Holy Sh**! It is linked to Plame!!

[annxburns]

Larry Johnson on MSNBC just said that spy in the Pentagon is linked to who forged the uranium document and how that is linked to Valerie Plame.


Holy Crap! This is it! The plates are moving around!

(Please see clarifying post below for more info)

[imax2268]

link...

or something...?

[annxburns]

4. Sorry, sorry - I got excited

CBS news reported tonight that the FBI has identified a high level spy in the Pentagon who may have influenced policy toward Iran and Iraq. Larry Johnson on MSNBC just said that he has heard about these investigations for MONTHS and the spy may be linked to whoever forged the documents on the Niger uranium claim that Bush made in the SOTU speech (16 words). Now remember, that claim led to Nofacts outing Valerie Plame as a CIA agent after her husband said that there was no basis for Bush's claim in the SOTU. Therefore the report on CBS tonight - see yahoo or any of the boards for the breaking story - may be linked to Valerie Plame's outing.

Josh Marshall on talkingpointsmemo.com has been talking about a story that he has been working on that would "shift the tectonic plates in Washington". I think we are starting to see the start of that.

[Carla in Ca]

55. Leaks

I'm new here and enjoying every minute. I have worked out a headline if this story pans out (fingers crossed)

"BUSH ADMINISTRATION GOES DOWN IN "PLAMES"

But any reason will do.

Also, could someone explain what n/t means. Thanks

Has anyone noticed that, sadly, as we see the income levels go down and the poverty rate has risen...that upper-income stores like Tiffany's and Williams-Sanoma are posting gains? That is absolute proof that the tax refunds are indeed going to the top 2%!

One final thought...If *ush wins, my husband and I have accepted an invitation by my great aunt and uncle to move to British Columbia. I'm not kidding here...my beloved America is changing in ways I can no longer tolerate. My husband and I are not old (fifties) but not young enough to be able to recover. Alan Greenspan made our decision for us today...did you see it?
I've got my rock music, my 1957 Chevy street rod, my beagle, my husband of 26 years...We're outta here!

[HootieMcBoob]

63. Welcome to DU

Love the headline :)

I understand you're feelings about the way the country is changing. I'm in my 40's and believe me I'm worried about it too. The idea of moving to BC has actually crossed my mind as well, it's a beautiful place.

[Carla in Ca]

67. Hootie...

Thanks for the welcome. Also, per my post, what does n/t mean?

[Jacobin]

68. n/t means "no text", also sometimes "eom" or "end of message

[Minimus]

66. I've discussed moving also

at least to a blue state. These North Carolina Southern Baptists are driving me mad! I'm new here too and boy is it refreshing to read this forum.

[coloradodem2005]

1. Plame herself or the CIA Leak?

n/t

[aquart]

2. Please be a trifle clearer?

[Rose Siding]

16. Here's the spy case link

FBI Probes Pentagon Spy Case

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/08/27/eveningnews/main639143.shtml

but CBS hasn't hooked the article up with Plame yet.

[roguevalley]

60. The FBI is going around to the conservative think tanks in the east and

asking them about the spying Chalabi did. Could be there are multiple rings in the government that spied. So much for us being safer. Amazing. Multiple spies spying for multiple countries. They assume that Chalabi sent agents to many countries to plant the WMD rumors for Bush's speech.

We are so vulnerable as a country right now. Its like our front doors are open.

[HootieMcBoob]

64. Wouldn't you love to have the Heritage Foundation

somehow linked to this? Would it bring down and discredit this whole neo-conservative movement?

[Alpharetta]

65. They already are linked

http://www.motherjones.com/news/feature/2004/01/12_400.html

Chalabi fed his lies through the Pentagon offices which were populated with PNAC and Heritage members.

[DemMother]

3. I saw it too. Just now on Keith Olbermann's show

Unfortunately, I can't explain what the heck he's talking about. But he did say this could be huge. And he said he's known about the investigation for months.

