Got into a discussion with a freeper co-worker

[NEDem]

this afternoon. I have been trying to avoid him at all costs, but I find his views hilarious, so black and white, so narrow minded that I occasionally slip up and we chat.

Anyway this afternoon we started talking, and he kept saying over and over how * was going to win "because its written". When I finally pushed him on it, he said that * was chosen by God, and God will see to it that he gets another 4 years. Apparently this guy thinks that * is referenced in Revelations.

Now I've seen stories about how people believe this, but I'd never met one. Where do they come up with this stuff?

I am not a Christian nor do I have any interest in organized religion, so I'm really at a loss for how to address this crap. Any DU'rs ever run into these kinds of people before?

[cheezus]

1. just wait until nov 3

if kerry wins, it is certainly PROOF that god doesn't exist

[Hepburn]

LMBO!!!! What a great line!!!!! n/t

[NEDem]

4. Thats what I keep thinking

How many suicide cults will be left on Nov. 3?

[VOX]

2. Whoa. If this guy believes in predestination, he might as well just...

sit on his can and wait for God to give him a directive or two.

Mercifully, I'm in So. Calif., and while we have our fair share of nutcases, I don't run across too many of these here.

BTW, would this guy agree that Clinton was also chosen by God? Just wondering.

[ThomCat]

3. Ask him what else is written.

What, exactly, does revelations tell him about the modern world? Chances are he won't have anything to report except this one prediction.

If he does have other predictions then prepare to be very amused.

[TexasBushwhacker]

16. Bush's "Christian" Blood Cult

The Pope thinks Bush is part of Biblical prophecy too:

"Bush's blood lust, his repeated commitment to Christian beliefs, and his constant references to "evil doers," in the eyes of many devout Catholic leaders, bear all the hallmarks of the one warned about in the Book of Revelations - the anti-Christ. People close to the Pope claim that amid these concerns, the Pontiff wishes he was younger and in better health to confront the possibility that Bush may represent the person prophesized in Revelations. John Paul II has always believed the world was on the precipice of the final confrontation between Good and Evil as foretold in the New Testament."

http://www.counterpunch.org/madsen04222003.html

I wonder what your co-worker would have to say about that?

[NEDem]

23. I'll let you know, he'll have a copy of this Tuesday morning

[crispini]

29. Holy cr*p!

I hadn't read that article before. Interesting viewpoint coming out of the Vatican. The article didn't havae many citations tho... how reliable is it? and if that viewpoint is the case, why isn't there more about that out there? altho I am not a Catholic so am not up on Catholic websites, etc.

[TexasBushwhacker]

38. It all comes back to the same journalist - Madsen

It was originally published in the New Catholic Times, but I've seen it reprinted and referred to in several places on the web. Just Google "Pope Bush Antichrist" and you'll come up with pages of links.

[Cha]

30. Wow! Just Wow!

So I can quote the Pope and say he thinks bush is the anti-Christ?!!

[Lefty48197]

5. Actually shrub was chosen by the "supreme" court, and his 4 years are up

.

[troubleinwinter]

6. Ask him for 'CHAPTER and VERSE'

where it "is written", and we'll look it up! I do not recall anyone in the Bible called Chimpy-Bunnypants.

[West Coast Democrat]

7. I would tell him, there's no need for him to go out and vote then!

[LoZoccolo]

8. Just ask him if he's worried at all...

...if he's putting words in God's mouth.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

9. I think their adulation of B*sh has become downright cultic.

It can't be explained any other way. Somehow they think God speaks through B*sh (and if that's true, God has a really twisted sense of humor), and they can't be reasoned with. I truly think that if he handed out cyanide-laced Kool-Aid at a rally and said God wanted them to drink it "for America," a lot of these loons would do it. It's just inexplicable unless you think of it as a cult. Some people will need serious deprogramming.

[NEDem]

17. He did say

God speak through *, to which I responded "You would've thought God would have chosen someone with a little better speaking skills to carry his message." He wasn't amused

[mahina]

46. Well I think it's funny!

:)

[yardwork]

10. Yes, this talking point seems to be making the rounds of some churches

I know some people who are going to vote for chimp "because he's a Godly man," whatever that means. They disagree with everything he stands for, but they won't let themselves see that. Somebody has brainwashed them into believing that chimp's presidency - and his wars, which they refer to as "noble wars" - are part of God's plan.

