"The Lord is Risen", response: "Christ is risen indeed!" May the Lord be with us all on this day.

[papau]

I just wanted to post a bit of positive news. :-)

[Clark2008]

1. Well, yes, 2000 years ago.

True story: on Good Friday two years ago, my son, then 5 years old, was very upset for some unknown reason.

I finally quizzed him about it and he said, "I'm sad because Jesus died today and I don't see what's do good about it!" Poor thing! He thought Jesus had actually DIED on Good Friday 2005. Sweetie pie. He worries too much.

[Buzz Clik]

2. That's a pretty easy concept for a five-year-old to grasp.

No doubt you straightened that out without problem. We recognize the anniversary of the death of many high profile leaders; I'd hate to think that your child would be in an endless cycle of grief because no one clued him in on why we do this.

[Zynx]

5. When I was about 4 I thought about it I thought that Jesus was only

alive for about four months or so(Christmas-Good Friday). I didn't understand the idea of the church calendar so well.

[Ian David]

15. I thought people only died between Rosh Hashana and Yom Kippur. n/t

[Clark2008]

26. Oh, of course I did.

I just thought it was very intuitive of him - and very empathetic. He already has much more empathy than that cretin in the White House.

[KittyWampus]

"Christ" is a capacity for Enlightenment that lies dormant, waiting within all of us.

And your son sounds like an old soul.

Sweetie pie, indeed. :hug:

[Clark2008]

39. You've nailed it.

My son's soul is extremely old and his kindness is mesmerizing.

I'm nearly eight months pregnant with his little sister and we had a long, long, LONG wait at the pharmacy for some anemia meds I needed to be on. I was in PAIN from standing because no one else bothered to get up and allow a very pregnant woman to sit. He went over to the counter, got one of those little hand-held, battery-operated back massagers and came over to me and started to rub my aching back with it. Unasked, unprovoked.

Needless to say, about three men finally stood up from their chairs and offered me (and him) a seat.

You know what they say: "...and a child shall lead them."

[Ian David]

126. Is it sacrilegious to say, "You've nailed it" on Easter? n/t

[lksmith]

53. Being an atheist, i don't call it "Christ",

but other than that i agree.

[SidDithers]

3. No thank you...nt

Sid

[SammyWinstonJack]

8. Ditto....nt

[Arugula Latte]

65. Agreed...I'll pass on the religious, um, stuff. But I do celebrate Spring. nt

[beam me up scottie]

151. How dare you decline to practice someone else's religion on their Holy Day?

And politely, no less.

The nerve of some people...:spank:

[charlie and algernon]

4. And also with you

Amen :-)

[The Cleaner]

6. Thanks for this.

Good to see a non-Christian-bashing post on DU. :)

[Coyote_Bandit]

7. That's my church for this festive day

Last time I attended an Easter service was about a decade ago. And I dressed all in black for the occassion....

[Buzz Clik]

9. Why are sincere messages with a religion theme an immediate target for the non-religious?

There's no disguise in the title. Not clicking the thread would be the logical approach for those who don't appreciate the message.

Anyway, thanks for the thought.

[dogday]

11. I have seen that too nt

[pintobean]

14. Evangelical Atheists

I assume.

[Ian David]

18. Like that Australian guy who went to Salt Lake City?

John Safran: Door To Door Atheists Bother Mormons

Australian filmmaker, John Safran, goes to Salt Lake City, Utah and tries to convert Mormons to atheism.
http://www.devilducky.com/media/54259/

[Subdivisions]

71. HA! I love it! I have my own story of Mormon intrusion in

my life. A couple of years ago, I accepted a job in Jackson, Wyoming. Jackson was a little on the expensive side but rent in the small communities in a nearby valley were more along the lines of what I was used to in Texas. I thought moving the family to a new location might help to alleviate some of the societal headaches that were manifexting themselves around our five kids, drugs and gangs for instance.

