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Cheney Lies Again: The case for a war crime prosecution is at this point overwhelming. (A. Sullivan)

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jefferson_dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-25-09 08:16 PM
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Cheney Lies Again: The case for a war crime prosecution is at this point overwhelming. (A. Sullivan)
Cheney Lies Again

This is vital, because it reveals just how bad a card Cheney has to play in protecting himself from being prosecuted as a war criminal. The CIA inspector general's report found no evidence that torture had given any information that would not have been found using legal and moral means. Even one of the legal architects of the torture program, Steven Bradbury, had to concede that much:

"It is difficult to quantify with confidence and precision the effectiveness of the program," Steven G. Bradbury, then the Justice Department's principal deputy assistant attorney general, wrote in a May 30, 2005, memo to CIA General Counsel John Rizzo, one of four released last week by the Obama administration.

"As the IG Report notes, it is difficult to determine conclusively whether interrogations provided information critical to interdicting specific imminent attacks. And because the CIA has used enhanced techniques sparingly, 'there is limited data on which to assess their individual effectiveness'," Bradbury wrote, quoting the IG report.

More salient for future war crime prosecutions will be the fact that the actual waterboarding did not even follow the absurd attempts to make it non-torture:

Contrary to Bush administration's insistence that waterboarding carried few risks and that medical concerns were a priority, the CIA didn't initially seek the help of medical professionals in setting up or carrying out the procedure.

"OMS (the CIA's Office of Medical Services) was neither consulted nor involved in the initial analysis of the risk and benefits of (enhanced interrogation techniques)," Bradbury wrote in his May 10, 2005, memo, quoting from the IG's report... Quoting from the IG report, Bradbury wrote, "The waterboard technique . . . was different from the technique described in the DOJ opinion and used in the SERE training . . . At the SERE school . . . the subject's airflow is disrupted by the firm application of a damp cloth over the air passages; the interrogator applies a small amount of water to the cloth in a controlled manner. By contrast, the Agency interrogator . . . applied large volumes of water to a cloth that covered the detainee's mouth and nose."

Bradbury said the inspector general reported: "OMS contends that the expertise of the SERE psychologist/interrogators on the waterboard was probably misrepresented at the time, as the SERE waterboard experience is so different from the subsequent Agency usage as to make it almost irrelevant."

Then the final internal coup de grace: they tortured people they weren't sure knew anything that could be gotten from torture:

"According to the IG Report, the CIA, at least initially, could not always distinguish detainees who had information but were successfully resisting interrogation from those who did not actually have information," Bradbury wrote in his May 30, 2005, memo. "On at least one occasion, this may have resulted in what might be deemed in retrospect to have been the unnecessary use of enhanced techniques.

The case for a war crime prosecution is at this point overwhelming.

http://andrewsullivan.theatlantic.com/the_daily_dish/2009/04/cheney-lies-again.html
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WeDidIt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-25-09 08:21 PM
Response to Original message
1. Cheney will go to prison
or Cheney will die from natural causes exacerbated by the stress leading up to war crimes prosecution.
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jefferson_dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-25-09 08:23 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. Given those two choices, I'm rooting for the former...
'Cause I'm a good guy... :)
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Sarah Ibarruri Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-25-09 08:41 PM
Response to Reply #1
5. You think? I hope and wish! nt
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Optical.Catalyst Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-26-09 07:01 AM
Response to Reply #1
13. Cheney should already be in prison


His forwarding address should read:
Leavenworth, Kansas

<>


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AtomicKitten Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-25-09 08:27 PM
Response to Original message
3. They tortured to back-fill their bogus rationale for invading Iraq.
Edited on Sat Apr-25-09 09:05 PM by AtomicKitten
They should also be tried for lying this country into war.
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WinkyDink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-26-09 06:21 AM
Response to Reply #3
10. Of course! By now this is THE OBVIOUS reason! Have a tortured man's words ON TAPE to give to the
masses.

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rustydog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-25-09 08:34 PM
Response to Original message
4. The most important reply to any Cheny, GOP claim Torture Worked
Really? Then where is Bin Laden?

Are the American public supposed to be so stupid we would believe that with this FANTASTICLY successful interrogation technique euphamisticly called "Enhanced interrogation techniques", Bush simply forgot to ask any terror suspect in Gitmo, Abu Ghraib, (and myriad secret torture sites we had around the globe at the time): Yo, terrorist, where the fuck is Bin Laden?

Dick Cheny, Rumsfeld, Addington, Rice and company must be investigated and if the evidence warrants, these soulless bastards must stand trial.

America, we are so much better than a group of thugs that believed the 24 tv series was real and would be a good policy to follow.
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Gidney N Cloyd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-25-09 08:46 PM
Response to Reply #4
6. You nailed it. If torture works, where the fuck is Bin Laden? nt
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rufus dog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-25-09 08:47 PM
Response to Reply #4
7. Rustydog did you come up with that?
It is perfect, short and sweet. Where is Bin Laden?
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rustydog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-25-09 10:01 PM
Response to Reply #7
9. It drives me nuts that no one in the media is asking this!
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WinkyDink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-26-09 06:24 AM
Response to Reply #4
12. "So I don't know where he is. You know, I just don't spend that much time on him...."
So I don't know where he is. You know, I just don't spend that much time on him, Kelly, to be honest with you...I'll repeat what I said. I truly am not that concerned about him.

http://www.perrspectives.com/blog/archives/000311.htm
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Purrfessor Donating Member (463 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-26-09 03:22 PM
Response to Reply #4
16. I'll add this to my arsenal...
I tried enlighten an old friend of mine about the torture issue; he recently found me on facebook (the first time I'd heard from him in nearly 40 years). He thinks torture is great (he refers to it as enhanced interrogation) and that we should do more of it. When I directed him to some former interrogators who have come out strongly against torture, he refused to even read their reasons for opposing it.

He claims torture prevented the Brooklyn Bridge plot and saved thousands of lives. I linked him to a blog that took apart that assertion on a point-by-point basis. He refused to read it as well, and said he no longer wanted to discuss the matter. He concluded by implying that history would prove him right when he said earlier that Obama is destroying this country.

I tried to ignore him but his Limbaugh-like criticism of Obama eventually got to me and I had to respond. Next time I'll just keep my thoughts to myself when dealing with people like him. It's one thing to have an opinion, and I respect that; it's an entirely different thing to spout right-wing rhetoric (lies) as fact and act like Bush was a great and wonderful president.

Oh, well. I tried to help him out.
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MarjorieG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-25-09 09:03 PM
Response to Original message
8. They wanted an Iraq-Bin Laden link, no matter how phony or ill-gotten.
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WinkyDink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-26-09 06:22 AM
Response to Original message
11. Can we waterboard DICK so we learn the truth about his 9/11 "war-games"?
All of them?
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Jennicut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-26-09 08:12 AM
Response to Reply #11
15. I highly recommend we do. Maybe we can learn some "useful information".
How about it Dick?
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Iwillnevergiveup Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-26-09 07:43 AM
Response to Original message
14. John Dean was right
with his book titled "Worse Than Watergate."
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