When the campaign is over..

[KennedyGuy]

and assuming Hilallry is not the nominee..what will be the reaction of women when the dust settles and some of them realize that they enabled a campaign that attacked a woman based on her gender..labeled her as shrill..criticized her appearance..her tone.
When you are not taken seriously by men in the world..how will you feel, knowing that trashing Hillary this way..you have made this sort of thing OK?
I have just been struck at the personal and demeaning attacks against Clinton based on her gender..by women on this board..or by men..with women du'ers cheering them on.
Aside of my concerns with Obamas experience..
as a gay male..I can not sell my "gay soul" as it were and support a candidate that seems to think that discrimination against gays is OK.
It would be like me, as a gay man, attacking a gay candidayes lisp..or something else stereo-typical..and then being shocked when gay intolerence becomes mainstream.
Flame away..
these are just thoughts to get feedback..

[billbuckhead]

1. What happens when Obama loses badly in the general election?

Who do we blame?

[mtnsnake]

15. If Obama goes up against McCain, it's 4 more years of Republican rule

How's it goin bill

[KennedyGuy]

2. I don't see anyone here attacking Obama based on his race

[bpeale]

38. you will if he is the nominee. he will be demonized for being black

[KennedyGuy]

3. the lack of response by women here speaks volumes..

and makes the case..

[peacebird]

6. no - most probably just saw this arguement as the strawman bs it is

and decided not to waste their time.

[KennedyGuy]

8. thought so..no answer

probably too cereberal for you..

[peacebird]

10. I did answer below - I do not see her being attacked because of her gender but her policies.

:eyes:

probably too obvious for you.

[KennedyGuy]

12. what part of her policies are "shrill" or "catty"?

you are sounding rather hollow here..
I ask again..is it appropriate to use these terms to attack a woman..
policiy differences are fair game..
is this?
so much for womans rights..
I can say that if a candidate called me a "fag' or anything like that..I sure wouldn't be supporting him..

[peacebird]

19. "Shrill" "catty" "bitchy" are not anywhere NEAR in the same class as fag or nigger, and you know it

Women are equal to men intellectually, your premise seems to state we should be horrified that people have called Hillary catty and shrill. Why?

I am a woman of a certain age. When I was first out of college I was the ONLY woman in the engineering conferences I went to. The ratio at the first one I attended was 98 men to 1 woman (me).

I met some men there who were condescending, some who tried to lay me, some who were helpful and nice. I didn't think their behaviour was a problem because I could ignore the first group and say no to the second. It never bothered me. I knew I was in a field that was USED to being a "boys only" club.

Rather than WHINE about it, I dealt with it. Not that big a deal. THAT is why I find your whole premise so utterly assinine and completely CONDESCENDING TO WOMEN.

What the hell do you think we are? Poor little pitiful shrinking violets who need to be protected? :puke:

Hillary has been around even longer than I, believe me, she can handle it. It's part of the game.

[KennedyGuy]

20. I have heard her called much worse..

Look..I really don't care..but I am just intrigued at how it has been OK to have this become mainstream. I expect this kind of idiocy from some men I know..but EVERY woman I know is APPALLED at this. I guess If this ok now I can go find some shril, catty bitch to harass..
I wouldn't stand for it..no way..no how.

[peacebird]

29. I guess you aren't strong enough to be a woman...? (rolling eyes in amazement)

off to the "ignore" pool for you little boy!

[Little Star]

21. I tried. I use to be an Edwards supporter until the debates on...

Saturday Night. The nasty childish gang bang of Hillary is beyond the pale. The tag team approach is so visible and sickening that I have now turned into a Hillary defender. In reality she has probably learned more from her mistakes than her successes and that could be a good thing for the USA.

[annie1]

32. Right on

[midlife_mo_Jo]

37. She was the front runner with the most money

If she were a man, she'd have been attacked just as much. Were they supposed to tiptoe around her because she's a woman?

She has a HUGE war chest. She is the obvious target, until the voters decide she is not.

[Hydra]

4. Strawman

:popcorn:

I'd love a woman democrat president. She seems to have problems with the "democrat" part. If she ever got around to fixing that in a permanent fashion, I'd be happy to vote for her.

As for it hurting woman candidates in the future...unlikely. During Bill's Presidency, do you remember all the whispers that she might really be the power behind the throne? Even 10 years ago, America wasn't ready for a minority president. Now, if it were Hillary Vs. Condi, I think most everyone would be ok with it. That's big, and that doesn't go away.

