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Walt Starr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-22-04 07:44 AM
Original message
My email to the MSNBC question of the day
Edited on Sun Aug-22-04 07:46 AM by Walt Starr
Yes, military service should be in this campaign. John Kerry was awarded the following, verified by the documents Kerry released as indicated:

Silver Star (Verified via DD214)
Bronze Star (Should have Bronze Combat "V" Device, Verified via DD214)
Purple Heart (Should have two Gold Star devices for subsequent awards, Verified via DD214)
Combat Action Ribbon (Verified via DD214)
Presidential Unit Citation (Verified via DD215)
Navy Unit Commendation (Verified via DD215)
National Defense Service Medal (Verified via DD214)
Vietnam Service Medal(Verified via DD214, w/four bronze star devices verified via DD215)
Republic of Vietnam Gallantry Cross Unit Citation (Verified via DD215)
Republic of Vietnam Civil Actions Unit Citation (Verified via DD215)
Republic of Vietnam Campaign Medal (Verified via DD215)

Now, looking into George Bush's military awards, we see on the picture located at (I provided a link to this:)

he is wearing an Air Force Outstanding Unit Award and a Small Arms Expert Marksmanship Ribbon. Neither of these awards are listed on his ARG22 discharge. In fact, poring over the documents released by Bush, one can find mention of the SAEMR only in an AF11 form and in a "military biogrpahy" that is NOT an official military document. Also, this alleged "military biography" lists a National Defense Service Medal, which Bush would not have been eligible for as it is reserved for Active Duty troops during a conflict, not Guardsmen who were never activated.

The conspicuous absence of any documentation for the AFOUA is damning. If you recall, there was a story about a general who lost his career over a similar ribbon being worn when not earned. He eventually took his own life over the issue!

Why isn't the press asking George Bush about an award he wore but did not earn instead of carrying water for a group of politically connected veterans with an axe to grind over Kerry's documented awards?
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lil-petunia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-22-04 07:46 AM
Response to Original message
1. he honestly cannot recall those days
snow, lots of snow fell.

Lots and lots of snow.
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asjr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-22-04 07:52 AM
Response to Reply #1
4. My cable does not carry MSNBC, so if they bring up the bit
about Shrub, please let me know. I don't think they will touch it. You know, the "fair" media.
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Walt Starr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-22-04 08:41 AM
Response to Reply #4
7. If any reporter in the mainstream picks this up
it will be a FEEDING FRENZY!
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olddem43 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-22-04 08:03 AM
Response to Reply #1
6. Say it ain't snow, George! - Say it ain't snow!
Well maybe, but that was when he was only in his 40s.
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BootinUp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-22-04 07:47 AM
Response to Original message
2. Lets ask them :)
Good question!!
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yellerpup Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-22-04 07:49 AM
Response to Original message
3. Stay on them, Walt...
A real reporter wouldn't be able to resist this story, especially after you've already done the heavy lifting.
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Walt Starr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-22-04 12:10 PM
Response to Reply #3
8. The facts are pretty clear here, Bush wore an award he was not entitled to
Edited on Sun Aug-22-04 12:24 PM by Walt Starr

FACT: Bush was wearing an AFOUA and SAEMR in the above photograph.
FACT: Bush was a National Guardsman for Five years zero months and 28 days according to his ARG22.
FACT: Bush's ARG22 lists NO medals or awards.
FACT: IF Bush had faithfully executed his oligation under his enlistment in the Texas Air National Guard for the term of his enlistment, he would have qualified for the Texas Faithful Service Medal.
FACT: A Form AF11 dated May 16, 1971 lists ONLY the SAEMR as an award received by George W. Bush.
FACT: Form AF 1712 dated May 10, 1973 lists NO Awards.
FACT: A "military biography" of dubious origin released by the White House contains his enlisment dates, the units he was attached to, and lists the NDSM and SAEMR as his awards, but NOT the AFOUA.
FACT: No document provided by the Bush team lists the AFOUA as one of his awards, by comparison both the DD214 and DD215 provided by John Kerry lists multiple Unit awards.
FACT: To date, no document has been presented to demonstrate Bush earned the AFOUA he was wearing in the picture above.
FACT: No document has been presented that any unit Bush served in was awarded the AFOUA during the period of time in which Bush served.
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Crunchy Frog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-22-04 07:58 AM
Response to Original message
5. Wow,
an "Outstanding Unit Award and a Small Arms Expert Marksmanship Ribbon". There are Cub Scouts who have more than that.

Good work Walt.
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mourningdove92 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-22-04 12:34 PM
Response to Original message
9. What would a person have to do to get those
medals? Can we prove he never got them? This could be big, IMHO>
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Walt Starr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-22-04 12:39 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. I've shown that the AFOUA appears in NO document presented
by Bush.

Not one!
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MoonRiver Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-22-04 12:41 PM
Response to Original message
11. Please also e-mail this to Chris Matthews and Keith Olberman.
Let them fight over who will break it first. (I don't necessarily trust the MSNBC administrators to get this to the right folks.)
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Raenelle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-22-04 12:51 PM
Response to Original message
12. Very, very cool, Walt. Very cool.
Send it to all the cable networks, and to Chris Matthews and Keith Olbermann individually.
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