To entirely too many people in GDP

[knight_of_the_star]

Just a simple thing I would like to point out.

I have been seeing a LOT of people in an effort to slam HRC have brought up Bill's infidelities. My problem is not that these are being brought up but the manner in which they are being brought up is almost exactly the same as how the Republicans in 1998 brought Bill Clinton to impeachment on the grounds of, "Shame on you, you put the country at risk because you lied about a hummer!"

I'm pretty sure when that happened nearly every single one of you dredging up that sewage now was shouting down that bullshit with the same vigor you use to shovel it right now. For those of us who did deride the whole thing, I'm pretty sure it wasn't along the lines of, "How dare he!" but more "Damnit Bill why did you get caught?"

So I'm curious as to when it suddenly became OK for the Right Wing's attempted coup de grace to be used by Democrats on other Democrats? Or to put it more eloquently, in defeating the enemy you become them have you won anything?

[dkf]

1. In the words of Atrios...

Remember back in junior high, when you had that friend that the bullies picked on all the time? And you defended that friend, who really never did all that much for you, which led to you getting your ass kicked a few times yourself? And then you got to high school and your friend joined up with the bullies? It's kind of like that.

http://atrios.blogspot.com/

[knight_of_the_star]

5. That is a piss-poor analogy in this situation at best

And it still does not justify using such tactics. If you want to act like the Religious Reich that's your go, but you aren't going to use that act to hijack the Democratic Party and turn it into a pale shadow of the GOP in all but name, colors, and logos.

[dkf]

7. FYI, I haven't talked about it lately

but I am pissed at Bill for the Monica thing. If I had realized at the time that defending Bill Clinton would lose us the Presidency and usher in George Bush I would have walked him off the plank. Saving his ass wasn't worth it.

After all, it was his own stupidity that did him in, just like Spitzer's did him in and Kilpatrick's will do him in. Hell, Kilpatrick is going to face perjury over his affair too. I don't see many defending that idiocy.

[anamandujano]

9. The Supreme Court handed Bush the presidency. We did not lose it.

[dkf]

10. We should have won that handily.

And if you blame Gore I will figuratively punch you in the nose.

[anamandujano]

12. I guess you didn't bother reading my post.

[dkf]

13. I did. And I am saying if Bill Clinton had not messed around with Monica

Al Gore would have easily won the Presidency, and maybe not even needed Florida, which he would have taken anyway.

Going even further, would George W. Bush have had any momentum at all had he not had his anti-Clinton "Family Values" schtick?

Monica-gate gave George W. Bush his reason to run - namely to "restore honor and dignity to the White House". George W. Bush ran against Bill Clinton, not Al Gore.

[anamandujano]

16. Nobody easily wins the presidency. You are being willfully ignorant

in an effort to slam the Clintons.

You might want to take note that the same Repuke media that repeated the fabricated slurs against Gore (who still won) ad nauseum is presently doing its best to oust Hillary the only way they can, by helping Obama win the primary.

It's the same old shit pundits doing the same old shit things. You didn't like them then. Why do you like them now?

[dkf]

27. Do you not understand that George W. Bush ran on Bill Clinton's personal failings?

Please try to deny that if you can.

[Bluenorthwest]

31. How GW Bush ran for President

He said he was a Uniter, and would bring together both Parties, as his strong State level record proved he could do. He said he was going to restore dignity to the White House. He said gas prices were too high at 1.60 and that was Bill's fault. George said he'd just get on the phone and 'jawbone OPEC to lower prices' from that staggering high. This would work because GW was going to persue a humble foriegn policy, and lead by example.
Above all he ran on the Jesus ticket. Claimed to be born again, talked about his faith a lot, and of course used anti-gay evangelits as a special kind of enetertainment.

Sounds familiar.

[dkf]

32. All the soccer moms were pissed that their kids had to hear about

oral sex and cigars.

And they threw Al Gore out with the bathwater.

[knight_of_the_star]

15. With Democrats like you

Who needs Republicans?

[dkf]

29. Your own personal view that you are ok with Bill Clinton's relationship with Monica Lewinsky

doesn't mean that the rest of the country felt that way.

