Dean is furious at GOP for "Daschle Retirement Party"! His email to us.

[madfloridian]

My view: I have been critical of Daschle often in the past, but right now I will forget that and send a little his way. How dare the GOP have a retirement party for him at their convention!

Here is Dean's email:
http://www.blogforamerica.com/archives/005088.html

"Last Thursday at their hate-filled convention, Washington Republicans held a so-called "Daschle Retirement Party" where corporate elites wrote checks to take down our party's leader in the Senate, Tom Daschle."

SNIP..."The invitation went out from George Allen, the right-wing Senator who once told Republicans at a state convention that their job was not just to beat Democrats but to "kick their soft teeth down their whiny throats". They're taking that money and putting their hate on the air in South Dakota. This week they launched a $2.4 million smear campaign -- that's more than $9.00 for every voter in the last election there..."

SNIP..."I am tired of crackpots with corporate backers polluting the airwaves. Ads like these make people with real problems tune out from politics. People quickly believe that our political process cannot produce serious solutions to our common problems. And if we let people like George Allen and the Club for Growth win, those people will be right...."

https://www.tomdaschle.com/contribute/contribute.php

Even if you don't like Howard Dean, and even if you have qualms about Daschle, this is just plain ugly tricks and power plays. I am sending some his way.

[Jacobin]

1. Helluva lot stronger support of Daschle by Dean

than Dean ever got from Daschle.

Dean is my hero.

[madfloridian]

2. And I don't see others coming out in support of Daschle.

While I don't like some of the Daschle things, I do feel this is just rotten. If we can donate enough one place to make a difference, it would help.

[Mojambo]

4. Just when I think I couldn't admire Dean more...

If he is not given the reigns to the DNC after this election, I really hope he goes about starting a new Democratic Party.

I'll be first in line behind him.

[LuminousX]

5. and I'll be standing right behind you

[jrieth50]

24. I'm in...

It seems to me that any right-minded democrat knows that Dean is the future of the party. So if that involves upheaval of the democratic status quo than so be it. Maybe Daschle will be a powerful figure to give more credit to Dean's mission if he gets the help he needs.

[mandyky]

27. My thoughts exactly

Personally I think Daschle is the head of the pink tutu gang, but we cannot afford to lose anyone in the Senate - esp. the majority or minority leader. Dean is a gem and if the Dems don't wake up, I hope Dean will head up a populist progressive party!

[Julien Sorel]

9. This is a good thread with a good purpose.

So I hate to do this, but the simple fact is Dean ran his campaign against Daschle as much as he did against his primary opponents. Against whom do you think the good Dr. was railing with his constant rants against "Washington insiders," and the people responsible for 2002, and Democrats who needed to "get a backbone?" Under those circumstances, just how much support would you expect Daschle to give to Dean?

Daschle is a smart politician who has been doing what it takes to keep this party in the ballgame through some extremely trying times. The Republicans wouldn't be targeting him if he was their "spineless" lapdog, and it was unfortunate that Dr. Dean did so for political purposes during the primaries, as it made people who did things for survival purposes look weak, and caused divisions in the party that are still there. But that's another topic for another day.

Whatever problems I have with Dean, I am tremendously happy to see him out there fighting to keep Daschle where he belongs, and where we need him: in the senate. He's doing some good work here, and I hope to see him keep it up.

[Tactical Progressive]

12. That Repubs hate Dashle should tell you

1) he isn't on their side
2) he isn't ineffective

Clinton always liked Tom Dashle too, which is a third clue.

[Jacobin]

13. If Dean hadn't made it "ok" to criticize the Emporer

The Dems would still be worshiping him.

Dean changed the tide. Daschle IS a wimp and asks for his butt kickings. He's a mealy mouthed prick. He has a "kick me" sign on his back as he whimpers around.

I have no sympathy for him but admire Dean for trying to give him a back bone and trying to support him, despite his inherent lack of cajones.

