to the people bashing Reid over bankruptcy reform

[Enrique]

then what about Obama?

He's the one with all the Wall Street ties, not to mention his general influence over Senators.

So what did he do to ensure this legislation?

As far as I know, pretty much nothing.

I don't want to bash Obama, I just want to know, why isn't any of the bashing aimed at him?

[DJ13]

1. Reid runs the Senate

Where do you think the blame should lie?

[AndyA]

3. That's what I'd like to know.

President Obama can only do so much. That is why there's a Senate Leader. Only the current occupant of that position doesn't seem to do much leading... :eyes:

[lamp_shade]

4. When did he start "running" the Senate.

[Enrique]

6. it should lie on the influence Wall Street has over Congress

there is a group of dem Senators on the East Coast who are particularly a part of the problem.

I supported Hillary in the primaries, but she has been part of the problem. I support Obama, but he has been part of the problem.

I know Harry Reid isn't perfect, but on this issue it's imo just pointless to blame him.

[TwilightZone]

11. You're not making any sense.

You talk about Wall Street influence over Congress being the issue, but you blame Obama?

Odd.

[Enrique]

14. they have influence over Congress, and influence over him

what's so odd about that.

Do you agree, does Wall Street have significant influence over Obama?

[TwilightZone]

19. How does that absolve Reid of responsibility?

This is the Senate we're talking about. It's Reid's job to get the votes.

[Enrique]

21. and it's Obama's job to help

they both failed. Why are people bashing Reid and gushing over Obama's dog?

[DJ13]

13. I agree with you, except for not holding Reid to blame

What our party needs is someone who will assert some influence on his party members, not a guy who cant be bothered to see to it his members support a President from their own party.

Reid is ineffectual at his job, and he should be replaced with someone with a stronger will.

Today it was loan modifications, what happens when even more desperately needed legislation comes to the floor in the future?

[Enrique]

16. replace Harry Reid, the influence of Wall Street remains

that's what's at play here. Dick Durbin agrees with me.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gtHgxziLqCM

[NoSheep]

47. Look into Harry Reid and GOLD. And then find me one damn thing that comes

close to that where Obama is concerned. You can't.

edited because I can't even spell the bastard's name.

[w4rma]

23. This isn't a monarchy. Reid doesn't control the Senators' actions. (nt)

[brentspeak]

26. Clinton almost-singlehandedly pressured the Dems to back his first budget bill

He didn't throw his hands up in the air and say, "Oh, well, I'm just the President, not the Senate leader. Nothing I can do."

[uponit7771]

2. Enrique, could you back up your statements with some sourcing? Thx in advance...

[Enrique]

8. here's one

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/01/business/01credit.html?hp

But supporters of the legislation disputed that argument. President Obama sought the cramdown provision during the election, although the White House has done virtually nothing to move it through Congress.

[FrenchieCat]

5. Because he is the reason that such a bill was brought forth to begin with?

When it is called the Obama bankruptcy bill, that should give you a hint!


Mortgage Bankruptcy Bill 2009 - Does Obama's Bankruptcy Bill Provide Foreclosure Relief to Homeowner
http://ezinearticles.com/?Mortgage-Bankruptcy-Bill-2009-Does-Obamas-Bankruptcy-Bill-Provide-Foreclosure-Relief-to-Homeowner&id=2222164


the house passed it!

House Passes Mortgage Bankruptcy Bill
The legislation, which now heads to the U.S. Senate for consideration, empowers federal judges to modify the mortgages for borrowers who file for bankruptcy.

The House passed a bill Thursday intended to ease the burden on homeowners struggling to pay their mortgages.

The so-called "cram down" bill passed by a 234-191 margin. The final tally was not entirely party-line as 24 Democrats voted against the bill and seven Republicans supported the measure.

The legislation, which now heads to the U.S. Senate for consideration, empowers federal judges to modify the mortgages for borrowers who file for bankruptcy, including lengthening loan terms, reducing interest rates and cutting principal payments.

