Are Dems dumber than Repugs

[xrepub]

I am a Democrat, and I strongly support Kerry. That said, I am dismayed by what I read on this board. Every time a poll shows Kerry ahead by a point, there are a hundred posts claiming that we are a shoo in. Every time a poll shows bush ahead, there are a hundred posts about the world coming to an end.

I see the same thing every time there is some positive or negative mention of either candidate.

Various players in this game go from geniuses to idiots in a twinkling.

There are two dominant forces in this election:

All the facts call for the removal of bush and the election of Kerry.

They are running a better campaign than us.
***********
It is unlikely that the situation in Iraq or the economy will improve before the election. I hope that our campaign will. All of us can help by doing what can be done rather than going into hysterics regularly.

[Nicholas D Wolfwood]

1. We're not dumb

The problem is some people here watch "Meet the Press" once a week and then fancy themselves a political scientist.

[ArkDem]

16. Isn't 'political scientist' an oxymoron?

[Nicholas D Wolfwood]

34. Not in the least.

[sui generis]

2. we are human - no need for name calling

Repugs are dumberer!

[Rabelais]

3. not dumber but

more pavlovian.

[Nordic]

9. in general more subject to mood swings

Don't equate sensitivity with stupidity.

Big mistake.

[xrepub]

14. mood swings

When mood swings affect actions then stupidity comes into play. It is important that we all do what we can to win this election. If mood swings interefere with that then we get into stupidity.

[Nordic]

20. ever studied Meyers-Briggs?

it's psychological profiling. States that there are basically four temperment types.

The rational.

The idealist.

The guardian.

The "artisan".

The rationals hate emotional arguments, don't trust them, and never use them. They don't trust emotions.

The idealists are the exact opposite. Many Dems are idealists.

The guardians are people who need authority and heirarchy. These people are often republicans.

The artisans live to be spontaneous. They can swing either way based on whim.

This is an extremely thumbnail sketch of the temperment types. I suspect you are a rational. Nothing wrong with that.

But you might try to understand both the idealist and the "artisan" temperment.

I'm an idealist which means I'm extremely empathetic and can easily see someone else's point of view. I also use emotional arguments and trust my instincts. I distrust "rational" arguments. I find you can rationalize anything, even the greatest evil. I'm also capable of being diplomatic and helping others see others' points of view.

But I can also hate more strongly than almost any other type. An idealist who has decided to hate is not something to fuck with.

I suspect many terrorists are hateful idealists. I could be wrong. I've never met one in person.

[StClone]

21. Dems seem to be more widely read

Republicans often disappear into their own little corner of ideas and try to comprehend (fail) from that point of view then attempt to force the world to obey the laws they believe should hold.

[Burma Jones]

4. No, we assuredly are not

If we were dumber, we would be happier to follow in line happily and get the unified message out. Also, go to this link and look at some data......

http://www-unix.oit.umass.edu/~gcharter/iq.txt

[TexasUnderground]

19. So you mean to say that

Hypothetically speaking, if one were to deviate oh so slightly from the accepted party line, that the rest of the gang won't jump on that person like a pack of wolves?

In my short experience posting, I would say that non-conformity is punished much more than it is rewarded. If you don't believe me, try posting that you think the NG memos were forged.

But, YMMV.

[Kathy in Cambridge]

28. Most people here arrive at their conclusions by studying the facts

which is more than I can say for your pals on the right.

[Burma Jones]

31. No, I said that

The Republicans will not jump on that person, mostly because they just don't deviate, or, as in Pat Buchanan's case, they ignore them.

PS, I think the memos were forged too. Enthusiasm often causes stupid mistakes. We didn't need the memos......

[Misunderestimator]

33. LOL... This thread is like flypaper

[dave123williams]

5. They're less professionally devious...

[MsTryska]

6. oh we're just big dummies.

and emotional nitwits.



(is that what you were looking to hear?)

[amber dog democrat]

7. If you are asking about Zell Miller

then
yes. otherwise No, Dems are not less intelligent than Repugs. I suggest we avoid the polls for now. I tene to see them as mostly vapor.

[progressivebydesign]

8. In an online community of 50k+, you'll have it all..

.. doesn't mean we're "dumb", means that in a group of 50K, you'll find all types of personalities. The optimists, the pessimists, the infiltrators, some dumb, some genius, some wondering what to have for lunch. Doesn't make Democrats dumb.. makes them human.

[liberal N proud]

10. It the compasion in us all that keeps us from playing dirty!

They are not running a better campaign than the Democrats. They just have all the weapons of mass deception:
CNN, FAUX, NBC...
Orealy, Rush, Hannity...
Their game is slime and dirt and when you put that with the LIBERAL media you don't stand a chance of looking good.

[andino]

11. most of us know that it will be close and more than likely...

be decided after the debates... All this crap leading up to them is just that... CRAP.

