"I listened to you, and in the process I found my own voice"

[Adelante]

I just wanted to say that I thought this line was lovely. I don't think Hillary is the splendid speaker Obama is; she is much better in debates. But that line was poetry and emblematic of what she needed to do, and did, in New Hampshire.

Congratulations to Clinton supporters :toast:

That's it for the nice words :)



GOBAMA!!

[goldcanyonaz]

1. You're always fair Wes, thanks for being you! nt.

[DemCam]

22. And I hope she did.

In person she is warm, at ease, funny, and very, very present.
That wasn't apparent in her campaign until the last couple of
days. For good or for ill, she seems to have taken charge of
her message and I hope she lets us see her passion, her ideas,
her warmth.

[Bonobo]

2. That line almost made me vomit. Honestly. Clearly she was referring to the diner episode.

It seemed like a clever wink and nod to the strategy that won it for her.

[annie1]

8. i don't think so. what about in the debate..

when she cracked that joke. have you ever seen her do that? also, in her town meetings she was totally normal and not stiff. even people who had interviewed her like Morning Joe guy said after his interview, "that was unlike i've ever seen her" and the female agree she seemed much looser. just sayin'. :)

[maddiejoan]

11. yeah she was commenting on it

but calling it a "strategy" that won it for her?

tsk tsk tsk

[Bonobo]

20. I honestly see it that way. She did not just start her political career yesterday you know.

If you think she can't compose her face before the cameras and only show EXACTLY what she wants to, you are wrong.

She may have genuinely allowed some real emotions to show, but it was still calculated.

[maddiejoan]

36. Okay.

Thank you for explaining to your sister, the professional actress, what she saw.

To clarify --here's what I saw --versus what the media paints it as.

I saw an exhausted 61 year old woman, with a hoarse voice, get hit with a wave of emotion.

In that brief moment of exhaustion we caught a glimpse of real Hillary.

just like we saw her anger come out at the NH debates, and her compassion come out at the Hostage situation a month or so ago.

Hillary, because she is a woman, generally feels she needs to keep MORE of a lock on her emotions than if she were a man.

Male candidates do the exact same choking, watery eyes thing and they are lauded by the media for letting it out and showing emption.

Hillary mists up a little and the story is she is a "cry baby".

It wasn't calculated. It was the sudden absence of calculation.

[Bonobo]

41. I never called her a crybaby and I never said it was fake. I said it was calculated.

I simply can't believe that this person suddenly became incapable of putting on a game face. She let it slip because she thought it would be effective.

Your profession does not make you immune to being wrong in this case.

I have directed hundreds of actors and actresses in the last 15 years as well.

[maddiejoan]

44. Have you never been so exhausted

that you get overly emotional with no ability to clamp down on it?

saying it was a "caluclated" move is saying it was fake.

If Hillary was that good an actress, she'd have done this long ago.

[Bonobo]

45. No it is not saying it is fake. It is saying she decided to let people see her emotions.

But she still made the calculated decision to show them.

[maddiejoan]

46. based on what?

what are you basing this on?

Do you have some insight into her campaign the rest of us do not?

[Bonobo]

47. It's just an opinion. Just an opinion like yours. I think I read people well.

[maddiejoan]

48. I think if I get up to NH

you and I should not talk politics until after the primaries.

[Bonobo]

49. Umm, I live in Mass.

[maddiejoan]

50. Uhm

it's a city abbreviation.

[Bonobo]

51. Ooops.

Anyway, plenty else to talk about.

[Name removed]

54. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. 
[link:www.democraticunderground.com/forums/rules.html|Click
here] to review the message board rules.

[Patiod]

3. I'm liking Hillary more

And that comment helped.

Still sending my $ to Edwards, but not as "terrified" that she might get the nomination

Seeing my boy Wes up there on the platform doesn't hurt ("Secretary of Defense Wes Clark" has a nice ring to it. Maybe not as much as "President Clark", but hey....)

[annie1]

9. hey, not terrified, we'll take it!

:D

[GalleryGod]

13. I'm liking Hillary less and less...downhill curve since 2001

My guy...back when everything seemed possible..

From my personal collection,SORRY about the wear & tear.

[Patiod]

18. Nifty picture, but sad

I was about the age of the kid in the striped shirt, and didn't understand why my teenaged brother was so upset.

[GalleryGod]

23. Not sad anymore. Nice man,very warm memories.

Even the great Big Dawg, Bill Clinton, is a mere cardboard cutout when compared to Bobby.

Watts,1968

[Patiod]

26. By the way, who HAVEN'T you met, GG?

I'm starting to get a Zelig/Gump vibe.....

(37 days to Clearwater)

[GalleryGod]

34. I LOVED that movie! (zelig)Well..when you start by blowing up balloons @ JFK

rally for one cent per balloon...and ditch Prep School Graduation to campaign for Bobby in L.A. (thanks to my older brother,who was a UCLA student)in 1968...you get to meet some folks...O8)

James Dean & Ursula Andress on her 19th birthday

[Lerkfish]

4. whom was she speaking to?

I have trouble believing she meant voters.

[alcibiades_mystery]

5. It's pure feminist code speak

Heart, voice, listen, personal...these are some of the key terms of second wave feminism that still resonate. And she works them in without sounding like Andrea Dworkin. The right wing has their coded-Jesus dog whistles. Hillary worked these coded feminist terms in perfectly. Just great stuff. And damnably brilliant.

The woman is goddamn smart with the rhetoric. Her speeches aren't as nice as Obama's (for reasons I lay out here: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=4004168&mesg_id=4004439 ), but she knows where the buttons are.

