debates and was a part of the spring supplemental bills that all candidates voted for, either the first or second bill.

Not one other candidate has addressed this issue, yet the control of resources is a reason why many in Iraq are fighting us.

[MrMickeysMom]

8. Those clever media Moguls and their follow up questions...

Stellar, aren't they?

Oh, the strings are being pulled and it's so apparent with this latest insult.

[slipslidingaway]

18. Yes and for the record neither my spouse nor myself work

outside of our home offices :)

[napi21]

4. I'm not against Kicinich, but be real here! If you REALLY intend to be

President of the US, do you honestly believe you can do it from a home office?

Like it or not, it takes lots of $$ to run a national campaign, and even IF we ever get public financing of campaigns, there HAS TO BE some criteria that a candidate much meet before they get any money!

This is NOT a poor mans contest!

[MrMickeysMom]

9. In a word, YES. Yes you can... Let me remind you...

HOWARD DEAN

Grass roots..... ability to use the internet..... dangerous to his opponents as the responding numbers of the grassroot campaigns were going to "meet ups"... making it apparent their support and HIS CANDIDACY support was swelling..... and...THEY FUCKING KILLED HIM.

Do you remember?

And, yes, Virginia, you can honestly run it from a home office. :-)

[Freddie Stubbs]

19. Did Howard Dean run his camapign out of someone's house?

:shrug:

[MrMickeysMom]

23. He did in some states, over many homes, and when we had "meet ups", we met

in public places like city halls and libraries, and sometimes in places you had to buy a cup of coffee.

Gee, has it been so long that you wouldn't have know this? Your question sounded like his whole campaign was being run out of an office, and we are talking about early caucuses and votes and a lot of grassroots operations... just like Dean had.

[Freddie Stubbs]

38. But he did have an office in Iowa three weeks before the caucuses, didn't he?

:shrug:

[MrMickeysMom]

41. A "storefront" office?...

... or an office out of someone's "home"?

Because, as seems to be the idea floating around, a storefront says so much more about the candidate's public image, and less about what goes on within those walls.

Whenever I received reports from Dean HQ's I was looking at electronic mail, and I was also calling from MY HOME, where I was doing work to reach out on MY PHONE to inform voters in THEIR homes. I'd have to say, that's where those who would caucus examined his platform when they weren't working, taking care of their children, tending to elders, buying groceries, getting their cars winterized, etc. This is how you reach out. This is how Dean would have continued to succeed, had he not been knifed in the back by the fiefdom of the DLC and related media whores.

You would have to ask an Iowa caucus er whether they received more enhanced information by walking in the snow to the storefront, if indeed Dean had one. And, again, was this the way Dean connected with the public. NO... not by a storefront, but by grassroots FROM ALL OF OUR HOMES AND PUBLIC EVENTS- JUST LIKE DENNIS KUCINICH HAS TRIED TO DO.

[napi21]

27. I realize the meetups helped Howard. I was part of them!

However, Howard also had store fronts! I really don't want to demean the Kicinich supporters or him, but I hontstly think he was in this to stir the pot, much the same as Gravel. ron Paul is never going to win a nomination either! Someone in each party has to be the extreme, and both make some serious and important contributions, but I doubt they really believe they're ever going to win.

[penguin7]

31. Kucinich has store fronts

Just not in Iowa.

And if you are going to have a store front, does it not make sense to staff it? Kucinich has a national campaign. This debate will be heard nationally and he should not have to commit major resources to Iowa if he deems they can be used better elsewhere.

[napi21]

32. the store front in Iowa was a requirement of the IOWA!!!! newspaper

for inviting candidates to the debate! I understand he had storefronts in other States, but this is like anything else, you have to meet the requirements for the specific situation. I'm sure it wasn't planned that way and he and his campaign had valid reasons for setting up their strategy the way they did, but they missed this one!

[redqueen]

48. Not if your name is Alan Keyes. Kucinich's exclusion was UNFAIR.

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2007/12/13/opinion/main3614663.shtml

[drexel dave]

14. You could do it from a closet

after all, it's really just a job where you make decisions. You don't need some fancy building to MAKE DECISIONS!

