Interesting. Most of our "Liberal" Media is saying this weekend that Kerry

[KoKo]

let Bush define him. And many are saying that "wind surfing," "boarding" and the rest of this stuff is coming off lame for the average voter who has questions about Bush.

I think some of us were saying this back some months ago and being trashed for sayin that a "biker, snow boarder, kitesurfing/windsurfing, etc...Macho, Macho Man wasn't a way to deal with the "Texas Two Stepping Cheerleader/Skull & Bones Man/Fratboy from Yale...

It was the wrong "Marketing" presentation by our DNC/DLC...IMHO...who the hell told Kerry he should try to "athletically/militarily" go after the "Chimp-in-Thief's" record?

Chimp's record is "sealed." It only allowed them to "Gore" Kerry...

Was it arrogance? or "Moles" in the DLC/DNC Kerry Campaign? The same folks who led Gore down the path of a "close election which turned into fraud?"

What kind of folks manage or Dem Candidates Campaigns? And who decides who they are? There's definitely a "mole or two" in there.

Anyone checked to see what "Stephanopolis" has been doing for the last few years? hmmmm.

[2Design]

you need to join Jchild thread

[Frodo]

1. One of their 527s did just run an add filled with those images. n/t

[Feanorcurufinwe]

2. Kerry does in fact like to snowboard etc., that's actually who Kerry is.

If people prefer a President who spends pretending to do things to earn votes, they'll vote for Bush -- I think he's got that demographic locked up.

I believe in honesty.

[Mayberry Machiavelli]

5. I agree wholeheartedly with this. Why the hell should JK pretend to

be other than he is, despite the fact that Bush has spent his whole political career doing this?

[Malva Zebrina]

3. Not to be negative or disparaging of our candidate

but I would like to point out that Kerry was also a member of Skull and Bones. :shrug:

[Name removed]

6. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Julien Sorel]

11. What does that mean?

Sorry if I'm missing the point.

[Malva Zebrina]

14. the point is

that it was mentioned in the intro:

Macho, Macho Man wasn't a way to deal with the "Texas Two Stepping Cheerleader/Skull & Bones Man/Fratboy from Yale...

lt can hardly be a negative against Bush, when Kerry was also a member of Skull and Bones, Get it?

That is all. I was trying to alert people to that fact because it can only be thrown back in the face of the Kerry Supporters.

[Old and In the Way]

19. So who is making an issue out of Skull and Bones?

You and Koko01. Actually, you are implying that Bush = Kerry because both were in S&B. Character assassination by association....nice.

[Malva Zebrina]

27. No I am not making an issue out of it

the lead in did and I thought it was not a good move, since any detractor could bring up that fact.

Am I not to mention that or bring it up as an alert?

[Malva Zebrina]

28. No I am not "implying" anything, It is a fact, plainly and simply a fact

we cannot bring it up as a negative against Bush, when Kerry was also a member of Skull and Bones. That is my point.

[Julien Sorel]

24. OK, makes sense now.

I had missed the Skull&Bones reference in the original. Probably skipped over it out of habit from the bad old days.

[Catch22Dem]

4. That's the shit Kerry likes to do?

We're gonna begrudge him that because it's not "manly" enough for you? Armchair quarterbacking has become a god damn art on DU.

[Old and In the Way]

7. What's your point?

Other than you don't like Kerry or Democrats?

[Julien Sorel]

10. I'm happy to see I'm not the only one who's noticing.

This kind of stuff is destructive, and brilliancies like this,

What kind of folks manage or Dem Candidates Campaigns? And who decides who they are? There's definitely a "mole or two" in there.

Make this place look like a nuthouse. But this thread will stretch on and on and on, and it isn't the first, nor will it be the last, started by this individual like it.

[Old and In the Way]

17. She hasn't gotten over Dean's loss yet.

[AP]

13. KoKo01 also loathed Edwards with a passion during the primaries.

I'm happy to see that that antipathy wasn't discerning and happens to encompass a great deal of territory to the left of center.

[KoKo]

18. Senator Edwards is KoKo01's Senator......and I used to be a conservative

Democrat...now I'm a "Progressive." Trashing the Messenger? Not the Message?

Did any of you see the Frank Rich Editorial and others here in LBN/Editorials Forum? Do you even read what our "Liberal Writers" are saying out there?