[Adelante]

16. Second wave feminism

Maybe that's why it registered with me. That makes sense.

[Adelante]

25. Very interesting post in that other thread

Thanks for that link.

[alcibiades_mystery]

40. Consider the difference between a Catholic church and and African American church

The Catholic Church DOES have a call and response tradition:

Priest: the Lord be with you
Congregation: And also with you.
Priest: We lift up our hearts.
Congregation: We lift them up to the Lord.

That's call and response. It's just HIGHLY ritualized call and response. Programmed to the point of automaticity. In the black churches, you see much more spontaneous interaction, although there are certainly ritualized calls, so you learn, as a speaker, different sorts of techniques for managing the speaker-audience interaction. That's what gets embedded in the African American oratorical tradition, which has its roots in the sermonic (and, I would say, more long range, in a different worldview about where and how meaning happens, the value of rhythmic form, etc.).

The same thing happens in the political oratory. If you listen to most white speakers, they "pause for applause" in a highly ritualized way, usually damaging the rhythm of the speech. The truly talented African American speakers can create call and response structures in white audiences, who are less accustomed to the form (King, Obama). Watch next time. Watch how he manages applause. You'll note that the applause rarely interrupts a rhythmic sequence. It's rarely this "applause after every sentence" that so ruins white political oratory. He's able to pile up clauses that form a rhythmic whole (usually through anaphora, epistrophe, balanced clauses, ascending tricolon, etc.) because he doesn't allow the audience to interrupt until the rhythm is established. That's how he creates these crescendo moments. It's extremely skillful use of rhythm and audience interaction.

[BootinUp]

6. Awww

what a nice sentiment. :)



Now back to your regularly scheduled programming....



En Garde!

[Adelante]

27. You low-down lying sonofabitch!!

:rofl:

[ursi]

7. nice Maya Angelou headline

but I've converted to Obama. It's time for the baby boomers to let it go.

[GalleryGod]

14. As a boomer..I'm trying to pry as many of us off as I can (lol) !

"Hillary came out smokin'...but I'll be a peckin' and a pokin' (S.C. & Nev) all the way to the Convention"

[Viva_La_Revolution]

10. she's supposedly a strong, independent woman...

and she just now found her voice? As a namby who didn't find my voice until 25 or so... I just didn't find it believable in the least.

[maddiejoan]

12. What would your voice be

in a national campaign for the Presidency?

Do you know?

[GalleryGod]

17. Sure. I use it every single day....Teaching Poli Sci

the cadence of King and the passion of

[maddiejoan]

37. with all due respect

that doesn't inform how you find a voice that communicates you to America as the next POTUS

[GalleryGod]

15. One line speech. Then there was Obama's !

My,My,My...

[goldcanyonaz]

21. Obama gave what came off as a victory speech to many. He was obviously unprepared for the loss.

[ellacott]

28. They say Hillary gave a victory speech in Iowa n/t

[GalleryGod]

33. I disagree. He conceded in the first 3 paragraphs and moved on to Wednesday.

They were as unprepared to lose as the Clinton Camp was to win. Some of the anecdotals coming out of the Clinton Camp on election eve were astounding (i.e. "get me off of this train" type sentiments)

[Auntie Bush]

38. Looks like the Clinton camp believed at the press, pundits and polls.

and it allowed them to loose faith in themselves.

DAMN, IT SHOWS THE POWER OF THE PRESS! AND IT'S FRIGHTENING.!!!!!!!

[Seabiscuit]

43. All I heard was a brief congratulations to Hillary before launching into a scripted victory speech.

I got the impression that he was so full of himself with his pre-election poll numbers that he directed his speechwriters to draft only one post-election speech for him to memorize: a victory speech.

I was embarassed for him.

[mrdemocrat78]

19. Hillary needs to stop watching Dreamgirls

didn't beyonce say that...

[ellacott]

31. I believe she did

There was also a similar line in Diary of Mad Black Woman.

[Cameron27]

24. Thanks WD,

you're a class act. Smooch :-)

[Adelante]

29. Smooch to you, my friend

:)

[Rosa Luxemburg]

30. she may not have that success with foreign leaders around the world

when she becomes president that is

[bigwillq]

32. It was a good line.

I think it was sincere and very indicative of how her campaign went down the last few days of NH.

[Auntie Bush]

35. I'll bet if Clark runs as her VP or is a member of her cabinet....

that won't be it for the nice words. Big :hug: for this post.
I'll also have nice words for Obama if he wins.

[Politicub]

39. Obama is a wonderful speaker

And I agree with you, Hillary is better in the debate arena. How can we be so lucky to have to front runners who are so amazing!

[Seabiscuit]

42. That has got to be the best line delivered in this entire campaign.

My hat's off to Hillary for that one.

[PatSeg]

52. I was doing something else when she was speaking

and that line just jumped out at me and got my attention. A couple of days ago I saw her handle Chris Matthews with humor and grace, and I thought, "Where has that Hillary been?" It was more the Hillary I remembered, but have rarely seen the past few years.

[Common Sense Party]

53. "Don't cry for me, fellow Democrats..."

It won't be easy, you'll think it strange
When I try to explain how I feel
That I still need your love after all that I've done


Don't cry for me primary voters
The truth is I never left you
All through my mild days
My DLC existence
I kept few promises
Don't keep your distance



Have I said too much?
There's nothing more I can think of to say to you.
But all you have to do is look at me to know
That every word is true



(Sorry, but that's the image that keeps coming to mind)