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Stuckinthebush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-31-04 10:23 AM
Original message
Rejoice! We shall prevail!
I found myself becoming bogged down in a pit of despair yesterday and this morning while perusing the Campaign 2004 forum. I discovered that I had become a nattering nabob of negativity - so much that my wife told me to go to bed because I was scaring the children. I faintly remember hearing my five year old scream in the middle of the night, "Bush is coming! I can't afford this much debt!"

I knew that my attitude needed a quick adjustment.

Instead of focusing on the RNC, CNN's lack of Democratic response, swift boat veterans, or fluctuating poll numbers, I would focus on the positives. Please add to my list:

1. The best, most accurate pollster out there - John Zogby - still has Kerry ahead overall and in the swing state race. This indicates that the SBV thing had little effect.

2. I still maintain that very few to no 2000 Gore voters will be changing their vote to Bush this time. Conversely, many 2000 Bush voters will either vote for Kerry or not vote this time. We have much anecdotal evidence to back this up. Add to this the wide margin we have in the young voter demographic and you see a Kerry win.

3. SBV has had and will have some serious blow back. It was red meat for the Bush supporters, but will have the effect of turning off some swing voters. I maintain that the number of swing voters turned off will be greater than the number swayed by this tripe.

4. CNN today is hitting hard on the stupid band-aid stunt by RNC delegates. The media is sensing a negative story here and will not let go for a day or so. That only helps us.

5. The protests will help us. Sure, if they get ugly and violent, then it could be bad. The trend so far is that the 10s of thousands of protesters are peaceful.

6. Pentagon spy.

7. General election kick off in a few days with Kerry hitting Bush hard right after W's speech. Watch Kerry rock and roll.

8. Job numbers are still bleak

9. Iraq is becoming a quagmire within a quagmire.

10. Severe weather is threatening the east coast - let us all pray/hope that damage is minimal. This will mean that the spotlight will transfer to this danger and away from the RNC as it rightfully should. Good from a political standpoint, but nothing to cheer about. I hope everyone on the east coast is watching Frances because it looks big. Stay safe.

11. To me the biggest indicator: On my street alone there are six Kerry signs and not a single Bush sign. Folks, I live in Alabama for goodness sakes! I have seen few W stickers and many Kerry stickers. If Bush's base is depressed in Alabama, just think what it is like in more reasonable locales!


Keep your chin up, we still have a long way to go and the fun hasn't even begun yet!

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seabeyond Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-31-04 10:26 AM
Response to Original message
1. hearing my five year old scream ....Bush is coming!
this just busted me up. i too have little ones

just wanted to say, now i will continue to read
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July Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-31-04 10:26 AM
Response to Original message
2. Good pep talk! I needed that!
And everything you say makes sense.

I still need more boosting concerning the actual election, though. I don't see how we can be sure our votes will be counted fairly.
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goodhue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-31-04 10:28 AM
Response to Original message
3. yes indeed
hope is the way
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Fed Up Donating Member (443 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-31-04 10:34 AM
Response to Original message
4. If I was military I'd be livid they are mocking purple hearts
They are saying in effect a purple heart is no big thing and that if you won one, so what? Not only that, they get to wear the insignia without fighting in a war. Oh man I hope this blows up in their faces.

Glad I'm not watching this shit. I'll be glad when Friday comes. And it will.
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Stuckinthebush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-31-04 10:37 AM
Response to Reply #4
6. Amen, Mike
They just laugh and think it is so clever. Swing voters won't.
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rocktivity Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-31-04 10:37 AM
Response to Original message
5. A-CHENEY-ING-MEN!!
Edited on Tue Aug-31-04 11:04 AM by rocknation
And another example of great minds thinking alike--I posted this last night:

"...now that the Smear-Boaters (have been) exposed as a pack of liars, the public are not going to take anything else (Bush) says at face value even with the mainstream media's help...

Bush has unwittingly painted himself into a corner by not condeming the smear-boaters while stating he believes that Kerry served honorably--he can't have it both ways. And his recent remarks about catastrophic success and the war on terror not being winnable suggest that might be desparate enough to bring the troops home for his Ocotober surprise

Bush's blind spot is that he is NOT a superior alternative to Kerry, and all Kerry now has to do in retalliation is point that out. Starting next week, I am confident that he will."