All one needs for that job is eyes, ears, nose (for smelling bullshit like the "real office" requirement), and throat.

That the U.S. Presidency is not a poor man's contest. It's for wealthy exploitative predators.

[GreenArrow]

20. what is the "White House"

if not a home office?

[Bicoastal]

5. Sigh...Look...

...nearly every Iowan on this board, even those who are considering voting for DK, have said that the man has barely done a thing to promote himself in that state, especially compared to other candidates--even ones polling lower than he is. One was pretty sure he was focusing all his attention on NH and writing off Iowa as a loss. Since this is a regional debate by a state newspaper, it only stands to reason that they're only interesting in candidates taking an active interest in Iowa's voters. The home office thing is really just the tip of the iceberg, it seems...and yes, it does seem kind of shocking that Kooch wouldn't set up a storefront headquarters in the nation's first and arguable most visible primary. What was he thinking?

Dennis can't downplay Iowa's importance and then complain when he doesn't get invited to an Iowa-centric debate. I like the guy, but I'm starting to get a bit tired of him and his supporters constantly playing the victim...KO, NPR, and all the rest have given him plenty of debate opportunities, and he remains a threat to exactly no one.

[MrMickeysMom]

13. You are listening to a different NPR and watching a different KO than I

I've heard all the NPR interviews... I watch Keith Olberman. Who is playing the victim? I'm confused with that statement. I'm following Kucinich's campaign and have supported him. I'll tell you what he's thinking... he's getting his message out the best way he can.

True- not every state is given the same amount of focus, when the candidates weigh their resources versus the schedule. Given that this is the case, what in the world would that have to do with his Iowa campaign being run out of a home location?

[slipslidingaway]

17. Has KO interviewed Dennis on his program, even on the five

year anniversary of the vote for war Keith interviewed those who were fooled that week.

Why not interview those who got it right?

:shrug:


And I'm still looking for the Keyes rented office space in Iowa, not sure why he was invited and Dennis was not?

[Bicoastal]

22. Actually, while I stand by my comments before (re: Dennis' downplaying Iowa)...

...I've been snooping around myself, and I can't figure this one out either.

:shrug:

Oh well, I guess we should to take it up with the good people who run the newspaper--The Tribune--which is hardly a media powerhouse. Odd, really--as much as we can (and should) criticize the country's major networks, they've never snubbed DK in such a public (and rather insulting) manner.

We may hear more about this in the days to come....

[slipslidingaway]

25. Yes I agree that he has not spent the time in Iowa that he did last

time and not sure what the strategy is, but so many states have moved up their primary and caucus dates to February it is a different race. Also since he would be competing with candidates that live there and have more money he might be trying a different approach.

The rules appear to be somewhat selective, Dennis had this debate listed on his calendar for at least the last month and did have paid staff that used a home office.

Why Keyes was included I still do not understand and I did call the Des Moines Register and spoke with several people, but they could not point to where the criteria was listed.

Not sure if we'll here more about this, guess the bright side is that the Republican debate today was not impressive and only ran on C-Span tonight.

In the meantime the FCC Commissioner is looking to consolidate the media even more and most people pay no attention.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=3823330&mesg_id=3823330

[GreenArrow]

21. "playing the victim"

What's he supposed to do, bend over and say fuck me harder?

He met the requirements to be included, which apparently did not apply to Mr. Keyes, and his exclusion is arbitrary at best.

[asdjrocky]

28. I'm in my home office right now,

And my real office is about a mile away. Real business goes on in the real office. I've worked for a Congressional Campaign, and a Presidential primary campaign now, and neither one of them were ran out of a home office.

Now, having said that, I think it's kind of bogus that he's not in the debate, but I'm disappointed in him for not seeing this coming.

[MrMickeysMom]

44. Perhaps he did "see it coming"...

... and his foresight would not change how this campaign had to be run. If there is a point to be made, perhaps it's the WAY presidential campaigns should be run, and who truly decides.

I realize we're Monday morning quarterbacks, because unless you are inside "the" campaign, you know NOT the strategy.

