Pragmatic and Pre-emptive: Rove Swift-Attack Still Un-matched

[WiseMen]

Rove’s well timed and calculated “swift-attack” aims at the heart of the DNC’s monumental efforts during the Convention to present John F. Kerry as a more credible Commander-In-Chief.

It is clear that the brazenness of the Rove attack took all of us Democrats by surprise: we had no well-packaged counter-attack to rollout. At this point the evidence of talk shows, talk radio and newspaper editorials is that Rove’s goal of insinuating doubt about Kerry’s record of service into public discourse has been achieved.

Consider the genius of an attack which is at once Pragmatic, Preparatory and Pre-emptive:

1. Rove has been ruthlessly pragmatic in achieving the element of surprise. He used the same passionate anti-Kerry Vet team with materials developed and road-tested as far back as the Nixon era; committed old-time right-wing campaign financiers who could keep a secret; and the same hit-piece producers who effectively smeared and ended McCain’s presidential campaign.

2. The swift-attack is precisely preparatory of the Republican Convention, serving to soften-up the Kerry-leaning undecided vote for what the NYT describes as concerted “effort to feature Mr. Kerry as an object of humor and calculated derision.”

3. A truly high-risk attack, Roves swift smear is most importantly a pre-emptive strike. The looming threat against Bush’s relative credibility in leadership of our military forces is the anticipated release of George Butlers “John Kerry” movie. This movie is expected to put Kerry’s service to the nation in the most favorable light if not in heroic proportions. Kerry arch-enemy, O’Neill has commented :"I would say is going to bear as little relationship to reality as Gladiator does to Roman history." Rove is rightly concerned about “John Kerry – Gladiator” appearing on the eve of elections and is willing to take risks to assassinate the soldier before he reaches the coliseum.

An effective response is going to have to come from either a 60 Minutes type expose of the Rove operation, or a significant and protracted counter-campaign. Since we don’t have much influence on the first option, I suggest that we lobby our respective pro-Kerry independent groups do the second: launch an Ad campaign that goes directly after Bush’s credibility as the “War President” and tars him with responsibility for this fraud against honorable military service.

John Kerry is doing extraordinarily well leading the fight an incumbent President at war. But, more that ever, he needs others in the progressive community to watch his back.

[NMDemDist2]

1. kicked and nominated

:kick:

[DaveinMD]

2. the attack

has been discredited already. We'll win this campaing by attacking the Bush record on the war, the economy and health care. That's what we're doing.

[physioex]

3. I think we should also contact Mr. Perry...

And let him know that we do not approve of what he is doing...

[Zen Democrat]

12. Bob Perry could care less. He's a homebuilder of ill-repute in Houston.

This guy is up to his eyeballs in bribery and crooked dealings in Texas.

[physioex]

23. I know...

But remember the way we went after St. Clair Broadcasting. I say do the same here.... 800 24 PERRY

[WiseMen]

24. These guys are not moralist. They believe in dropping bombs on "enemies"

[physioex]

56. Well aware of that...

But still call him up and let him know that we don't approve. How else do you suggest we protest these types of people? 800 24 PERRY

[WiseMen]

70. Have to lay it at Bush's feet. They are playing the "disavow all" game.

[union_maid]

4. I think there was a pre-response.

You can't erase an attack like that but I have to disagree that it took anyone by suprise. I think they were waiting for it and ready for it. That's part of the reason for the band of brothers and for the heavily militarized convention. Sure, it was about who's more fit to lead in time of war, but Kerry's campaign knew there was no way to overdo hammering his credentials home because they'd had a preview of what was to come with McCain and with Cleland. People are going to have to decide whether they want to believe the facts and the people that were there or the people with an agenda or grudge who want to discredit Kerry. There's nothing anyone can do to stop people from lying. But I do think they were prepared and I think Kerry saw it coming before he ever considered running for president, this year or any year.

