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Kerry Accuses Bush Of Dishonesty On Iraq (Read This Thread Or I QUIT!)

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KittyWampus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-15-04 11:13 PM
Original message
Kerry Accuses Bush Of Dishonesty On Iraq (Read This Thread Or I QUIT!)
Edited on Wed Sep-15-04 11:15 PM by cryingshame
This is what we have been waiting for people.



Kerry Accuses Bush Of Dishonesty on Iraq



John F. Kerry accused President Bush (news - web sites) on Wednesday of misleading Americans about a spiraling
crisis in Iraq (news - web sites), saying the president has not been honest about the strength of the anti-American
insurgency and the diminishing chances of free and fair elections in January.

"The president has misled America about those weapons, about the intelligence, about the war," the Democratic
presidential nominee said on the Don Imus show on MSNBC. "He's misled America about what we're achieving today
and what is happening on the ground in Iraq."

As part of twin strikes on Bush's credibility on the war and the economy, Kerry said the president's failures in Iraq
have complicated efforts to bring U.S. troops home sooner and have created large swaths of Iraq "where there are
terrorists where they were not before."

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/washpost/20040916/pl_washpost/a22980_2004sep15&cid=1803&ncid=1480
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ClassWarrior Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-15-04 11:15 PM
Response to Original message
1. Read it! Thanks.
These are the "issues," folks, that we keep claiming we want to discuss. Sooo? Discuss!


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LittleClarkie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-15-04 11:17 PM
Response to Reply #1
6. Greetings
ClassWarrior!

I'm in Wisconsin too!

So proud of Feingold I could burst.

So perplexed when folks say "He didn't support the Patriot Act" as if that were a bad thing.

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ClassWarrior Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-15-04 11:21 PM
Response to Reply #6
8. Welcome to DU fellow Cheesehead!
I'm proud of Russ too. One of the few politicians with real integrity.

And I'm proud of Brew Town's Gwen Moore - soon to be Wisconsin's first African American representative in Congress, and a TRUE progressive!

I love our state. C'mon over to the Wisconsin forum some time. A bunch of great people there.


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LittleClarkie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-15-04 11:42 PM
Response to Reply #8
21. Yahoo group?
I may already be there, just not posting.
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alarcojon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-15-04 11:27 PM
Response to Reply #6
13. I've seen him speak several times here in Western Wisconsin
and the Patriot Act part of the speech always seems to get the loudest applause.
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HootieMcBoob Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-15-04 11:15 PM
Response to Original message
2. Keep it up John Kerry
Maybe eventually someone in the mainstream media will notice
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-15-04 11:15 PM
Response to Original message
3. What I have read and seen last few days, he is speaking out firmly.
He is putting the problem on Bush....Bush owns it .. He is doing better on addressing the war.
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Sydnie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-15-04 11:15 PM
Response to Original message
4. The link doesn't work ... but don't quit!!!!
try the link again please.
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KittyWampus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-15-04 11:16 PM
Response to Reply #4
5. LOL! Fixed The Link... Sorry For My Agita!
Edited on Wed Sep-15-04 11:17 PM by cryingshame
:)
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Sydnie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-15-04 11:32 PM
Response to Reply #5
17. Thanks! Read it!!! Go Johnny Go!!! n/t
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KittyWampus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-16-04 06:11 PM
Response to Reply #17
26. Kick, For Tonight's Crowd
:)
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existentialist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-15-04 11:18 PM
Response to Original message
7. George W.'s dishonesty
Yes, I read it, and while its about time Kerry hit Bush on his dishonesty, its certainly not that he's the first or the only one.

Here's a good one:

Sept. 16, 2004 | For 25 years, Yoshi Tsurumi, one of George W. Bush's professors at Harvard Business School, was content with his green-card status as a permanent legal resident of the United States. But Bush's ascension to the presidency in 2001 prompted the Japanese native to secure his American citizenship. The reason: to be able to speak out with the full authority of citizenship about why he believes Bush lacks the character and intellect to lead the world's oldest and most powerful democracy.

"I don't remember all the students in detail unless I'm prompted by something," Tsurumi said in a telephone interview Wednesday. "But I always remember two types of students. One is the very excellent student, the type as a professor you feel honored to be working with. Someone with strong social values, compassion and intellect -- the very rare person you never forget. And then you remember students like George Bush, those who are totally the opposite."

