Dividing us on Vietnam was the plan all along...

[Junkdrawer]

There are times when I fear for the safety of my TV. While waiting to see Rove, I saw smarmy Carl Cameron on Faux:

"In all his previous campaigns, John Kerry was able to turn Republican attacks on his anti-Vietnam activities to his advantage. But that was in liberal Massachusetts, a state that opposed the Vietnam war. We'll see how this plays out on the national stage. - Carl Cameron with the Kerry Campaign"

So ripping open the half healed scars of Vietnam is just another campaign tactic.

[jeff30997]

1. Liberal Massachusetts...

Hates us because of our freedom.They are with the terrorist.Bin Laden once said the word Massachusetts.Boy do Right wingers love to bash Massachusetts.:eyes:

[olddem43]

3. I would too if I was a RWer. After all, that's where everything

started.

[UTUSN]

2. Well, WE're Not Divided, So It Ain't Working n/t

[KittyWampus]

4. No, I Don't Think So. You Give Rove Too Much Credit

as is often the case.

They really just want to smear Kerry and get away with it.

Now that Kerry is fighting back and the Media is shining a light under the Rovian rock... they're trying to spin this as something more than it is.

Covering Rove's ass if this backfires on Junior.

[Junkdrawer]

5. Come on. Rove had to have looked into Kerry's record of addressing...

this issue.

This was cold and calculated.

[KittyWampus]

8. No, It Was Incidental

[Tansy_Gold]

6. Of course

It's very convenient. It's also very dangerous. But they -- the booshies -- have to risk everything because they have everything to gain, as well as everything to lose.

1. They can't run on the issues. Boosh is an abject failure at all of them: the economy, the environment, the tax cuts, the education system, the infrastructure. Social Security is a mess, the prescription drug benefit is a lie.

2. They can't run on the war in Iraq, because it's a disaster, too. It has eaten up uncounted billions of dollars, not to mention nearly 1000 American lives. Pretty soon boosh will have killed as many Americans as the 9/11 terrorists.

3. They can only run on fear. They maintain a level of fear and put ol' Georgie out there as the great leader who will protect us all.

Therefore, they MUST keep the campaign focused on something OTHER than the issues. At the same time, however, they can't let Kerry be perceived as any kind of protective leader. And since he has a much better military record than booshie, and because Kerry knows it and they know he knows it, they absolutely MUST tear that down. They have to. They have no choice. If left alone, Kerry's military record would cream booshie's. And they have to count on the desire of many people to leave the wounds of Vietnam safely scabbed over, even if they are, in many ways, just festering sores.

4. Kerry has to respond. If he doesn't, he's tacitly conceding their point. If he does, it keeps the campaign off the issues and picks at those scabs. Advantage, GOP.

5. The Vietnam war was divisive enough -- and Kerry was a visible enough element of that division -- that they can play it up. No problem finding a few hundred Vietnam vets who still nurse a grudge over Kerry's remarks to the FRC in 71. I'm sure we can find a couple hundred anybody who nurse a grudge over the 1969 Mets, too. Advantage, GOP

6. The Vietnam war divided in almost exactly the way the country is divided today, and that division works FOR the booshies. They love it. Advantage, GOP

The risk, however, is that Kerry will really fight back. I think Rove & Cie. (I love using the French version just to spite them!) are counting on Kerry wimping out the way Gore did. I think they have a campaign of countless little sniping attacks all lined up for the next ten weeks.

7. If Kerry does fight back, if he and Edwards (who can do all kinds of Dem damage under the radar, bless his little heart) stay on the issues even minimally and make a reasonable challenge to the smears, all Kerry has to do is unleash the real salvos in the last couple weeks of the campaign. You know what they are, and I know what they are, and we know they are related to Vietnam and we don't have to publicize them for the lurking freepers. Because if Kerry proves not to be a wimp like Gore, boosh is toast.

Game, set, match.


Tansy Gold, who does not do tennis

[Junkdrawer]

7. Great post. And, oh, I think he will...

#7, that is. ;)

[dweller]

12. Damn, you did it again

i think you are just warming up.