[DrFunkenstein]

5. Sorry, Don't Buy It - The Attack Is Totally Half-Assed

1. Element of surprise from the Nixon era? These guys have a dull axe to grind, O'Neill got bested 30 years ago, and the media knows this. It is "newsworthy" because the cheap attack is novel, not because it is gaining ground.

2. The attack comes after Kerry already got a huge jump in his Commander-in-Chief credentials among the public. The timing is poor. If it had been just before the convention, the talking heads would have kept talking about it all throught the speeches. Again, half-assed.

3. It's high-risk, which stinks of desperation, like most of their campaign. It would be much more effective to keep the focus on Kerry's anti-war past - trying to smear his heroism will only backfire, especially with AWOL boy hanging around. It may work on those that think the Clintons murdered Vince Foster, but it won't play in Peoria.

Karl Rove is not the image guru we took him for. This has been a shoddy, wasteful campaign with very little coordination beyond a few too many terror alerts. On the other hand, Kerry has run a fantastic campaign, especially considering his somewhat limited range of oratory. Time after time, lesser candidates would have taken the bait, but Kerry has kept a smart and tightly run campaign, which gives some indication of his capabilities once he becomes President.

[physioex]

7. You take the glass half full approach...

I'll take the glass half empty approach. The people who fund this have large amounts of money something our side lacks. And really the purpose of the attacks may not be to to discredit Kerry but to take away attention from the REAL ISSUES.

[Mayberry Machiavelli]

9. Been paying attention this season? JK has raised a huge amount of money

this campaign. Total will still be somewhat less than Boosh but a lot of campaign funds raised.

[physioex]

18. No denying lots of money has been raised on both sides...

And I am glad to say I played a small role. But I think large corporations back their side more.

[DrFunkenstein]

64. People That Donate Are People That Will Vote In November

Kerry has raised an unprecented level of funds, a great deal of which is made up of small contributions over the internet. Corporations don't vote, people do.

Sure, corporations can leverage their power, but it is nothing compared to the power of word of mouth.

[Sensitivity]

8. Look at what Rove has to work with: near Zero. Kerry has perhaps 10x the

credential for the Presidency as the current resident.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

31. I'm With You....

I think some of the "sky is falling" Democrats need some cahones....


Think about it, Dr. Funk, don't these attacks remind you of the attacks on Arnold.... Some of them were probably true but the people who were making them were made to look small....


I think these attacks can be put in the same category with the Hillary Clinton was slapping skin with Vince Foster rumors... It rallies the faithful and strikes the people in the middle as desperation politics....

[DemocratSinceBirth]

33. The Way He Has His Fingers

reminds me of how Ron Jeremy uses his fingers to describe his penis size....


You can find it at ronjeremy dot com.... I didn't want to put a hot link to a porn site but I believe there are still free pictures of Ron Jeremy with celebrities doing the finger thing to describe the length of their penis....


Is Rove decribing his Johnson or Bush's Johnson in that picture... If he's describing Bush's Johnson it's no wonder he had to stuff his flight suit in the "Mission Accomplished" picture..


LOL@Me

[OHdem10]

6. Excellent Post and on point

They have now pivotd while doing the Texas Two Step and are going to attack Kerry only on his postwaractivities-Leader of ANTI Vietnam WarVeterans. Slick --Let the BIG LIE (Swiftboat Ad go out and have the pjublic get a good dose. Then very innocently we are going after Kerry because he opened the door. He has talked so much about Military Experience, we can talk about his Anit war experience. (Burke, Bush Campaign strategist on MSNBC and Linda Chavez on Fox news this am.
Slick Slick Slick.

A poll at CNN shows over 50 % of people believe Kerry would do abetter job on Terrorism than Bush. ON leaderships qualities necessary to be a good president. Kerry is even with Bush.