Anyways, as it happens, this particular valley was a Mormon stronghold and, sure enough, we weren't even finished arranging the furniture before, at about 9am on our second morning there a couple of Mormons were knocking at our door wanting us to attend their church. My wife doesn't feel comfortable dealing with this sort of situation so I relunctantly spoke with them and explained that we were a mixed family of Baptist and Catholic and that we would be considering attending the non-denominational church a bit up the highway. They suggested that if we would attend their church service, perhaps we would enjoy it and instead choose to attend their church and I said that we would discuss it as a family and if we agreed to do so, we would attend their church on a trial basis. I was being polite. I actually had no intention at the time to go to their church.

So, a few days (and two Mormon services) later, again they were at my door. Again, it was while we made breakfast. The reps at the door explained that they had "missed us" at their service and again invited us to attend. I explained that we had decided that we would continue to pursue our own choices and I thanked them and explained that we were making breakfast and to please excuse me. They left.

A few days later, sure enough, they were back. For the first time, I invited them in and, being the little devil that I am, I explained that I had a confession. I was actually an atheist but I had withheld that information previously out of deference to them but now they had forced me out. I then began an attempt to convert them to atheism. But they didn't stay around long, excusing themselves rather expediently.

We began to experience the cold shoulder. The town we settled in was very small, population of less than 400. There was a local video store, a grocery, a corner market and a hardware. Curiously, there were four bars, but I digress. Anyway, we began to notice that while we were pleasant and neighborly, we were greeted with the cold shoulder and the turned-up nose, as if we were branded with a scarlet letter. This got so bad that my wife, who is extremely chatty (and susceptable to loneliness), had had enough and insisted on coming back to Texas.

It's funny. I hated leaving there because it was soooo beautiful. So beautiful that it matched my idea of what I imagined Heaven would look like. Ironic.

[cyborg_jim]

116. If Heaven is full of assholes like that I don't want to know

[Ian David]

133. The Mormons once helped push my car out of a snowbank once.

For that, I cut them some slack... but that slack does not extend to Der Mittenfuhrer.

[cyborg_jim]

137. Before or after you admitted you are in league with Satan?

[Ian David]

171. Flying Spaghetti Monster. n/t

[Ian David]

127. You should buy property there and turn it into a condo development for gay atheists.

I have this fantasy of finding a small town with less than 500 people in it, and opening a 1,000 unit condo development full of gays, atheists and assorted liberals-- all registered to vote.

[Leopolds Ghost]

114. Door To Door Atheists Bother Mormons

I see the makings of a new thread, with hilarity for all.

[Ian David]

16. Because we're bored...

... with giving the finger to cars with "Know Jesus, Know Peace. No Jesus, No Peace" bumper stickers?

And we're annoyed with that Jesus Saves guy who writes his name everywhere.

[dogday]

Bored, not rude?

I am just trying to distinguish the difference?

[Ian David]

23. Today is Sarcasm Sunday for me. It's a new holiday I started when I woke-up grumpy this morning. n/t

[dogday]

25. Thanks for being honest about it nt

[Ian David]

27. Whatever.

:P

[dogday]

28. God bless you

O8)

[Ian David]

30. You know, you could just buy a billboard like everyone else

Fundamentalist christian girl attacked by jellyfish?"

[dogday]

32. Or I could just wish you the very best that

life has to offer... I think I will do that... Best of everything to you....

[Ian David]

34. Thanks. You, too. n/t

[CrispyQ]

41. Godvertising.com

Wow, what Deity wouldn't like that?

:rofl:

[Ian David]

128. I can think of ONE diety who wouldn't like it

6:5 And when thou prayest, thou shalt not be as the hypocrites are: for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and in the corners of the streets, that they may be seen of men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward.

6:6 But thou, when thou prayest, enter into thy closet, and when thou hast shut thy door, pray to thy Father which is in secret; and thy Father which seeth in secret shall reward thee openly.

More:
http://skepticsannotatedbible.com/mt/6.html

[lksmith]

52. And of course you could not

You can't help but take it out on people. Your sarcasm and your boredom, that is.
Poor thing.