[Julien Sorel]

15. Pure nonsense.

The Democrats correctly rolled with the punches in 2002 when Bush was riding a wave of 60-70% approval ratings. Under those circumstances, "criticizing the emperor" was politically foolish, and the people who did so got spanked hard during the elections that year.

Beyond that, there's not much to say in the face of things like,

Daschle IS a wimp and asks for his butt kickings. He's a mealy mouthed prick. He has a "kick me" sign on his back as he whimpers around.

except that it's kind of scary.

[Malva Zebrina]

19. It was so politically foolish that one thousand of our children are dead

and a slaughter of ten to twenty thousand innocent people took place.

I am sick of politics over people. I am sick that the "electable" person is one who voted for it and the ones who did not, the ones who had some sense of integrity and less sense of politics, are now the ones who did not know what they were doing, and did not have as much wisdom as those who did--ie those who are in the race now because it was an "electable" position.

I still don't know what Kerry's plan for Iraq is and his campaign is saying they are not telling. How can anyone know who to support--we can only know who not to support and are expected or forced to vote for Kerry and we do not know what his plans are for Iraq and they aren't telling. That is a real smart way to vote eh?

I am sick of hearing the slogan that our troops are fighting for "freedom" and the war on "terror" a noun and an impossible concept.

"oday marks a tragic milestone in the war in Iraq; more than 1,000 of America’s sons and daughters have now given their lives on behalf of their country, on behalf of freedom, the war on terror,” John Kerry

Excuse me? Honor the dead, yes. They should never have gone there in the first place and it is a tragedy that they died for nothing.

but some of us see Iraqi innocent people dead who did NOT ask to be freed by lying in their graves. Excuse me? It is the ones now who were bombed, the ones who we supposedly "freed" and liberated,

that have risen up to indeed, fight to the death for their freedom

and not the ones who are killing them and their families that are fighting for freedom.

The Iraqi resistance are the only ones fighting for freedom.


WE are the government, not those we pay to look after our life, liberty and pursuit of happiness.

Politicans are not our bosses==WE are their employer.

What is left at this point is to pump up more of our young with the glamour of fighting for freedom and the war on a noun. It is time to diminish the glamour of war.



Dean is right--people get turned off by duplicity on both sides

[Julien Sorel]

20. And this belongs here why?

[Malva Zebrina]

21. probably not--you are right--went off topic

have it deleted.

[jrieth50]

28. Belongs here because...

The topic moved in the direction from Dean's party loyalty to Dean being seen as a jerk for attacking poor defenseless Tom Daschle who proudly marched the democratic party into complacency after the 2000 election.

Complacency that is the #1 reason why we are being beat by the opposition right now. Complaceny that is also the reason why John Kerry is unable to define his position on the Iraq war. Because he didn't do what he believed to begin with, he now is finding it rather difficult to wake up and suddenly say his heart tells him this thing is wrong.

Dean stood up and didn't play with polls and tricks to get on the good side of the status quo, he gave the democratic party a wake up call. And lo and behold, people started turning up out of the woodwork in support. Even John Kerry heard that wake up call.

[Julien Sorel]

31. What "complacency" are you talking about?

It's more nonsense. The Democrats staged a tactical retreat in the face of overwhelming support and approval for Bush in the aftermath of 9/11 and the illusory "success" of the Afghan campaign. That's doing something, which is the opposite of "complacency." You can sit and say it was cowardly, and I'll point out two senate seats we kept, and a couple of House seats that were lost, by people who followed that strategy on the one hand, and ignored it on the other.

To not do anything in the face of a changing political landscape would certainly be complacent. Daschle did something. That you don't like what he did speaks more about your level of knowledge than it does about Daschle's, or Kerry's, "complacency."

[jrieth50]

34. He's a leader right?

If he's such a great leader than he could have *led* the democrats in a campaign to educate the public on why the IWR was wrong among other things.

Without his "leadership" in the senate I would say that is the reason why those seats were lost. He allowed those democrats that stood up against Bush to be defeated by not offering party support based on the principles we are supposed to hold dear.

