Bush grounded himself to avoid testing positive for coke.

[Gold Metal Flake]

That's why he refused the physical.

[mourningdove92]

1. That is what I have always thought.

He knew he couldn't pass the "golden flow"

[meti57b]

3. That's what I had always thought, too.

[cthrumatrix]

24. well let him answwer the MF question for once....Rather asked the question

tonight..!

[librechik]

2. duh n/t

[Gold Metal Flake]

8. I know, but it's two sentences long, easy to say, and fun to lay on RWs.

It's also true, as far as the evidence shows. So, please excuse my exuberance.

[librechik]

15. luvya, godless gearhead

and I really love your handle. I have godless gearheads in the family.

(I'm just a bad mouthed babe--nothing personal!)

Cheers!

[Gold Metal Flake]

25. Back atchya!!

All good!

:toast:

[Lex]

4. Dan Rather should just go ahead and state the obvious.

He could do like Fox News and say "Some people say . . . "

[MazeRat7]

5. Did they have reliable UA's in the early 70's

Just asking. Seems to me, a teen of the late 60's early 70's, we did a whole lot of drugs but there were very few standard test to show if you were dirty. That activity (standardized, simple, cheap drug testing of workers, pilots, criminals, etc) didn't really enter the medical scene until the early to mid 80's.

Does anyone know "what" was tested in a 1970's military physical ?

MZr7

[jimshoes]

10. I've heard from talking to a Nam vet

that all returning troops were tested for drugs before they could leave country. I'm sure someone can confirm. This was around 1970 or 71 maybe 72.

[lunarboy13]

12. Here's what makes it very interesting...

In April of 1972 is when the U.S. Military began routinely testing military personnel for drugs. Not only would they test urine and blood, but also inspecting the nasal cavity. And yes, if you did coke, you would be caught. It was the medical exam after April of 1972 that Bush missed.

Think about that....

[oasis]

19. Taxpayers trained him to fly and he was snorting coke? What can a desk

jockey do if we were to come under attack? "Throw spitballs?"

[nostamj]

22. "the nasal cavity" Now, THAT's an 'aha' moment...

thanks. first I've heard but it makes perfect sense.

my larger guess is that the chimp had NO IDEA what the tests would be or what they could expose and just didn't take ANY chances...

[Red State Rebel]

38. Killian's son who was also TANG

said that a drug test was not a regular part of a physical at that time, they started in 80 or 81. He said if an officer suspected drug use, he could specifically request a soldier be called in for one.

[AnnInLa]

6. Yes, and that's what's behind that phony

"community service" that chimpy performed. Can you imagine him doing volunteer work for the poor? PUHLEEZ

[aint_no_life_nowhere]

7. And why did James Bath also miss the physical and get grounded?

Someone needs to use the FOIA to get hold of Bath's records. There may be more reprimands and action-memos in that file, if it hasn't been sanitized like Bush's file. Bath and Bush were friends in the Guard and may be been involved in the same drug use. By the way, anyone know what happened to James Bath after HE was suspended from flying? Did he also get transferred to Alabama with Bush and not show up?

[City Lights]

13. I've said the same thing.

Why hasn't any "reporter" connected those dots? Maybe it's time to drop Mr. Rather a note.

[eleny]

9. And to think he was flying jets right before that!!!!!!!!!!!!

:scared:

[yardwork]

41. Well, not all that consistently.

It turns out that chimpy was flying co-pilot in two-seater trainers most of the time.

[Catch22Dem]

11. Pretty much common knowledge...

Too bad the media won't call him on it.

I like how Rather mentioned the physical then asked "WHY?" Makes me think he's gonna take a run at the coke angle.

[smiley_glad_hands]

14. Coke is only in your system for 2 days.

Either he is a dumb ass (which we know is true) or there were other reasons for missing it (ie: other drugs such as pot).

[lunarboy13]

16. When drug testing first became available...

No One knew how long different drugs remained "testable" in your system. And the military does a good job of trying to make you beleive that what you hear isn't true. When I was tested in 1986, I was told by a Miltary Officer (who interviewed me for part of my security clearnace) that any drug I had taken within the last two years would be found in my system and it was better if I admitted it right then. Now, when military testing came on line in 72, I don't think Bush would have known how long such things would be in his system. Plus, if he was hooked, he wouldn't have been able to pass a test anyway. No one "hooked" on coke could have just said no for a few days. If they can afford it and they can get it, they do it. Period.

[aint_no_life_nowhere]

18. Kitty Kelley's book apparently says he did both pot and coke in the TANG

[EST]

26. Reliable urine tests for pot

didn't come on line until 1978, coke test about 10 years earlier, although the military brought coke test in in April, '72, and lied that they could detect pot for several years.

[AnnInLa]

17. Someone please do a cartoon about

bu$h preferring COKE (over Pepsi, of course.)

[librechik]

20. I heard a truly outrageous rumor about why he dropped out

(attention Kitty Kelley!)

I read somewhere that although most people assume drugs were the secret reason he didn't take the physical, what really happened is that he was caught having sex with another NG (The very same James Bath!) and they were both suspended immediately and the whole thing was hushed up.

They didn't need to take the flight physical because all agreed their careers were over and they would not be flying--or serving again. Chimpy pretended to still be in the NG just for appearances sake, but never took practice anywhere else again, and he was hustled out with an Honorable Discharge.

[jimshoes]

27. That would be too, too juicy

hope it's true.

[yardwork]

42. It's outrageous but it fits the facts far better than anything smear vets

have said about Kerry.

If Michelle Malkin can make the rounds accusing Kerry of having self-inflicted wounds and the smear vets can televise ads saying that Kerry faked his medals, and almost every single reporter and commentator on TV takes them at their word, why can't reporters talk about the possibility that your scenario is true of Bush?