This is Bush's strong suit and Kerry has moved right in. Who said he did not get a bounce?? Here is the clincher--Bush disapproval is higher than his approval. This is why they are going after Kerry--They want to hit him where it will inflict most damage.
This is exactly how they knocked MCCain out S.C They used the same darned group to smear Kerry.

The Campaign and the DNC had better be ready.Bushes do not like to lose.

[Raya]

79. I think many Bush operatives are Crooked, Lying, and SMART"

[Zen Democrat]

10. I disagree. This goes back quite a while. Douglas Brinkley was aware

of the Veterans for Bush when he wrote Kerry's biography. He discusses it in the book. The Republicans showed their hand in this a long time ago. Kerry knew this "Unfit to Serve" book was in the works. As reported in the Dallas Morning News, this Bob Perry funded group hired private investigators to interview all the men that served on Kerry's 2 Swift boats. They were stunned that the investigators were trying to get them to slam Kerry. They interviewed everybody that ever served on a Swift boat that they could find.

And, as a result, Kerry brilliantly makes the Swift Boat Veterans that actually served with him in Vietnam (and who strongly support him) a centerpiece of his acceptance speech. It was a PREEMPTIVE STRIKE. All week the convention speakers talked about how nasty the Republicans were going to be and asked for a clean campaign with no personal attacks. This was done with full knowledge of what was coming. And, it worked. These smear-vets are looked at skeptically because we've already heard from Lt. Kerry's crewmembers. We know what they have said. These smear-vets look like the frankenstein creations of Karl Rove that they are.

Don't be critical of Kerry. He manuevered this brilliantly. This isn't a Willie Horton -- this is now a story of "Who are these men who didn't serve with John Kerry and why are they saying these contradictory things and who is paying them to say it."

The www.johnkerry.com website has his complete military records already posted in .pdf files. AND there's now a Rapid Response section and a long, detailed refutation of the smear-vets.

Cheer up, people. Kerry's got it together. He's the MAN!

[DaveinMD]

11. exactly

Kerry has his shit together and the surrogates did a great job aswering the lies.

[WiseMen]

15. Kerry has been dealing with this all his career. But not this kind of

heavily financed hit! If the nature and scope of this
attack had been truly anticipated there would have been a 30 sec
counter-attack AD ready to roll-out. The vet-smear is a perfect
opportunity to go hard after Bush's frightening lack of
qualification, IF THEY WERE REALLY READY.

[DaveinMD]

16. that's not the plan

the plan is talk about how horrible the attack was and then to hit Bush on his job performance. Its right out of the Clinton playbook.

[Zen Democrat]

20. A 30-second counter-attack ad? They had the whole night of July 29!

Where were you? Max Cleland ... Jim Rassman and the crewmembers who served with Kerry grabbing and hugging him and talking about how they would follow him anywhere and he is a born leader, etc. Did you miss it?

Then this rag-tag bunch of veterans, some contradicting remarks they made in praise of Kerry in the past, some changing their story 3 times in 1 day. They are a joke. A big fat joke.

Republicans are now in a position to worry. Will they lose McCain? Will this backfire in the media? Will this backfire with the military? Do they look like creeps and thugs and evil-doers?

[buycitgo]

44. EXACTLY! they've been way too slow on ALL the major attacks

parTICULARLY the flipflopping and the 87 billion vote, their (non)response, was inexcusable

Kerry himself, last week, REFUSED to answer the charge that his vote was hypcritical.

I saw it, and wanted to vomit

all he had to say was that his initial vote was FOR the money, and that BUSH would have VETOED his OWN BILL!!!!!!

and, as a fillip, with all that money allocated, the troops were still sent into combat without adequate BODY ARMOR

he could have hit that one into Boston Bay, but he CHOSE, for god knows what idiotic reason, to pull a fricking DUKAKIS

they MOCKED his refusal on the panel. doesn't matter that it was Will, Stephie, and coCkie, he allowed them the OPENING

really really really made me mad

they're not doing as poorly on this, but are NOT getting the word out anywhere NEARLY as strongly as they should; McPeak was a great example today. He CLEARLY didn't have the info on thug connections to swiftboat vets for LIES, ONeill's ties to Spaethe, Perry, Colson, etc.

