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Bread and Circus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-03-08 12:45 PM
Original message
The article Hillary Clinton doesn't wany you to see:
http://www.latimes.com/news/politics/la-na-earmarks10dec10,1,2408915.story



Clinton rolls a sizable pork barrel
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The senator embraces 'earmarks' as a way to help N.Y. She's received campaign funds from project beneficiaries.
By Tom Hamburger and Dan Morain, Los Angeles Times Staff Writers
December 10, 2007
SYRACUSE, N.Y. — It's a real estate developer's sugar-plum dream: a mega-shopping mall complete with 10 Broadway-style theaters, an indoor river, a Tuscan village and a 39-story luxury hotel sheathed in green solar panels shaped like giant blades of grass. Plus as much as $1 billion in government-backed financing, thanks in part to Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton.

...

In the case of Destiny, she teamed up with other New York lawmakers to secure federal backing for the private investment project. And she collected tens of thousands of dollars in campaign contributions from the developer and others associated with the project.

...


Her record stands in contrast with others in the Senate seeking the presidency, particularly John McCain (R-Ariz.) and Barack Obama (D-Ill.). McCain, who has long opposed earmarks, does not write them. Obama has used the device, but now declines to earmark funds for private companies; he uses earmarks only to secure funds for government projects such as road building and hospital construction. Other senators seeking the presidency provide earmarks to home-state constituents and collect donations from recipients of the federal largesse. But The Times review found that Clinton does it on a different scale.

...

"This pattern shows that Clinton has made aggressive use of the pay-to-play earmark game," said Keith Ashdown, research director for the Taxpayers for Common Sense, a nonpartisan research organization in Washington.

...

Clinton supported those basic reforms, but she and other Democratic senators running for president balked at a proposal by Obama that would have required members to disclose their proposed earmark requests, not just those that were enacted into law.



If you folks think Hillary will change things, you've got another thing coming. Clinton understands one thing, and that is power politics. And in this country money is power. Corporations and the wealthiest individuals have power. That's her constituency. There is nothing in her record to suggest that she will make a strong fight against corporate abuse, lobbyist abuse, pork barrel abuse, or the status quo.

She will throw you a progressive bone or two and she will increase the overall competence in our Government (not hard to do after Bush). However, if you think you will get real change, you are wrong.

We may have a return to Clintonomics and we will play a shell game for another 8 years. Things will look better... for a while. But nothing will be fundamentally improved.

You will not get more transparency in government. You will not get more accountability of the monied interests. You will in fact, get Republican-lite with a lot of window dressing.

And if Clinton wins the Presidency, she will be running for 2012, ON DAY ONE. And like Michael Moore said she is not going to want to be perceived as "soft on terrorism". The last significant time she used that in her political calculus for her long running ambition for ultimate power, she helped Bush rush to war with a public statement and a vote that she still has never apologized for.

And if you think it will "take a woman" to fix the mess that "the men" have gotten us into, remind yourselves of Condoleeza Rice and Margaret Thatcher. Gender and race, are no substitute for character.

Look at Clinton's record, look at what big choices she's made in life. It seems like a lot of time, she takes the choice of what makers her big $$$ and what gives her a bigger springboard to the next political hoop.

She's done some things for women and children, she's not all bad. Her voting record is very respectable except on some major issues of the day, the IWR being the main one.

However, on the balance of her life she is just another power-hungry politician who glad hands and greases palms of those that can move her pieces forward on the the chessboard.

Will she be better than Bush, Romney, or McCain. In many ways yes.

But don't come crying if in 4 or 8 years you didn't get the true social justice you seek and thirst for.
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1corona4u Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-03-08 12:46 PM
Response to Original message
1. Yawwwwwwnnnnn..........
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Bread and Circus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-03-08 12:53 PM
Response to Reply #1
6. You would yawn at something so important... probably because
you are not astute enough to recognize a real issue when you see one.
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1corona4u Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-03-08 12:54 PM
Response to Reply #6
8. No, probably because
I'm not a brainwashed minion, like Obama supporters are...
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Bread and Circus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-03-08 01:27 PM
Response to Reply #8
16. Bullshit. You are just trying to distract from the fact that Clinton
has basically used pay to play, quid pro quo politics in NY. The same kind of politics that have gotten us to this very broken place.

You can't come up with a reasonable counter argument so you "yaaawwwwnnnnn".

I don't blame you for not coming up with a reasonable counter argument, because there isn't one.
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1corona4u Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-03-08 01:47 PM
Response to Reply #16
17. How about.....
I don't give a rats ass? That's really it in a nutshell. It's just politics.
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Bread and Circus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-03-08 02:03 PM
Response to Reply #17
18. Yep, "it's just politics" - that's the cynical bullshit we reject.
Clinton is relying on you to say that.

