Carville's Complaint

[unfrigginreal]

Monday, Aug 30, 2004; 8:52 AM

NEW YORK--James Carville is off the reservation.

With the Republicans having taken over this city for a week, you'd think the Ragin' Cajun, one of the masterminds of Bill Clinton's nomination at Madison Square Garden 12 years ago, would be sticking to the Democratic script. A hardy band of Dems, like the Republicans in Boston, is here to stick some pins in the Bush balloon.

As the cohost of CNN's "Crossfire," Carville is no longer a party hack. But he raises money for the Democrats, gives high-level advice and is a certified insider.

So it was surprising to hear him declare at a Time Warner party last night that the Kerry-Edwards message is muddled. That there's no bark, no bite to what the candidates are saying. That the Democratic campaign is too timid when it comes to attacking the Bush-Cheney team. That too many people are in charge, so no one's in charge.

"They're a perpetual committee listening to a perpetual focus group, and it's got to change," he says.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/nation/columns/kurtzhoward/

--------------

Another henny penny chicken little hand-wringing armchair strategist heard from. I hope that the campaign pays some attention to this one.

[seabeyond]

1. rove goes after kerrys strength

this is a kerry weakness and that is cool. he got bogged down before in rpimary,. remember in he started cleaning and took over and did good.

[Warpy]

14. Right, last fall he dumped his DLC handlers,

hired Teddy Kennedy's guys, abandoned the circular firing squad, got on message, and took off in the polls.

Perhaps he needs to do another housecleaning. It seems a few DLC types have slithered back in.

[Borgnine]

2. Got a mailer from Carville the other day...

...with a photo of * and Cheney inserted, telling me to stare at it daily and get angry.

Not that I needed it, but it's working.

[Doosh]

3. Dems better listen to this guy

it's still a toss up race, but we can't let buch seize the advantage and play catch up. Get Carville more involved in the campaign!

[mazzarro]

4. I have the same feeling that K-E campaign is being too tentative in

its approach to issues. I have this profound fear of the DLC have an overbearing influence on how they respond to reThuglican attacks. This idea of wanting to please the moderates (or IMO fence-sitters) leaves me with a big VOID about their effectiveness in countering W*-Cheney lying claims and policy debacles. It is about time K-E take off the gloves, kick out the DLC DINOs and lay the damn thing on these reThuglican bastards.

[Octafish]

Thank you, James!

MUCH OBLIGED!

[Myrina]

5. Carville is a lame, whiny pansy-ass political amateur

... and needs to leave the party NOW !
How dare he naysay the candidate-who-walks-on-water !?!?!
What does he know, he's married to a Pug Whore !
Traitor !

<sarcasm off>

[mmonk]

6. Carville's complaint

is my complaint. If the Dems fail to heed him, we're in trouble.

[WI_DEM]

7. If this is what Carville truly said

I have to agree with him. Kerry does need a crisper message and he has to find an issue to pound away at Bush on which has legs. Iraq is the natural choice, but for whatever reason Kerry doesn't seem to believe he should--at least not yet. And I put my eggs in the basket for the opinions of this dem_strategist.

[chiburb]

8. And did Howie the Whore actually hear this?

Or did the gossip columnist hear it from someone else?

(No offense to sex workers intended.)

[AspenRose]

9. I agree with Carville

The man KNOWS what he's talking about. He speaks wisely.

[Piperay]

19. So do I

it has seemed to me for awhile that Kerry is not 'hitting the mark', something is not quite right and Car ville has really pinpointed it. I just hope it is not too late to do something.

[Kimber Scott]

10. Is he lying?

nt

[WiseMen]

11. Carville descibes exactly what has been happening. And it is tragic.

But, not necessarily fatal. Most campaigns have problems.

Again, progressive need to take up the challenge and topple
the Bush regime, regardless of the issues in the mainstream
campaign operation.

[Cheswick2.0]

12. DOESN'T CARVILLE UNDERSTAND -ROPE A DOPE-?

The nerve of him being a chicken little! I hear he secretly supported Howard Dean during the primaries!

[TwoHandedLayup]

23. I completely agree

Take the gloves off. Get as dirty as they are. Call them for what they are or you are going to lose this election.

[Booster]

36. I agree. There are so many issues that Kerry could

pound Bush with that just maybe he's overwhelmed, but he better start picking on one and get on with it. Bush's latest remark that the war or terror should be a good one to start with and then bring up the fact that Bush is apparently bored with looking for Osama. God, where to start.

[Crunchy Frog]

13. Oh, I just know that Carville

is either an embittered Deanie or an embittered Clarkie who's just trying to rain on our parade and demoralize us with all this "sky is falling" crap.