I could not BELIEVE how stammeringly he answered the attack question on that, set to him by stephie the wonder poodle

[Sensitivity]

52. Unfortunately is should be the V.P. that answers attacks. Kerry is

right to stay above the fray. But the campaign really should have
so sharper counter-offensives ready. They need someone like
Bill Maher as communications director ready with vicious/funny
counter attacks.

[buycitgo]

62. I agree, obviously, BUT the question about the 87 billion

was put directly to him, and he FLUNKED

that concerns me

I can't come up with a rational reason for his REFUSAL to knock that softball all the way down that little GOPher's smackhole.

it REALLY bothers me.

what happened to the guy who beached his swifty to go after the
CONG?????

huh?

did you see the exchange? I did, and could only shake my head in bewilderment

it's one of the EASIEST charges to counter, as well as one DESIGNED to put chimp on the defensive

[deminflorida]

13. No counter-attack Really?? NOT Here in NW Florida....

Bush boy will be here on Tuesday...to shore up his bleeding ass in the Panhandle. But re-enforcements are on the way on our side as well.....

Right-now it's Kerry 50, Bush 43 in Florida as a state.....

Vets here in the heavy military/retired veteran area of NW Florida are pissed off at this half-assed attack on a Vietnam Era Decorated Veteran. What the Navy department is so Fu**ed up that they just handed out a Bronze and Silver Star??? Sorry, nobody's buying it here.

No better time than a visit by some of our best supporters.....

"ATTENTION:
All Panhandle for Kerry/Edwards Supporters

You are invited to attend a Press Conference/Rally with

Senator Bob Graham, Jim Rassman and Senator Max Cleland at the Wall South Memorial on Monday, August 9, 2004 at 1:30 p.m.

(The Vietnam Veteran's Wall South Memorial is in Veteran's Memorial Park, located on the Pensacola Bayfront at the intersection of 9th Avenue and Bayfront Parkway.)

Senator Graham, Vietnam Veteran and Senator Cleland and fellow Vietnam Veteran and Kerry shipmate Jim Rassman will speak in support of Senator John Kerry as the next President of the United States. They will discuss the status of our military and the need for a new direction for our country.

Space will be limited therefore all supporters are encouraged to arrive early and wear Kerry gear."

www.panhandleforkerry.com
www.santarosaforkerry.com

Sorry but the Revolution is just starting in Florida and we're ready for them!!!

27 Electoral Votes, and the world watching.....we plan on seizing victory November...and if it gets dirty then so be it!!!

[DaveinMD]

14. excellent

this campaign knows what its doing. I love the role Cleland gets in this. Call it Max's revenge.

[rucky]

19. That's the thing, Kerry IS fighting back

and smartly, the campaign is addressing the people who need to be addressed - in person. This is how he won Iowa out of nowhere.

What, you expect him to depend on the media to deliver the message? Let 'em scream in the echo chamber all they want, but Kerry's people are getting the truth out where it counts.

[DaveinMD]

21. he's winning the media battle

on this too. Ann Lewis was awesome yesterday.

[AirAmFan]

17. A new book, 'Deserter', has the gist of a hard-hitting counter-ad script

Ian Williams, UN correspondent for the Nation, has a new book out called "Deserter: Bush's War on Military Families, Veterans, and His Past". He points out that Dubya has been dressed in military garb for more photo-ops than any recent world leader save Fidel Castro and Saddam Hussein.

Imagine watching a video that jump-cuts every three seconds from one clip of Dubya in uniform to another, culminating with a longer clip of his expensive landing on the carrier Abraham Lincoln. Not only did that "Mission Accomplished" flight cost tens of thousands of dollars; it delayed, for more than a day, tired soldiers' reunions with their families after tours of duty in Iraq.

