The President has Olbermann's wheels a'turnin'!

[Clio the Leo]

Someone help me out here .... I cant explain what I'm trying to say, but Keith is saying that the President's three answers related to torture and state secrets may show that Obama's opinion on the matter may not be as simple as he (Keith) thought ... I THINK what KO was trying to say was something some of us have said .... Barack is purposefully not giving a hard and "final" answer in order to keep the issue in the forefront for the time being until SOMETHING else happens .....

.... I think .... did I charcterize that right?

Gosh, this makes my head hurt lol.

[Uzybone]

1. KO is coming around to a position

that I have seen here many a times on DU. I hope the sanguine DUers who have repeatedly made this point are right.

[Clio the Leo]

4. it's fun watching him sort this out in his head, live on national tv. NT

[jefferson_dem]

2. KO and Rachel are acting really desperate for an angle here...

So POTUS didn't personally indict Boosh, Cheney, and their henchmen from the podium tonight, that means he's weak on torture and accountability. Please. Get a grip.

[Cha]

5. Really..

get a grip guys.

[jefferson_dem]

13. It's moments like these when I realize our guys can be just as base and reactionary as theirs...

n/t

[Cha]

14. I guess sooo and that

political watchers on DU know more about P Obama's "moves" than the professionals:)

[Cha]

34. Think you'll like this..

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x8380536

[high density]

6. Their one note tune on torture isn't much fun to watch

Torture is bad. We want Bush and Cheney prosecuted. We get it. Pestering Dvid Axelrod about it isn't going to make it happen.

[jillan]

7. Did they really think Obama was going to show up with handcuffs tonite?

[Flying Dream Blues]

29. LOL! nt

[jenmito]

11. I think they somehow came to the conclusion that Obama took Cheney's position

in the way he worded the answer. Am I right? 'Cause if so, they're so wrong.

[Thrill]

3. Obama's first statement after releasing the memos, was a clear sign

Its carefully worded. I suggest people read it over and over again. He is not ruling out prosecuting Bush officials

[jillan]

9. Exactly - he has said that no one is above the law.

[Windy]

10. It is in the hands of the attorney general and the DOJ. He has ALWAYS said this

because that is how it is. Its not up to him.

[Perky]

8. Well good frief.... He cant give a hard and final answer

The actual investigation has not even started yet. and him giving his views taints any jury pool.

ANd even if it doesn't Calling a former president and Vepp criminals would be the controlling news cycle for weeks because it sets up a talk show war with out ned,

Let Holder get all the evidence grathed. FOllow the rules of evidence... Follow the leads, and indict when you are ready. WIthout it appearing to me mandated by the president. He understands the balance of powers and power of the presidential voice.

[MissDeeds]

12. It makes my head hurt too

A lot of people are trying to spin this whole thing into something that is palatable. The thought that a Democratic administration would let the crimes of the Bush administration slide is so abhorrent that another explanation must be found - whatever that explanation (excuse) might be. Obama said early on that we need to "look forward" and not focus on the war crimes that cry out for accountability. That is not acceptable. No matter how it's spun.

[ChiciB1]

17. I "Think" I Just Said The Same Thing You Are... Just In A Different Way.... n/t

[ChiciB1]

15. Axelrod Basically Said That They Were Looking Forward & Then

muddling it up again. He also said Obama had read the memos and I for one don't like having to "guess" what the hell is going on!

I'm sick of wondering what we should be "divining" from these answers. Is it tap dancing or tip toeing?? Sounds kind of "secret-eee" too, as Rachel would say!

Out with it already!! I could be out in left field by what I'm saying, but wait... I AM out in left field! And even though the ball has been hit, I can't see it to catch it! I don't know anymore than I have for weeks and weeks!

JMHO!

[Clio the Leo]

20. Yeah, for crying out loud! Why doesn't he just broadcast his daily security briefings....

.... on the internet! What happened to your transparency Mr. Obama!!!!

:sarcasm:

[ChiciB1]

36. Sorry You Feel The Need For Sarcasm... I Just See Things Differently, But I Won't

get sarcastic about it. It just how "I" feel and it's something I have felt strongly about since we first heard about "torture" so many years ago!

However, I DO respect your right not to agree with me.

[Clio the Leo]

41. Dont take my snark personally, I'm pretty snarky by nature....

... that being said, a serious question, do you feel that EVERYTHING done by the gvt. should be for public consumption? Or is there ever a need to keep confidential security matters .... confidential.

[ChiciB1]

44. Seems To Me Like This Issue Isn't On A "Confidential" List Anymore

Nor has it been for a very long time. Regardless, I suppose there are some things that need to be kept secret for the sake of security, but this sore has been festering for a very long time.

And as I mentioned before, most here were screaming about this and how secretive BUSHCO was and breaking the law for such a long time. Most were howling about how the CONSTITUTION was being torn to shreds by them, so now as far as I'm concerned it's time for them to pay the piper! BUSHCO, that is.

I will admit one thing though. I didn't think it was ever going to get this far, so I should be happy for ANY progress!

[stillcool]

21. Well...Nadler and Conyers....

officially requested the Attorney General appoint a Special Prosecutor. In a reply to my email my Congressman said they had been working on it for some time, and would let the investigation take them wherever it went. The pics should be coming out soon, and hopefully more.

[Realtalk]

47. Well... "guess" what?

You might have to keep on guessing and guess again. For now, this is how Obama is rolling. Get used to it.

[high density]

16. Back on torture again

Give us a BREAK!!