:headbang:
rocknation
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Stuckinthebush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-31-04 10:42 AM
Response to Reply #5
9. LOL
:D

I had to reread your title a few times until I got it.

I like it!
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calico1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-31-04 10:39 AM
Response to Original message
7. You are absolutely right.
I am amazed at the number of people I see here ready to throw in the towel with 2 more months to go.
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Stuckinthebush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-31-04 10:41 AM
Response to Reply #7
8. Yep...
I say we go to our corner, spit in the bucket, get that grease stick stuff over our right eye, shake off the sweat and come out swinging!

(I like the boxing metaphors!) :D

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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-31-04 10:42 AM
Response to Original message
10. Well Said! Bravo!
Chin up people! We're in good shape! Zogby just released a poll w/ Kerry ahead in VIRGINIA!!!
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Stuckinthebush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-31-04 10:43 AM
Response to Reply #10
11. Aren't the band-aid morons from VA?
I bet they'll love to see that poll, huh?!

Good news!

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bigtree Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-31-04 10:44 AM
Response to Original message
12. Good points!
On the money.
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Tarheel_Dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-31-04 10:50 AM
Response to Original message
13. thank you S.I.T.B.....
Edited on Tue Aug-31-04 10:51 AM by Tarheel_Dem
i swear, for the last few days, i've wondered where all the negativity has come from. seems to be the same posters, starting thread after thread of alarmist b.s. did anyone really expect this would be a cakewalk? thanks for injecting some rationale at long last. :yourock:
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Stuckinthebush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-31-04 11:00 AM
Response to Reply #13
14. From now on, if I see the negativity...
I'm going to point and scream NABOB, NABOB!

Be careful in NC. It looks like Frances may head up the coast toward you guys.
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Tarheel_Dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-31-04 11:12 AM
Response to Reply #14
15. thanks......but i'm too far inland.........
but the coastal areas are certainly battening down the hatches.

NABOB! NABOB!
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Stuckinthebush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-31-04 11:21 AM
Response to Original message
16. I need to add another positive point
12. From Trof's thread here: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x701040#701576

The Florida panhandle chair believes that Kerry has a shot at taking Escambia County. That is huge! Escambia County is the North-western most county in Florida - mostly an Alabama annex. It is so Republican, that you turn red when you cross into it. If Kerry has a good shot here, Florida is finished for Bush!

Thanks, Trof.
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gatorboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-31-04 11:27 AM
Response to Original message
17. Thanks for the great thread!
I was getting tired of the doom and gloom trend in here today.
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UrbScotty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-31-04 11:45 AM
Response to Original message
18. Thank you for keeping my hopes up!
:thumbsup:
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Nicholas_J Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-31-04 11:52 AM
Response to Original message
19. As long as Kerry soon starts pointing out
That Bush is now running his entire campaign on the fallacy that he and Cheney in particualr have been repeating in spite of all evidence to the contrary. That fighting the war in Iraq is fighting terrorism. They are still trying to assert the link between AL Qeada and Saddm that everyon and all intelligence indicated never existed.

In fact, I certainly hope that the Kerry campaign points out that when Osama bin Laden issued the tape to the Iraqi people just prioir to the invasion, calling for resistance to the AMerican invader fist as being the prime duty of Iraqi Muslims, he followed this up with the assertion that Iraqi Muslims, once the U.S. Infidel was repulsed, must immediately kill Saddam Hussein and replace his non0Islamic, secular Government with an Islamic State. Harly sounds like Osama was prepared to work with Saddam.

Next, it is certainly necessary to point out all of the reasons attacing Saddam may have been eventually necesary, in order to deal with his brutal government, Saddam should have waited while we dealt with the primary threat to our national security, Al Qaeda, and in particular, its leadership. Just as the attacks of September 11th had a deep psychological effect on the U.S., the capture and removal of Bin Laden and Al-Zawahiri would have a deep psychological effect on terrorists, particualrly Al Qaeda.