Narration would be provided by someone reading a script much like the following online excerpt from Williams's book:

From http://www.theprescotian.co.uk/williamsplug2.htm :

'(T)here are deeply personal reasons why George Bush has wrapped himself in quasi-uniform, which he wears with the same grin of a six-year-old presented with a cowboy suit for Christmas. From one way of looking at it, all over the world, men and women are now dying and being maimed because George W. Bush had lived through "the war of his generation," without hearing a shot fired in anger. "Little Googen," as his indulgent parents called him, has been trying to emulate his genuinely heroic father -- without actually risking his life. Bush's Freudian self-delusion is apparent in Bob Woodward's friendly account, "Bush at War." In the days after September 11, Bush tells Rove, "just like my father's generation was called in World War II, now our generation is being called ... I'm here for a reason."

Bush the Elder, however, was a genuine war hero who left school at 18 and used his family connections to become the youngest pilot in the Navy. But when the government was drafting his contemporaries and sending them to Vietnam, his son joined the Air National Guard in Texas, and TICKED THE BOX SAYING "NO" TO OVERSEAS SERVICE: a choice denied most of his contemporaries then, who did not have the Ivy League connections to enter such units. More importantly, such choices are denied now to the National Guardsmen who were not only called up for service in Iraq, but have found their terms extended while they were out in the desert."

[WiseMen]

22. Wise-up Folks. Neither accidental nor incompetent that Bush's "Love" Ad

is rolled out for the first time while the vehemently disavowed hit squad knife's the Kerry war record.

[AirAmFan]

26. Who's suggesting that KERRY take the low road?

That's what Howard Dean, Ted Kennedy, and other Democrats with no Presidential ambitions this year are for.

The question is, where are OUR Jerome Corsis and OUR Bob Perrys? When you get dragged into mud, you must disabuse yourself of staying cleaner than the doofus who pulled you in.

[Sensitivity]

25. Is there any ROVE equivalent in Kerry's campaign??

[JI7]

43. nope we don't need roves, we just need to tell the truth

[Protected]

27. Remember the "bunny suit" photo?

I think that this attack ad will be worth just as much on election day: Nothing. If people want to select a president based on Vietnam experience, Kerry certainly stands far above Bush in that regard.

[kaitykaity]

28. Oh, hogwash.

The backlash against this smear campaign is more harmful
to Bush than the campaign itself was to Kerry.

John McCain came out on Kerry's side, and for center-swing
voters, that's all they needed to know.

This is a flash in the pan and will be gone when none of these
creatures can come up with names, dates, times, places,
documents, signatures, evidence, blah, blah, blah.

[kskiska]

29. Dick Morris said he never would have run that ad

that it was stupid. He said you NEVER attack your opponent on his strong points.

[Sensitivity]

30. Very Dangerous, yes. Yet Rove has taken the risk. Why? He must

be calculating the pros and cons.

Who would have believed that so many of the pundits could have been
bought into the "fog of war," "just another point of view" position.

[union_maid]

34. Maybe he's just not as smart as people thought

It's been apparent for a while that this administration, including Rove, is not made up of evil geniuses, but just of evil. They're, for the most part, bumbling, incompetent fools. However, considering how Bush has nothing positive to run on, I guess any kind of attack is worth a shot. I still take issue with the notion that Kerry was in any way surprised by any of it. They knew and were ready. Those who believe this nonsense were already voting for Bush, if they're able to sober up enough to get to the polls in the first place.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

32. The Sky Is Falling....

NT

[Sensitivity]

35. Don't think so. But Dems have not been very passionate about Fighting

"FOR" Kerry in the past -- they have been "stand-offish" taking
the "we are united against Bush" posture.

I think we have been caught with our pants down NOT at battlestations
for passionate defense of John Kerry.

