Interesting Maureen Dowd interview

[featherman]

on Tim Russert show touting her new Bush book. Russert was his usual smarmy, smug, ill-informed self but brought out an interesting comment from Dowd. Dowd feels strongly that Kerry camp was played like a fiddle by Bush and Rove on the "if you knew then what you know now (no threat, no WMD etc), would you still have gone into Iraq?" I was on vacation in Maui and missed most of this but apparently Kerry finally replied publically to this "are you a macho man" type baiting and said "yes". Whatthe!!! Dowd thinks falling into this trap was a disaster for Kerry for several reasons and bodes poorly for the campaign by making Iraq a non issue. Am I missing something here? Now both candidates a running on the fact that invading Iraq was a good idea and that we need to "win" and the only difference is how to best wage the war?
Did Kerry really get snookered like this? Should this be making me nervous in combination with the slow response to the Smearboat campaign?

[Zomby Woof]

1. relax

It's Maureen Dowd, no one to take seriously.

[featherman]

2. Dowd Schmowd... what I want to know is

does Kerry now claim that going into Iraq was a good idea even though there were no WMD's or imminent danger etc? This seems an odd position that slaps the face of what is now a majority of the public who seem to have decided it was actually a particularly BAD idea. Hey I'm just a cynical immoral pol myself...if this needs to be the winning message, so be it... but is it?

[NWHarkness]

3. Kerry never said going into Iraq was a good idea

How do you not know that?

[rasputin1952]

4. Kerry made a statemnet at the Grand Canyon, in which he said...

that going into Iraq, at that time, was not as bad an idea as it has turned out.

The bush camp, took off with it and is saying Kerry agreed w/bush all along...you'd have to go and look at the transcript, (I don't have the link off hand), at the Kerry site.

[buycitgo]

7. got an exact quote on that?

what I remember him saying, and Tweety has been VERY exacting on his guests about this is that Kerry said that he voted for the IWR, specifically as the conditions were written, NOTHING more.

not that going into Iraq was not as bad an idea as it has turned out?
please show where you came up with an idea like that, as I can't believe he said anything close to that.

What Kerry DID say at the GC was that Bush did NOT fulfill the conditions of the IWR. I can't remember what he said exactly, after that, but he definitely criticized Bush for his horrible mishandling of just about every aspoecgt of the war and it's aftermath.

Dowd, the ignorant, superficial LIAR that she is, simply restated the BUSH talking points on this, misstating Kerry's reponse, in the EXACT same way those media hoes LIED about what Gore said, Re: Love Story, Inventing the Internet, Love Canal, Naomi Wolf. And Russert, you can be SURE, knew what Kerry's response was, and did NOT attempt to correct her on that.

Additionally, they had a good laugh at Kerry/s expense on the sensitive issue, once again taking the word out of context, without mentioning the other words he used, the FACT that just about all the high ranking members of the bush junta have used the same words MANY times in the same context, without much comment by the media.

I can't believe ANYbody can stand that silly, shallow, self-involved shrew, who is CLEARLY in the Bushbag (you DID hear her idiotic comments about what an impressive person Laura Pickles was, and what an interesting debate it would be with her and Teresa?)

what on earth does anybody see in her, past a fifty year old woman, desperately trying to hold on to her youth, bragging about her good legs on national TV.

that was one of the most nauseating displays of narcissism I've seen in quite a while, not to mention the mendacious Kerry bashing.

and howdja like those flabby ARMS?

the only tolerable segment was the first, in which she laid down a farily reasonable assessment of the way things really work in the WH, with Cheney pulling the strings, but she, of COURSE, got the rationale for invading Iraq completely wrong, implying that it was NOT on the table til after 911. Right, MO.....guess you don't believe Paul ONeill, or all the others who said it was part of the PNAC agenda, to whose members you kept referrring, but whose anti-Iraq agenda you also neglected to mention.

didn't ANYBODY who watched that trainwreck pick up on ANY of this?

[kentuck]

5. I think MoDo is fascinating..

Although I do not always agree with her. She is an original thinker.

[The Zanti Regent]

6. Whoreen an original thinker??????????

of meaningless trivia, yes

but everything else, oh please, this witch hasn't had an original thought in centuries!

[buycitgo]

8. really........see my post number 7, for similar reaction

she's just a clever little SNOT, who, for some reason, is a sort of modern day 'courtesan,' for lack of a better word, to the Bush world. that crap about her "relationship" with 41 is really creepy.

did you see her making EYES at Russert at the very beginning?

he did a little goggle back at her, too

I'm taping the rerun JUST for that

[NightOwwl]

10. hahahahah -

she had the eyelash batting going on with John Stewart and Bill Maher.