It's times like this that I am somewhat relieved that I no longer call myself a Christian. I have a lot of respect for a lot of Christians and I recognize the good that the Church does. However.

[scarletwoman]

11. Of COURSE * is "referenced in Revelations" -- he's the AntiChrist!

Disclaimer: I really know absolutely NOTHING about Revelations, I'm not a Christian either. But that would be MY immediate reply to someone spouting that kind of nonsense. :evilgrin:

sw

[NEDem]

19. I said that to

I told him we should shave *'s head and check for the mark.

[kikiek]

12. Gotta wonder if people who can't handle the stress of the real world

find some kind of solace in the thought that they have no control over it at all.

[seabeyond]

13. firstly i have found most of these people dont go to church

they dont know the bible and they cant quote. but if they can, in my non religious being i know enough i can take them down cause everything of who bush is, is contrary to christianity, and everything bush has done, the behavior is against the bible.

without going into specifics, grinnin

[LisaL]

14. Just ask him if he thinks if

Bush is the anti-Christ, and that is why he is so sure Bush will win?

[gratuitous]

15. Go back and tell him you've been thinking about what he said

Ask him chapter and verse of where it's written that Stupidhead is supposed to win the election. Heck, ask him to write the citations down for you.

Then skedaddle back here, and let us know what he's talking about. I can't think of more than three or four (hundred) posters who can turn his citations inside out.

This is, of course, strictly for fun.

[NEDem]

20. Great idea, I'll do that Tuesday.

[alcuno]

27. Don't do the "Revelations" debate. It's a waste of time.

See my post below because the question isn't whether * is IN Revelations, it's whether he THINKS he's in Revelations.

BTW - My Catholic Bible tells me that Revelations was just a piece of apocalyptic literature popular at the time.

[MsUnderstood]

18. Maybe he was looking at the Old testament and got confused

You know Exodus 3 where it says

"And the Angel of the LORD appeared to him in a flame of fire from the midst of a bush. So he looked, and behold, the bush was burning with fire, but the bush was not consumed."

It is true that the president's pants are on fire, but he is still alive. . .

[NEDem]

21. LOL!

[Jackpine Radical]

22. Sometimes I just tell them

that their delusional system doesn't seem to overlap with mine on that particular point.

[LittleClarkie]

24. He's referenced alright -- as the ANTI-CHRIST!!

I didn't know they were such big supporters of the big A-C.

I still believe in God. I'm praying for the best man to win, and if he deems ours worthy, to lead us to victory.

If we go to hell in a handbasket, it will be another example of "getting the government you deserve."

Rush was freaking me out today, suggesting that with a Bush win, the Republicans will be unbeatable and will slowly solidify their base, weakening Democrats so that they will dominate in the Presidency and both Houses until 2012.

Where's a good rapture when you need it. Get me outta here!!!

[Sugarbleus]

45. LOL-->Where's a good rapture when you need it. Get me outta here!!!

n/t

[MasterD]

25. Even though...

...you aren't a Christian, you could do what I've done. When they bring up the "chosen by God" nonsense, look at them straight in the eye and coolly say "Where I come from, that's BLASPHEMY."

I usually get a "deer-in-headlights" look in response. Shuts them up.

And yes, I really do consider it blasphemy. Kerry is a better Christian than the whole administration put together. ('Course, that's not saying much...)

[merh]

28. Welcome to DU MasterD

I agree with you -- it is blasphemy and they need to be told that every time they make the statement.

Enjoy DU, there are a lot of opinionated, well read folks with great minds that post here. I believe you will fit in well. Be careful though, DU is very addicting!

Welcome to DU :hi:

[MasterD]

51. Thank you...

...for the warm welcome!

DU is quite addicting - I've been lurking for the better part of this year. Quite a lot of information here - the signal-to-noise ratio is better than many other sites.

See you around the forum!