That's the only reason anyone could possibly have for saying anything critical about this campaign isn't it?

[ItsMyParty]

15. Same thing brought up by Joe Klein in Time (where he cited Carville)

Yes, we are attacking Bush on the usual: healthcare, jobs, economy (don't we always in an election??). But Klein points out that Kerry could kill Bush on Bush's total fuck up of the war in Iraq. He says to point to the goon government we installed in Fallujah (Saddam the II) or this little 'thing' we have going with Sadr, etc. The stupid idea of "flowers thrown at us" - flowers that killed 1,000 GI's. The mess at the prison because they dimwits "didn't think there was going to be that big an insurgency", etc. In other words, they were inept!! But Klein points out about these focus groups that his campaign staff is living and dying by and how they don't want to get nasty and fight. He then points out what Carville does that these focus groups are bullcrap on a stick---they aren't going to say the truth about "negative ads", etc. in public. We will know soon enough. They also need to get real nasty about Bush's center theme of "terror--look how I protect you". If Kerry doesn't come out swinging and I MEAN swinging next week, may I suggest you stop thinking there is some 'magic moment' he has in store for us?!!

[Placebo]

20. Damn good points!

:thumbsup:

[buycitgo]

24. ''these focus groups are bullcrap on a stick...

---they aren't going to say the truth about "negative ads", etc. in public.''..........A MEN!

not focus groups.....FUCK us groups

[lancdem]

16. Every other time Kerry needed to step it up this year he has

I believe history will repeat itself. Too much is riding on this.

[DemWitch]

17. Kerry need to pick up the phone and have a long talk with Carville...

And pay attention to what he says. Clinton NEVER would have been elected if it wasn't Carville and Begala. As progressives we have got to stop being so worried about not playing nice. Turn the other cheek, my as. Someone make a political sucker punch, kick 'em in the balls as payback, and smile while your doing it.

This doesn't mean you have to go all negative. You can get the ideas out there, but you can also play hardball when needed.

To quote the Divine Miss M at a HIV/AIDS fundraiser... "for crissakes, stop being a doormat and open your fuckin' mouths"

[Placebo]

18. He's ABSOLUTELY RIGHT.

The Kerry/Edwards campaign would be smart to listen to him, he's the man who put a democrat in office for 2 straight terms for the first time since roosevelt, he knows how to win elections!

[Jaybird]

21. damn straight james...

i hope kerry/edwards goes on the offensive and start attacking soon, and they better not stop until nov.2 or the democratic party will forever be the party of pussies in this country....we wont have a chance. i say fuck 'em and go for the jugular and don't let up

[Julien Sorel]

22. Something's wrong here.

I read the whole thing, and nowhere in it does Carville predict the sky is falling, he sounds reasoned rather than hysterical, and, most shocking of all, he has specific suggestions, not wild and impossible demands that someone "do something."

He isn't jumping up and down like a semi-articulate 10 year old demanding that something be done. Yet he's described as "Another henny penny chicken little hand-wringing armchair strategist."


Someone else in this thread mentioned Joe Klein as someone who agrees with Carville. Where in the world do you think Klein gets his information? He's a Carville echo chamber; it's just the same complaint from a different mouth. If Carville were to say everything's great, Klein would say the exact same thing tomorrow.

[Malva Zebrina]

25. I thuink that was tongue in cheek humor nt

[Julien Sorel]

33. No kidding!

wow.

[WiseMen]

26. The Critics on DU are, frankly, just more SENSITIVE in the war against *

[DemWitch]

27. This is WAR

there is no room for some candy ass, pinko commie, left wing whiney ass sensitivity...

<turning off Cheney channeling>

[okieinpain]

28. hmmmmm, does this make james a chicken-little.

[Jacobin]

29. He's right, of course.

Also, take a look at what Mark Shields said recently, a true liberal for whom I have a lot of respect:



On the eve of the Republican National Convention, one of the party's foremost leaders from the South was asked about George W. Bush's chances in November. He replied, in a moment of rare candor: "If this campaign is about Kerry, Bush will win the election. If this campaign is about Bush, he will win my state." That is, the GOP must make sure the focus is on Sen. John Kerry to avoid being reduced to the solid Republican South -- and a lost election.

snip

The assessment of what has been going on the last four weeks is much the same in both parties. By stressing his professions of military valor in Vietnam, Kerry opened the door to an examination of his questionable performance both during and after his four months of combat. His campaign was slow and then ineffective in its response, got off message, and finally switched from offense to defense.