The reality is that the affair gave George W. Bush the opening to make his case to the country that Democrats were perfectly fine with infidelity, which repelled enough people that we couldn't hold on to the Presidency.

I see the damage that has been done to this country and I am sickened.

Bill Clinton's selfish behavior is resulting in a lot of suffering for a lot of people.

I'm sorry if I can't forgive him for that.

[knight_of_the_star]

36. Clinton's behavior didn't open the door to that

Unless you're ignoring the fact that his popularity was in the mid 60s during the whole impeachment scandal, so I would guess a solid majority was ok with him and what was going on. That and Al still won the popular vote in spite of that by 500,000 people, if there hadn't been blatant fraud in Florida then he would be in office right now blue dress or no.

[anamandujano]

2. Thoughtful post but don't expect any thoughtful replies.

See post #1. I rest my case.

[Yes We Did]

4. It is nobody's business who Bill slept with...

Except Bill, Hillary and whoever he was cheating on her with.

It is not okay to use it as an attack now, and it was not okay to try to impeach him over it back in the 90's. It was a bullshit witch hunt.

I only wish he would have had the same response back then that Chelsea gave today.

"It's none of your business."

That is how this Obama supporter feels about that.

[dkf]

33. until it turns into an impeachment and then its everybody's problem.

And when it leads to the tragedy that is George W. Bush, everybody pays.

[Recursion]

35. It gets Republicans elected and sent me to Iraq. Damn straight it's my business (nt)

[leftofcool]

3. DU =RW talking points

not to mention the people who actually believe everything they read on Alternet. It's scary.

[murielm99]

6. It seems to be the anti-Clinton talking point of the day.

Sometimes I think the so-called Obama supporters are given homework assignments. They all post about one thing during a given time period. Right now, it is the Clinton sex scandals of the past. There are numerous threads where there were none before.

Not long ago, many of them blamed Clinton for that picture of Obama in the African outfit. Never mind that that picture has been out there for a long time. Thread after thread about this appeared in a brief space of time. There are other examples, but they are tiresome.

I am convinced that many of these people ARE right-wingers. That is why they are using right wing talking points and sources. They are not Obama supporters. The reasonable Obama supporters stay away from this nonsense.

Clinton supporters have been driven away from this board. Maybe some of the reasonable Obama supporters have been driven away, too. A few names I recognize have been absent lately.

[JoFerret]

24. R/W or mindless drones

with an obsession.
How do they think it helps their candidate of choice to tear hillary down with incessant repetive and mindless niggles and attacks?
It doesn't change minds.
It only serves to piss people off.
Swirl in the filth - get bitten by typhus. Or something. More likely - ensure a GOP victory.

[October]

41. Interesting

I read a lot here at DU.

There is definitely a trend when it comes to posts on the same topic.

I NEVER thought I'd see the day where Dems would be bringing up Bill Clinton's infidelities to use against Hillary. Wow. There are scads of them!

Aren't we running against McCain? I used to think this was a place for discussion and intellectual exchange, but at this point, I couldn't recommend DU to anyone I know. It's embarrassing around here. Really ugly.

[Window]

8. I'd venture to guess it began when Hillary & Bill began acting

just like Right Wingers toward a Democratic candidate. You know, kitchen sink, toilet, scorched earth tactics.

If anyone knows how to play that game, it's the Clintons...in part, because of their experience with the vast right wing conspiracy thingy.

Yes, I stood up for the Clintons back then against all odds. I'm sorry the see them do the exact same thing to another Democrat in their desperation to crown Hillary "The First Woman President" while attempting to return to the scene of the crime.

[anamandujano]

11. Just because you excuse all of Obama's dirty tactics doesn't mean

others haven't noticed.

[Window]

21. ..

:rofl:

[knight_of_the_star]

14. Tu quoqe is bs no matter how you spell it

If someone else jumped off a bridge does that mean you should too?

[Window]

20. No, but what goes around, comes around.

Karma and all that.

[knight_of_the_star]

37. Does not excuse dredging up a swamp

If one sinks into the gutter you have no obligation to follow them, honor would demand you stay out of the gutter in fact, but I guess you have just shown the color of your character.