[newyawker99]

53. Hi MasterD!!

Welcome to DU!! :toast:

[Tsiyu]

31. Welcome master D

Great response. Christ said all manner of sins would be forgiven, but that the unforgiveable sin was blaspheming the Holy Spirit. If they are claiming the Holy Spirit is guiding us to war in Iraq, to torture prisoners, to make the rich richer and the poor poorer, hmmmmm. What would Jesus say about that?

I don't want to judge, but if there is a God, someone's gonna get judged.

[crispini]

34. Nicely said!

and welcome to DU!

[alcuno]

26. The Apocalyptic President.

I believe there is even a book by this title. The question is, should we really have a president in office who BELIEVES that he is featured in Revelations? A president who, when faced with an international crisis, thinks he is playing out his part in the "end times?" Does your crazy co-worker really think THAT'S the person who should have his finger on the trigger of a nuclear armageddon?

[lgardengate]

32. My Christian Mom and her friends say different

They believe Bush to be a faithful Christian who does his best to obey God.They believe that God chose Bush to lead partly because of Sept 11.THat he had the faith and strengeth to get the nation through it and to defend us from the muslim fanatic's.These women could not be more kind in almost every way,but they see Islam as a false,gutter religion.

Also,a while back i got an email from a "cyber pastor", he claimed Bush would lose because he refused (then) to back the anti-gay marriage ban to the constitution.He was orginising Christians to pray for Bush and now that Bush changed his mind and has come out for the ban he thinks Bush is now obeying God again.He was telling Christians that if Kerry wins they will be very badly persecuted by Kerry and his admin. and by the left wing in America.

[southern democrat]

33. You Freeper friend is a fool and a heathern who has O.D.ed on the Koolaid

[NEDem]

39. He's not a friend, I work down the hall from him.

I run into him occasionally during a smoke break.

I think he's completely nuts and try my best to stay away from him. I didn't make eye contact with him for 6 months until about a week ago when he baited me with some bullshit line about Kerry.

Today I decided to challenge him with the Guardian story about * family history with the Nazis, since he's an alleged supporter of Israel I thought I'd catch him off guard. After explaining the story too him he gave me a dear in the headlights look for a minute and then went off on the whole God thing.

[Mr_Spock]

35. Bumper Sticker: "Psychotic Cultists for Bush"

Are these people out of their friggin' minds? Talk like that will end up destroying our country - what a disaster religion can be for an impressionable person - sheesh!

[gauguin57]

36. It may sound ridiculous, but not only could this kind of crap sway the

election... but this Revelations stuff is also causing born-agains to put pressure on the Bush Administration to favor Israel over the Palestinians in the Middle East crisis ... because Israel has to have the land it has, the HoRo's say, for the Rapture to happen (which, of course, will leave the Jews behind, but the Jesus freaks won't care by that point -- they'll be in heaven).

See this 60 Minutes story from 2002.

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2002/10/03/60minutes/main524268.shtml

"For Christians who interpret the bible in a literal fashion, Israel has a crucial role to play in bringing on the Second Coming of Christ. Last fall, supporters of the Christian Coalition gathered on the Mall in Washington to express their faith and to lobby the administration. The rally was organized by the Christian Coalition, which wants to make sure that the Bush Administration sees the struggle in the Middle East between Jews and Muslims their way - the Christian way."

[NEDem]

41. This guy is one of those

all the way. He's completely nuts.

[AuntPatsy]

37. Send him this if you know his email address, if you don't know

it, then find it out, he needs some enlightment...

http://www.bushflash.com/faith.html

[proud patriot]

40. My only response to people like this is

"Jesus warned us of one who called himself annointed which
bush has done numerous times " then I walk away talking
to the air "The good book also said that Church would
be corrupted "

That'll keep em' up at night contemplating hopefully

[agincourt]

42. I agree with him,

Bush is the Beast of 666!!! And the great harlot that stretches across the sky is Karen Hughes. Rove is the old serpent. He's right.

[RevCheesehead]

43. I think the Gospels are clear:

(Mark 13:22-23) "False Messiahs and false prophets will appear and produce signs and omens, to lead astray, if possible, the elect. But be alert; I have already told you everything!"