[Raya]

36. Tommy Franks: Kerry qualifed to be Commander-In-Chief? "Absolutely!"

Just on "This Week."

Hope some 527 is compiling clips like this for the counter-offensive.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

38. I Saw That

Tommy Franks is a conservative no doubt but not a right wing lunatic...

[MoonRiver]

37. And exactly WHY weren't we prepared for such an attack?

Rove has been doing this for decades! The phony swift boat wingnuts were screaming about such an attack months ago! Not being prepared under these circumstances is inexcusable. I am now of the opinion that Kerry should institute a massive counter assault. Demand that * produce his missing Vietnam months records, which he can't, and force the networks to have one on one debates with those who served under Kerry and those determined to smear him for political gain.

:mad:

[Raya]

39. Fact is Kerry hates negative politics. First Campaign Manager go canned

because he was insisting on going on the attack against Dean.
Kerry effectively took over the campaign himself because he knew
how he could win IOWA -- grassroots, ground fight, using his
"band of brothers" and the firefighters. His new campaign manager is more a great coordinator than a gutter-fight strategists.

[MoonRiver]

40. Dean is no Rove.

And it's not gutter tactics to demand that people lying and smearing one be confronted, face to face. Surely Kerry and his campaign are not just going to lie down over this!

[janx]

67. I doubt very much that they are. n/t

[ljm2002]

41. Agree 100%

The Bush/Rove machine has taken to heart the dictum "the best defense is a good offense". It has served them well over the years. If they have a weakness, such as Bush's military record compared to Kerry's, they will go on the attack to discredit Kerry's record. Make no mistake, they will sound credible to lots of people no matter how many McCains stand up and say it's not fair, no matter how many times we post about the fact that Kerry served in Vietnam while Bush asked not to.

We need to get something out there, and fast, that will completely discredit the Swift Vote Bets For Loot. Not with *us*, who already know what a crock it is. But for the gullible, who do not follow this stuff. We need to absolutely smash them, publicly. We need to take a page out of their book -- not in the sense of lying, but in the taking the offense.

We have *got* to "take it to 'em".

[DaveinMD]

42. we were prepared for this attack

and we have handled it brilliantly. It has backfired on the Republicans. Kerry had a very good week on the campaign trail.

[WiseMen]

48. Gues that's why all the pundits on "Chris Mathews" show say "Bush"

won the week.

PLEASE. Bush demonstrated the power of incumbency and the slickness
of their operation by dominating a week that should have been
ALL KERRY in the typical post-convention celebration tour.

The slime attach should have blown-up in their faces already if
Dems were really prepared.

I suspect Rove had intelligence that Dems did not have anything
ready to roll out against Bush and this sear before he took the
risk.

[Selwynn]

45. Whoever wrote this is not in touch with reality.

The "swift boat" attack has totally backfired in spectacular ways. You've even got FOX NEWS condemning the ads, the White House got put on the defensive by people like McCain demanding they denouncing, virtually all the media coverage has been negative, and guess what - Bush's polls continue to go down while Kerry's continue to go up.

This may have been "brilliant" on paper, but in reality, it will go down as one of the chief blundering failures that sank the Bush campaign. I don't believe you can take the swift boat example as indicitive of anything - especially not as a case study in a "brilliant" strategy. The best thing Kerry can do is stay completely away from bullshit attacks like this that are personal and meanspirited and totally backfire in exactly the way this one did - and instead continue to focus on the issues and at, the specifics of this administrations failue in this term, and the specifics of his plan and how it represents a different, better way.

I would agree with that writer's analysis if the facts hadn't shown the attack adds to be such a dismal failure. They failed so bad I'm almost glad it happened.

[ljm2002]

49. Sadly, I must disagree

At first it looked like it had backfired. Then I saw the Washington Week show, where they claimed that the campaign had sunk to new lows -- but they didn't cite just the Swift Votes Bet For Loot ad, they also cited Kerry's *response to a question*, where he said that he wouldn't have just sat there for 7 minutes on 9/11.