Who cares if a national poll has Bush up. We don't elect our leader with a national poll. We elect them with a archaic electoral college. Hell, I don't care if bush gets 80% of the votes so long as Kerry gets 271+. Plus polls are fickle little things. One person asking a leading question to a VERY SMALL group of people that at best don't give a shit. Then they assign a margin of error so big you can drive a truck through it. Oh and by the way, most polls are useless now since they can't poll cell phones.

So yeah, it's fun to build up your guy and trash the other. It gives people something to do until October. ;)

[Lex]

12. We just not as smart as you, I guess. n/t

[Southsideirish]

13. We are smarter, kinder and better people. That is our problem

when dealing with absolute evil - we underestimate them all the time.

Look at our posts - they are all over the place, about cats, PMS, whatever - where the Evil Ones post only on the meme of the day and do so with tremendous passion.

Until we match and surpass their ferocity we won't be successful.

[xrepub]

17. Not organized

We are clearly not as well organized as the repugs, but I don't consider that a negative. The Dems have always been freer thinkers than the repugs, and that is part of our strength. It also makes it tougher to wage a campaign. We also have more scruples, and that makes it harder to wage a campaign. We are more able to understand nuances, and assume that others can also, and that makes it harder to wage a campaign.

When Kerry makes a statement that most of us understand, but 50% of Americans don't we get into trouble. BUsh is good at talking to the double digit IQ's, Kerry has to learn how to do it.

[Nordic]

22. that's where sloganeering comes in

Hiring some good advertising people is imperative. I work in TV advertising so I see how it's done. It's the best propaganda on earth.

The Dems feel a strong need to explain everything. People don't want that. People want slogans and easy answers. That is what they respond to on a visceral level.

I live in a Kerry state, so I see almost none of his advertising. About all I have seen are a few Swiftboat ads (I guess they don't mind wasting other people's money).

[Sick_of_Rethuggery]

36. All that you said is true, but...

that still doesnt explain why Dem surrogates who turn up on those stupid TV shows cannot express clear concise support for their own standard bearer's (Gore or Kerry or Clinton or Dean or...) positions, even when those positions are clear concise and supportable.

Examples: 1. Kerry's IWR vote: This issue galled for me till I read somewhere that Kerry refused to authorize the Gulf war resolution but voted for the IWR for a very intriguing (and eminently supportable) reason: GWR was a war authorization, but IWR was a lever (to leverage world opinion). Not even one Dem surrogate has made this rather beautiful point -- it blew me off, this rather nuanced position and principled vote (at tremendous political risk, mind you, since he was on the unpopular side both times and this time could have very easily lost his party nomination) which has a very simple and coherent explanation (we do not need to agree with it, but the position certainly has some merit to it).

2. Kerry's elegant solution to the job-exportation problem: The angle of not subsidizing the loss of American jobs by American taxpayers is a spectacularly simple, and probably a very effective (time will tell), solution to a seemingly intractable problem. Why wont Dem surrogates state this even?

We may be more nuanced, we may be more reluctant to beat up our political opponents or attack them personally and unfairly, but what about this seeming reluctance to even showcase our own strengths and thoughtful, yet straightforward and simple, solutions?

Kerry is himself pretty terrific at both the intelligent attack and a considered positioning -- it is the unwillingness of other Democrats to even follow his lead that makes us seem like intellectual wimps. Watch his economic policy address from y'day, available on C-SPAN, to see an excellent example of my point about Kerry leading the way on mounting an effective campaign. He succinctly, directly and devastatingly nails Bush and his policies to beginwith - then he offers, modest, sensible policies to attack the most egregious problems: quite brilliant, I think. If only, we could all do that, the Rethugs will not have a chance.

The problem in my opinion is not our candidates, it is the surrogates and the handwringing rank-and-file who do not have enough patience to look deeply at the candidates that do emerge.

In this respect, we all need to thank Iowans for doing the hard work and "finding" Kerry for us -- he is far and away the best candidate (this is coming from a person who used to think Gore and then Dean were the best candidates!) for the circumstances we find ourselves in. Supporting him does not detract from our natural thoughtfulness, our penchant for nuance nor compromise our dislike for slinging mud.

I am sorry to post such a long response, I realize it is against DU etiquette (seemingly!), but I dont have thread starting privileges :-(

[Walt Starr]

15. There are two parties in this nation, the Stupid Party and the Evil Party

I, sir, am a PROUD member of the Stupid Party.

:evilgrin:

[xrepub]

18. I am a proud member of the non- evil party

I don't see any reason for us to be stupid.

[Julien Sorel]

23. I've reached the same conclusion.

Far more Republicans seem willing to shut up and do what it takes to win than Democrats.

I think it actually goes further than Democrat/Republican, and goes to left/right. Too many leftists are clinging fiercely to the chimera of the 60s, and refuse to acknowledge that the world has changed. The 60s are their ideal, and anything less than that is a failure. So Nadir and the Greens can pull 2-3% of the vote, while their right wing counterparts don't get 1%. The wingers shut up and vote for Bush knowing the alternative is worse; the leftists agitate and either vote for Nadir, or vote for the Democrat after loudly badmouthing him or her for a lack of purity. Bush refuses to take a defined position on religious issues with a wink and a nod, and the fundies get it; the Democrat does it and becomes a sellout, a "pink tu tu Dem," and all the rest of the abusive foolishness these morons spew.