That's the double-standard that we're dealing with, and that's why the Rove machine needs to be stopped now.

[MazeRat7]

21. Not convinced "not taking test" was for fear of failure

No, I think GW had a more sinister cognitive disorder. Specifically,
an attitude of "hey... I'll do what I want". I don't think he gave a rats ass about the drug test or at that point even flying. I think he got bored with the whole flying thing and decided that since he was from a privileged background we would do damn well what he wanted.

The underlying point being, he made commitments but felt he was not obligated to stand by them because of "who" he was....sound familiar given modern day events ?

MZr7

[EST]

29. You have the prize, IMHO.

n/t

[EST]

23. 50/50

Bush was also an incompetent dork, whom his buperiors refused to cover for any further.

[Old and In the Way]

28. Check this thread out

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x777713

How do we really know it was his choice not to take the physical?

What I find interesting is George was working with some of Poppy's business associates from Zapata Offshore Oil Co. in 1971. This business included locating/buying non-flowering tropical plants primarilly in Central America and Florida.

Does anyone know the date when George was alledgedly busted for smuggling kilos of coke at Tiamiami (sp) Airport?

[aint_no_life_nowhere]

30. I believe it was 1982

Try googling the following:

Barry Seal George Bush cocaine From The Wilderness

The website From The Wilderness has the story on it, but for some reason it won't let me cut and paste the website coordinates (they don't even show). This may not be the most reliable source of information but there are tons of websites that also have the story of George W. Bush being caught on videotape bringing cocaine into the U.S. aboard a private jet.

I believe the story goes something like this. There was a DEA sting to catch Houston drug dealer Barry Seal. It so happened that unbeknownst to the DEA, the CIA through George H.W. Bush who recently had become Vice President and Oliver North had turned Seal into a US government operative. It was part of the guns for drugs operation between Iran (source of the guns) and the Contras (who paid in drugs), with Barry Seal helping the US government to then bring the drugs into the US and sell for cash (in order to buy more guns from Iran). The story says that the DEA running the sting was hidden in wait at the airport for Bobby Seal's jet plane. On that day, George Bush and his brother Jeb were in that plane helping Poppy Bush because they were considered reliable individuals who could keep a secret, and were videotaped coming out of the drug dealer's plane that contained a shipment of coke from Central America. They were bringing cocaine shipments back to the U.S.

I believe the approximate dates are about 1982, according to the story. I'm not sure if that was the story you were talking about.

[Old and In the Way]

32. OK...that doesn't fit the timeline.

But something went down in '71/'72 to get George into community sentence, I mean service. His traveling around Central American/Florida in 1971, buying tropical plants with his Dad's CIA associates is most interesting, too.

I just wonder if his actual personnel file was already doctored to give it the appearance that he failed to show up for his physical when, if there was a real conviction for cocaine for which he did community service, he'd have lost his flight privilages permanently. It's becoming apparent that his Alabama service was totally bogus, so what really happened in the '71/'72 timeframe?

[lockdown]

31. That bust was 1985

Must be the longest lasting career he's had. :D

http://www.fromthewilderness.com/free/ciadrugs/W_plane.html

[DoYouEverWonder]

36. That would be Tamiami Airport

Used to be owned by the Ott Brothers. Twin boys who married twin wives.

Was Jeb hanging out with Armando Codina at that point? He ended up becoming Jeb's partner and was a well known drug money laundering down in Miami. George was going down to 'help out' would fit right in with all the other Iran Contra sort of stuff, George and Jeb were involved in at the time.

[rullery]

33. Bush was afraid of flying

According to another thread here at DU yesterday, based on released logs of Bush' flights, he had some trouble landing his single-seater plane during the last months he was flying. So he then flew double-seater training planes, sometimes as a passenger.

When he was ordered to take a physical he dodged out, knowing that it would result in his being grounded. He WANTED to be grounded! There was another comment I read somewhere by his father, that George W. was afraid of flying.

So it seems that his reasons were two-fold: fear of having his drug use exposed, and not wanting to have to fly anymore.

[tuvor]

34. Proof, dammit!

I just got off a Yahoo board about the new memos where a bunch of freeping neocons were saying "%!#@$%@#$% it's all lies!!!" and such.

I told them to back up their assertions. (Of course I had no takers.) I'm afraid I have to ask you to do the same. If this is just your conjecture, then please say so.

I don't mind fighting dirty, but the facts HAVE to be with us.

[blm]

35. DON'T FORGET - HIS BUDDY, JAMES BATH, WAS GROUNDED AT THE SAME TIME.

A reporter should do a FOIA on James Bath's record and see if it was monkeyed with, too.

[Lex]

37. Yes! I agree.

Something weird there for certain.

[Mr_Spock]

39. That's what any person with common sense believes

I happen to know it's true - he is a person with very low moral character.

[Guaranteed]

40. That's the connection that we have to make...

Like Patton and Montgomery coming together- the AWOL status and the Kitty Kelley book...

If we can bring them together, which will be VERY difficult working against the r/w fucks, we can finally paint a really nasty picture of this guy.

[zignovis]

43. I wish it were true, but...

They don't test for drug use at flight physicals, even today. They test for blood sugar levels, etc. -- it's a bona fide Class 1 aviation medical exam.

The military had drug policies at the time, but random sweeps didn't exist yet. You could get sent for an exam if your fitness for duty was in question.

Random testing didn't start till the eighties, after a crash on the Nimitz where it was later determined that many of those killed had been using drugs -- including the pilot, who had been self-medicating with antihistamines.