Neither one of "them" were run out of a home office... okay. It would answer the question of whether it was Howard Dean's campaign, or would it?

[peace13]

29. In this age of home offices,

cell phones and internet. Volunteers can work in any state 24 hours a day. This is a bogus restriction that is being used ot keep Kucinich from embarrassing the corporate candidates. That is all. peace, Kim

[MrMickeysMom]

49. My point is that, and I was doing that same thing with the Dean campaign.

Thanks for your input...

I think that the other candidates are scared to death about the real issues, now that they have the media circus cooperating FULLY. Start the circus music...

[FlyingSquirrel]

30. DECEMBER 15 2007 .COM

Even if you have a different favorite candidate, please read this.

Please donate to Kucinich's campaign on December 15. This is the same day in 1791 upon which the Bill of Rights took effect. If he can collect $10 million in one day (or a sufficient amount to get the attention of the media like Ron Paul did) perhaps Kucinich's days of being excluded from debates will be over. Even if you prefer another Democratic candidate, please donate because what he has to say needs to be heard, and because it will HELP BUILD MOMENTUM FOR IMPEACHMENT. Go to December152007.com to pledge by signing up on the email list. You'll get a reminder email on December 15. Donations must be made through his official website, dennis4president.com, or call 877-41-DENNIS (877-413-3664.

Thanks for your attention.

[Occam Bandage]

33. He hasn't campaigned in IA at all.

Which is somewhat surprising; given the success Huckles and Edwards have had with their populist messages, you'd think Kucinich would want to give it a shot.

[FlyingSquirrel]

34. Maybe he rejects the idea that two small states should determine a president

I mean really.....

[Occam Bandage]

35. So this is a form of protest? Has he said anything to that effect?

[FlyingSquirrel]

36. Heck i don't know. :-)

Personally I think the idea is absurd though. Why should two small states that don't really represent the entire country have such a major part in determining the nominees? Please don't say Tradition.

[Occam Bandage]

37. Pity for Iowans, I'm pretty sure.

In exchange for having to live in Iowa, we let them be important once every four years.

Seriously? I agree, it's absolutely absurd. I understand the concept of letting a few states go first; we allow candidates to concentrate, letting the citizens of that state get an in-depth view of them. But Iowa and New Hampshire in particular? Neither are particularly good choices.

I think Ohio would be a good bet to go first. It seems fairly representative of the nation as a whole.

[Freddie Stubbs]

39. If that were true why would he sign a pledge to not campaign in states which

are holding their primaries earlier than DNC rules allow? :shrug:

[PVnRT]

40. Then why focus on New Hampshire? (n/t)

[LWolf]

42. I'm disgusted enough

to put whatever candidate "wins" Iowa on the "no vote" list for the GE.

Of course, if it turns out to be Clinton or Obama, they've been there since before they declared their candidacy.

The Democratic Party is burning bridges left and left, so to speak. How many GE votes are they willing to burn to keep the nomination safe for the establishment?

[MrMickeysMom]

46. :-^o...

The Democratic Party is burning bridges left and left, so to speak. How many GE votes are they willing to burn to keep the nomination safe for the establishment?

Answer: Oh, I know! :bounce: .... as many as it takes?

[LWolf]

51. Ding Ding! Your a winner. n/t

[redqueen]

45. Alan Keys doesn't cause any trouble for the rich & powerful.

Sad that so many are so willing to rationalize the way Kucinich is treated.

[MrMickeysMom]

47. I know that's true...

It's the great myth of "The Hero's Journey"... watch one who could walk through hell, and make idle chat with clucking tongues while he is torn limb by limb.,,

[rucky]

50. When I worked for the Gerry Brown campaign...

The Dallas HQ was my friend's apartment. It was good times.

[MrMickeysMom]

52. Hey.....

Come to think of it, don't Gerry Brown and Joe Biden look like they could have been brothers? Hmmm...

[rucky]

53. they look nothing like my father.

honest!

[Lydia Leftcoast]

54. I've worked out of my home for 14 years

I'm self-employed, and I have an office in my second bedroom.