Repeated Kerry blunders have benefited grateful Republicans. His statement that he would still vote for war in Iraq even with his current knowledge undercut a major emotional support base for him. Sending wheelchair-bound former Sen. Max Cleland to the Texas desert to be turned away at the gates of Bush's ranch was foolish. So was his predictably ineffective challenge for Bush to engage him in a weekly debate.

http://www.cnn.com/2004/ALLPOLITICS/08/30/antikerry/index.html

Mark Shields is a pro and is on our side. I wish the Kerry campaign would listen to him and to Carville.

[John_H]

30. Carville can't even spell political judo! His house is a chess-free zone!

[Gloria]

31. I just told a friend earlier today that I still don't know what the over-

arching theme of this campaign is. I see a sign on the door of HQ which says "Do Right By America" ....yawn.

More questioning of Bush will get air time and raise doubts about Bush...Kerry has to raise doubts about Bush. What if all that crap about the SB's hadn't come out? If they knew it was coming and they HAD the info on these guys, why didn't they destroy them right away? Instead, it dribbled out over 2+ weeks and took away the momentum of the Convention.

I heard a commentator say that Kerry has never looked into the camera and declared "I earned these medals!" and expressed genuine, powerful anger for himself and other vets. Instead we get the hokey "Bring it On" which is stupid, because they already HAVE brought it on! A flash of passion on this would have reminded people that Kerry could be a strong leader.
Instead, we get this fancy footwork crap.

I feel a lack of direction in this campaign. What are their two themes, not the laundry list? I hear about "leadership"--well, at least go after Bush's leadership. Really, they have to start hammering this guy. Hillary's phrase "bait and switch" is a direct counter to being accused of flip flopping. Start undermining Bush's integrity and motives with the theme of "bait and switch." Or use Bartcop's one paragraph "message" he posted last week: Basically, he enumerated a few things which Bush has screwed up on in the world, and finished of with--if you like this, then vote with your pocketbook. Blunt, no fancy language, forget the "above the fray" stuff.

We're in the fray, right now!

[Tomee450]

32. amen!

[coeur_de_lion]

34. Carville is right -- he usually is.

Kerry should pay more attention to him. I didn't start out as a Kerry supporter, though I am one now. I liked him during the primaries but not enough to support him. He was kinda boring. But to tell the truth I saw more toughness, more attacking his democratic opponents than I see today when his opponent is Bush. Why can't he come out and say it like it is? Show some of the spunk he showed during the primary (and then some)?

I'm telling you, he needs to hit it harder, come out swinging, stop playing it so safe. I can't understand why he doesn't do this. If things keep up like this we'll get another 4 years of Bush.

He can come across strong without sounding like a flaming liberal. And he had better start.

[TexasSissy]

35. I agree. I hope someone in Kerry campaign is listening to him. He's

a sharp strategist.

I believe in being "presidential" and calm and serious....but sooner or later Kerry/Edwards is going to have to go for the jugular. I want to hear him on TV speaking out, gosh darn it! Is he saving it for the close? Is money the problem?

Don't get me wrong....he has been doing pretty well in the polls most of the year. But he should've jumped off his chair and attacked the attack dogs when they went after his service record. Edwards should've jumped on the attack dogs, as well, instead of letting them get away w/that crap.

And that answer Kerry gave about his authorization for the IW, in view of the fact that we know the intelligence was faulty, that he'd authorize again....that was a mistake.

But enough of dissing our candidate. A few complaints are okay. I'm still behind him 100%, but I YEARN for a Democrat who isn't a wuss, while not being a raving lunatic and overly emotional. I'm still reeling from the weak Dem. syndrome of 2001 through 2003, until they finally started speaking out.

[NightOwwl]

37. I agree 100%. They need to get off their butts and fast.

The last straw was when the campaign failed to pick up the White House gift to them on a silver platter: Bush says The war is a catastrophic success." WTF? Does anyone think the perfect response is "The war is a catastrophic FAILURE!" It's a quick, concise sound bite that sharply criticizes Bush's handling of the war. And for god's sake, the definition of catastrophe is UTTER FAILURE! They couldn't think of one way to take advantage of this incredibly stupid Bushism?

No, let's have John Edwards say this instead. "He's half right. It was catastrophic to rush to war without a plan to win the peace." blah-bu-de-blah-blah-blah.

Disclaimer: I am not laying any of this on Kerry. It's his campaign staff I'm criticizing.

[napi21]

38. James is a great attack dog. Kerry is not. This ploy might work.

People get disgusted when campaigns turn mean and nasty. I heard Cheney for sure, and possibly shrub, were going to spend a lot of their campaign speech slamming Kerry. Is it possible that James is pointing out that the Pubs are so mean spirited and certainly not like Kerry who is trying to speak to the voters on serious subjects? If the voters get pi**ed, they will at the Pubs.