It's all about taxes

[auburngrad82]

Anytime I ask a Bush supporter why he supports Bush they invariably reply that it's because of the tax cuts. Do they not realize that we are paying more in taxes now due to local and state tax increases, sales tax increases, property tax increases, etc because the local and state governments have to make up for the lost monies from the federal government? Do they not know that taxes pay for, among other things, police, firefighters, road maintenance, etc? These are not the so-called top 2 percent. These are normal middle-class people. What needs to happen to convince them that the Bush position on tax cuts is NOT benefiting them as they seem to think?

[Kierkegaard]

1. Next time it comes up,

ask them just how much less they are paying in taxes now than compared to before the so-called 'tax cuts.'

[stevebreeze]

2. also point out that their income is likely falling relative to inflation

average pay has risen only 1.9% in the last year while inflation is 3%. Also point out how much the price of a gallon of gas has gone up in the last 4 years.
:kick:

[FloridaPat]

3. Reagan made the biggest tax cuts in history. Every middle

class person I knew paid more taxes. A friend of mine that was a Democrat and get very well informed one time made the comment about how good the tax cuts were. I asked him if his taxes went down. It was at this point that he realized his taxes had actually gone up.

The IRS code is so complicated that people have to look at their bottom line every year. Most people don't remember that far back. Have them compare their tax returns. Ask them about their 401K's and IRA's.

Here is Florida our sales tax is up 1%. My property taxes have doubled. And since I've been unemployed for most of the last 2 years, I am really hurting.

[cornfedyank]

4. remind them that all government spending has to be paid

shrub et al give tax breaks to #%^&*s, and made it possible to squirrel away vast wealth and leave the debt to be paid by some future tax.

(on edit) those tax cuts gave most people a months rent. What does 100% elimination of the estate tax do for them at the top?

those people deserve something for their entrepreneurial courage, insight, and hardwork. They also owe something to the Country that provide the safe place to do their business. And the Country also provided the natural resources they bought so cheaply. Love that Mining Act of 187something.

[LimpingLib]

5. Well we have no credibility sadly.

Unless we take the Democratic party heads of the most regressively taxed sates (California and Alabama)and burn them at the stake , then we have little reason to be trusted.

California was run by Democrats and the wealthy only paid 7% in income taxes where as the poor paid 10% plus sales taxes. Just putting the wealthy at the same 10% rate would have turned the record deficit into a surplus.

Alabama ..omg dont get me going on Alabama .Lets just say a top to bottom purge will do. Want to win elections by bringing in the 50% who dont vote? Do a public hanging of the Alabama Democratic party heads and tape the evnt then distribute it to every non voter in the nation from the colonias of Texas to the plains of Kansas to the woods of Mississippi. (the poor pay an 11% income tax in Alabama and the wealthy just 3% btw)

[AP]

6. Going into a debt is a tax on the next generation, and the tax issue isn't

just about taxes going up or down. It's about a fair APPORTIONMENT of taxes. Not only do we need to shift the burden off the middle class (if we expect them to work us to a better America) we need to apportion the burden less on earned income from working (at ALL income levels) and more on unearned income (which is just the tax on money as it cyles and accumlates among the super wealthy from activities much much less socially valuable and socially productive than labor).

[LimpingLib]

7. I gave up a long time ago.

I kept trying to point out that some of the most hard hitting taxes on the poor were a direct transfer to the wealthy such as the 1983 Payroll Tax doubling where it went from around 8% to a flat 15.3% . It was supposed to save Social Secuity (and it frankly did...or would have)but has been raided.


Social Seurity with no changes is safe till at least 2045 and probabilly longer than that. A modest raising of the max taxable income from $84,000 to around $250,000 will make it safe forever. Bringing in young immigrants in heavy numbers at certain times will make it safe beyond any near century.

But the funds have been raided to fund defence spending increases and tax breaks for the wealthy and now a big myth is going around that SS is in trouble.Over $1 trillion worth and it will be $3 trillion by the time the baby boomers retire and it will be time to pay up.


The current party leaders wont touch this issue so now we better just prepare for the big propaganda blitz by the emdia , Federal Reserve , and GOP when the "crisis" hits in around 2012-2015.Just make it clear the program has self funded quite well but the Pentagon and wealthy raided it so let them bear the brunt of the costs in paying the system back.