[Ian David]

129. I plan to avoid taking personal responsibility for my actions and blame all the Easter candy. n/t

[knitter4democracy]

92. *snicker* That looks, um, odd.

I particularly like the flags on the side. :)

*sigh* Some of us sure get silly around Easter. Please forgive us Christians, for we know not what we do. :)

[Leopolds Ghost]

101. Godvertising.com

Since mankind is made in His image,

What if we are all just 4th-dimensional promitional advertisements
created for the benefit of an audience of higher-order beings?

Like the girl in the billboard.

Something to ponder. I knew something about that girl was eerie,
and I've figured it out! ;-)

[muriel_volestrangler]

62. Definitely not rude

After all, the only 'atheist' post read "no thank you". So it was polite.

[jakem]

20. can always post in the Xian board... Ill stay out of there for sure!

but have yourselves a nice Easter none the less.

I do enjoy the gorging on Polish foods.

[shrike]

24. You'll wish you were at my house

No polish food, but I made a butterscotch-chip cheesecake with butterscotch topping.

We can't wait.

Since you're not a believer I won't wish you Happy Easter, so how 'bout "Happy Polish Foods Sunday"?

Have a good one whatever.

[jakem]

29. I am happy with my coming feast... (excuse the spelling)

Kielbasa
Golupkis
Rice cutlets
Cabbage Pierogis

and of course the ever bizarre 'egg cheese' that my wife insists upon...

I wont move for a week.

Frankly, rising after such a meal is miraculous in itself... (sorry, couldn't pass it up!)

[shrike]

36. Wow

I couldn't move for a month after all that.

Enjoy!

[jakem]

37. And Ill accept a 'Happy Easter' thank you.

I'll even return the sentiment.

[papau]

148. Happy Easter jakem :-) n/t

n/t

[Clark2008]

47. I wish I could HAVE cheesecake - any kind.

Borderline gestational diabetes and can't have a stitch of sugar, even though that's the ONLY thing I've craved during this pregancy.

:(

[MistressOverdone]

105. OT, but I've made a decent cheesecake with Splenda

[Buzz Clik]

33. The religious forum is like honey for that kind of reaction.

[YankeyMCC]

21. Maybe because it is not "The Lord"

if someone religious would like to wish me a happy day in the name of a person or idea they consider Lord over them that's fine with me but to announce "The Lord" has risen seems wholly inappropriate in a mixed group that is supposed to value religious freedom.

And I don't see any attacks just freedom of expression.

[Buzz Clik]

38. Hm. Okay.

if someone religious would like to wish me a happy day in the name of a person or idea they consider Lord over them that's fine with me but to announce "The Lord" has risen seems wholly inappropriate in a mixed group that is supposed to value religious freedom.

I can see that.

And I don't see any attacks just freedom of expression.

Nope, neither do I. Not yet. But it's early.

[MistressOverdone]

102. How about "My Lord"?

[ayeshahaqqiqa]

140. Don't have a problem with the OP

and I don't believe in the Resurrection/Easter story as explained by Christianity. But I do understand the joy and goodwill behind the greeting and therefore have no problem with it.

[papau]

146. Thanks ayeshahaqqiqa - when I left for church this morning I knew the MODS and R/T would do this to

the post.

Joy and goodwill to you always.

By the way after services the Bishop had the kids given Easter eggs in the traditional red color (he handed them out), and for first time in my life, at the door there were folks that also handed out chocolate to the kids!!

:-)

[cyborg_jim]

153. So you posted it so you could get some persecution?

Aren't you worried at all that you seem to be seeking it?

[papau]

167. No I posted it so I could communicate with like minded folks which I have done n/t

n/t

[cyborg_jim]

169. As has already been pointed out if you just wanted that then you wouldn't have posted in GD

There are groups for that for a reason.

[Name removed]

172. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[SidDithers]

177. But non donors can post in R/T...

which is where this thread, if the actions of the mods are any indication, should have been posted in the first place.

It sounds like what you really want is a public forum open to only those who think like you.

Sorry, that's not going to play here.