The bill is officially dubbed the "Helping Families Save Their Home Act," but is known as the "cram down" bill because it enables judges to reduce or cram down the size of the mortgage.
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009/03/05/house-passes-mortgage-bankruptcy/


IT'S THE SENATE'S FAULT THAT IT DIDN'T PASS.

THEY ARE CALLING IT A DEFEAT FOR BARACK OBAMA....

So blame him if you must, but it ain't really his fault.

[saracat]

9. it isn't Obama's fault , but he didn't do anything to "lean" on anyone

and shepard it through either. Proposing it is one thing, getting it through is another. Reid didn't do his job either. Reid needed to lean on the Senate along with Obama.

[ShortnFiery]

17. No, Obama must stay pure ... yes, IMO, it is partly his fault but mostly Reid's for not

telling those nasty Blue Dogs and Third Wayers (right wing democrats) "where the bear shits in the woods." :wow: :(

[Sebastian Doyle]

7. Spineless Reid needs to do his goddamn job, or step the fuck down

We need a majority leader to kick these cowards right in their DLC Blue Balls and make them ACT LIKE FUCKING DEMOCRATS.

[Enrique]

10. mad at Obama too?

[Sebastian Doyle]

15. Now that you mention it, I don't care much for his so called "economic team"

I don't think Wall Street whores, Federal Reserve flunkies, and Clintonista rejects are the ones to fix the problems that THEY helped create.

But Reid was a spineless coward long before they were in office.

[snowdays]

12. Banking lobby successfully defeats mortgage cram-down provision.

The money factor was just too big for some.

Durbin Smacks Senate for Influence of Banking Industry



http://thinkprogress.org/2009/04/30/cram-down-lost /

Banking lobby successfully defeats mortgage cram-down provision.

Today, a proposal to change bankruptcy law and allow bankruptcy judges to cram-down mortgage payments for troubled homeowners failed in the Senate by a vote of 45-51. The provision, which was introduced as an amendment by Sen. Dick Durbin (D-IL), required 60 votes to pass. In recent weeks, support for the measure evaporated in the face of furious lobbying by the banking and mortgage industries. Prior to the vote, Durbin -- who this week said that bankers "are still the most powerful lobby on Capitol Hill" -- took to the floor to decry the banking industry's influence in the cram-down debate:

At some point the senators in this chamber will decide the bankers shouldn't write the agenda for the United States Senate. At some point the people in this chamber will decide the people we represent are not the folks working in the big banks, but the folks struggling to make a living and struggling to keep a decent home.


.................

And Dems helped defeat this amendment:




http://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_lists/roll_call_vote_cfm.cfm?congress=111&session=1&vote=00174#position


U.S. Senate Roll Call Votes 111th Congress - 1st Session

as compiled through Senate LIS by the Senate Bill Clerk under the direction of the Secretary of the Senate

Vote Summary

Question: On the Amendment (Durbin Amdt. No. 1014 )
Vote Number: 174Vote Date: April 30, 2009, 02:47 PM

Required For Majority: 3/5Vote Result: Amendment Rejected

Amendment Number: S.Amdt. 1014 to S. 896 (Helping Families Save Their Homes Act of 2009)
Statement of Purpose: To prevent mortgage foreclosures and preserve home values.


Grouped By Vote Position

YEAs ---45


Akaka (D-HI)
Bayh (D-IN)
Begich (D-AK)
Bingaman (D-NM)
Boxer (D-CA)
Brown (D-OH)
Burris (D-IL)
Cantwell (D-WA)
Cardin (D-MD)
Casey (D-PA)
Conrad (D-ND)
Dodd (D-CT)
Durbin (D-IL)
Feingold (D-WI)
Feinstein (D-CA)
Gillibrand (D-NY)
Hagan (D-NC)
Harkin (D-IA)
Inouye (D-HI)
Kaufman (D-DE)
Kerry (D-MA)
Klobuchar (D-MN)
Kohl (D-WI)
Lautenberg (D-NJ)
Leahy (D-VT)
Levin (D-MI)
Lieberman (ID-CT)
McCaskill (D-MO)
Menendez (D-NJ)
Merkley (D-OR)
Mikulski (D-MD)
Murray (D-WA)
Nelson (D-FL)
Reed (D-RI)
Reid (D-NV)
Sanders (I-VT)
Schumer (D-NY)
Shaheen (D-NH)
Stabenow (D-MI)
Udall (D-CO)
Udall (D-NM)
Warner (D-VA)
Webb (D-VA)
Whitehouse (D-RI)
Wyden (D-OR)