And it proves me right, nothing will change.
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Sarah Ibarruri Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-03-08 12:49 PM
Response to Original message
2. YEAH? Well I can post lots of negative Obama articles. And then so F what?
Edited on Sun Feb-03-08 12:50 PM by Sarah Ibarruri
Where do we go from there when we have posted all the negative OBAMA articles from the media, and all the negative Hillary Clinton articles from the media? Hmmm? Where do we go then? Care to tell me?
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Bread and Circus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-03-08 12:56 PM
Response to Reply #2
9. I think you have to look at it all on balance and see what measures up...
all the "negative stuff" I've seen on Obama is either overblown or has no bearing on what kind of President he would be.

He stands up against pork barrel spending for private corporations, Clinton embraces it.

Obama wants more transparency in government and disavows special lobbying interests, Clinton embraces them.

This is a clear, real and consistent difference between the two candidates.

It matters and it's very telling to their approach to politics.

Clinton fundamentally supports the type of government that has gotten us into all this trouble.
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Sarah Ibarruri Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-03-08 01:27 PM
Response to Reply #9
15. I think shit can be posted on both. Why don't we post the POSITIVE of each one?
I want to hear what they CAN do, not what they CAN'T or what the CORPORATE MEDIA lies about. Tell me what they'll each do. THAT is all I want to know. I'm not talking to you only. I'm talking in general.
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Desertrose Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-03-08 12:50 PM
Response to Original message
3. Thing is...our choices are all pretty much equal
Hillary knows how to play the game...thats the good news & the bad news...but then so does Obama I'm afraid.

I no longer have any hope for this election. The choices do not impress me, regardless of the letter behind the name.
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Bread and Circus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-03-08 09:47 PM
Response to Reply #3
23. Wrong. Obama has foresworn private corporate earmarks and McCain
does not make any.

This isn't two shades of grey. Nice try, but you are wrong and actually quite ignorant of the issue.
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ursi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-03-08 12:51 PM
Response to Original message
4. wow, nothing like keeping real estate artificially pumped up with government pork for the rich!
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panader0 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-03-08 12:52 PM
Response to Original message
5. K&R
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indimuse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-03-08 12:53 PM
Response to Original message
7. ANOTHER Barack H Obama LIE!!!!

NYT SCANDEL: Obama Lied to Iowa Voters
Edited on Sun Feb-03-08 12:14 PM by neutron
Took hundreds of thousands of dollars from Nuclear interests then
worked AGAINST the interest of his contituents.
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/02/03/us/politics/03exelon....
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/02/03/us/politics/03exelon.html?em&ex=1202101200&en=f2853a7f59384438&ei=5087%0A
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Bread and Circus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-03-08 01:19 PM
Response to Reply #7
11. I read the article, first off you are the one lying
by inferring "Obama Lied to Iowa Voters" is somehow the title of the article.

However, the article is actually http://www.nytimes.com/2008/02/03/us/politics/03exelon.html?em&ex=1202101200&en=f2853a7f59384438&ei=5087%0A "Nuclear Leaks and Response Tested Obama in Senate" and doesn't make Obama look bad at all, it seems like Obama was basically trying to thread a political needle in a state that is hugely powered by nuclear energy.

However it is written by this guy: MIKE McINTIRE who also happened to write all these articles too (and most of them make Hillary R Clinton look bad because they call into play a lot of what I'm talking about in my OP):

found here http://topics.nytimes.com/top/reference/timestopics/people/m/mike_mcintire/index.html?offset=0&s=newest

In Charity and Politics, Clinton Donors Overlap
By DON VAN NATTA JR., JO BECKER and MIKE MCINTIRE; ALAIN DELAQUéRIèRE and ARON PILHOFER CONTRIBUTED REPORTING.
An examination of the William J. Clinton Foundation shows how its fund-raising has fostered potential conflict.

December 20, 2007Accused Law Firm Continues Giving to Democrats
By MIKE MCINTIRE
Milberg Weiss, which was indicted on charges of fraud and bribery, still has a political partnership with Democrats.

October 18, 2007Details of Candidates’ Spending Are Released
By MICHAEL LUO; REPORTING WAS CONTRIBUTED BY MIKE MCINTIRE, ARON PILHOFER, LESLIE WAYNE and SARAH WHEATON.
The release of federal campaign finance filings this week provided clues to the candidates’ strategies and travel habits.