[grasswire]

6. I thought he said something else

It was part of the discussion about Israel spying on the U.S. I thought he said that there was still an unanswered question about who forged the papers regarding the Niger uranium.

Granted, I was only half listening. But I didn't hear him make the link.

Re-run later.

[KittyWampus]

7. IS This Josh's Scoop?

?

[Cush]

24. thats what I'm wondering

[Stephanie]

54. Yes, but he hasn't posted on it yet

For months, I have been working with my colleagues Paul Glastris and Josh Marshall on a story for the Washington Monthly about US policy towards Iran. In particular, it involves a particular series of meetings involving officials from the office of the undersecretary of defense for Policy Doug Feith and Iranian dissidents.

http://www.warandpiece.com/

[blondeatlast]

5. Nothing in the online report about Plame, but I heard it too.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/5844415/

[Gman]

8. So are they going to try to pin the forged uranium document on Plame

or maybe Wilson?

If so, the indictment on Scooter Libby must be imminent for them to fire this kind of preemptive nuclear warhead.

Then again, I don't know diddly from what's been written above...

[emulatorloo]

9. No, pinning it on the israeli spy who works for Wolfowitz and Feith

EOM

[Rose Siding]

19. No! I don't see that at all

The Plame grand jury investigation could be involved in uncovering a spy but not pointing to Plame or Wilson, rather to someone in the admin/bushies.

[Elidor]

69. Exactly - pointing to the same people who outed Plame

The same people who pushed the bogus yellowcake "intelligence."

Not only are they criminal, they're incompetent. And they also leaked classified info to Chalabi. Someone is going to prison. I don't know who, but someone.

[blondeatlast]

10. CBS--they broke the story

CBS sources say that last year the suspected spy, described as a trusted analyst at the Pentagon, turned over a presidential directive on U.S. policy toward Iran while it was, "in the draft phase when U.S. policy-makers were still debating the policy."

This put the Israelis, according to one source, "inside the decision-making loop" so they could "try to influence the outcome."

The case raises another concern among investigators: Did Israel also use the analyst to try to influence U.S. policy on the war in Iraq?

With ties to top Pentagon officials Paul Wolfowitz and Douglas Feith, the analyst was assigned to a unit within the Defense Department tasked with helping develop the Pentagon's Iraq policy.

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/08/27/eveningnews/main639143.shtml

[Democrat 4 Ever]

30. oh boy, oh boy!

Anybody think it was completely serendipitous that Bush finally admitted today that he was wrong when he said they had proof of WMDs? Bush never admits to anything but today he "finds" honesty. Rove is in major CYA mode and somebody is going to take the fall. Rove is now using a favorite Dem campaign slogan - but in an entirely different context - Anybody But Bush!:crazy:

[wndycty]

11. I saw that. . .

:kick:

[wndycty]

12. Basically the link is. . .

. . .that the uranium story allegedly came from the Israelis who forged it. At least that is how I understood it. Holy Shit.

[JohnnyRingo]

13. Are they implying it was an Israeli spy (Pat Buchanen)?

Did I hear that right?

As in: The Israelis influenced the decision to invade Iraq ?

[blondeatlast]

14. Read post 10 and the CBS link.

That is exactly right.

[annxburns]

15. People this is HUGE

A spy in the pentagon may have manipulated the case for war with Iraq and instead of investigating the claim, the WH tried to cover it up by outing a CIA agent

[faithnotgreed]

17. i hear you but theres discussion going on here about this. when you

say the wh, do you think this includes bush or goes only to cheney

someone else here said that bush isnt likely connected

im just trying to clarify your very succinct description

[blondeatlast]

22. Very likely can be linked to Rumsfeld, according to CBS and

MSNBC.

[annxburns]

23. Don't know

I only know that somehow what broke today on CBS about a spy in the Pentagon is somehow linked, according to Larry Johnson on MSNBC, to the forgery of the Niger Uranium documents and the outing of Valerie Plame.

