Kerry at Cooper Union: Misses the mark again..campaign staff useless!

[lottie244]

Heard Kerry this morning. His message was fair but missed a great opportunity to go after the vote of ONE AMERICA. Instead, he is making political promises to the "middle class." Great, that's were many of the voters are BUT what about those of us who are not fortunate enough to make it into the middle class and what about those who are fortunate enough to be in the upper 5%? If he and Edwards want to appeal for "one America" then they had better beging to speak to all of America. Speak to the poor and underprivileged about registering to vote to help elect politicians who will work to bring them up or at least to help take care of them where they are. Let's face it, not everyone in America CAN be wealthy...some are elderly, sick, uneducated, handicapped, and many are just good honest hard working families who will never be able to get ahead because of the capitalistic system under which we live.

Then there are the wealthy and very wealthy among us many of whom ARE decent, honorable men and women who give selflessly to causes that help people less fortunate then themselves...they need a message of inclusion as well as any others. And those who have much need to be encouraged to look inward to their better selves and work to use the wealth with which they have been blessed to help preserve this nation's humanity and true compassion. Buffet and a few others have spoken out against the tax breaks to people like themselves so has Clinton. Yet, we hear no public statements that honor these people for their ideas and willingness to be on the side of social and economic justice. Thus, many are left with the impression that ALL wealthy people are selfish and uncaring and this is just not true but we never see or hear about examples of these people.

Come on Kerry campaign, give us a different type of candidate the run of the mill un-Bush. Talk about the things that we ALL can relate to and not feel besmirched.

How do I get this message to the Kerry campaign?

[Claire Beth]

1. Send an email to their website. n/t

[volosong]

15. Fax the HQ

That is the best way to convey a message with some permanency.

Phone calls and e-mails are usually read by some ninnie and junked.


202-712-3001 (fax) Kerry Washington, DC HQ

[swag]

2. Seriously, lottie

quit polluting my fave message board with your crap.

If you are serious, contact these people:

http://www.johnkerry.com/contact/

[Warren DeMontague]

3. Nobody's going to lose votes addressing the "Middle Class"

It's hardly divisive rhetoric.

[Ducks In A Row]

4. this is according to you, too bad the rest of us weren't allow to see it

I would have liked to make up my own opinion, but the media didn't see fit to allow the rest of us see the full speech.

but I will say, the part they allowed to air was good. in fact, I think that the media pulled the speech because it was getting too good.

so forgive me, I won't be taking your's, or anyone else's word on this speech.

[DoBotherMe]

5. Didn't he say ...

those in the middle class and those striving to be?

[Trajan]

6. HA ! ....

ALL I got to say ....

HA ! ...

oh yeah ... and PFFFFFT !

[papau]

7. I agree a message of inclusion is needed - indeed the rich I hang with

are proud to pay taxes - and give away a lot -

Yes - they are liberals - but there should be no problem with Kerry mentioning that folks of all income/wealth levels can agree on the need to keep the common well maintained for our kids.

The http://www.johnkerry.com/contact/
http://blog.johnkerry.com/

http://www.johnkerry.com/communities/
sites are where you should post your thoughts.

You need only do a signon registration (use fake names if you like) and you will be able to post.

[DaveinMD]

8. the clips

they showed were very good. Kerry has won the message war today and has been winning it for the last 3-5 days.

[Union Thug]

9. I noticed this at the convention...

lots of talk about middle class, but not a lot about poverty or the working class (yes, I DO think that there is a big diff between the working class and the middle class).

[qwlauren35]

11. I have already written in to the Kerry campaign about this.

I am quite distressed that no one in the Kerry camp has pointed out how much working class black folks HATE being labeled as middle class. They consider the "middle class" to be the sellouts, and if Kerry keeps using that language, he will end up seeing a lot of his black votership stay home.

[lottie244]

17. I'm not just speaking about poor blacks, there are a lot of poor whites

out here, many in my family, who don't see themselves a "middle class." There pay checks and welfare checks let them know in no uncertain terms that they are struggling, working poor about whom few seem to care. Their numbers are huge and growing..growing faster than the middle class that the politicians want them to believe that they are a part of. Probably a lot of your children are in that class and without your support would be totally classified as "poor"

[AP]

18. By protecting the middle class, the working and lower class know that

Kerry is trying to reinigorate class mobility.

I'm not sure why you think Kerry's message is incompatible with the interests of the poor and working poor.

He's talking about valuing work. He's talking about putting money into the middle class, which works for everyone who wants a democratic society that is economically productive.

[lottie244]

20. Because he simply doesn't mention the poor and the rich only to complain

about their tax breaks. Instead, he should be appealing to the rich to use their tax breaks to shore up those who need the most help instead of paying accountants to find ways for them to escape paying even more taxes. He should be encouraging them to speak out and set examples for the well-off to help elect people who will help the bad-off!