The future president was one of 85 first-year MBA students in Tsurumi's macroeconomic policies and international business class in the fall of 1973 and spring of 1974. Tsurumi was a visiting associate professor at Harvard Business School from January 1972 to August 1976; today, he is a professor of international business at Baruch College in New York.

Trading as usual on his father's connections, Bush entered Harvard in 1973 for a two-year program. He'd just come off what George H.W. Bush had once called his eldest son's "nomadic years" -- partying, drifting from job to job, working on political campaigns in Florida and Alabama and, most famously, apparently not showing up for duty in the Alabama National Guard.

Harvard Business School's rigorous teaching methods, in which the professor interacts aggressively with students, and students are encouraged to challenge each other sharply, offered important insights into Bush, Tsurumi said. In observing students' in-class performances, "you develop pretty good ideas about what are their weaknesses and strengths in terms of thinking, analysis, their prejudices, their backgrounds and other things that students reveal," he said.

One of Tsurumi's standout students was Rep. Chris Cox, R-Calif., now the seventh-ranking member of the House Republican leadership. "I typed him as a conservative Republican with a conscience," Tsurumi said. "He never confused his own ideology with economics, and he didn't try to hide his ignorance of a subject in mumbo jumbo. He was what I call a principled conservative." (Though clearly a partisan one. On Wednesday, Cox called for a congressional investigation of the validity of documents that CBS News obtained for a story questioning Bush's attendance at Guard duty in Alabama.)

Bush, by contrast, "was totally the opposite of Chris Cox," Tsurumi said. "He showed pathological lying habits and was in denial when challenged on his prejudices and biases. He would even deny saying something he just said 30 seconds ago. He was famous for that. Students jumped on him; I challenged him." When asked to explain a particular comment, said Tsurumi, Bush would respond, "Oh, I never said that." A White House spokeswoman did not return a phone call seeking comment.

In 1973, as the oil and energy crisis raged, Tsurumi led a discussion on whether government should assist retirees and other people on fixed incomes with heating costs. Bush, he recalled, "made this ridiculous statement and when I asked him to explain, he said, 'The government doesn't have to help poor people -- because they are lazy.' I said, 'Well, could you explain that assumption?' Not only could he not explain it, he started backtracking on it, saying, 'No, I didn't say that.'"

If Cox had been in the same class, Tsurumi said, "I could have asked him to challenge that and he would have demolished it. Not personally or emotionally, but intellectually."

Bush once sneered at Tsurumi for showing the film "The Grapes of Wrath," based on John Steinbeck's novel of the Depression. "We were in a discussion of the New Deal, and he called Franklin Roosevelt's policies 'socialism.' He denounced labor unions, the Securities and Exchange Commission, Medicare, Social Security, you name it. He denounced the civil rights movement as socialism. To him, socialism and communism were the same thing. And when challenged to explain his prejudice, he could not defend his argument, either ideologically, polemically or academically."

Students who challenged and embarrassed Bush in class would then become the subject of a whispering campaign by him, Tsurumi said. "In class, he couldn't challenge them. But after class, he sometimes came up to me in the hallway and started bad-mouthing those students who had challenged him. He would complain that someone was drinking too much. It was innuendo and lies. So that's how I knew, behind his smile and his smirk, that he was a very insecure, cunning and vengeful guy."

Many of Tsurumi's students came from well-connected or wealthy families, but good manners prevented them from boasting about it, the professor said. But Bush seemed unabashed about the connections that had brought him to Harvard. "The other children of the rich and famous were at least well bred to the point of realizing universal values and standards of behavior," Tsurumi said. But Bush sometimes came late to class and often sat in the back row of the theater-like classroom, wearing a bomber jacket from the Texas Air National Guard and spitting chewing tobacco into a cup.

"At first, I wondered, 'Who is this George Bush?' It's a very common name and I didn't know his background. And he was such a bad student that I asked him once how he got in. He said, 'My dad has good friends.'" Bush scored in the lowest 10 percent of the class.

The Vietnam War was still roiling campuses and Harvard was no exception. Bush expressed strong support for the war but admitted to Tsurumi that he'd gotten a coveted spot in the Texas Air National Guard through his father's connections.