(Matthew 24:23-24) "Then if anyone says to you, 'Look! Here is the Messiah!' or 'There he is!' - do not believe it. For false messiahs and false prophets will appear and produce great signs and omens..."

(Matthew 24:36) "But about that day and hour no one knows, neither the angels of heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father."

(Luke 21:7-8) "They asked (Jesus), 'Teacher, when will this be, and what will be the sign that this is about to take place?' And he said, "Beware that you are not led astray; for many will come in my name and say 'I am he!,' and, 'The time is near!' Do not go after them."

See also:
Matthew 25:31-46 The judgment of the Nations (the sheep and the goats)


Luke 17:20-37 The Coming of the Kingdom

*************

Tell 'em The Cheese says so (United Methodist, Duke Divinity grad).

[Sugarbleus]

44. Well done Cheese!! heheeh I was "preaching" in here

earlier. There was another thread talking about similar things. I had my say which followed along the same lines as yours.

Must be "wake up your spiritual self day" :)




PS: I've been reading about United Methodist...they appear to be closer to my deepest beliefs than anything else... Hmmm, I might have to go find a place and take a look see. ~~~Peace~~~

[RevCheesehead]

56. glad to hear it!

Our "Igniting Ministry" has placed TV ads - you may have seen, with our new slogan "Open hearts, open minds, open doors: The People of the United Methodist Church"

If only that were true throughout - but alas, there are many UM Churches that are outright conservative. But we're working on it!

Try it out - you might like it! :)

[DeadHead67]

48. . . .and the number of the Bush is 666. . . .

. . .(paraphrase, I'm Episcopalian) Tee Hee!!!

[RevCheesehead]

57. Methodists are bastard Episcopalians! (Anglican roots)

In regards to 666:

I suggest: George Walker Bushie!

[VOX]

50. Good job, Rev.

Appreciate it.

[StrongbadTehAwesome]

47. I'd just tell him that Jesus said,

"Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves. Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles? Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit. A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit. Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire. Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them."

Matthew 7:15-20

I'd say it's pretty clear that * "bears bad fruit," so to speak.

[Piperay]

49. It has been predicted

chimp is the Anti-Christ....666 the mark of the beast some thought it was Reagan but he was the precursor to chimp, the real Anti-Christ. :evilfrown:

[MsTryska]

52. Good Lord...if * is reference in Revelations

it really is the End Days. Apocalypse Now.

[sherilocks]

54. Point out if God creates hurricanes

Why did he so mercilessly send the worst parts of four hurricanes to the Republican counties. Jeanne actually went around my Gore county and up and over to surrounding Bush counties.

[maxsolomon]

55. sit down and read Revelation. It will help you understand.

Sort of.

But not the king james version. its poorly written & nearly impenetrable. try the NRSV.

what you'll find is the ramblings of a demented asshole named john. he was not a contemporary of Jesus. it was placed in the biblical canon over other texts precisely because it could be used (by the roman empire) as a tool of social control.

to take this shit as the divinely revealed word of god is to be a fool. it demeans the life & words of jesus.

[jmowreader]

58. Bush IS referenced in Revelations.

He's either in this verse...

Rev.6:3-4 When he broke open the second seal, I heard the second living creature cry out, "Come forward."

And there went out another horse that was red: and power was given to him that sat thereon to take peace from the earth, and that they should kill one another: and there was given unto him a great sword.

or this one...

Rev. 6:7-8: When he broke open the fourth seal, I heard the voice of the fourth living creature cry out, "Come forward."

I looked, and there was a pale green horse. Its rider was named Death, and Hades accompanied him. They were given authority over a quarter of the earth, to kill with sword, famine, and plague, and by means of the beasts of the earth.

Also consider: There is a reference to 42 months of things being not-so-bad after the Devil shows up before all hell breaks loose. If you want to start your counting at the inaugural, 42 months was July 2004.

[gauguin57]

60. Are you sure it wasn't a horse's ASS that came forward

when he broke the seal? Then I'd KNOW it was a reference to Bush.

[Gore1FL]

59. Judas Isocarot was chosen by God too

Go figure...

(I use that line a lot when someone pulls that argument)