The "criticism" is that Kerry is fighting back against Bush trying to look like he's "more in command, a 'real' athlete, a macho man."

Kerry was always better than this "pandering." Gore's "handlers wouldn't let Gore be Gore...Kerry's handlers are not playing up Kerry's "intellectual strengths" but allowing "Media" to play it all to be a competetive sports thingy against Bush.

It's "Moles" I tell you.....and you guys want to trash ME as a FREEP...
Sheesh...it's disgusting being trashed for being too "Liberal" for DU...:puke:

[Old and In the Way]

21. hahahaha

You crack me up. Sounds like you did a Reverse Zell Miller!

Your message is confused, it's really hard to figure out what to respond to.

[AP]

40. I was thinking the same thing.

Confused. It's more like criticism for the sake of criticism rather than a reasoned critical analysis.

[Julien Sorel]

26. Complete nonsense.

The "criticism" is that Kerry is fighting back against Bush trying to look like he's "more in command, a 'real' athlete, a macho man."

Kerry had prostate surgery, remember that? He has to demonstrate he's physically robust. It has nothing to do with trying to "out macho Bush" and everything to do with projecting an image of Kerry that is virile and healthy. Any campaign that didn't pre-empt this issue would be truly as badly run as you, and all the rest of the Kerry bashers, whine that this one is.

"Moles." Christ, what a fucking nuthouse.

[Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin]

8. I think when somebody 60 years old can do those things it's impressive.

At least he doesn't fall off his boards. Bush can't even ride a freaking mountain bike right.

I'm an avid Mountain Biker. I got a course I'd like to see chimpy try.

[Cronus Protagonist]

15. Well, here in CA, he looks damn good

And he probably looks good in any place where there's a large outdoor contingent like here in LA. We see lots of people doing all these activities and we don't think it looks at all goofy, and in fact, I think it shows someone who can balance his life and keep fit and active at 60+ - shows me there's a man who is smart AND fit AND has a balanced life. Someone I'd like to emulate, in fact.

Lick Laura's Bush - Drop Bush Not Bombs! - FUCK BUSH
http://brainbuttons.com/home.asp?stashid=13

[Bullshot]

9. Bush was on vacation for 40% of his first term in office.

Shouldn't that raise some flags in voters' minds.

It seems like when Kerry takes time off to engage in his hobbies of skiing, windsurfing and skeet shooting, the media use it against him. Like, he's goofing off when he should be working.

What hobbies does Bush have? Clearing brush? Riding horses on the ranch? Reading? What hobbies does this man have?

Inquiring minds would like to know.

[olddem43]

16. He doesn't ride horses. Reports are that he is afraid of horses.

[The_Casual_Observer]

12. The campaign is just getting started

Nobody has defined Kerry. Kerry is going to do some defining now. chimp has lots of baggage to carry across the finish line, and it looks like in Iraq and the economy he will be carrying more very soon. Forget this stuff and join the fight.

[KoKo]

20. Ummmm..."the campaign is just getting started?"

"detaching gas mask" might be a good idea. :shrug:

[The_Casual_Observer]

29. 'fraid so

Looks like Clinton's guys have just entered the fray. It may be a whole new deal now.

[Nordic]

39. I agree. Look what happened to Kerry in the primaries

everybody (including me) wrote him off completely.

Now he's the candidate.

Kerry is going to be the next president of the United States.

[Cronus Protagonist]

22. You're happy because the right-wing media agree with you?

Why? Don't you know their positions are made specifically to attack and defeat Kerry? And why are you agreeing with them and undermining Kerry?

Who's side are you on? If I ever find something the right wing media says is something I agreed with, I would have to rethink my position because, for me, it would be proof that there's something I don't know about going on and I'm about to shoot myself in the foot, much like you're doing right now.

Lick Laura's Bush - Drop Bush Not Bombs! - FUCK BUSH
http://brainbuttons.com/home.asp?stashid=13

[seabeyond]

23. THEY did the same with gore......they are playing

they dont get to define kerry which is exactly what they are trying to do with this. i havent heard a single person have issue with kerry's sport. all fabrication to bring another dump on kerry and see if we can feed this one too

i am saying they are going to do this time and again, to see if they can see something snowball

[KoKo]

25. Kerry is "Definitely THE Macho Man." But are voters looking for Macho?

Are voters looking to see which of these guys has the biggest "War Dick?"

