Do you like Fascism?

[Snoggera]

then vote for either * or Nader.

If you disagree with the tenets of fascism, and don't think it would be a "good thing" for you, then vote against Bush.

It's that simple.

[LoZoccolo]

1. Problem is, some people like it as a path to socialism or whatever.

They think that by letting things get so bad, people will run to whatever "progressive" government they advocate.

And hey, it works! The German communists eventually did get their communist state after the Nazi government, right? Tell the truth.

[JI7]

6. but why ?

first of all, why do they support socialism ? is it because it is a good and just system ? if they want to be good and just then how can they support allowing things to go bad in the hopes of getting something they think is perfect ?

there are real people involved here. it seems sometimes as if people view this as a personal religious thing rather than political.

[mike_c]

2. do you like illegal wars of aggression against poor people...?

If not, don't vote for pro-war presidential candidates.

[DaveinMD]

3. he didn't say

he was pro war. He said he stood by his vote to give teeth to the inspection process. Enjoy 4 more years of Bush, because that is what you are asking for.

[mike_c]

13. what "teeth" did the inspection process need?

1) Iraq was already disarmed;

2) Iraq's ambitions were already contained, and at a fraction of the cost of the war (the Pentagon estimates that 2.5 billion/yr would have been necessary to continue the level of prewar containment; Saddam Hussein would have died of OLD FREAKING AGE long before that rate of expenditure reached what the invasion has already cost and a bunch of other folks would still be alive);

3) Iraqi airspace was already an open book to U.S. and U.K. patrols;

4) Iraqi air defenses were bombed whenever they turned on their radars-- coalition patrols already used suppressing force with complete impunity;

5) Iraq's civil infrastructure was already shattered by more than a decade of brutal sanctions-- more than one million Iraqis died, including over 500,000 children;

6) Iraq's military was already broken by the Iran-Iraq war and Gulf War I;

7) Hussein had already allowed U.N. weapons inspectors to return with virtually no conditions on their activities;

8) The weapons inspectors would have eventually certified that Iraq had already complied with the disarmament mandate-- because it had. It was all over except the foot dragging and chest thumping in the U.N.

WHAT BLOODY REASON WAS THERE FOR MORE "TEETH" IN THE INSPECTION PROCESS? What part of "you been lied to" don't you understand? Kerry voted to give Bush permission to invade and says that if he knew then what he knows now-- ALL OF THE ABOVE-- he'd do it again. WHY WAS AN ADDITIONAL THREAT OF FORCE NEEDED?

[LoZoccolo]

4. Of course not.

That's why I'm voting for Kerry!

[Djinn]

5. that's another way to see it!

but I doubt most people here will see that - seems like if you're not 100% happy with Kerry you're a fascist - you cabn even repeatedly state that you WILL vote for Kerry but you're just not happy about it and you get called a Naderite, a Bush enabler blah blah...seems some people aren't THAT fond of democracy

[DaveinMD]

7. the poster

above is not voting for Kerry and therefore is a bush enabler.

[mike_c]

14. busted-- I haven't signed the loyalty pledge....

eom

[Djinn]

19. I'm sorry what?

I'm not voting for anyone in the US elections - not unless George has opened it up for Australians - now I guess instead of the "bush enabler...screeech" I'll get "shut up you're not a US citizen" one - well frankly given how many wars we follow you into and the "free trade" agreement that will see the destruction of a world leading public drug subsidy system, I think I'm still able to have an opinion on this.

Maybe you were referring to someone else but I actually don't see anyone here saying they're not voting for Kerry - but if they did that IS their choice, it's this little thing called democracy.

Remember everyone you must state on every post "I am voting for Kerry" otherwise you are by default apparently voting for Bush. :eyes:

[noahmijo]

9. I personally don't care if people disagree with kerry but what burns me

Is the constant labeling of him as being "pro-war" like he right alongside Bush going "atta boy go git em hehehe!!!'

All he did was trust the president not to misuse his vote, he gave him authorization on the war SOLEY on the basis that the president would only do it as a last resort and build a coalition.



http://www.independentsforkerry.org/uploads/media/kerry-iraq.html

Other than that I don't care if a few "Naderites" wish Kerry was more "pro-gay marriage" or something or whatever but I'm sick of this Kerry is pro-war spin. You play right into the Neo-Cons hands everytime you label him as that.

[LoZoccolo]

11. Sure we like democracy!

We're practicing it when we call Ralph Nader out on being delusional-like.

[JI7]

10. like in afghanistan ?

[mike_c]

15. yes, like in Afghanistan....

Refresh my memory-- how many of those Afghani's that we bombed into bloody pulp had ever threatened the U.S.? I don't seem to recall them being very involved in 9/11, for example, but maybe I'm confusing them with the Saudis....

[JI7]

16. i wonder why people don't get upset about it much

the same with the war against iraqis that went on for years with the sanctions.

[mike_c]

17. forgive me for snapping....

I don't get it either. It's damned frustrating. I think most Americans are simply not informed about the disasterous human consequences of U.S. foreign policy. Europeans seem much more generally upset about U.S. actions abroad than most Americans are even aware of them.

[JI7]

18. even on here

you don't see complaints about the afghanistan war.

[Snoggera]

12. Don't vote at all

that'll show'em!

Or better yet! Vote for someone who will get 2000 votes! That'll show them!

[gristy]

8. fascism - n.

1. A philosophy or system of government that advocates or exercises a dictatorship of the extreme right, typically through the merging of state and business leadership, together with an ideology of belligerent nationalism.

This is from my American Heritage Dictionary, copyright 1976.

[Snoggera]

20. Do me a favor admins/mods

at least give an explanation before you lock this one!