[Julien Sorel]

38. Educate how?

The Iraqi war has been a bust, and polls say people only now, two years and thousands of lives later, are saying it was a mistake. But Tom Daschle, Senate Majority leader, was somehow responsible for failing to convince a public that worshipped George Bush that George Bush was wrong? That would have made Tom Daschle just about the most powerful and persuasive politician in history. It's simply naive.

And sorry, if the whole party had adopted the in-your-face approach you seem to believe Dean would have adopted, we'd have lost two more senate seats and God knows how many more house seats, while being labeled the soft on terror party. I think I'll pass.

[jrieth50]

52. With all due respect...

No one ever tried to convince the public that the war was wrong. And it very likely is taking so long for people to figure it out because even the people who are now opposed to the war were for it. Which to them looks like political posturing in an election year.

Sadly. It is.

[Julien Sorel]

58. Howard Dean spent most of his

primary trying to convince people that the vote was wrong. It didn't work too well for him. Didn't seem to help Kucinich much, either.

[jrieth50]

60. Oh really?

I thought it did work since anti Iraq talk is now considered within the realm of OK within the democratic party.

[Cheswick2.0]

41. no way

The democrats acted like cowards and lost the congress senate and presidency.

[WillyT]

30. CORRECTLY ROLLED ??? They Were On Their Knees Fellating...

the boy king and his cronies, and after they hit their money-shots, they spread the word all over town how 'easy' we are.

Dean may be the only reason this race is even close!!!

:wtf:

[Julien Sorel]

35. Uh huh.

I think I'm going to file this one in the "scary" folder and leave it be.

[lastliberalintexas]

39. That's not true, btw

"Under those circumstances, "criticizing the emperor" was politically foolish, and the people who did so got spanked hard during the elections that year."

The ones who lost in 2002 were Dems like Cleland, Carnahan, and Ron Kirk- all of whom ran ads showing how *allied* they were with Shrub. And Landrieu only pulled through after she started slinging arrows at Dim Son in the runoff. The ones who failed to show the voters a difference were the ones who lost.

I can't think of a single outspoken critic of this administration who lost in 2002. Please correct me if I am wrong.

[Julien Sorel]

44. Cleland's election was fought entirely around

the degree to which he supported Bush's war on terror. Chambliss won the battle and the election with it. Had Cleland rolled a little more, he'd still be a senator.

Landrieu specifically refused outside support from other Democrats, because she was afraid it would identify her with people like ... Tom Daschle, that Bush loving wimp, and alienate her from the true Bush lovers in her state. She ran ads claiming to be a conservative (her voting record is fairly liberal, actually), and touting her support of IWR. Hardly sounds "In your face" to me. With all that, and with a truly awesome effort to turn out the black vote by Donna Brazile and a little dirty trick over sugar imports played by Landrieu, she still only won by 52-48 % against a little known and lightly-funded opponent. If she had voted for the IWR, if she had been in your face, the 30% of the white vote she got would have shrunk to the point where she would have lost.


I can't think of a single outspoken critic of this administration who lost in 2002. Please correct me if I am wrong.

Cynthia McKinney and Earl Hilliard both lost their primaries to moderate Democrats. The Democrats who did speak out against Bush and keep their seats either weren't running for re-election, or were in ironclad safe seats. I don't know of a single competitive race, house or senate, that was contested by a critic of the administration where the critic won. I've asked several times for someone to present an example, and I'm still waiting.

[lastliberalintexas]

47. Thank you- I did forget about McKinney

But the Landrieu race was run differently than you've posted. In the first race, she ran as a Bush toady, and didn't get the votes necessary to avoid the runoff. From November to December, she actually ran a campaign which was very anti-Shrub. Terrell was very well financed by the RNC, who thought that the seat would be theirs for the taking. It was an all out war, and Landrieu only survived when she started fighting back.

As for your request, I'd say Harkin. You are right though, that it is very hard to find races which can actually be contested due to gerrymandering.