--------
edited incorrect tense

[KennedyGuy]

7. Really?

I wouldn't toss my gay identidy under the bus the way women seem to be doing with their gender.
Are you a woman? Do you endorse this..
Is it then OK for a male co-worker to dismiss you as "shrill" or "catty" or would you haul his ass into the personnel office?
I don't really care..as I am not a woman..but I just don't see how some are saying this is OK just because its Hillary.

[Hydra]

11. I'm not a woman

but I belong to a minority group(much like yourself, I imagine), and I'm used to being demonized for it.

I don't have any illusions about us- we aren't civilized, polite or refined as a species. The fact that many people hate Hillary because she's a strong woman is not surprising. Here's the thing, though- fewer and fewer every year. Just like the number of people who want to beat you to death because you're gay.

Progress is still progress. I honestly didn't expect a woman to be seriously considered for the presidency for another 20 years. Had Hillary been a Lefty, it might have happened this year.

[KennedyGuy]

16. I agree to your points

I am just amazed at how some of the WOMEN here are attacking Hillary using those terms..
I would naver attack a gay candidate using similar terms..
I don't care how much I was trying to push another candidate..
Its like the Log cabin Republicans..

[peacebird]

5. good grief... So if HRC isn't the nominee it's because she was a WOMAN, not b/c of her policies?

:eyes:

I'm a woman, and I do not like HRC for president. I do NOT want her to be the nominee, and it has nothing to do with her sex and everything to do with HER proposed policies and her inability to admit she was wrong to vote for Iraq.
Her health insurance policy is completely bas-ackwards - require people to get "insurance" but let the "markets" determine the rates and care you will recieve. I'm sure the HMO execs just LOVE her.

[KennedyGuy]

9. I am asking women what they think of attacking a woman based on her gender

and why some are doing it..the fact that none can come up with the contortions to explain it speaks volumes...

[peacebird]

13. Her tone strikes me as false. I object to that in candidates, male or female.

Her appearance I could care less about. All politicians get crap over that - it is meaningless, utterly trivial. Think Gore getting ripped for his clothes, Edwards his hair and youthful appearance, etc.

As I said before - I don't see the attacks as being based on her gender, but based on her policies and statements.

[KennedyGuy]

18. how does the term "bitch" or "shrew" describe her policies?

[elizm]

14. When did the Obama campaign attack Hillary based on her gender???? nt

[KennedyGuy]

17. (sigh) try to follow along now..I said Supporters..not Obama

Its like some haer the word "Obama" and immediatly stop listening and start talking...

[elizm]

40. NO, you did not. Look at your post. You said 'a campaign that attacked Hillary'...

Your EXACT words. Do I need to copy it for you???? Geesh! I'm a woman, by the way.

what will be the reaction of women when the dust settles and some of them realize that they enabled a campaign that attacked a woman based on her gender..labeled her as shrill..criticized her appearance..her tone.

[Viva_La_Revolution]

22. Relieved that the "waaaa you hate her cause she's a woman' crowd lost.

I vote on Issues, not Gender.

[KennedyGuy]

23. I am really not suprised that you guys didn't get the question

[Viva_La_Revolution]

27. I got it. There's been far more whining about name calling around here

than actual name-calling.

[Sparkly]

24. They'll never realize they did it. nt

[Kucinich4America]

25. What happens when the Hillbots finally give up on this FUCKING RIDICULOUS idea

That only "sexist pigs" are opposed to her buying the Presidency?

[KennedyGuy]

26. you sound catty

[peacebird]

28. LOL! and you sound "bitchy"

:rofl:

[KennedyGuy]

30. ohh a shrill woman yowza!

[annie1]

31. I'm already sicked by it. But most who don't get it now, won't ever get it.

[K Gardner]

33. You've been attacking Edwards all day. So don't complain now about people attacking

your chosen candidate.

[Arugula Latte]

34. I'm a woman. I'd like a woman president. I do not like Hillary.

I'm not going to pretend I like Hillary, just because she's a woman.

[cali]

35. I don't support Hillary, but I've defended her here ferociously

for months against the bullshit attacks- and I got endless crap for it. I'll feel fine if she doesn't get it, because I never bought into the Hillary as satan crap.

[thatsrightimirish]

36. Considering that at least in Iowa

She lost the women vote 35% to 30%, I think they look at the issues. The main criticism is that she is to much of an insider and people, including women, want a fresh face. I'm white and I don't support all white candidates

[bpeale]

39. woman here. she's a big girl. she can get over it. happens to women

everywhere every single day. no reason to exclude her.

[College Liberal]

41. Are you serious?

You are the only one being sexist. You are saying that women "know not what they do"? Did you not get the results from Iowa? Women saw Clinton, up close and personal, and they did not like what they saw. Get over it.....