If Bin Laden is the heart and soul of Al-Qaeda, its spiritual pole star, then Zawahiri is certainly the mind of the organization. To lop these two heads off the beast of terrorism would be a profound and crippling blow against Al Qaeda.

IN fact, if we compare Saddam Hussein to Al Qaeda's leadership, we can easily see that Al Qaeda was clearly the imminent danger, while all evendence indicates that Saddam was well boxed in, a great deal of bark, but no bite whatsoever.

The history of Saddam is a history of failure. With suprtior military force, he fought a war against Iran, trying to take its oil fields, and failed. This fight was a draw which yielded not one advantage to Saddam. His attack on Kuwait was put down in six weeks by the will of the united world under the banner of the United Nations, led by the U.S. His attempt to assasinate a U.S. President was uncovered so soon that it barely went beyong the planning stage, and he was caught very easily, which makes one suspect that this was more the bluff and bluster of a bully trying to intimidate by threatening actions he had no ability to actually perform. Saddams attempt to build a reacto to process nuclear grade fissile materials barely got off the ground before it was blown to bits by the Israelis.

The bad intelligence, from equally bad sources, that he was developing other weapons of mass destruction have been priven to be lies that were known lies at the time. The fact that no WMD's were found in Iraq indicate one thing very clearly. That the methoods being used to contain Saddam were very effective in keeping him from being a threat to the U.S. Not only did he not have WMD's, he was totally unable to develop them given the co-operation between the U.S. Britain, and the U.N. Not only did he not have WMD's, all evdence indicates that the infrastructure of Iraq was so falling to pieces that Iraqi industry was completely unable to even start developing WMD's of any kind on a massive scale.

So what we have in Saddam is a tyrant who cold brutalize his own people, but who constituted not one iota ot threat to the U.S.

No on the othe hand, Al Qaeda was quite sucessful at its atempts to attack the U.S. or U.S. Interests overseas.

Al Qaeda Actions:

World Trade Center in 1993

Attacks in November 1995 in which 5 Americans are killed in A car boming in Riyadh.

June 1996, Khobar Towers, 19 dead

1998, co-ordinated bombinga at 2 U.S. Embassies, several hundred killed

October of 2000, the bombing of the U.S.S. Cole, 17 dead.

November of 2000, Al Qaeda linked terroists kill a British citizen in Riyadh because they mistake him for an American.

September 11th 2001. World Trade CEnter, Pentagon hit over 3000 dead.

October 2002, French Oil Tanker bombed in Yemen. One dead.

December 2002. Abdul Razzak Kamel Al Qaeda terrorist, ruhes into a
Baptist missionary hospital and slaughterd three U.S. aid workers.

Lets not forget the night club bombing in Bali.

The kidnapping and murder of Daniel Pearl .

There have been bombing and other killings througout Afghanistan and Pakistan that have been related to both the Taliban and Al Qaeda that are simply too numberous to count.

Given the numerous faiulures of the Bush Administration to capture Osama Bin Laden, or Ayman Al Zawahiri, or Mullah Omar, and the numerous occasions in which it woul have been easy to capture them, but where the orders were to wait and negotiate the surender of Mullah Omars troops (while the Mullar slipped away, once on a motorcycle, another time dressed as a woman in a burka, one must question the actual degree of effort made by the Bush Administration to capture the leaders behind the events of 9/11 and all the terrorist activities before and after. When one considers that had these people been captured, and brought to trial, Bush would have little left to run on, as the terror, would be greatly diminished.

In fact when looks at Saddam Hussein, and Osama bin Laden adn his close supporters several facts jump out at you.

1. Saddam has had a pattern of failure after failure, He has been stopped from accomplishing his goals regarding gaining control of the oil fields of his neighbors. He has failed in his plan to assasinate GEorge H.W. Bush. He was unable to obtain or deveop WMDs.

The one word that describes Saddam Hussein is FAILURE.

Looking at Osama and Al Qaeda, another word somes to mind, and is is not failure, but success. They have succeed at virtually every attack theyhave planned, They have sucessfully attacked U.S. interests and killed Americans both inside the United States and outside of it.

