Don't flame me 'cause I just have to ask this....knowing all we know about

[Sperk]

BBV, why do so many duers still feel that Kerry will win (bush won't steal it)?

[movonne]

1. We all have a lot of hope because it is almost unbearable to think

we would have 4 more year and maybe ever ending Repug administration. I feel that this is our last hope.

[bunkerbuster1]

4. If bush manages to win, somehow

I'll lick my wounds, and then carry on thinking globally, acting locally.

These ratfuckers won't keep me down, nor will they keep down the tens of millions of patriotic Americans who will continue the good fight.

/bb

[bunkerbuster1]

2. My simple, if possibly naive answer, is...

When it's sunk in that Bush's response to 9/11 has been a failure, and (very important) Kerry is not a lunatic Commie gun-grabbing Frenchman, there won't be any way for the election to be "stolen." there will be too many exit polls for that kind of tomfoolery to rule the day.

My story, stickin' to it.

/bb

[acmavm]

3. Two reasons for me. 1.) because we're wise to their tricks so the vote

will be in Kerry's favore by a large number; 2.) because Kerry and the dems have already gotten a staff of lawyers and others who will monitor the votes and they've already said that they will not ALLOW it to happen this time.

[in_cog_ni_to]

11. How can they stop electronic hacking? How will they know when a machine

has been hacked to change the vote totals? Just curious.

[acmavm]

15. Monitoring the elections. Of course this will require that our side have

monitors at the polls, or for that matter are allowed to have monitors at the polls. But Kerry/Edwards are already thinking ahead and planning just for this situation.

Geez, this place is nuts today. I give up. We don't have a chance, we're gonna lose, everyone abandon ship.

[in_cog_ni_to]

17. OK. Explain to me, please.

HOW will a Kerry/Edwards monitor know that Mr. RW hacker is sitting in an office somewhere, with a cell phone, hacking into the voting machines to change the vote totals? How will the monitors KNOW that the machine has been hacked? That's all I want to know. :hi:

[LisaL]

5. Well, everybody wants something to look forward to.

[Eric J in MN]

6. It's completely plausible to me that Bush may steal the election

with BBV.

[Cocoa]

7. some of BBV is intended to suppress votes

give people the feeling that their votes won't count, so why go to the polls.

Another aim is to set us up for what happened in Venezuela. When Kerry wins, I guarantee you, if it's close, that Bush will challenge, likely with BBV.

[AuntPatsy]

8. Obviously in 2000 some were blindsided by the blantant corruption

of such a noble endeavor of our nation as a whole regarding the presidential election. This time, the gloves are off, and the Dems have their own backyard soldiers ready and waiting...

Money and power recognizes the like, and contrary to what so many seem to believe, we have our own such faithful followers though they might be more hidden...

Kerry has many friends in high places, and the cash flow to back them up, for those of you who believe the Dems to be friendless because the media tells you so is not facing the reality of our times..

We have this one in the bag, all this going on now is nothing but show boating, no need to be as blantant as the Reps are, fear is never a good reason to let one's self look so pathetic as so many repubs re doing these days...by attacking the messagener and not the message, they have failed to realize that the message was viewed as if a poloaried went off when they weren't looking..

[blue neen]

9. Please, PLEASE forgive me for asking such a dumb question,

But what is BBV? Then I'll tell you why Kerry will win.

[in_cog_ni_to]

12. BBV=Black Box Voting=Electronic Voting Machines.

:hi:

[AndyTiedye]

13. BBV is "Black-Box Voting", using Computerized Voting Machinez

most of which are made by Diebold or ES&S, which are companies with
heavy ties to the Republican party. (Diebold's CEO is a Bush* "Pioneer"
and has "committed to deliver the electoral votes of Ohio to Bush").

Many of the machines produce no paper ballots, so if they are programmed
to divert Kerry votes to Boosh or Nader, nobody would be the wiser as
long as the proper code is restored before the machines can be inspected.
Even when paper ballots are produces, state election laws usually preclude
any recounts unless the election is "close", and even then, they often
just run the ballots through the same machines again.

They are planning to steal the election. There can be no doubt of it.

Several of the best-known polling agencies are in on it -- their polls
already diverging sharply from the pack, but ready to provide a verneer
of respectability over their fraudulent results.

They got away with as much as a 16% shift of votes in Georgia in 2002,
when they were testing out their election fraud software. There, they
simply supressed the exit polls, said there were problems with the data
and refused to publish them, ever. If they do that for the national
elections, people will be suspicious, so they had to get Gallup and
a couple of the other well-known polling organizations on board.

The only thing that can stop them is a historic landslide for Kerry.

[wiggs]

10. Chaos scenario

The results don't have to come out in Bush's favor for Bush to win. A FUBAR'd election would also serve BA purposes. It seems likely to me that there will be many areas were results don't make sense or are challenged. Election results may not be certified in many states. It is possible, with no paper trail, that an election won't be valid. Then how long would it take to fix the problem and hold another election? You couldn't hold another election in just the affected areas because results from most of the country would already be known.

Also, even if we get to certified results, committed electoral delegates may take advantage of chaos to switch votes.

So, there doesn't even have to be conspiracy for Bush to stay in office longer than Jan 05....just a screwed up system with no way to verify vote counts.

This is going to be a mess. And if you are the incumbent candidate in power and stand a good chance to lose, a mess is as good as a win.

[blue neen]

14. I have not heard anyone say that they are intimidated enough

by the thought of this that they will not vote. People are so angry at Bush & Co. that they will not stand for a repeat of the 2000 fiasco. I truly believe there would be a revolution in this country if that happened again.

[spanone]

16. There is no option.