NAYs ---51



Alexander (R-TN)
Barrasso (R-WY)
Baucus (D-MT)
Bennet (D-CO)
Bennett (R-UT)
Bond (R-MO)
Brownback (R-KS)
Bunning (R-KY)
Burr (R-NC)
Byrd (D-WV)
Carper (D-DE)
Chambliss (R-GA)
Coburn (R-OK)
Cochran (R-MS)
Collins (R-ME)
Corker (R-TN)
Cornyn (R-TX)
Crapo (R-ID)
DeMint (R-SC)
Dorgan (D-ND)
Ensign (R-NV)
Enzi (R-WY)
Graham (R-SC)
Grassley (R-IA)
Gregg (R-NH)
Hatch (R-UT)
Hutchison (R-TX)
Inhofe (R-OK)
Isakson (R-GA)
Johanns (R-NE)
Johnson (D-SD)
Kyl (R-AZ)
Landrieu (D-LA)
Lincoln (D-AR)
Lugar (R-IN)
Martinez (R-FL)
McCain (R-AZ)
McConnell (R-KY)
Murkowski (R-AK)
Nelson (D-NE)
Pryor (D-AR)
Risch (R-ID)
Roberts (R-KS)
Shelby (R-AL)
Snowe (R-ME)
Specter (D-PA)
Tester (D-MT)
Thune (R-SD)
Vitter (R-LA)
Voinovich (R-OH)
Wicker (R-MS)

Not Voting - 3
Kennedy (D-MA)
Rockefeller (D-WV)
Sessions (R-AL)

[bigwillq]

18. Reid needed to go long before this.

:mad:

[tavalon]

20. In the post Bush world, there really is a separation of co-equal branches of govt.

[Enrique]

22. meaning when legislation fails, blame lies with Congress?

hm, so when legislation passes, Pelosi and Reid will get all the credit. Don't think so.

[Uzybone]

29. of course they get the credit

how do you determine an effective legislator?

[w4rma]

24. This bill needed to pass. This is bad news for the nation. The DLC just gave us a longer depression

And a worse one.

[alcibiades_mystery]

25. Yeesh

:eyes:

[babylonsister]

27. Where'd the meme come from that Obama has all the Wall Street ties?

News to me.

[TwilightZone]

28. He must, he's a "corporatist".

Or so I've heard.

[Better Believe It]

30. Reid "runs" the Senate. Senators are not free to vote for working people? Who "runs" the party?

[Enrique]

31. according to Durbin, it's the banks

blame Reid all you want, but if he's gone, will this be any different?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gtHgxziLqCM

[Better Believe It]

32. One can also blame the Obama Administration

President Barack Obama had said the bill was important to saving the economy and promised to push for its passage. But facing stiff opposition from banks, Obama did little to lean on lawmakers who worried it might spike interest rates.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/30503750

-----------------------------
In February, the newly inaugurated president included the proposal as the stick in a housing plan full of carrots for the banking industry. The broader rescue plan encouraged, but did not require, lenders to cut homeowners' monthly payments and refinance loans for individuals whose home's market value has sunk below what they owe.

But the bankruptcy option got only a tepid endorsement from Treasury Secretary Timothy Geithner. As debate on the measure brewed, Geithner was pushing for the creation of a government-sponsored program that would rely on private investors to buy the risky mortgage-backed securities weighing down the market.

In recent days, as it became clear the bill would fail, the administration did little to counter the aggressive lobbying by banks fighting the bill and focused its efforts instead on a more popular bill targeting credit card companies.

Spokeswomen at the Treasury Department and White House did not respond to requests for comment, and absent from the debate was any statement of administration policy.

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Senate-defeats-Obamabacke...

