F-That! I DON'T WANT TO GROW UP!

[NewHampshireDem]

What the hell happened to Fighting Democrats?

If a little name calling and a few hurt feelings are the price of DEMOCRACY, then god damn us if we aren't willing to pay such a small price.

For too long--well, as long as I can remember--it seems that we've had coronations rather than primaries. I'm glad this one has gone on (well, okay, maybe a bit too long) and that people have fought.

Why?

I've never backed a single primary winner from start to finish. I suspect, by the math, that a significant number of us have felt the same way.

For years, up and down the ticket, many of us have at best had to accept someone who was 'close enough' and at worst had to hold our noses and vote for the lesser of two evils.

Well, screw that.

Maybe, just maybe, this battle will do us some good. I wonder how many people voted for Nader because to them Al Gore was 'Prince Al' and they didn't feel they had a real choice until November. Maybe those voters will come back to us because, well, who ever our nominee will be will have *earned* it?

How many of us will be energized because we understand the process better and understand that yes, my vote does count in the primary, and that yes, there is a reason to be a member of the Democratic Party? How many of us will look at some of those potential down ballot races a little differently now that they see they have the power to oust some of those DINO's in our party?

If screaming, shouting, and being passionate means I'm 'acting like a Republican' then F-it, maybe we need to act like Republicans a little more. But, then again, maybe we're just acting like we're Democrats and we believe in Democracy--warts and all.

[stellanoir]

1. "mechanistic reductionism often masquerades as maturity."

[NewHampshireDem]

5. Uh ... quoting uncited sources often masquerades as intelligence?

Purple monkey dishwasher.

:shrug:

[stellanoir]

10. Richard Tarnas PHD from Stanford U and a highly respected author.

http://www.cosmosandpsyche.com/

Just thought his words spoke for them self.

[NewHampshireDem]

12. "PHD from Stanford U"--Is that your exaggeration, or his?

http://www.cosmosandpsyche.com/AboutTheAuthor.php

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saybrook_Graduate_School_and_Research_Center

[stellanoir]

13. It's what I remembered from hearing him on a radio show.

Why are you so frigging hostile?

He is really smart.

You could lighten up and read his award winning book and then maybe someday we can discuss it.

Play well.

[NewHampshireDem]

15. Uh, you decide to insult me, then accuse me of being hostile?

:shrug:

[stellanoir]

16. Chill

I have no desire to argue with you at all.

[Nitrogenica]

2. "Acting like a Republican" means half-truths and lying.

We have truth on our side. Scream, shout and be passionate about truth.

[Thrill]

3. There haven't been fighting Democrats in over 30 yrs

They don't fight. They cave to Repukes. The voters and the Dems in Congress. 28% of Hillary supporters would vote for McCain? I'm not surprised. Weak Democrats. It never changes. Thats why we had Dubya for 2 terms.

[katty]

4. I want the fight, too-but most wrangling on issues--instead

of what has been served up 'as issues' lately. If it's issues, yes, carry on, fight all you want!

[undeterred]

6. The number of Hillary supporters who won't vote for Obama

vastly exceeds the number of Obama supporters who won't vote for Hillary. The selfishness and viciousness is not totally one-sided, but it pretty much lines up with the behavior of the candidates. If we were trying to find out which one truly cares about the Democratic Party, it obviously isn't Hillary Clinton.

[40ozDonkey]

7. They'll quit the drama and vote Obama.

Acceptance is the final stage of grief.

[NewHampshireDem]

9. I wouldn't confuse Hillary and her supporters on that point

I don't think Hillary cares about the party--it's gotten in the way of her coronation--but I wouldn't throw all, or even most, of her supporters in that category.

[undeterred]

11. There was a poll (not on DU) that shows that

something like 28% of HC supporters won't vote for Obama, only 18% of his supporters say that about her.

[NewHampshireDem]

14. I understand that, but ...

I'm of a mind that most of that is just talk. Are they going to stay home? When they get into the voting booth, are they really not going to cast a ballot for president? Are they reallying going to vote for McCain?

I just don't see it happening.

And I wonder, for the sake of a thought experiment, if this were a 2 dog race, what percentage of those voters would have simply said 'Undecided'? If that were the case, we'd be having a whole other conversation about those damn fickle undecided voters ... but instead we're having a fight about the soul of this party ... a fight that's been way overdue.

BTW, this is the post that's got me so riled:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x5273080

I thought later to click over to the source and I saw that the person who wrote this piece (not the poster, but at the Newsweek blog) is probably about 25 years old--so while no doubt he knows a lot of political history, he hasn't really lived through much of it.

[undeterred]

17. David Bender is taking call ins on Air America right now

and its Hillary women who are calling in and saying this exact thing. Putting down Obama just like Hillary does. They would vote for no one. They would risk our Supreme Court because they are being bitches like her and don't care about the party.

[NewHampshireDem]

18. Well, I don't know what to say to that

Other than perhaps they're just another symptom of what's been wrong with our party for the past decade (or maybe longer). If supporters of either candidate refuse to vote for whomever our nominee is, then shame on that campaign for not doing enough to educate their supports about the importance of the election.

That said ... I believe we've brought enough people into the fold that we can afford to lose a few off the edges. (And I don't mean edges as in alienating a part of our spectrum of support from center-left to far-left.) And we've got more than enough time to bring more folks in.

[NewHampshireDem]

8. I don't care which side is worse or better or whatever

This is about the fact that for once I see more passion than I've seen outside a Red Sox vs. Yankees argument.

Yes, it would be great if everyone would play by the rules, but it isn't going to happen--and that's the price we pay. And it's ultimately a small price.

I, for one, think it's a better bargain than we've gotten from the past, oh, at least 8 years, and probably going back to those disastrous mid-term elections of 1994.