[RummyTheDummy]

21. "People this is huge"

I wish I had a buck for every time I've heard that on DU over the last two years. If I did I could leave this God foresaken shit hole of a country and buy my own private island in the south pacific never to return.

Just kidding. I hope you're right, though. I just worry there are no silver bullets. We shall see if this time things are different.

[annxburns]

26. Okay Okay

I meant huge as important and significant. Not huge that it will bring Bush Co down. God knows the media is useless.

[qanda]

28. I'm with you...

Every single time something like this happens, people start crowing about how screwed Bush* is, well he's still standing and I doubt this or any other scandal in the next two months will bring his reign of evil to an end. Only educated voters will be able to do that. I'm sure they knew this was going to break and I'm sure they have a plan to weasel the weasel-in-chief out of it.

[blondeatlast]

42. It's an huge story even if it has no impact on Bunnypants.

It's not her fault that the media is as effing corrupt as the misadministration.

[qanda]

62. Oh, I agree...

I wasn't trying to beat up on anyone. It's just that we've been through this so many times and nothing, absolutely nothing seems to stick. Who would have thought that Kerry showing up to fight in Vietnam would be the story after all this administration has done. I cannot tell you what is happening in our country, but I don't like it anymore than anyone else on this board. Sorry to the original poster if she's getting piled on-- it's not her fault.

[w13rd0]

27. but Bush wanted to invade Iraq...

...from before he was sworn in. So this spy obviously just fed him what he wanted to hear. That's always been the case, regardless whether it was PNAC or AIPAC feeding him the shit. This means that BushCheney, in order to hear what they wanted to hear, took foreign policy direction of:

1) an Iranian spy (Chalabi)
and
2) an as yet unnamed Israeli spy

Can we really trust these people's ability to judge character? I mean, Ken Lay, Chalabi, Israeli spies? Hell, if he weren't 6'4" and obvious, these assclowns would give bin Laden a job in the administration...

[Bongo Prophet]

56. WHat you said, w13rd0!

Self fulfilling prophecy from Neocon/Theocon clusterf8ck.
What a project! What a century!
:toast:

[22181]

37. WOW Annxburns you hit it dead on for me, Thank you!

"A spy in the pentagon may have manipulated the case for war with Iraq and instead of investigating the claim, the WH tried to cover it up by outing a CIA agent"

This is the most succint and easily understandable summation thus far. Thank you!

Wow.

[Scorpious_Maximus]

52. Wow.

This is mind blowing. It just all adds up.

Fucking amazing.


:scared:

[ngGale]

59. Did they try to cover up, if so...

why. Maybe the neocons knew what they were doing. I did hear a big break in the Plame case was coming the other day. And that he or she was offered immunity to testify. Now, this could be very big.
I have a feeling in the pit of stomach about this, a bad one. What if this witness can prove that Bushco, Inc. outed the total security of this country.

[Princess Turandot]

58. This may be a stupid question..

but if there is someone to hang this on at the FBI, which then leads to Israel, which leads back to the US, won't Israel's involvement be the main story? I had the impression that blaming things on Israel caused the average blue collar worker, not the fundamentalists waiting for the rapture, to side with Republicans. Or is the story that someone at the FBI lied to Israel intentionally, in hopes that they would pass the info back to us, helping to 'support' the Iraq invasion decision?

[Rose Siding]

20. My money's on Richard Perle

[Cheswick2.0]

33. As if we didn't already know that was the case

[foo_bar]

39. Pat Buchanan's an Israeli spy?

it's always the ones you least expect.

[starroute]

18. Guardian article from a year ago on the OSP

http://www.ireport.net/qx/1610/The.spies.who.pushed.for.war.

The agency, called the Office of Special Plans (OSP), was set up by the defence secretary, Donald Rumsfeld, to second-guess CIA information and operated under the patronage of hardline conservatives in the top rungs of the administration, the Pentagon and at the White House, including Vice-President Dick Cheney.