:thumbsup:

dp

[MoreDemThanMost]

9. I can't remember who invoked Viet Nam

When and who dragged Viet Nam in to this election?

[Junkdrawer]

11. I believe Kerry touted Military Service...

The last Swiftie attack invoked betrayal for opposing the Vietnam war.

[MoreDemThanMost]

13. Was the "Reporting for duty" the opening salvo?

My fear is that the honoable POW vets that had to suffer Kerry's Jengis Kahn remarks while in the Hanoi Hilton will speak out and get America's ear.

[Junkdrawer]

15. Bye Bye...

And thanks for playing. :hi:

[MoreDemThanMost]

16. No need to pretend it didn't happen

Have you heard the Kerry testimony while POWs were still in Hanoi?

We will have to deal with it before 11/04 and you know it. How can we difuse it now?

[dweller]

17. not only have i heard it

i've read it in its entirety. There is nothing there to difuse, sic. Nor defuse.

where do you get your newsclip of the testimony?
dp

edit: asked and answered. see below, #19

[MoreDemThanMost]

18. where do you get your newsclip of the testimony?

Not from the MSM...they have not shown it yet. I got from the web.

[A_Possum]

19. Here's how to deal with it

Kerry, the Congressional Record, 1971:

"Mr. Kerry: Well, Senator, frankly it does not appeal to me if American men have to continue to die when they don't have to, particularly when it seems the Government of this country is more concerned with the legality of where men sleep than it is with the legality of where they drop bombs. (Applause.)...

...But at the present moment that is not going to happen, so we are talking about men continuing to die for nothing and I think there is a tremendous moral question here which the Congress of the United States is ignoring...

...But I think if we can talk in this legislative body about filibustering for porkbarrel programs, then we should start now to talk about filibustering for the saving of lives and of our country. (Applause.)

And this, Mr. Chairman, is what we are trying to convey."

Kerry, 2004:

"The Navy 35 years ago made the awards that it made through the normal process. I'm proud of them and I'm proud of my service and I'm proud that I stood up against the war when I got home because it was the right thing to do," he added.

*****

Simple.

[Kathy in Cambridge]

21. The same smear boat vets smeared McCain

Why are you blaming the victim? Or do you believe the Swift Boat Liars-NONE of whom served on the same boat as the same time.

Oh I know why you believe the liars! :eyes:

Sniff, sniff. Something SMELLS in here....

[dweller]

14. We did

:nuke:

why do you think they call us 'boomers' ?

okay, i know that's not why, but it works here, right now, for this post.
:)

dp

[Monte Carlo]

10. Well I'm glad my opinion has been determined, then.

Being from the People's Republic of Massachusetts myself, I know that my feelings about the Vietnam War are a little more complex than just for or against.

People think Kerry holds a complex stance on wars. I don't see how one couldn't.

[Tansy_Gold]

20. Spot on, Monte Carlo!

Ah, yes, nuanced. Methinks Monsieur Kerry could just nuance 'em to death! :evilgrin:

The booshies/rovies/whatchamacallems are not complex people. They can't deal in shades of grey. Just as Kerry referred to boosh last night on the Daily Show as "stubborn," the reality is that they can't budge from a very narrow set of givens. They are true ideologues. So, they can't admit mistakes, they can't change (aka flip flop), they can't grow, they can't learn.

I know some of my professors would laugh their tenures off to know that I'm actually supporting postmodernism, but that's what Kerry represents, and it's anathema to the right wing. It's nuanced, it's flexible, it's a zillion shades of smoke and pewter and tarnished silver and stormcloud.

And therein lies, IMHO, the greatest hope for the anti-booshies. In their stubbornness, they won't be able to deal with Kerry. They won't even be able to imagine their inability to deal with him. They will be so supremely confident that they may not even know when they're beaten.

The concern, of course, is that the American electorate is too stupid to realize this. Fortunately, I think Kerry can even take that into consideration and emerge victorious.

Tansy Gold, who will never reveal her true identity for fear someone will tell Dr. K--- she's become a (the horror, the horror!) postmodernist of sorts.