[Julien Sorel]

57. That's not entirely the Landrieu campaign I'm reading about.

She didn't attack Bush, she highlighted her independence. This was after her general election, where she stressed her support of Bush. She did vigorously attack a mythical sugar deal that Bush was supposed to have made to increase sugar imports from Mexico (sugar is an important industry in Louisiana), and this was a factor in her campaign (and a nice piece of dirty campaigning); besides that, the bulk of her runoff campaign was 1) Stressing her independence 2) Campaigning with John Breux (another guy who is derided here, but who manages to bring home the bacon for the Dems more often than not) to deflect charges of liberalism -- hardly sounds like someone taking the "in your face" approach some people here demand. There was no Bush bashing at all, as far as I can tell, unless accusing her challenger of being a rubber stamp for Bush counts as bashing.

She voted for the IWR, for the Homeland Security Act (two weeks before the runoff), and did not vote on the PATRIOT Act. I would bet that a "no" vote on any of those three would have resulted in a loss.

In the election itself, three Republicans, none of them very strong, drew more votes, 51%, than Landrieu did. Had she had a single strong Republican challenger, instead of three weak ones, she might have lost then. If she'd had a strong Republican challenger in the runoff, she almost certainly would have lost.

And all this was for a runoff, when the big thing is to energize your base to get them to go out and actually vote, which is not as big a problem when a full slate election is going. Landrieu, with the help of Brazile (yet another pincushion here), did that by harping on the sugar issue and energizing the black vote. Terrell, on the other hand, a moderate Republican, did not get strong support from the Louisiana conservatives, which was a contributor to her loss.

Terrell, her opponent, did spend 5 million total (contrary to what I said previously), but Landrieu spent more, and started out with name recognition. It looks to me like Terrell did not run the best of campaigns, either -- had she done a better job of shoring up her base, she might have won, but she depended too much on national Republican help.

This is a lot longer than I planned, so I'm going to sum up here:

Landrieu ran as a faux conservative in the election, and a moderate in the runoff. She never directly criticized Bush, with the exception of the non-existing sugar deal. She voted with Bush or abstained on the liberal hot button issues that dominated the national campaign that year. She eked out a win, running against a moderate Republican with no previous statewide experience, despite outspending her, and despite poor base turnout for her opponent. Had she been a Bush basher, want to bet that base turnout would have been energized? If she ran as an open liberal, want to bet that base would have been energized? Mary Landrieu would have lost in the runoff, if not the general, from everything I've seen. I can't prove that with 100% certainty of course, but there's a hell of a lot of evidence supporting it, and nothing opposing it.


I'm tempted to assume the Tom Harkin thing is a joke. Harkin is an institution in Iowa politics, making his seat pretty safe. But even at that, Harkin voted for the IWR and the PATRIOT Act. Exactly what makes him a Democratic, liberal he-man?

[ZJoeZ]

49. Well...

There was Walter Mondale/Paul Wellstone.

Poor old Wally. I really like him. He's gotten a bad shake so many times it's painful.

Hope he has some good times fishing and stuff. It's probably better for him to spend time with his grandkids now anyway.

[unfrigginreal]

16. BB:"I hate to do this"

Yeah, right. :eyes:

[madfloridian]

32. Dean is pragmatic. He knows what has to be done.

I am pragmatic, and I will do whatever I have to do at any given time to keep the GOP out of power.

Until November we should work to get Kerry and CONGRESS elected, he needs more Dems in congress.

I am pragmatic until November 2.

[blondeatlast]

36. I couldn't agree with you more... Daschle is the kind of politician

I wish we had more of in Washington. There was a time when deals were made, hands were shook, and the concern was the country's best interests.

Those days are gone, but I think they can return.

Funds are squeaky tight in my house right now, but I'm sending waht I can.

I was vociferously opposed to Dean as a presidential nominee, but he's a damn good advocate for our side.