<snip>

William Luti, a former navy officer and ex-aide to Mr Cheney, runs the day-to-day operations, answering to Douglas Feith, a defence undersecretary and a former Reagan official. ... The OSP also sucked in countless tips from the Iraqi National Congress and other opposition groups, which were viewed with far more scepticism by the CIA and the state department.

<snip>

The OSP was an open and largely unfiltered conduit to the White House not only for the Iraqi opposition. It also forged close ties to a parallel, ad hoc intelligence operation inside Ariel Sharon's office in Israel specifically to bypass Mossad and provide the Bush administration with more alarmist reports on Saddam's Iraq than Mossad was prepared to authorise.

"None of the Israelis who came were cleared into the Pentagon through normal channels," said one source familiar with the visits. Instead, they were waved in on Mr Feith's authority without having to fill in the usual forms.

[Malva Zebrina]

25. Does not sound like a spy to me

sounds like it was a cabal, a friendly association, with Feith and Wolfowitz --

[Cheswick2.0]

34. I agree

That is exactly what I thought.

[H2O Man]

29. This is getting big.....

I think it also involves a potential move on Iran's facilities.

[Hell Hath No Fury]

31. Here's the connection...

From The Nation back in June of 2003:

http://www.thenation.com/doc.mhtml%3Fi=20030707&s=dreyfuss

As the Pentagon scours Iraq for weapons of mass destruction and Iraqi links to Al Qaeda, it's increasingly obvious that the Bush Administration either distorted or deliberately exaggerated the intelligence used to justify the war against Iraq. But an even bigger intelligence scandal is waiting in the wings: the fact that members of the Administration failed to produce an intelligence evaluation of what Iraq might look like after the fall of Saddam Hussein. Instead, they ignored fears expressed by analysts at the Central Intelligence Agency, the Defense Intelligence Agency and the State Department who predicted that postwar Iraq would be chaotic, violent and ungovernable, and that Iraqis would greet the occupying armies with firearms, not flowers.

Not surprisingly, perhaps, it turns out that the same people are responsible for both. According to current and former US intelligence analysts and government officials, the Pentagon's Office of Special Plans funneled information, unchallenged, from Ahmad Chalabi's Iraqi National Congress (INC) to Defense Secretary Rumsfeld, who in turn passed it on to the White House, suggesting that Iraqis would welcome the American invaders. The Office of Special Plans is led by Abram Shulsky, a hawkish neoconservative ideologue who got his start in politics working alongside Elliott Abrams in Senator Henry "Scoop" Jackson's office in the 1970s. It was set up in fall 2001 as a two-man shop, but it burgeoned into an eighteen-member nerve center of the Pentagon's effort to distort intelligence about Iraq's WMDs and terrorist connections. A great deal of the bad information produced by Shulsky's office, which found its way into speeches by Rumsfeld, Dick Cheney and George W. Bush, came from Chalabi's INC. Since the INC itself was sustained by its neocon allies in Washington, including the shadow "Central Command" at the American Enterprise Institute, it stands as perhaps the ultimate example of circular reasoning.


"The same unit that fed Chalabi's intelligence on WMD to Rumsfeld was also feeding him Chalabi's stuff on the prospects for postwar Iraq," said a leading US government expert on the Middle East. Says a former US ambassador with strong links to the CIA: "There was certainly information coming from the Iraqi exile community, including Chalabi--who was detested by the CIA and by the State Department--saying, 'They will welcome you with open arms.'" Rumsfeld's willingness to accept that view led him to contradict the Chief of Staff of the US Army, who predicted that it would take hundreds of thousands of troops to control Iraq after the fall of Baghdad, a view that seems prescient today.