[ClarkUSA]

33. I have an idea! Why not blame the actual senators who voted against it?

[Better Believe It]

39. Of course, that shouldn't excuse those Democrats who failed to fight hard for passage of the bill.

Isn't that right? Or do you think we should give them a free pass?

[Laelth]

34. Let us hope the President has enough of FDR's spirit in him to rebound.

"If we can not do this one way, we will do it another, but do it we shall." -FDR

:dem:

-Laelth

[anonymous171]

35. Because Reid deserves it. Getting the votes is his fucking job. nt

[MasonJar]

36. Obama pushed hard for the Wall Street bailout money and the Stimulus

package and the budget, going out to town halls, pushing hard in the Congress, having both sides in, etc. Has he spoken on this? Barely if at all. So he goes after what he wants. He obviously was not willing to take a strong position on this legislation. So do NOT excuse him because he is not in the Senate any more.

[stillcool]

37. Obama was a Senator...

when the bail-out bill was passed..and why do you have a problem with the stimulus, or the budget? Don't you think they were priorities? And..does Obama have to do everything..or is Congress actually capable of legislating? I guess not.

[heronkid]

40. Congress are a bunch of incompetents.

Most congressmen are self serving, not for the people at all.
Back in Sept 2008, most of the country was against the proposed bailout. Congress (and Obama as senator) voted for the bail out.

Spector switched not because of ideology but to try to keep his seat.

Find one senator or congressman that is in power and has done something noteworthy & for their country's good.

[stillcool]

44. My Congressman and My Senators..

have done noteworthy things for my state. Which is why I keep voting for them. My Congressman has local meetings fairly regularly..he has never voted against my wishes. I think he is wonderful! As far as the bailout is concerned, I was, and still am convinced that some kind of action was necessary..just like in other countries across the globe. But our government has a habit of making every crisis an opportunity for gain.

[heronkid]

49. and the 8000+ pork that Congress added

I assume that you're happy with the fact during the last budget voted by these buffoons, that they added over 8000+ pork barrel projects. This happened at a time when the country is in a severe recession and facing potentially depression, unemployment is sky-high, taxes are going through the roof, housing prices falling, businesses and companies failing, etc.

In prior recessions, we could count on other countries doing well enough to help the global economy, not this time.

Meanwhile, we're handing out money with no questions asked to the Wall Street who scammed all of us and adding to the gargantuan budget deficit. The only way they will be able to pay for all of this is with hyper-inflation in the range of 20-30% annually.

Oh it won't come all at once. First only 5% in the first year, then it will ratchet up. Soon your $100K salary will be worth only 80K after the first 3 years, then $60K, etc. In less than 10 yrs, this country will be no better than Zimbabwe.

[stillcool]

38. Legislators..

are responsible for legislating?

[Better Believe It]

41. Reid's Game Plan To Help Republicans Kill Progressive Legislation

It appears that Senator Reid will only bring legislation for a vote on the Senate floor if he is convinced it will be defeated, like the bankruptcy bill.

And if more than 50 votes are assured for passage of a bill, Senator Reid will not introduce the bill because the Republicans MIGHT threaten a filibuster!

Do you detect this possible pattern developing for the rest of this year and beyond?

[Better Believe It]

42. Because Reid is a convenient target who takes the heat off of President Obama?

I don't know.

Just a guess.

[Egnever]

43. considering your post right above this one

you are sounding a little um....two minded on this one.

[Better Believe It]

45. That's because both comments are true!

This appears to be Senator Reid's MO and his behavior also takes the heat off President Obama if he fails to campaign hard in support of progressive legislation that is opposed by Wall Street.

[dionysus]

46. the clue phone rings... to tell you Obama's not in the senate...

are you daft?

[Trajan]

48. You realize this is a fallacious appeal ... right ?

The fact of Reid's stance on the issue has nothing whatsoever to do with the fact of Obama's stance on the issue ...

Reid leads the body of government that rejected recent legislation most of us deem important - Obama has not acted on any such legislation ...

Reid is the kindergarten teacher who couldn't line up his students for assembly - That is HIS problem, not Obama's (directly) ...