He should be mentinoning the poor to get them to not feel disenfranchised and unimportant. Just because you are working two jobs and struggling to make ends meet doesn't mean they aren't entitled to one vote. Anything to get their attention and to help them feel a part of party. Tell them they are needed. If some don't understand all of the issues send foks out to teach them, reach them at their own level.

[AP]

22. When he talks about class and opportunity he's talking about everyone

who only has their labor to sell to get wealthy, whether they have a job or not, or have two jobs and no wealth.

I know for a fact that Edwards makes this point explicitly (refers to poverty directly when he talks about these same issues).

However, I'm nost sure how you get the impression that Kerry's chat excludes the poor.

[Union Thug]

23. I disagree.

I don't think we should be appealing to the rich to "use their tax breaks' to do anything. We should be talking about repealing those tax breaks and then raising taxes on the richest percentile.

[AP]

24. We should be talking about rewarding work with wealth, rather than

rewarding weatlh with wealth, whether it's in the way we regulate overtime or in the way we tax income.

We should NOT be taxing earned income twice as much as unearned income, even if it's a million bucks of earned income -- that's a punitive tax on work. If you want to discourage people from working for a living, then tax the hell out of earned income. However, since all wealth comes from work, I don't think we shoudl be doign that.

And I don't think rich people who feel like they get rich from working for it would have a big problem with hearing that Kerry is going to take some of the tax burden off people who get their money from work and shift it on to people who get their income from unearned sources.

[Union Thug]

28. I suppose the difference is when you start lumping us together...

While I agree with you on some points, although when it sounds as though you are coming to the defense of the rich I have to take issue. Maybe I'm misunderstanding you. So, you're telling me that the rich are going to 'stop working' if we raise their taxes? Personally, I don't give a shit about what the rich want. Poor fucking babies.

We have nothing in common except that we crap and that we die, that's the bottom line reality of the rich and poor.

If you want to talk about punishing people for working, we can start our discourse by looking at paying people shit wages and refusing to provide for their basic needs such as healthcare, (all the while tempting them with fake prosperity by luring them into becoming credit thralls, which credit parasites are only too willing to do). Destroying unions comes to mind, as well as what you brought up, killing overtime pay to help raise an army of 24/7 workers toiling away their lives for a base 'salary'.

I say, no tax up to about 60k and then a graduated tax system up to 80-90percent for the wealthiest.

[AP]

30. In some respects, the rich have stopped working...

...not because we've raised taxes, but because we've shifted the tax burden off of unearned income (cap gains & dividends) and shifted it on to earned income. Why work hard for a company and take your money out in the form of a salary that came from the wealth your hard work created when you can get stock options, pump your corporation based on lies, and then dumpt the stock? Why work for a living when you can come up with finance tricks that pay out in the forms of dividends?

The tax code punishes labor, whether you're a doctor or lawyer or a janitor. If you do things for people and get paid for it, you pay high taxes. If you figure out how to make money off the public markets, you've got it made. Now, which of those two activities creates value for society? Working or math tricks?

I don't care that a person is rich. I care how they got rich. I think people who create value for society should be able to retain a fair percentage of that wealth. (So long as they pay progressive income tax on the money they make, and don't get so incredibly big that they can use their power to skew the marketplace in their favor, and ensure that they keep getting rich without working to earn that wealth -- think microsoft). That's the right risk-reward system.

[AP]

16. It's the un-unionized, "salaried managers" and cube dwellers who are up to

their ears in student loans, mortgage, auto loans and credit card debt who are making the rich richer and who are going nowhere.

Do you see why Kerry is focusing on these people? It's not some cynical play for votes. It's because these are the people who are getting killed by Bush. These people are the engine of the economy, and Bush was put all the burden on them to pay all the taxes, and to work long hours without getting overtime pay, and to spend, and to take on all the risk of debt without the reward.

They are the gold mine for the rich, and they get nothing in return. They don't even get medicare. They're expected to get their health care from the private sector, so that somebody else can make huge profits off them.

The story of burdening the middle class to make Bush cronies super wealthy is the story of the last 30 years, and it's coming to point in this election.

Kerry has his finger on the pulse.

[kodi]

29. yeah, the "working class" don't vote, the "middle" class does

you hunt where the game is or starve.

but middle class is roughly defined as an income of $25-100K.

try telling a man working 40 hours a week pulling down $17,000 a year that voting will change his situation. he'll call you a crackhead.

go ahead, i dare you, try it.

[lottie244]

10. Thanks for links and thanks for your opinions.

No matter how different from my own, I appreciate your sharing you views honestly.

[blondeatlast]

12. Self-deleted. nt

[AP]

13. This is THE story of the last 4 years (if not the last 30 years).

In the US, it's no longer the people at the bottom whose labor is used to make people at the top wealthy. It's people in the middle.

Everywhere you look, it's the transfer of wealth from the middle to the top that is making people at the top so much wealthier while making America collectively poorer.

Even the rich should appreciate that their wealth depends on a strong, wealthy middle class.