We lose because of them, because of their stupidity. Sometimes I look at the losers who post on this board and it literally sickens me to have to vote in the same direction as they do. I start thinking, "If people this stupid and crazy are on this side of the issue, then it has to be wrong." And I know for a fact that a lot of Americans actually go the whole way and do vote that way -- not for the Republicans, but against the crazy left, who have become easy caricatures for the Republicans and the media. But they still don't get it, and likely never will.

[xrepub]

25. We go different places with our conclusions

This is probably the most important election we will ever vote in. In order for the Dems to win, we must pull together and get the job done. We are not mindless group thinkers like the wingnuts, but we must put aside differences till after the election. Then we can go back to being traditional Dems.

I understand that many of my fellow Dems are way to the left of me or way to the right of me. Some of them may think that I am not the brightest fellow or the most compassionate. I may think the same thing of some of them. But we must stand together on this.

THIS ELECTION IS TOO IMPORTANT TO LOSE.

[Julien Sorel]

30. Shrug.

Trying to get these people to pull together is a somewhat problematic task. They are all geniuses, you see, and don't need anyone telling them what to do.

Personally, by the way, it isn't a matter of ideology for me. It's a matter of pragmatism. I don't care if they're further to the left or to the right of me; what I care about is are they willing to do what it takes to beat Republican ass and get shit done. The answer is no, all too often.

Let me give you an example. A little more than a year ago, there was a debate on PBS featuring some Republican guy and Medea Benjamin over the Iraq war. The Republican dressed conservatively in a suit. Medea Benjamin dressed in this weird looking pink outfit. She spoke well, mind you, but anyone looking at her would automatically think, "Another hippie who doesn't know the 60s are dead," and dismiss her out of hand.

Here she was, debating the most important subject of the day, and she couldn't be bothered to dress in a way that would win favor with an audience -- she had to rub their noses in her radicalism. If fighting the Iraqi invasion were really important to her, if she really wanted to make a difference, wouldn't she have taken the relatively minor step of dressing conservatively for the debate? When you go on a job interview, don't you dress in a way that you think will favorably impress your potential employer? If you were in sales, wouldn't you dress in a way that would make your clients more likely to buy your products? Being radical was more important to her than having an impact on the invasion -- on getting the job done. On winning.

And that's where we are. Too many of these people are too out of it, too idealistic, too stupid, too crazy -- too whatever -- for the left to fashion a winning platform. Move to the center, and the Medea Benjamins of the world howl to the moon. Move to the left, alienate the center and create "Reagan Democrats." The center isn't changing; the wingers figured that out a while ago and gave in. The far leftists still haven't.

[w4rma]

24. We're not dumb. We're amatures up against pros. (nt)

[BootinUp]

26. Everyone has their opinion

As to how good or bad the campaign is, I would say they are running a good campaign. It is the campaign I expected, so is Bush's. It will be a very close election, which should not be surprising.

[Borgnine]

27. Me no stoopid.

Me am smarter tahn the republycans?!

[heidler1]

29. The Republicans are better at promoting greed.

They are adept at giving the underdogs crumbs and playing on their greed and/or unsustainable interests. Like snow mobiles in Yellowstone, guns and SUVs in every garage. The voter too often sees having these things as freedom. My guess is we should set a good personal example and quit preaching about these type of issues.
The final solution for these behaviors will be when the price is so high that only the rich can play.

[Misunderestimator]

32. LMFAO... What the hell?!?

Oh... yeah... and Welcome to DU!

[Kathy in Cambridge]

35. This thread is like a freep filter

:boring:

[AuntPatsy]

37. I believe your thread heading is completely innacurate and

definately misleading. As someone else said on this thread, you have a wide variety of people in both camps. To label one party as being stupider than another makes about as much sense as my two year old grandson.

You state the repubs are running a much better campaign? I cannot for the life of me understand exactly how you would come to such a misleading conclusion. If you take into account the outright lies and the ongoing spinning of the so called liberal media that is being forced down it's viewers throats which is nothing more than more spinning and outright lies being heraled as Gospel against Kerry over and over again..

I am sure if the Dems had such an abililty to distribute it's hateful rhetoric along with it's misleading news stories than with your reasoning, they then would deserve the smarter title...

I am sorry, I am sure there are stupid people as well as liars in both camps, but to say one is smarter than another is only encouraging the already misleading information we are forced to endure daily as a whole...

I would have to honestly say that the Democratic camp has a definate majority of it's members to have more morals and compassion for all people to be well above such numbers that trickle out of those sympathizing with the Repubs agendas...

[xrepub]

38. Fessing up

I titled this thread so as to attract attention. A thread title such as "we must all pull together" would have expressed my feelings better but would have languished.

My basic point is that this election is IMPORTANT.

I believe that we have the power to win it.

Let's get to work.