[Name removed]

37. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Cheswick2.0]

40. Please get over it already

Dean is sticking up for all democrats in this election. That doesn't mean Daschle doesn't need to be replaced. He shoudn't be replaced by a republican is all.
Tom is too centrist and IMO corrupted by corporate money.

[lastliberalintexas]

43. Yep- while we may need Daschle in the Senate,

we don't need him as the leader. He is too centrist to conservative- understandably so, given the state that he represents. And he could be a very good asset as a whip to gather votes for our side within the Senate. But that doesn't mean he should be the leader.

[Cha]

26. True! But Dean doesn't hold grudges and knows

repuke vile ineptitude when he sees it!

"Dean is my hero." Mine, too!:D

I saw that george allen quote earlier today and couldn't remember what it was connected with..

"soft teeth down their whiny throats"!! Sounds like ol' allen is describing the repuke party to a tee!

[ComerPerro]

3. Dean nailed it, thought. That is exactly what the reich wingers want

They want average people to become so disillusioned, disgusted, and disinterested in politics that they become downright disgusted and stop paying attention or voting. They stop giving a shit about domestic policy. They will, of course, still care about wars and shit like that, and that is where Republicans are strong. Of course, its not because Republicans are better at waging war or conducting foreign policy. Its because Republicans know they can just lie to Americans about what is happening and no one will question it.

The bottom line is, this is essential to Repugs because it makes domestic issues take a backseat, if they even get a seat at all. Republicans are continually weak on Domestic policy for two reasons: They don't give a shit about anyone else, and if you fuck up domestic policy everyone knows.

Once the Republicans have most of America thinking that politics can't solve any of their problems, they will be able to finally achieve the dominace they need to have their aristocracy.

[Larkspur]

6. Yes, that is the Repukes strategy and unfortunately Dems play into it

Dems played right into it in 2002. Will 2004 be different? We'll see on Nov. 2.

Dems, like Dean, know that this Repuke attitude must be fought energetically.

Repukes are using the same political strategy Hitler used to gain power in Germany -- weaken opposing parties so that yours is the only one left.

[kwolf68]

7. Dean Dean Dean

I am slowly falling in love with this man. I was not in his camp during the primary at all and waged many a battle with the Deaniacs, but what an absolute priceless warrior in the arena of ideas we have.

Dean is slowly becoming what Paul Wellstone used to be…A voice for truth, a man hell-bent on speaking his convictions come hell or high water…a Man who places the hope of our world over the individual desire of achievement…

Words can’t express the gratitude I have for this man at this time in our nation. If John Kerry is elected, Howard Dean will be FAR MORE than just a footnote on this time in history…he will be who defines it. God bless this man.

He has been the biggest stalwart for Kerry even though tensions between the two were obvious during the campaign.

Howard Dean=Pure…If Kerry doesn’t win and Dean comes out in 2008 I am going to give him serious consideration. What a great man.

[madfloridian]

23. I agree on that. He is fighting so hard. It gives me courage.

I was one who had just given up. Now our group here is starting to pull our local party back from the far right more to the center. They listen to us. They get mad at us, but they are listening. More are speaking up. They did not realize what had happened to them until we told them.

[mzmolly]

53. It is heartening to see that so many recognize Dean for who he is today

and look past the media caricature.

Howard Dean=Pure…If Kerry doesn’t win and Dean comes out in 2008 I am going to give him serious consideration. What a great man.

I've been thinking this recently, if Kerry loses ... my only consolation is that Dean may run again in 2008, and I'll start working for him on November 3, 2004.

"What a great man" indeed. :hi:

[Name removed]

8. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[iwantmycountryback]

11. I'm not a huge Daschle fan either

But I still think that it is necessary for him to win. We really need Democrats right now. Though I would certainly like a new leader. (Say, Hillary?:D)

[lastliberalintexas]

29. Hillary Clinton's voting record

isn't much better than Daschle's. Do you like her simply because she's female? What is it with the Hillary worship here?

So you know, she voted in favor of the war, for the Patriot Act, for the extremely anti-consumer bankruptcy "reform" bill, and for NCLB. What's so great about her?