According to the former official, also feeding information to the Office of Special Plans was a secret, rump unit established last year in the office of Prime Minister Ariel Sharon of Israel. This unit, which paralleled Shulsky's--and which has not previously been reported--prepared intelligence reports on Iraq in English (not Hebrew) and forwarded them to the Office of Special Plans. It was created in Sharon's office, not inside Israel's Mossad intelligence service, because the Mossad--which prides itself on extreme professionalism--had views closer to the CIA's, not the Pentagon's, on Iraq. This secretive unit, and not the Mossad, may well have been the source of the forged documents purporting to show that Iraq tried to purchase yellowcake uranium for weapons from Niger in West Africa, according to the former official.

(Unless I am mistaken, the "official" spilling the beans is Wilson)

[Toots]

38. This information has been in the public arena for over a year

It is just now being brought to light for the second time at least by the date on this article. This is American intelligence at it's best I guess. :crazy: I truly hope and pray that this is the straw and some of these neocons end up in some Texas Prison system.

[peacetalksforall]

32. Caution. Caution.

Finding a spy is convenient. They can keep Libby or Cheney or Bush out of jail by pinning everything on a spy. First gut reaction pending further information.

[Tamyrlin79]

35. yes...

clearly they could then be all "we were duped by the israelis!" as a defense of their "miscalculation" and try to shift responsibility. However, that requires looking like a naieve dupe, too, so its a sword that cuts both ways. :shrug: On the whole, I don't see how this can be good for Bush Co., particularly if it gives the admin a MOTIVE to break the law and out a CIA agent...

[starroute]

36. But Cheney and Libby are tied in to the OSP as well

http://www.marchforjustice.com/8.8.03.critics.php

Kwiatkowski's comments echo the worst fears of some lawmakers, who have begun looking into the OSP's role in the administration's mistaken assumptions in Iraq. Some are even comparing it to the off-the-books operation run from the National Security Council (NSC) during Reagan administration that later resulted in the "Iran-Contra" scandal. ... In her article, Kwiatkowski wrote that OSP's work was marked by three major characteristics:

First, career Pentagon analysts assigned to the Secretary's office were generally excluded from "key areas of interest" to Feith, Wolfowitz, and Rumsfeld, notably Israel, Iraq, and Saudi Arabia. "In terms of Israel and Iraq, all primary staff work was conducted by political appointees, in the case of Israel, a desk officer appointee from the Washington Institute for NearPolicy", a think tank closely tied to the main pro-Israel lobby in Washington, the American Israel Public Affairs Committee (AIPAC).

Second, the same group of appointees tended to work with like-minded political appointees in other agencies, especially the State Department, the NSC, and Cheney's office, rather than with those agencies' career analysts or the CIA.

<snip>

The CIA's exclusion from this network could help explain why Cheney and his National Security Advisor, I. Lewis Libby, a long- time associate of Wolfowitz, frequently visited the agency, in what analysts widely regarded as pressure to conform to OSP assessments.

[nolabels]

57. They have, with much intent, been putting up the picket fence for chimpy

It's more than just this scandal also. The torture scandal, the banking scandal, the Enron fiasco, the AWOL outing, the can't chew gum and talk scandal.

Just saying don't expect anything to be done or investigated. The corporate puppet masters who own most of the media have a very real interest in keeping things divided in favor of the GOP. My guess some of the spooks are just testing the waters to see how deep they are. Just lobbing crap over the bow to make Rove think twice.

I betting they have some big ammo in the breach and are waiting to see if they need to use it.

[kwolf68]

40. We don't

Want the United Nations running American foreign policy..Isreal will do just fine.

Now maybe we can figure out just why the Muslims over there hate us. All that "they hate us for our freedoms" is and always has been bullshit.

[Rose Siding]

41. Ding! Didn't Bush admit to "miscalculations" TODAY?

hmmmmmmm. Pre-emptive butt covering?