Then -- one of our local TV stations had a poll -- invited their viewers to go online and vote on the following question: "Could Senator Kerry be lying about his record in Vietname?"

I kid you not.

[Selwynn]

50. That stuff goes on all the time, and would go on with or with out...

...the swtif boat ad. The fact is, the ad itself was a total disaster.

[WiseMen]

46. Just noticed a bad typo in my post: Re soon to be released "Kerry Movie"

The words "THE FILM" in the quote was in SQUARE BRACKETS and got droped.

______________________-

Kerry arch-enemy, O’Neill has commented :"I would say (THE FILM) is going to bear as little relationship to reality as Gladiator does to Roman history." Rove is rightly concerned about “John Kerry – Gladiator” appearing on the eve of elections and is willing to take risks to assassinate the soldier before he reaches the coliseum.

[napi21]

47. McCain was a big help with this too!

After all, he is a Pub! When he said this is the same thing they did to me in SC, I think that helped a lot.

The other thing the ads could do is show a copy of Kerry's request for Swift Boat duty along side of a close up of *'s check mark on the question "duty in Vietnam YES or NO.

Background comentary could say "What do you believe...Gov't documents, or some guys who were't there?"

[WiseMen]

51. I am sure the McCain response was part of a prepared defense against

this smear.

But the response is not proportionate to the scope, intensity and
coordination of the attack Rove launched. Looks like all republican
operatives (pundits, talk hosts, internet, grassroots) were well organized to both leverage the smear to attack both Kerry and all
anti-Bush 527 groups (MoveOn) while giving Bush a free pass on the
smear.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

53. You Give That EffeteTub Of Goo Way Too Much Credit

He doesn't intimidate me....

[Sensitivity]

54. I think the combination of "Terror Alert" and smear on Kerry War Record

has had a real disruptive effect on the Post-Convention campaign.
Repubs seem to be really go as disrupters.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

55. People Are Giving Those Clowns Way Too Much Credit....

NT

[jhml]

57. Rove is not in control of this

Silly to blame everything on him. I suspect he would have preferred this not happen.

[janx]

58. Now that the whole thing has (predictably) backfired,

of course he doesn't want anything to do with it.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

59. Finally.... A Person With Sense.....

These attacks remind me of the attacks on Arnold.... Whether they were true or not the people who were making them were made to look small....

[WiseMen]

60. WOW! I heard that same story from WH Press Sec. Must be true.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

61. Rove Really Has You Spooked......

NT

[Raya]

63. Bush Campaign says Democratic Groups Like MoveOn are to blame for Smear.

I would rather put the shit at George "I Know Nothing" Bush's feet.

[Sensitivity]

65. Response better come soon. Else Rove will call it an unjustified attack

As positive as the Dem convention was the Repub talking point was:
Negative Attacks, Extreme Makeover -- regardless of the question.

[janx]

66. I wouldn't worry about it if I were you. n/t

[Sensitivity]

68. I am not worried. This is above my paygrade. Hope someone is taking

Rove as seriously as we all took Trippi in Iowa.

Campaiging a tough game and the campaign manager rules.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

69. Trippi's A Smart Guy....

We never underestimated him....


I don't underestimate Rove but I don't think he's ten feet tall either.....

[janx]

76. I can't compare Rove to Trippi. Sorry.

They are completely different animals who happen to share only a job title.

The "swiftvets" will implode on their own, with a little help from those they believe (but aren't) their fellow vets.

Their fellow vets are going to be completely insulted. And I can't blame them.

[NV1962]

71. Not in your dreams

Let's not get overboard here. This plot is horrendously ill-conceived (if you're working for the Bush / Cheney team) or a godsent (if you're normal human being like the rest of us.)