[iwantmycountryback]

54. Well I'm a male

So the fact that she's a woman doesn't really influence to me. She is my senator though. NCLB would be good probably if it was properly funded. The Patriot Act is good bill except for about 5% of it. I like her as a senator and besides it would really really piss of the Republicans.

[Mr Blond]

10. Senator Daschle is a loyal Dem and I'm proud of him.

He's stood up for the Democratic Party at every turn. He's stood up against the Idiot in Cheif at every turn. He's EARNED our respect and thanks!! I'll be giving to his campaign and I think everyone here should.

IMO, of course.

[Jacobin]

14. Um, When did he "stand up to the Idiot in chief"

He always appeared to me to be the Colmes in Hannity and Colmes in the senate.

[Mr Blond]

18. Right Wing court appointees???

He's got steel in his spine!

Plus, he's responsible for bringing Jeffers (AND the Senate) over to our side. I'm not sure, but I don't think anyone in history has done that.

Tom Daschle has earned a LOT of respect! He is Democratic Party all the way!!

IMO, of course.

[Julien Sorel]

25. If he's not jumping up and down screaming,

accusing Bush of AWOL and MIHOP and LIHOP, and whatever else you can think of, then he's a wimp.

Ignore the fact that he is in a state where 63% of the people voted for Bush in 2000. Ignore the fact that he helped SD's other senator, Tim Johnson, win a tough re-election fight in 2002, against the guy now going up against Daschle, by 500 votes. Naw. He didn't vote the right way on IWR, so he's a wimp, a coward, a "Repuke-lite," a "pink tu-tu Dem," and all the rest of the silly abuse certain people here have talked themselves into believing.

Life must be easy when you live it as ignorantly and passionately as possible.

[jrieth50]

33. Support his seat..

I support Daschle's seat but the Democratic party needs a new leader. And I will assist Dean in doing what he can to help Daschle. But he's still the leader of democratic complacency. In my op.

[juajen]

17. Go Dean!!!!

Even though he's made some mistakes, I certainly think the circumstances of the last three and a half years have been extraordinary. I like Tom Daschle.

[madfloridian]

22. Kick.

Kick for Dean and Daschle and fighting back.

[CityDem]

42. Where's Tom

Too bad Daschle is not reciprocating by supporting Kerry 100%. Instead, he is running ads showing a Bush* / Daschle make out session. Daschle is a first rate DINO.

[bigwillq]

45. Let 'em all have it Dean

Got this e-mail as well.

I love the way Dean puts things.


"I am tired of crackpots with corporate backers polluting the airwaves."

"Last Thursday at their hate-filled convention"


You must admit, Dean is really working hard for the betterment of the Democratic party and for John Kerry.

[Name removed]

48. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[FarLeftRage]

46. A kick for people-powered Howard!

Dean is correct and proper in doing this.

[NoPasaran]

50. I haven't been a Daschle fan

But People Powered Howard pried a contribution out of me.

Whether or not you like Howard Dean or his supporters, you can't deny that he's a hell of a good Democrat.

[madfloridian]

51. Angry with everyone who messed up my post with angry rhetoric.

Stop it.

[IronLionZion]

55. We're gonna wish we chose Dean as our nominee

Daschle didn't do shit for Dean and even ripped on him a few times. But Dean is supporting him and all other other Dems in office (except Zell Miller) and that's loyalty.

I won't be sorry if Daschle is gone as Dem leader, but it will suck to lose a Dem seat in the Senate.

If I was calling the shots, I would appoint Dean as head of the DNC. The party is need of something, and Dean has it: energy, grass-roots following, solid policies, backbone, etc.

[bklyncowgirl]

59. Keeping his eye on the big picture

We need every Democrat in Congress whether Kerry wins or not.

Howard Dean continues to impress.

[mandyky]

56. In less than 24 hours DFA raised 160,000 for Daschle

I hope Sen. Daschle remembers this!