October 17, 2007Complaint Says Hsu Admitted Fraud
By ALAN FEUER and MIKE MCINTIRE
Prosecutors said Norman Hsu, the Democratic fund-raiser, confessed to F.B.I. agents that he had swindled investors.

September 21, 2007Fund-Raiser’s Wallet Matched His Need to Please
By DON VAN NATTA JR. and MIKE MCINTIRE
Campaigns and charities took Norman Hsu’s money, while at the same time harboring doubts about his background and behavior.

September 16, 2007Investors Fear Fund-Raiser Took $40 Million
By MIKE MCINTIRE
Managers of an investment fund tried to cash checks from Norman Hsu, the Democratic fund-raiser, but the checks were returned because of insufficient funds.

September 13, 2007A Fugitive Political Fund-Raiser Leaves a Shadowy Money Trail
By MIKE MCINTIRE; KEITH BRADSHER and DON VAN NATTA CONTRIBUTED REPORTING.
At the center of the Norman Hsu mystery is the question of how he evolved from a bankrupt swindler to a wealthy political donor.

September 9, 2007Clinton Donor Fails to Appear in Court Again
By LESLIE WAYNE and CAROLYN MARSHALL; MIKE MCINTIRE CONTRIBUTED REPORTING.
Norman Hsu, the wealthy Clinton donor who turned out to be a fugitive, failed to appear in court on Wednesday.

September 6, 2007Anthony Day, 74, Editorial Page Editor, Is Dead
By MIKE MCINTIRE
Mr. Day, a longtime editorial page editor of The Los Angeles Times, helped transform the paper into a respected voice in national affairs.

September 4, 2007Democratic Donor, Fugitive for 15 Years, Surrenders in California Fraud Case
By LESLIE WAYNE and CAROLYN MARSHALL; MIKE MCINTIRE and PATRICK HEALY CONTRIBUTED REPORTING.
Norman Hsu posted $2 million for bail and was told to appear on Wednesday at a bail-reduction hearing.

______________________________________________________________________________

Be careful what people say about Obama, when they have a lot more to say about Clinton that is worse.

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bunnies Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-03-08 01:23 PM
Response to Reply #7
14. Posting the same off-topic crap in every thread is called spamming.
Please stop it.
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indimuse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-03-08 09:31 PM
Response to Reply #14
19. spam is crap some people eat..
I suppose... you could equate to what "some" people belive...I posted one time BTW!:)
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Scurrilous Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-03-08 12:56 PM
Response to Original message
10. K & R
:kick:
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guruoo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-03-08 01:20 PM
Response to Original message
12. Well, good for her....
I'll have the tenderloin.

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DiamondJay Donating Member (484 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-03-08 01:22 PM
Response to Original message
13. its called being a senator
senators are reelected for "bringing home the bacon" to their states. Its perfectly fine, except of course if it is the bridge to nowhere, beautifying the RayGun highway. its not like hillary has done those. She is of course not a Republican
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Bread and Circus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-03-08 09:45 PM
Response to Reply #13
22. I think you need to actually read the article. It's obvious you are ignorant
of its contents and the reality of what Clinton is involved in.

And for your information Clinton's final 2 opponents, Obama and ultimately McCain oppose these sorts of earmarks and have records and intentions of cleaning them up.

But go ahead, keep yourself ignorant, you will feel better that way.
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ElsewheresDaughter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-03-08 09:34 PM
Response to Original message
20. YEAH!!..... that's my Senator working for me!!!!
Edited on Sun Feb-03-08 09:34 PM by ElsewheresDaughter
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Bread and Circus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-03-08 09:42 PM
Response to Reply #20
21. She's not working for you and you'd know that if you actually read the article.
Edited on Sun Feb-03-08 09:43 PM by Bread and Circus
Well, maybe some times she's working for you but you'd be well advised to read this from the article:

"...Since taking office in 2001, Clinton has delivered $500 million worth of earmarks that have specifically benefited 59 corporations. About 64% of those corporations provided funds to her campaigns through donations made by employees, executives, board members or lobbyists, a review by the Los Angeles Times shows."

____________________________________________________________________________

It's this sort of abuse that contributes to the quid pro quo relationship between Washington and "bid corporate". Clinton embraces this fully. It's part of her source of power. She is not going to change things. Not the things that work so well for her.

And just so you know Obama has foresworn any corporate private earmarks and makes it a major part of his platform to limit and create greater transparency for this type of activity.

I know right now we are in that part of the political season where "you just don't care" about such things.

Just don't be surprised if not much really fundamentally changes under Hillary.

In a democracy, people get the government they deserve.
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