There is no evidence of a link between Saddam and Al Qaeda, in fact, there is a lot of evidence to indicate that Al Qaeda wanted saddam dead, and his regime gone and replaced.

Yet, the current administration has spend a fifth of a trillion dollars to overthrow a nation that posed no direct threat to the U.S., in order to capture a rather nasty leader who posed no threat to the U.S. or the rest of the world, who was being well contained by the U.N. under the same terms that they fought and ended the Gulf War.

Osama, and Al Qaeda, have been left free to plan their next attack on U.S. soil, and this is an advantage to George Bush. While they are free, Bush and the Republicans can milk the terror card for all its worth. Devoting many billions to keep and control Iraq, and devoting much much less to capture those who make terror real.

Into one of the most difficult terrains in the world, the Bush Administration only sent a few hundred troops to try to prevent Osama Bin Laden from escaping from Afghanistan. SUch a small searhc insured that Osam would easily escape.

Had the resources spent on Iraq, and capturing Saddam been spent to go into Afghanistan and hunt down the Al Qaeda leadership, we could easily state that there had been real successes in the war on terror. Such a blow would allow the U.S. to say that it was well on the way to "WINNING" the way on terrorism.

THe priorities of the BUsh Administration are so twisted that they have not only not waged the war on terrorism, they have virtually ignored it. Creating terrorism where it did not exist.

They are still trying to assert that fighting Saddam is fighting the war on terror, a war which in fact, the Bush Administration has not only failed to engage in to the degree necessary, but have in fact, avoided.

A few months after the Taliban had been overthrown in Iraq a video of Osama, and the lieutenants who helped plan the events of 9/11 was found. Osama and his compainions were laughing gleefully at their success.

They are laughing still. While the American voters is being diverted from their real danger, many believe that this president is keeping them safe from terrorism. A dangerous belief.
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wiggs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-31-04 12:20 PM
Response to Original message
20. More
It is sometimes hard with this administration to separate negative from positive. But more reasons to think that Bush's days are numbered include:

AWOL (can't believe that someone isn't talking more about this...not smear)

Abu Ghraib (justice dept memos, second batch of abuse photos, involvement of military intelligence)

Edmonds (where did she go after coming out with some serious stuff regarding money trails and other countries)

Plame (from reading posts here seems to be very much alive and serious)

Congress has to be pissed about the way they've been treated (Medicare, WMD, 700 million diverted, near contempt of congress regarding justice dept memos)

Demonstrable lies and deception

Chalabi support and Iran secrets

Energy task force and enron

Halliburton

History of smearing. People will tire of lies and nastiness the more they see that this is a pattern (P O'Neill, Clarke, Cleland, McCain, Wilson, Kerry)

Debates.

Sorry to keep posting these past, unresolved issues but we have to keep them somewhat alive....sooner or later they'll come back into play. I mean, good God, Suskind's O'Neill book was devastatingly scathing in my opinion, but it seems like it came out years ago and is getting no mention anymore. John Dean's book even more so!!

You are right....lots and lots of legitimate ammo out there. Where are the guns?
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quinnox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-31-04 01:02 PM
Response to Original message
21. kick!
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Mad_Dem_X Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-31-04 01:05 PM
Response to Original message
22. Thanks for the dose of positivity
I would like to add to your list: The Debates! I'm convinced that once Kerry and W go head-to-head on the issues, Kerry is going to kick serious ass.
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KelleyKramer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-31-04 01:28 PM
Response to Original message
23. #2 gives me the greatest hope ..

Great post!

Was out with a group of folks last Sat night and asked that question.. Do you know of anyone who voted for Gore and is going to vote for Bush?

Of course it was a resounding NO, but there are tons of people who voted for Bush and this time will either not vote at all or vote for Kerry.


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Stuckinthebush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-31-04 03:04 PM
Response to Reply #23
24. Agreed
There is so much anecdotal evidence out there that suggests we have a net gain in votes from 2000 and they have a net loss.

We will see....
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