If Kerry ran on this message in '72, it might not have worked, because '72 marked the end of probably the most incredible expension of wealth in the middle class in the history of the world. In '72, RFK understood what the issue of the day was: race and (working) class issues.

Even thoug you don't get it, I trust that enough voters will appreciate this message so that Kerry wins the election and does good things for America once he's president.

[vickie]

14. I must say that I disagree. Although the cable news fascists

limited the coverage of the speech, from what was shown, Kerry was collected, confident and spoke clearly about the direction he wanted the campaign to take - as well as his plans for the future.

Unfortunately the speech was cut off just as he was really getting into the strength of it (so I read the rest on his website). The decibal of Swift Boat chatter has also come down a bit since yesterday. Fox is still pounding it fairly hard, but the other cable channels are leading with the Prison Abuse and Najaf fiascos.

I think the GOP will want the Swifty mess to recede as well - because they can't want this to dominate their message next week. Today was the first day I felt like we were driving the discussion because I just saw Enron Eddie Gillespie (GOP Chair) dissembling and blathering on Faux regarding Kerry's charge of 'Smear and Fear'.

[grasswire]

19. I honestly believe...

...that Kerry needs to hire Will Pitt to write his speeches. Seriously.

Kerry's stuff is boring, tendentious, repetitious stuff. BORING!!

He needs a Kennedy-quality speechwriter. A firebrand.

Will would do very well.

[union_maid]

21. Middle class is what America WAS about

Getting to it, or staying in it. When the middle class does well there's a way out of poverty for many more than there is right now. Kerry understands about poverty. He's one who has stated that most people in homeless shelters have jobs. When I was a kid working people WERE middle class. They might be working class in terms of culture, but the income provided the same lifestyle that middle management jobs did to a large degree. Blue collar families bought houses, educated their kids, and sometimes were able to buy retirement homes before selling their first home. I believe that when Kerry talks about the middle class he's also talking about what's happened to people like that.

[lottie244]

26. You don't get it either. All I want him to do is TALK about us...we are

here, we feel left out, we feel that nobody cares.

[Uzybone]

25. Yeah...the very rich are gonna feel left out

:eyes:


I agree with talking about the poor but Edwards talks about that everyday. Now you bitch becasue Kerry wont directly address the millionaires???

[Nicholas_J]

27. Depends on how you define upper five percent

If you talk wage earners, than a single person earning 45,000 dollars a year is a fat cat, in the upper five percent of wage earners.

Turn that around to someone who does not get his primary income from salary, but from investment, or a combination of investment and salary (whih is why the salary portion of CEO's remuneration is usually much lower than their stock options and other benefits, as the tax situation is much different there).

Sorry, to be honest, there are very few fortunes that in some way have not been earned by taking advantage of someone lower down the economic food chain, no matter how much they give of their wealth to good causes.

The only way to put an end to such a situation is to create a truly progressive tax code, that ensures that the more money a person makes the more tax they will pay, and that a situation where a person or corporation making ten million dollars a year can somehow pay less in taxes than a family making less than 100,000 a year. And make certain that the percentage that they pay is always greater than the percentage paid by those who earn less.

Europe and Canada are prime examples. There are plenty of millionaires in Europe and Canada, but there are very few people who can accumulate obscene amounts of wealth. There is nothing wrong with a person obtaining a fair degree of comfort and a modest degree of wealth in any society. But a nation like America, where massive tax cuts are given to millionaires, by raiding the returement funds of average Americans by way of using the Social Security trust find to give tax breakes to the wealthy out of a trust fund that they never contributed more to than the average worker is a =n unjust system, slanted to make certain that the wealthy can keep every cent of what they earn, or a far greater degree of it than the average worker, and are then able to use that welath to slant a the economic system of the united states to make abslutely certain that the working people of the country actually pay largely for the wealth that these people have obtained.

The War in Iraq is the prime example of this type of slanting of the system. Even when most politicians talks about passing the cost of the War in Iraq to OUR children and Grandchildren through the deficit, they are already excluded. The elimination of inheritance taxes assures that the money they have earned will pass to their cildren untouched, and the tax codes are slanted to the degree that their children will certainly not be paying the lions share of the higher taxes that will result from the deficit being run up now paying trillions for a war who's primary beneficiaries will neither be the people of Iraq, or the average American Citizen, but the CEO's of Halliburton, Bechtel, and dozens of other corporations, who will pass this money down to their own progeny, att a rather low rate of taxation. One of the priimary reasons the Bush Administration pushed the major members of the Security Council into opposing the war in Iraq was to simply prevent any of this large windfall from going to anyone but the very people planning the war, thier freinds, their families.


No quote ever made was more true than the one made by Balzac:

“Behind every great fortune there is a crime.

http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/authors/h/honore_de_balzac.html


Examine any amount of wealth, and somewhere, someplace, someone was grievously harmed, people have died, whetther immediately, or as a result of some long term problem caused by the conditions under which that wealth was generated. No money that has not been earned by the sweat of ones own brow alone, without the uuse of others in that work, is clean money.