[crankychatter]

17. NEVER repeat a FoxNews Talking Point against another Democrat

I decree it.

[crankychatter]

18. So, what IS HRC doing?

hm?

[crankychatter]

19. Seriously, NEVER tear down someone you MAY be campaigning for

especially parroting Republican talking points
I have to say I've been right on the edge myself for the FIRST time, but Monica-gate?
jeebus that's low

[intaglio]

22. I have never slammed her for Bill's trouser problems

tho' I am concerned that when she looses the nomination it may well be the end of their marriage - I don't think she should have had to put up with that sort of philandering

[lligrd]

23. Nobody Here Cares About Their Sex Lives

We do care about the IWR vote, her dirty politics and her lies. I'm guessing that if anyone brought up Bill's escapades, it was in retaliation for their dirty politics.

[Eagle_Eye]

25. Hillary is standing up under the onslaught

I wonder what experience that little twink Obama could call upon to handle attacks like this.

[Perry Logan]

26. Clinton haters have no ethics. They will say anyting.

[MadHound]

28. I'm not bringing up those old talking points against Hillary

But if she's going to run in the GE, she had better damn well get used to them again, because they will all be dredged up and turned against her by the RW attack machine. What are you going to do then, go tut-tut and try to move on, as you're doing now?

The whole Bill 'n sex thing is one more reason that Hillary is unelectable in the general election. Too much baggage, too many people coming out of the woodwork to take her down.

[george_maniakes]

30. im guessing it has something to do with hillary making judgement on obama's relationship...

with wright. If she can judge wright unworthy, and therefore question obamas judgement in not abandoning the man, than unfortunately it brings into question who she has stayed loyal too and why.

[knight_of_the_star]

39. So staying loyal to a philandering husband is the same as Wright's speeches?

You know, the ones that say God Damn America and all that other lovely stuff? Hate speech is hate speech, we should not tolerate it within our party just as we despise it when the GOP's shills do it, and I fail to see how turning a blind eye and LYING about the speeches is the same as excusing a husband cheating on oneself, considering Obama's association with McClurkin I would think the Wright thing in this case carries even more weight.

[cooolandrew]

34. Probably this hostile confrontation that turned teh debate...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0iEqB1tENuY

[nomaco-10]

38. As an Obama supporter, I thought it was a personal....

matter between a husband and a wife then, and I still think that now.

[Catherine Vincent]

40. One word...

Trolls.

[October]

42. Really, cat_girl25? That many?

I've wondered if we've been infiltrated because it's ugly around here.

I don't recognized DU at all.

[illumn8d]

43. Actually my response was

I don't have any moral qualms about cheating on your wife, however I do have moral qualms about Bill having sex with subordinates, and it didn't help that it was a young girl. I would be happy with him if that was my friend or daughter.

I didn't think it was impeachable, but at the same time if that happened at a company I worked at, I certainly wouldn't like it.

[MadBadger]

44. We would not be bringing up Bill if she had not said, "You cant choose your Family"

in her criticism of Barack Obama and Rev. Wright.

[LWolf]

45. I concur. n/t

[Autumn]

46. Thank you for your thoughtful post

it is really amazing how we have two strong Democrats running and both are trashed endlessly by people in our own party.

[Recursion]

47. In 1998 I said Bill Clinton should resign...

...because a President having relations with an intern is prima faciae sexual harassment.

[apocalypsehow]

48. You haven't seen me do that - and I won't start. But I really, really, really do not want to hear

any pious lectures on things "being brought up is almost exactly the same as how the Republicans" as regards other Obama supporters attacks on the Clinton's - not until every HRC booster ceases using that horseshit "Rev. Wright" nonsense as a talking point in the exact same manner that Rush Limbaugh and Sean Hannity do every day on Hate radio.

I know, I know: the next words out of your keyboard are going to be "but....but....but...that's different!"

Allow me to spare us both some time: no it's fucking not. It should stop. But it won't, and until it does I don't have the slightest problem with these "attacks" your OP whines about.