Are they? :shrug:

[Feanorcurufinwe]

30. Are you saying Kerry should pretend to be a wimp?

Why pretend to be something he's not?

[KoKo]

31. Here's what Liberal Frank Rich/NYT's said...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=103x71598

But Mr. Kerry, having joined the macho game with Mr. Bush on the president's own cheesy terms, is hardly innocent in his own diminishment. From the get-go he's tried to match his opponent in stupid male tricks. If Mr. Bush clears brush in Crawford, then Mr. Kerry rides a Harley-Davidson onto Jay Leno's set. When the Democrat asks "Who among us does not love Nascar?" and lets reporters follow him around on a "day off" when his errands include buying a jock strap, he is asking to be ridiculed as an "International Man of Mystery." In the new issue of GQ, you can witness him having a beer (alcoholic) with a reporter as he confesses to a modicum of lust for Charlize Theron and Catherine Zeta-Jones. Presumably the only reason he excluded the demographically desirable Halle Berry is that her Catwoman outfit too closely resembles his own costume for windsurfing.

The flaw in Mr. Kerry is not, as Washington wisdom has it, that he asked for trouble from the Swifties by bringing up Vietnam in the first place. Both his Vietnam service and Vietnam itself are entirely relevant to a campaign set against an unpopular and ineptly executed war in Iraq that was spawned by the executive branch in similarly cloudy circumstances. But having brought Vietnam up against the backdrop of our 2004 war, Mr. Kerry has nothing to say about it except that his service proves he's more manly than Mr. Bush. Well, nearly anyone is more manly than a president who didn't have the guts to visit with the 9/11 commission unaccompanied by a chaperone.

It's Mr. Kerry's behavior now, not what he did 35 years ago, that has prevented his manliness from trumping the president's. Posing against a macho landscape like the Grand Canyon, he says that he would have given Mr. Bush the authority to go to war in Iraq even if he knew then what we know now. The setting may be the Old West, but the words do sound as if they've been translated from the French. His attempt to do nuance, as Mr. Bush would put it, makes him sound as if he buys the message the Republicans hammered in last week: the road from 9/11 led inevitably into Iraq.

The truth is that Mr. Kerry was a man's man not just when he volunteered to fight in a losing war but when he came home and forthrightly fought against it, on grounds that history has upheld. Unless he's man enough to stand up for that past, he's doomed to keep competing with Mr. Bush to see who can best play an action figure on TV. Mr. Kerry doesn't seem to understand that it takes a certain kind of talent to play dress-up and deliver lines like "Bring it on." In that race, it's not necessarily the best man but the best actor who will win.

[Feanorcurufinwe]

35. I'm talking to you, not Frank Rich. Do you think he should pretend

to be something he's not?

[JI7]

32. another one from a supporter of a loser candidate using right wing talking

points to back them up.

[John_H]

33. The windsurfing has to go.

[Feanorcurufinwe]

36. So Kerry should fake it, and pretend he's into something else?

[JI7]

34. along with the right wing whore media, you also push also

[Radical Activist]

37. The media is the enemy

Remember when Dem_Strategist wrote that? Bush hasn't defined Kerry that way, the corporate media has. Turn off the corporations and support the independent media.

[bvar22]

38. Actually, it was a good idea.

They just fucked up in the presentation.

First shot:
bush* falling off the Segway followed by a shot of Kerry ripping a turn on the snowboard.

fade to:
bush* falling off his bicycle with a quick shot of his bruised and skinned face,
followed by a shot of Kerry laid out against the wind on the surf board.

fade to:
bush* dropping his dog on the tarmac followed by a shot of Kerry with the 12gauge shouldered up and popping a skeet.

fade to:
closing writing scrolling across the screen:" Who do you really want running this country?"


NOW! That would have changed some undecided minds, AND caused more than a few repubs to start whining!

[Zen Democrat]

41. The wind-surfing is a non-issue. If JK likes to wind-surf, WTF???

Junior can't even ride a bicycle, for God's sake.

[funky_bug]

42. Four words

Lockhart, Begala, Carville...relax ;)

Any mistakes were made early and the learning curve is no longer our concern. Make some popcorn and sit back... the fun is just beginning.