Is Kerry out of his mind?

[Worthless Teen]

Taking the Swift Vets to court is just going give them more publicity and give their little ads more air time and, even if there's not an ounce of truth to them, further cast doubt into the minds of voters.

[Mojambo]

1. He thinks he has Rove/Bush

If he does, the election is a slam dunk. IMO

[Trajan]

2. Disagree ....

Airing out the content of those ads in public is the LAST thing the Bushie's want : they would prefer a hit-n-run ....

So no: Kerry is NOT out of his mind ...

Next question ?

[American liberal]

34. I'm with you, Trajan...

As far as I'm concerned it's about time the Kerry camp put its own spin on this: war attrocities, indeed. Those MFers are sooooooooooooo busted! I was THRILLED when I heard that Kerry filed a complaint with the FEC. It's smart! It's strategy. It's called TURNING THE TABLES! The big difference: We have TRUTH on our side.

Did any of you read the NYT article (a friend sent it to me at work, otherwise I'd provide a link) about the genesis of the whole Swift Boat conspiracy? According to the article, it was Kerry's nemesis John O'Neil (please correct me if I'm wrong with the name) who started it all and got all kinds of Republicans on board. This guy is pissed 'cause Kerry went anti-war after his tour. And this guy has had it in for Kerry ever since. Several of the MFers were quoted as SUPPORTING Kerry's service as late as last year! It's such a crock! I think it's awesome that the whole thing is about to blow up in their slimy faces--and tying the Bush campaign to the whole mess? That's ICING, baby!!!

Yay!!!!!

[Surface Map]

35. No doubt

Kerry should file a lawsuit. He will appear to be worried about the truth if he doesn't. He has to file it to expose these people for what they are and at the same time appear pissed that someone is lying about him and is willing to go the distance to bring out the truth.

File the damn thing.

[MissB]

3. Nope. See link.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x643766

[iwantmycountryback]

4. No. In fact

He's a lot smarter than you. You think he doesn't know it will give them more publicity? That's the whole point. To show that they are liars and that they have connections with the Bush campaign. Do you realize it is ILLEGAL for the Bush campaign to have a connection with this group? Do you have any idea how much Bush's ass will be cooked if it shows that there are connections?

[Worthless Teen]

5. These people duped America into a war...

...a little ad connection shouldn't be anything they can't "fix"

[iwantmycountryback]

14. You don't understand

It is I-L-L-E-G-A-L to have an ad connection. Period. Do you think he will gain a ton of support if it is proven that he broke the law?

[XanaDUer]

7. What kerryedwards4USA said

I think this is going to blow up in Bush/Rove/Cheney's faces.

[NewYorkerfromMass]

6. Public humiliation of these fools will be a good thing

IMHO. Kerry is going to kick ass.

[Nicholas_J]

31. Exactly

Public revelation that not a single one of the Swift Boat Veterans for Truth would have qualfied as military witnesses to the events that Kerry won his citations for will be quickly exposed by such a trial.The nearest of them was 600 yards away from Kerry's boat and those who are making the stringest claims against Kerry were three miles away from Kerry's potition. The only people who ewre in position to give acceptible testimony would have been the people on Kerry's boat, most significantly the officer Kerry rescues, who put in for the citation to egin with.

Another misrepresentation is that the citations were based on KERRY"S testimony, and that is not the way citations are awarded. It required independent confirmation from other people within view ofd the events in order for the citations to be awarded, not Kerry's own report of the events. They do not give such citations to people who are presenting their own reports of the events.

[Sparkly]

8. The complaint is about the B* Campaign!!

This is against the BFEE no less than the SwiftLiars. It puts Chimp on the defensive and casts an ugly light on their despicable ads.

[Nite Owl]

9. Good move

Who would want to be on the other side of John Edwards in a court?

[Proud2BAmurkin]

10. Each one will be investigated and exposed as the lying dirtbags they are

GO KERRY

[DoYouEverWonder]

11. Bu$hCo just got caught with their pants down

Passing out flyers from their headquarters in Gainesville FL for a Swift Boat Liars Rally this weekend.

Kerry is a former prosecutor. He would only do this if he knows he's got them by the balls.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x643766

[blondeatlast]

12. This is too funny...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x643124

[bowens43]

13. I think it's a great idea.

No one other than the hard core bushbots believes these guys. If there is a clear link between the swift boat liars and the bushies and it is a violation of election law it needs to brought to the attention of the public.

[MoonRiver]

15. A lot of Repubs would like the lying swift boat Pukes to frame the issue.

Kerry isn't letting them. You got a problem with that?

[klook]

16. He's not taking them to court.

He's filing a complaint with the Federal Election Commission.

See http://www.cnn.com/2004/ALLPOLITICS/08/20/kerry.swiftboat/index.html -

(CNN) -- The Kerry presidential campaign on Friday filed a complaint with the Federal Election Commission, alleging ads from an anti-Kerry veterans' group are inaccurate and "illegally coordinated" with Republicans and the Bush-Cheney campaign.

[MichiganVote]

17. Nice try. We're questioning Kerry's sanity now in the face of

a Republican campaign that clearly and viciously intends to destroy him as it did John McCain and Max Cleland?

You obviously don't comprehend the indignity of having one's service questioned in the face of one's demonstrated heroism.

[blondeatlast]

18. This is one reason I oppose lowering the voting age. nt

[Democat]

23. Some peope do understand and they are trying to push it

The right wing talking points are flying on DU today.

[MichiganVote]

24. Whole new republican virus on the board

Careful children. We must be doing something right so mind your manners DU. The goal of this game is to disrupt the board with dissention and disgust.