This swiftboatbats nonsense looks good - but that's Rove's problem: he's too smart to be useful when issues matter. This year, people will cast their vote not so much for a candidate, but for their vision of America. Issues count, big time.

Rove can be said to dance around like a butterfly and sting like a bee for all his groupies might like to, but when he visibly fails to recognize a colossal clusterfek of his own making, he's giving the game away.

This campaign is a marathon. John Kerry has proven among the Democrats that he's the smartest, wisest fox: slow and steady crushes the race. And crush the competition he did.

November 2 is an eternity away. By Election Day, the swiftboatbats will be fondly remembered -- by the Democrats -- as the gift that kept on giving.

Any moron coming up with a plan like that ought to be fired immediately - except when he/she/it is working for the GOP. In that case, he/she/it must be lauded and overladen with glorious pomp and circumstance as the world's best and baddest campaign strategist and tactician, ever, bar none.

That's why I think you're right, WiseMen: Karl Rove is a fekking GENIUS - HALLOWED BE HIS NAME!!!

:evilgrin: :bounce: :evilgrin: :bounce: :evilgrin: :bounce: :evilgrin: :bounce:

[WiseMen]

72. Your Comments don't deny Bush tactical victory last week or the fact

Rove get away with a very tricky manuever in preparation for
the RNC convention because DEM were not ready to retaliate massively.

[NV1962]

73. what "victory" - that pundits spun the "non-bump" as failure?

Or that they set the implicit expectation that Kerry just might retaliate with a 527 airing ads featuring Bush's old coke dealers and others testifying that he was kicked out of the TANG for alcohol and drugs abuse, paid for an abortion, has several DUIs, and had his drivers license erased so as to erase the arrests and convictions with it?

How and with what did Bush "get away" based on this, eh, interplanetary scale stroke of divine genius named Karl Rove?

It was nice fodder for the precious few political junkies (e.g. here on DU, the usual blogs, and in Freeperville) for a whopping three days...

Let's see how things fare two weeks after the repug convention - if things are just as bad as they are now, Kerry wins by a landslide.

Sorry, but Rove is a mor... eh, intergalactic genius.

[NV1962]

75. Here's an excellent illustration of Kerry's vastly smarter "retaliation"

Right here.

John Kerry is twice a formidable foe in these elections: one, because he knows where his carefully planned and delivered 'attacks' hurt most, and two, because the other guys are desperate enough to come up with self-defeating manure like those swiftboatbats.

It certainly helps when you're campaigning with a stellar strategy, armed with tons of patience, walking the distance with the determination of a terrier - against an opponent who can't seem to miss a single opportunity to look bad.

What we have to do is counter all BS and spread the antidote out faster than they can say "f*ck you" - and meanwhile let's register voters, keep registering voters, and then register some more voters. Knock on doors, show enthusiasm, and motivate people to vote.

The obnoxious and off-putting desperate shrieks of his opponents notwithstanding, John Kerry's doing just fine.

Don't you doubt it.

[yardwork]

74. It didn't take me by surprise - Rove could not stoop low enough

It may have taken Kerry's team by surprise, but I kind of doubt it.

So far, the ad seems to be backfiring badly. Sure, morans will believe it but most of them were going to vote for shrub anyway.

There are more insidious problems threatening Kerry. He needs to keep fighting back hard to correct the lies that are being told about him on the internet.

I agree that every one of us needs to stay vigilant and correct the record when we hear lies being told about Kerry's record.

[Raya]

77. I think Dems didn't plan for the size of the mess this slime can cause.

Rove may find a way to keep nasty "Kerry may have lied about x, y or
z" rumor going till November.

McCain could have stoped it by threatening to resign from the Repubs but he has not.

Now we have to stop pretending Rove's smear campaign isn't a
serious problem.

[WiseMen]

78. Donate to the DNC to fund a response to Swift Smear. Heard that response

Ad maybe in works. At least it is being debated.