Seriously though, I really dislike that in a woman. All coy and condescending. Constantly needing feedback validating her sexuality and desireability. Can you tell I dislike her? :)

[buycitgo]

11. is there a batting eye icon?

you could start using it here

I would, if I knew how

[NightOwwl]

14. Like this?

[buycitgo]

16. heh......that's more sinsiter than come hither

scary!..........pretty blue eye, though. penetrating

need the eyebrow arch slightly, the eye to open a little bit, maybe move off to the left, ala Susanna Hoffs.
that's what I thought of when I saw that move of hers.

[NightOwwl]

20. Yeah, I thought the same thing,

but it was the best I could do on short notice. :7

[buycitgo]

27. it's very............hypnotizing

think I'll copy it to powerpoint or frontpage or something, and enlarge it

might make an interesting wallpaper for awhile

[redstateblues]

13. Occasionally Clever- Devoid of Any Heart or Soul- Totally Self Involved

[tblue37]

30. Maureen is a Heather.

That's all.

[gulliver]

9. She really slammed Junior today.

http://www.nytimes.com/2004/08/22/opinion/22dowd.html?hp

[buycitgo]

12. thanks! she is so utterly LOADED with shit.......

The weird thing is, given how transparently the Bushes play the game of staying above the fray even as their creepy-crawly surrogates do dishonorable and undignified things, their rivals always seem caught off guard when the third parties show up to rip their throats out
that's because people like, and including YOU, just stand by with your silver spoons up your koolkid ASSES, and refuse to create the echo effects for the counterpoint to the LIES you refuse to condemn, that you create for the lies themselves

you, Jody Wilogren, Adam Nagourney, Richard Berke, Ceci Connolly, Kit Seelye, and your ilk, ALL deserve to be daisychained for all eternity inside a flesheating bacteria-filled shitbath, forced to listen to YOUR nasal, whiny, ittybitty eastcoast valley girl voice

[NightOwwl]

15. Don't forget Judith Miller...

[buycitgo]

17. now you REALLY spoiled my evening

she's not as hung up on her incipient matronliness, though

I'd love to see HER in with Susan McDougal's pals, though.

that would be very very sweet

[AuntPatsy]

18. My Two Cents On Dowd

I hadn't honestly paid much attention to Ms Dowd until I glanced a copy of her book at the local book store and picked it up to thumb through it. After searching several titles a young man who immediately bared his colors as being a Republican began questioning my choice of reading material.

Had never had this happen before like this encounter. He wanted to talk politics which we did for well over an hour. But the point is, he expressed an active dislike of Ms Dowd saying she was in essence not his favorite person. Which made me wonder if she was more partial to the Left.

But after watching her interview with Russet, it is obvious she plays against both sides. And yet I did like her attitude and one very crucial sharing of info. She told Russet that she does not in any way shape or form involve herself with politicians period other than for reporting purposes.

So why is it that so many dislike her?

[buycitgo]

21. because she LIED about the point you like about her

she has a THING for 41

I don't know the details, but they've been remarked upon more than a few times here, since she's put her pouty piehole on the screen the last few weeks

I don't know details, cause she nauseates me, and I couldn't care less, except when she comes up for discussion

I do recall talk of her being on the Cigarette boat with 41.

and didn't you notice her REGARD for Pickles? ANYbody that superficial can never be taken seriously

one last, she got her PUlitzer for her columns which mostly bashed WJC, Hillary, and Gore, when she COULD have spent at least a more substantial amount on her equally "colorful inqisitors"

[AuntPatsy]

23. Me again

What is 41? I swear I thought I was pretty informed of late regarding names and recent news stories. But I haven't heard of that one? I know many Dems to not like Russet, I made the mistake once of saying he seemed like a good guy.

I was quickly informed otherwise. Now Dowd is another story, I am just not that familiar with her but give me a few days I will be, but what is the 41? Sounds ominus...

[buycitgo]

25. heh take your pick

1) W's IQ
2) his father's order in presidential taxonomy

welcome to DU, btw

do you know anything about Bob Somerby?

for a good intro into just HOW craven Russert the pigboy is, try googling Russert+daily howler+bush

you'll have fun, and come out with a vastly different opinion of that fat tub of GE goo

[Princess Turandot]

36. I dislike her because she never takes a stand on anything..

she plays all sides against each other; the result seems to merely depend upon what she thinks will sound the most clever in her column. During the 2000 election, I think she wrote more columns belittling Gore than Bush, which was when I realized that all she cares about is getting her column read, and not its impact. She's the worst of all worlds IMO, a vanity writer in the country's most serious newspaper (in theory.) I usually read the NY Times on-line and generally resist even clicking on her column now, to not give her the hits.

The only consistently reliable op-ed columnist in the NYT, is Bob Herbert, IMHO. I happen to agree with how he views thinks, but his columns are based on facts, and their purpose is to make a point.

I did read MD's column tonight on the Swift Boat ads, and it was the closest thing I've ever seen her write which sort of expressed an opinion, although she had to take digs at Kerry for not fighting back sooner. (Gosh, maybe he thought at least some of the press would pursue the truth!)

[kentuck]

19. "How pathetic is it that he's playing defense on Vietnam ....."