[Tatiana]

43. This is BIG...however, how do we know this is a SPY?

Perhaps the Bush administration is doing a little preemption here. Like Chalabi, it is very likely that this Israeli was a friend or close ally of this administration who fed Cheney and the Pentagon what they wanted to here. Now that another supposed link or piece of evidence has been exposed as a fraud, it is very convenient that this person is labeled as a "spy." It is another example of this administration trying to place the blame on others instead of where it belongs: with Bush and his cabal.

[blondeatlast]

44. It's what the mole gave to Israel, not what he/she gave to us.

From MSNBC
Agents said they had evidence that the official passed sensitive information, including draft policy documents and presidential policy directives, to Israel through the American-Israel Public Affairs Committee, or AIPAC.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/5844415/

CBS broke the story, indicating it's pretty clear that someone was trying to influence US policy towards Iran, and even policy regarding the war in Iraq.

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/08/27/eveningnews/main639143.shtml

Edit: AIPAC is also one of the most powerful lobby groups in Washington.

[powergirl]

45. OK, Don't laugh - but why are all news websites covering this except FOX??

Can't they at least pretend to be a news organization? They just need to go move into the Whitehouse.

[blondeatlast]

46. No, they would lose credibility with their market if they did. nt

[powergirl]

47. You're probably right

They can't serve the kook aide if they don't keep shillin' for the Republicans. I hate FOX and those jerks they shill for. :grr:

[gristy]

51. Oh, there's something on Fox's front page all right...

It's a link to the AIPAC statement. No companion story at all.

A statement from the American Israel Public Affairs Committee on Friday regarding an FBI investigation into whether a Pentagon analyst acted as a spy for Israel:

Today, AIPAC learned that the government is investigating an employee of the Department of Defense for possible violations in handling confidential information. News stations tonight reported that the investigation centers around a supposed "mole" in the Department of Defense who allegedly disseminated internal White House policy deliberations on Iran to Israel through two AIPAC staff members.

Any allegation of criminal conduct by AIPAC or our employees is false and baseless. Neither AIPAC nor any of its employees has violated any laws or rules, nor has AIPAC or its employees ever received information they believed was secret or classified.

AIPAC is cooperating fully with the governmental authorities. It has provided documents and information to the government and has made staff available for interviews. We will continue to offer our full cooperation and are confident that the government will find absolutely no wrongdoing by our organization and its employees.

AIPAC is an American organization comprised of proud and loyal U.S. citizens committed to promoting American interests. We take our responsibilities as American citizens seriously. We do not condone or tolerate any violation of U.S. law or interests, and we have and will continue to follow the law in all its facets.

[Jackpine Radical]

53. FOX ISN'T COVERING IT??! (Sorry for the scream, but...)

THERE'S YOUR EVIDENCE THAT THE WHITE HOUSE ISN'T THS SOURCE OF THE LEAK! If the WH wanted this story out, surely Rupert would be carrying their water for them.

[peacetalksforall]

48. Keep in mind that these peole are always forging partnerships

that end in some form of betrayal and revenge. Noriega, bin Laden, Hussein.

This could be a pseudeo betrayal - a pure set-up to protect themselves.

The Italy-Niger letter writer identity is probably about to be broken or announced.

[Nashyra]

49. They tie this to Cheney

The * states he might have miscalculated, the reason he miscalculated is that Cheney decived him and by the night of the nomination Cheney is out and is to blame for all *'s mistakes and the * looks like a leader because he is not afraid to make the hard choices, he will fire his VP and McCain is on the ticket as the new VP.

Maybe McCain will ultimately show his better side and let the Dems investigate the *, they will find enough evidence to impeach * and McCain becomes president.

[NEDem]

50. I love a good conspiracy theory.

[ezekiel333]

61. */McCain 04

Yep.

Lets * clear up some rather sticky business, no WMD's, Halliburton, & Cheney's recent remarks against party lines (or does he know he is leaving?).

Also pits a POW against a war hero helping to take the sting out of *'s shameful military record.

Conspiracy or tactics?

I hope it doesn't happen.