[stillcool]

18. I am so happy that Keith and Rachel..

will not let this issue die. I am certain the President of the United States will not initiate any investigation of the former President and his Administration, but I am just fine with him getting pummeled about it if it keeps the issue alive. I think Congress and the District Attorney need to be pressured too.

[ChiciB1]

27. Good To See That There Are Still Some Of Us Who Are Tired Of

all the pussy-footing and puddle jumping! I'm with KO & Rachel and I recall most here at DU were with them when BFEE was yanking our chain!

[treestar]

38. Gathering evidence is not pussyfooting

Please never have a legal problem. You'll be screaming at how long it takes and how much work there is in it.

[ChiciB1]

39. Seems To Me I've Been Hearing THEY HAVE The Evidence... I Think I Just

heard Axelrod say that Obama has seen the memos, and Richard Wolfe said that Spain was going ahead with their plans. I'd rather WE prosecuted before some other country does!

And BTW, I did have a legal problem recently... Bank of America owed me over $7,000 and I GOT IT!!

[stillcool]

43. I don't expect this President..

to be seen actively pursuing any kind of action against the former administration. I really believe that Congress and the Attorney General need to take the lead in this. But I also think that Obama needs to be hounded on this issue relentlessly, because that's the only way to keep the issue alive. I'm shocked that almost half of the American people are okay with torture, and I think this country needs to be saturated with facts about what we've done.

[SemiCharmedQuark]

19. Richard Wolfe talking about it now...

It's cool.

[ChiciB1]

24. Richard Wolfe Is ONE Classy Guy & I Think KO Has Him On So Much

because he has some kind of inside track to what's going on. At least I can "UNDERSTAND" what he says when he says it. He speaks clearly and to the point.

Granted he's NOT the POTUS, and DOJ is the place this has to happen... still I feel like we are being given bones to gnaw on without knowing if we're going to get to eat dinner!

I'm sure many of you here think this issue is being run into the ground, but let's not forget just how LOUDLY we howled WHEN THIS SHIT was going on, and how we were calling for "heads to roll" because of it.

Why is it different now???

[FightingIrish]

22. Keith and Rachel may have lost me tonight.

They seem unwilling to accept anything less than the President making a legal declaration of his predecessor's guilt. When you have a president smarter than the pundits who want to dissect his every move and statement, you get Keith jumping the shark.

[Ilsa]

23. They need patience to watch this play out. It isn't over. nt

[vaberella]

32. Exactly. I'm seeing a lot of people don't have patience. I sat through 8 years of Bush.

I have plenty.

[Ilsa]

46. More than that for me. He was my idiot governor for six years before that. nt

[ChiciB1]

26. And If It Was Cheney Talking Tonight Would You Be Saying The Same Thing??? n/t

[FightingIrish]

42. In case you missed my point, which you obviously did,

unlike Keith and Rachel I have no doubt President Obama wants justice as much as I do. I also have no doubt that he and his legal team have talked about how this will play out. You don't make a case for prosecution by declaring guilt on national television. Doing so would politicize what should be a matter of law and probably give the defendants grounds for appeal.

[Clio the Leo]

28. But that's my whole point....

.... the President's responses tonight seem to have Keith .... perhaps ..... rethinking his opinion of what in the heck the President is doing .... mebbe.

Either way, Countdown will be interesting tomorrow night after Keith has had 24 hours to process what he heard.

From a practical standpoint, I dont agree with Keith and Rachel on this .... but I LOVE the fact that the icons of "liberal media bias" call the President out when they think he's wrong on something.

It's something I doubt we'd ever see Hannity do.

[scrappydo]

25. How many times does someone have to say it....

President Obama jumps into NOTHING with both feet. He gathers the evidence, weighs it, and will pass it on to Holder who is the ultimate decider in this situation. I usually like Keith and Rachel but I am so sick and tired of them forever harping on the torture issue. Torture investigation will comes to its frutation when all the cards are lined up for the ultimate win. President Obama is a poker player and never shows his hand. GEEZ! some of you jump on President Obama no matter what he does or you believe he isn't doing. Have some you not learned that he will never allow his plans out in the open until they are ready to move forward? Oh, people of little faith!!!!!

[Clio the Leo]

30. I also dont think he's very vindictive by nature...

.... we want him to go after Bush et al guns blazing.

Problem is, the president doesn't own any guns and if he did, he wouldn't even know HOW to blaze them. :)

What he DOES know how to do is shake his head in dissapointment and walk away from you, vowing never to give you the opportunity to do it again.

[Blue_Roses]

33. well said!

and thank-you!:applause:

[vaberella]

31. Exactly right Clio. As I've said in the past many people underestimate the O admin.

He's setting shit up little by little. So we run around in circles doing this or that when O knows exactly what he's doing.

[jefferson_dem]

35. Now Rachel is going on and on with Valerie Jarrett about his torture answer...

As if there some there there that she's revealing. Boring.

[FrenchieCat]

37. I switched the channel, 2 minutes after the press conference was over....

when I realized that they didn't get it....or didn't want to.
Almost like they wanted a story that wasn't really there.
Quite disappointed in their entire approach.

[sniffa]

40. KEITH IS DAED TO MEE

[Clio the Leo]

45. Ok now *I* am mad at Rachel...

... and that's saying something.

She plays the clip of the President saying, "not because these techniques didn't yield useful information" and then reads it back as "people being subjected to these techniques DID give us some information?"

ARGH!!! That was NOT what he was saying! He was saying that the REASON why we dont toture has nothing to do with whether or not it's effective (which is what the GOP wants to claim.)

Ok ... I'm firing off an email to her.