"...when W. didn't even serve?" Good point whether we like her or not.

[buycitgo]

22. yeah, but she LIED about Kerry's answer, which ALLOWS

him to come out against the war, if he ever decides to recall the man he was thirty years ago

she LIED about it, and Russert played right along

that little exchange best typifies what the media are up to here.

they KNOW pressure will be put on them to play along with whatever minor changes Kerry might try to institute, and it might make things less cushy for them. They like things just the way they are now.
If nothing else, Russert knows that he's not going to get the kinds of perks he gets from the pugs, and will be at odds with an administration again, forced to actually WORK, after a four year respite.

[AuntPatsy]

24. I will have to check her out more..

Well I didn't see the whole interview having gone out a few times but she did make a remark about Theresa Kerry that I didn't find exactly flattering especially when she was in fact describing a strong woman who speaks her mind and you would have thought that being herself what seems to be of like mind, she would not have made such an offhanded statement saying that Thereresa needs to tone it down a bit. I for one Ms Kerry just as refreshing for a first lady that I did Hillary..

I just don't like some women putting down others like that which only in my mind knocks us back a few years, again, and again..And I don't like the fact that she went after Hillar..oh well...

Not a woman's libber by the way. Just wanting a fair playing table..

[buycitgo]

26. nothing wrong with being a woman's libber. I am

I'm a man's libber

I'm a kitty libber

[AuntPatsy]

28. Lol, I guess we can all lay claim to some

ad libbing...

[buycitgo]

29. ad hominen?

ad absurdem?

ad busters?

[tblue37]

32. Aunt Patsy,

equal rights--i.e., "a fair playing table"--is what women's liberation was about, so if that is what you want, then you are a "women's libber," though we are called "feminists" now. This is exactly what happened with the perfectly honorable word "liberal"--the right wing demonized it, so that now even people with very liberal positions will deny being liberal.

[AuntPatsy]

34. Your right to an extent..

But I was comparing woman's libber with being Liberal, not in my mind anyway nor do I see anything wrong with calling yourself one I swear. It is just that I still like car doors opened for me, etc and I feel that I would be being a hypocrite for calling myself one when I know some women who find little show of gentlemenly action demeening against women..

The thunder is not rolling on this one ;-)

[tblue37]

39. Every political position gives rise to extremism

of some sort, so that liberalism, which I assume everyone on DU embraces, can appear in an extreme (radical) form that sometimes embarrasses liberalism. Similarly, there are feminists who embrace a radical form of feminiism that most of us consider to be somewhat (or sometimes even very) unbalanced.

When I was married, a friend of mine berated me for daring to wear my engagement and wedding rings, because she considered them "politically incorrect" for an avowed feminist. As another example, I have known women who insist that all men are "the enemy" and that men cannot be feminists. But since I am good friends with a number of feminist men, I thinks she is full of caca.

There are some radical feminists who claim that all heterosexual intercourse is inherently rape. I think they are also full of caca.
I could argue that these radical feminists are not true feminists, just as Pat Buchanan and other paleoconservatives argue that certain radical forms of conservatism are not true conservatism.

But any political or philosophical stance can be carried to absurdity. That doesn't mean the core stance is wrong, though.

Feminism (or "womens lib," as it was once called) is simply the idea that men and women are of equal value and should have equal rights and equal opportunities. There is nothing in core feminism that says a man can't open a door for a woman (or vice versa, for that matter). There are all sorts of culturally conditioned gestures of politeness and consideration that add a grace note to social interactions. Some "leftists" consider all forms of politeness to be submission to dominance. That doesn't mean they are right, or that their extreme take on liberalism should be taken as defining liberalism.

I am 54 years old, so I come from a time when gestures of politeness were more gender-specific than they are now, though it was my generation that made the transition to less gender-specific gestures.

If I am getting out of a car, I do not expect the man I am with to rush to the other side to open the door for me. On the other hand, if we are both walking out a door at the same time, I will usually let him reach the door first and open it for me, especially if he is of my generation or older, simply because it is my gesture of politeness to not interfere with his desire to do something polite and thoughtful for me.

One need not have have a chip on her shoulder to be a feminist. I don't look for ways to have my feminist stance offended by simple, well-meaning gestures. Politeness, thoughtfulness, and consideration are always welcome--even to this aging women's libber.

[AuntPatsy]

31. Okay, now that I know what 41 stands for...

Are some of you saying that Dowd Did Dubya Sr?

[buycitgo]

33. doubt that big fat bugeyed bar let them get out of her sight

she'd sit on em if she caught em en flagrante delicto

definitely some sort of strange chemistry between them, though

wish I'd saved the thread

[AuntPatsy]

35. Meant to say wasn't....

[Jane Austin]

37. Kerry has to say this, because he needs to reserve that authority

for the President for when HE is the President.

Not giving that authorization was not a precident he would want to have set.

Sucks having to think about something besides just winning, doesn't it?

[DU GrovelBot]

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