[Nay]

19. R U kiddin'? This is a great move. Sue the bastards.

Show them for the liars they are, right on the good ole TV, while Murka watches. Watch the lawyers slice and dice the Bush cowards. Get your popcorn here.

[ibegurpard]

20. Do you think they would do this if they didn't have some substantial

evidence to go on?
The only way to shut these fuckers up is to discredit them and so far things seem to be shaping up nicely in that department.

[TheDonkey]

21. Not a court, just a complaint and Bush has filed many against JK

for Moveon.org and others.

[Democat]

22. Are you out of your mind?

Calling Kerry "out of his mind" on a day when the Republican talking point is "Is Kerry out of his mind?"

Maybe some posters are just out of their usual element today? :)

[blondeatlast]

29. I didn't fail to notice... nt

[KittyWampus]

25. He Is NOT TAKING THEM TO COURT? He Filed An FEC Complaint

big difference.

Furthermore, now the press has to start dogging BUSH on his alleged connection.

[librechik]

33. Also, the FEC deliberates behind closed doors

so there won't be much of a media circus from that stage--nothing to report til they decide.

[rumguy]

26. This is the plan Worthless Teen, listen up, ok?

First you let the enemy fully commit to their mistake.

Then you take out your long knives and sharpen them.

Then you attack your enemy and cut them to little tiny pieces, and you do it relish.

Then you take the stinking remains of the swiftfraud's credibility, you take those stinking remains - and you hang them around Bush's neck for the whole damn world to see!!!

[Nicholas_J]

27. Because the trial

will quickly bring out the certain statements being made by the swift boat people who approved Kerry's medals coming back and stating they were wrong claiming that the medals were awarded on the basis of Kerry's statements about the events that occured when the action occured for whih he was awarded them.


First fact that the media is not doing is making the public aware of the process by which such decorations are awarded. They require a totally independent investigation of the events for which the citations are being awarded. If medals were awarded on the basis of how the recipient viewed the events, there would be a lot more people walking around witrh silver and bronze stars. requires a totally independent investigation of the events, and not Kerry's report on the events. The only witnesses allowed to report had to witness t5he events at hand, not from 600 yards asay, or three miles away, as was the positioning of EVERY member of the Swift Boat Veterans for Truth.
THe net result if the court finds that they are lying about Kerry in orde to politicvally support Bush would be the loss of all their futire military benefits as well as loss of current military ensions and benefits. Kerry, is very aware of how these medals are awarded. The swift boat people opposing him could lose a great deal if Kerry takes this to court. What I expect is a rather sudden withdrawal of the swift boat commercials as soon as the case hits the courts, as the facts do not bear out the actual events, as required by military procedure. Kerry is letting them know that the may be risking losing a great deal of their military benefits, as well as being publically humiliated for lying.

Not one of the people who are calling Kerry a liar would have been qualfied or eligible to be called to give the necessary testimony to award the citations won by Kerry. Only direct witnesses to the events, directly present at the events can make statements regarding the awards, and these people are presenting themselves ash having been present at the events,and in partiicular, are representing themselves as "MILITARY" witnesses to the event. Which is not the case. Not one of them was within distance to even see the swift boat Kerry was on, let alone hear the shots they said were not occuring. You cant here much from 1800 feet when you are on a jungle river, and this is what the Swift Boat Veterans for Truth are claiming. A public trial showing the actual positions of all of the people who are attacking Kerry will make their ads far from credible, and pretty much put an end to them. Most of the Swift Boat Veterans claiming they witnessed the events were three miles away from Kerry's boat, and the nearest boat was 600 yards away. None of the people on the other boats were called as witnesses to the events, because none of them were considered to have witnessed the events. A public exibition of the facts, with nice Power Point exhibits will make that point very clear, and make it very clear that none of the swift boat verterans for truth were actually anywhere close enoutgh to have actually seen a single event that occured when Kerry performed the things he was awarded his medals for.

Again, the Bush people life by telling partial truths, and unless the full truths can be exposed, that none of tese people would be considered legitimate military witnesses to the events,there credibility will be destroyed. If the Bush campaign can be linked to working with this group, so much the better. Kerry's commanding officer will have a lot of explaining to do for his statements rating Kerry as one of the best of military leaders prior to his anti-vietnam activities. then stating that he still backed up his opinion of Kerry as a military leader several decades later, and only reversing himself when he became involved with supporting the Bush Administration will be an interesting cross examination to see.

Kerry is very correct to bring this to legal public view. becasue the mdeia will then cover all of it, including the actual physical location of everyone who is now attacking Kerry, and the fact that none of them would have qualified to witnes the events for the citations. Only the members of Kerrys' wn command were close enough to give acceptable tesitmony for the medals.

[Amaya]

28. "Is Kerry out of his mind?"

I'll say, no Kerry isn't out of his mind. He filed a complaint, he isn't going to court.

I gotta say GD2004 is really getting me down today. It's like being in a locked room with someone who has multiple personality disorder.

[Name removed]

30. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

32. Not even slightly.

On the contrary, he's handling this very cleverly. First: the timing. I think the Bush* campaign wanted the Garbage Scow Liars to wait until closer to the election, but they had to bring it out now because Kerry's poll numbers were improving. But even though the ads might hurt him a bit in the short run, there is also enough time for them to backfire -- which seems quite likely, especially since the NYT has done a thorough enough job of connecting the dots between the ads and KKKarl Rove that the Kerry campaign can file an FEC complaint. And I hardly think they would run the risk of doing that unless they were damn sure they had some solid evidence. The best part is we are now seeing Kerry fight back, hard. I don't think KKKarl and Chimpy expected that.