Toronto man shoot dead holding hostage after 40min negotiation.

[StandUpGuy]

Would a white man have been shot so quickly by Fantino?

http://www.cjad.com/content/cp_article.asp?id=/global_feeds/canadianpress/nationalnews/n082579A.htm

Heavily armed tactical police officers surrounded the scene and spent about 40 minutes trying to negotiate with Brookes, a large, heavy-set man towering over six-feet in height.

They were unsuccessful.

Police said the marksman grew concerned the situation would escalate and others could be hurt. He fired a single shot, killing the suspect as hundreds of bewildered office workers frantically made cell-phone calls from the scene.

Police and ambulances moved in and the hostage was quickly ushered away.

"Literally, you could see his brain fly all over the place," said one man who watched the sniper's bullet find its mark.

"Like you see (such things) in a movie and you're all cool. It's not cool. It's not cool at all."

more

[CHIMO]

1. I Would Appreciate

A clarification or amplification of your question, please.

[StandUpGuy]

3. OK

IMO Fantino is a Racist asshole who was on the scene.

There was no obvious escalation once "negotiations" had begun and the man was shot after only 40 min of trying to peacefully end the stand off.

Fantino ordered a massive show of force during Caribanna that I found truly disgusting. My question was pretty simple, do you think he would have allowed a white man to have been shot dead under similar circumstances after less than an hour of negotiations?

[CHIMO]

4. Well There Are

More questions than the ones that you see. I was wondering if you meant that if the hostage had been Caucasian if the shot would have occurred sooner.
I can't answer for the chief.
The picture in the Toronto Star looked like it was pretty disorganized.
After a common sense revolution and a mayor that shakes hands with biker gangs I can imagine that everything could become politicized and polarized.
I am an outsider on this, as I do not live in the area and only know those things that I see and hear on the media. And of course here on DU.

[HEyHEY]

5. I'd say his question was clear

no need to complicate it. ;-)

[CHIMO]

6. You Are

Welcome to your opinion.

[HEyHEY]

2. I believe they would have been

[LeftistGorilla]

7. I live in Toronto....

no one here (at least publicly) believes it wasn't justified...

even the Toronto Star backs the sniping....

[StandUpGuy]

8. I live here too..

In the past few days I've asked 3 taxi cab drivers their opinion. All of them non-white, and all three believe it was totally unjustified.

My white friends for the most part think it was sad but unavoidable.

Are we divided ?

[Canadian_moderate]

10. no race card needed here

Quit the BS. This was not racially motivated.

I agree the T.O. cops have their bad apples, but this incident was not an example of racism among the cops.

No offence to the profession, but what makes cab drivers experts? I think they're dead wrong. It was totally justified. The guy should have surrendered and given himself up instead of cowardly hiding behind an innocent person. He was a wife-beating and child-beating tyrant. I honestly do not feel sorry for this piece of shit being dead. That's just me.

[Canadian_moderate]

9. sorry, but this guy committed suicide by cop

Regardless of colour, this guy decided his own fate.

Turns out he was a piece of shit who brutalized his wife and kids for years. I find it very hard to feel sorry for him and commend the cops for a job well done.

[StandUpGuy]

11. Deadly Force ?

You might think he was a piece of shit but I'm worried about a police force that exacts justice the courts fail to.

His past is a smoke screen. Most intelligent people can see that. Most minorities also see through the media propaganda.

The question isn't was he a bad guy. When are police allowed to use deadly force, should be the question.

Have you seen the tape? He did not escalate the situation any further once he had taken the hostage.

Should any hostage taker be shot dead at the fist clear opportunity?

The Toronto police are out of control.


BTW I find cabby's have any opinion on most subjects right or wrong. In this case I wasn't interested in judging the depth of their insight only looking for a minority opinion.

[Canadian_moderate]

12. Deadly force should be used...

If the general public (and the hostage) is in danger. If this guy had been white, he would have also been shot if he had not surroundered. I agree there are racial problems within the police force, but let's not cloud this particular issue.

In this particular case, I commend the cops for protecting the public and the life of a 20 year-old black woman.

[StandUpGuy]

13. Have you seen the tape?

I worry about our police force when they take the first possible shot and use negotiations as a diversion in order to get sharp shooters in place to exact justice.

Stop trying to create an isolated circumstance that justifies this type of behavior.

How can you be so certain a white man clad in a suit would have been shot so quickly?

Do you think hostage negotiators should be used only when a clean shot isn't an option?

The Toronto Police are a corrupt organization starting from the top and working it's way down. Yes there are decent cops trying to do good, but the are unfortunately lost in the sea of sharks.

Any attempt to portray the systemic abuses of power rampant in the force as "a few bad apples" is to deluded yourself and make it more difficult for those trying to fight it.

We in Canada are not immune from right wing fascists.

[Canadian_moderate]

14. I agree with some of your comment about Toronto cops

..but in this particular case I agree to disagree.

The guy committed suicide by police. That's the way I saw it. He didn't have to die, but he chose to.

[HEyHEY]

15. I've got news for you, there is no media propaganda in this

If there's one thing the Canadian media doesn't so, it's protect racist and evil cops. This isn't the USA.
The guy's past has nothing to do with him being shot, neither does his race, don't even try to play that sympathy card, again, this isn't the USA. The guy was shot because he had his gun pointed at the head of an innocent woman.
Whether or not the cops went a little nuts is debatable, but the fact he is black had nothing to do with it. That's just more BS floated around by certain groups in Toronto to look oike victims.

[Swede]

16. We had a suicide by cop incident here in Saskatoon in August.

The guy was white,they shot him three times, he's now recovering in hospital.

[Canadian_moderate]

17. Was he holding a gun

to the head of a hostage as well?

Deadly force was the only option in Toronto. Who knows what would have happened if they had missed. Sad, but that's the situation the guy put himself into.

[SomthingsGotaGive]

18. The Only option ?

There is never only one option.

There was however only one option attempted.

This an old story but relevant if we start to discuss abuses of power under Fantino.

peace.