"I used to chat up a number of students when we were walking back to class," Tsurumi said. "Here was Bush, wearing a Texas Guard bomber jacket, and the draft was the No. 1 topic in those days. And I said, 'George, what did you do with the draft?' He said, 'Well, I got into the Texas Air National Guard.' And I said, 'Lucky you. I understand there is a long waiting list for it. How'd you get in?' When he told me, he didn't seem ashamed or embarrassed. He thought he was entitled to all kinds of privileges and special deals. He was not the only one trying to twist all their connections to avoid Vietnam. But then, he was fanatically for the war."

Tsurumi told Bush that someone who avoided a draft while supporting a war in which others were dying was a hypocrite. "He realized he was caught, showed his famous smirk and huffed off."

Tsurumi's conclusion: Bush is not as dumb as his detractors allege. "He was just badly brought up, with no discipline, and no compassion," he said.

In recent days, Tsurumi has told his story to various print and television outlets and appears in Kitty Kelley's exposé "The Family: The Real Story of the Bush Dynasty." He said other professors and students at the business school from that time share his recollections but are afraid to come forward, fearing ostracism or retribution. And why is Tsurumi speaking up now? Because with the ongoing bloodshed in Iraq and Osama bin Laden still on the loose -- not to mention a federal deficit ballooning out of control -- the stakes are too high to remain silent. "Obviously, I don't think he is the best person" to be running the country, he said. "I wanted to explain why."

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speedoo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-15-04 11:24 PM
Response to Reply #7
10. Holy Tsurumi!!!
That is the most scathing stuff anyone with direct knowledge has ever said about the coWard!!

Great find.

Do you have a link, or at least a source?
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nomatrix Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-16-04 12:30 AM
Response to Reply #7
23. Welcome to DU
Excellent post, wicasa. Where's the link for that?
Arrogant all along.
Scored in the lowest 10 percent of his class.

Scored the lowest 10 percent of presidents.
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yardwork Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-15-04 11:23 PM
Response to Original message
9. Rate it. It's being freeped and if it gets low yahoo will drop it
So rate it a "5" at the bottom of the page. Thanks!
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Doug Decker Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-15-04 11:28 PM
Response to Reply #9
14. Done and done. n/t
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Booster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-15-04 11:24 PM
Response to Original message
11. Read it and loved it. Just keep hammerin' John
on the credibility thing - timing in life is everything.
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mbali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-15-04 11:27 PM
Response to Original message
12. Yeah - but he didn't look really really mean when he said it...
he's just not trying hard enough...
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NMDemDist2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-15-04 11:29 PM
Response to Original message
15. read, rated and I saw the speech on CSpan, now will you stay? n/t
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oasis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-15-04 11:31 PM
Response to Original message
16. Read and appreciated. Thanks.
Edited on Wed Sep-15-04 11:40 PM by oasis
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dennis4868 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-15-04 11:35 PM
Response to Original message
18. Thank you Mr. Kerry....
but you have to say this more and more:

"The president has misled America about those weapons, about the intelligence, about the war,"
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Tangledog Donating Member (312 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-15-04 11:39 PM
Response to Original message
19. I just put it up to 2.75 n/t
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autorank Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-15-04 11:40 PM
Response to Original message
20. Excellent post. We need more of this!!!!! n/t/
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DemBones DemBones Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-16-04 12:17 AM
Response to Original message
22. Thanks for posting this. I have rated it &

other stories that are good for Dems. Too bad Yahoo doesn't just keep important news "on top" but we can out-DU the freepers w/o breaking a sweat.

:kick:
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RevolutionStartsNow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-16-04 12:50 AM
Response to Original message
24. Well, he's right!
Edited on Thu Sep-16-04 12:52 AM by Amerikav60
But is anyone listening?

Edit: Yes I know lots of people are listening, but I wish MORE people would hear what Kerry is saying and realize how badly * screwed up and how desperately we need to dump him. I figure the polls are just plain wrong, but I still can't grasp more than a very small percentage of people supporting *. Boggles the mind.
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Dr Fate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-16-04 12:52 AM
Response to Original message
25. The "L" word needs to get out into the media.
"Dishonest" is a start.

The "L" word will get you "on the TV."

If it aint "on the TV," it didn't happen.
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Psst_Im_Not_Here Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-16-04 06:18 PM
Response to Original message
27. Double done
n/t
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