Sid

[cyborg_jim]

180. Thats a yes then, you have a persecution complex

[muriel_volestrangler]

170. Threads wishing people "Happy Easter" have remained in GD

Yours, though, is literally evangelising, and makes a specific theological claim. And the format you give it is pretty bizarre, for a discussion forum: a statement and response, presumably copied out from your church's prayer book. You'd think that here, the response would be left to be people to make for themselves.

[Name removed]

173. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[muriel_volestrangler]

176. There's no need to accuse me of lying, papau

I can't work out why you get so angry. I didn't lie about anything; I said "presumably", and if you say it's a standard part of a church service (and a web search confirms this), it appears my presumption was right. There's no need to put "evangelising" in quotes - you made a statement of Christian faith, and called it "good news" - that is literally evangelising, using the derivation of the word.

Any 'dumps on religion' get moved to R&T. You, however, whine about your evangelising getting moved here too, and try to paint yourself as a martyr - "I knew the mods would do this" :cry: That's why I replied, pointing out your post got the normal treatment for a theological post. You seem to be proud that you broke the DU rules on purpose, giving the mods extra work to do. Why?

I think your views of posts, especially in the Science forum, is getting paranoid. You seem to regard science as your enemy.

[YankeyMCC]

174. Maybe so

and it certainly isn't a top priority problem for me either but just because you have no problem with it doesn't mean there is no problem. I'm simply stating that I think the OP was inapropriate at least perhaps purposely baiting at worst. And it seems to me it's perfectly reasonable for me to respond that way, perfectly within my right to free speech and within the realm of civil response.

A "Happy Easter" post wouldn't have gotten any response from me or maybe a "Thanks" if I felt I had a positive relationship with the OP.

This OP was deliberately provocative for whatever reason. And ok, I guess many of us are here just for that reason to provoke discussion and even action in some cases and some like to read provocative stuff. But if that's what you're going to do there should be no objection when people do respond.

[Clark2008]

31. I agree.

You'd think a bunch of allegedly tolerant liberals would be able to go a day without bashing an entire religion based on the actions of a few fundie nuts.

[SidDithers]

46. Where's the bashing?...

the OP gave some sort of religious blessing, and I responded with a very polite "no thank you".

I can only assume that Buzz Clik was referring to me in post #9, because mine was the only remotely non-religious reply when he posted.

Sid

Edit: removed the snark. no need for it.

[Clark2008]

48. The point Buzz Click was making is that you didn't need to

respond at all.

If you didn't want the blessing, you could have not taken it without comment.

Free Speech also allows for silence. ;)

[SidDithers]

56. Ah yes, a happy atheist is a quiet atheist...

I understand.

Sid

[Buzz Clik]

72. It was a question.

No one said that you don't ever have the opportunity to express yourself. And rather than attempt to answer the question, you engaged in the behavior I was asking about.

My question remains unanswered -- by you, at least.

[SidDithers]

91. Was the question being asked of me?...

you replied to the OP, not to my polite decline of the OP's religious good wishes.

Sid

[Mad_Dem_X]

35. It's par for the course.

You're correct, not clicking on the thread would be the logical thing to do.

[pintobean]

43. I don't believe

logic enters the thought process.

[Goblinmonger]

109. Yeah, that's right

Someone posts a thread that declares that the lord of all has risen on this day and declares their intent that that lord be with us all on this day and the one person who says "no thank you" is the rude one.

Get over yourself. Just because an atheist chose to decline the blessing doesn't mean they are being rude. I know you want all atheists to just be silent and then you tolerate them, but that doesn't really seem fair, now, does it.

And for what it's worth, I would put my money on the atheists in R/T in a logic battle over the theists.

[porphyrian]

50. Why share religious messages with people you know will react negatively to them?

This is General Discussion, not the Religion forum. Don't be surprised when you get what you ask for.

[Buzz Clik]

73. It's worse in the religious forum.

That's not an answer.

[porphyrian]

76. It's where it should be in the religious forum. That is an answer.

If you don't want your beliefs to be questioned, only discuss them with people who share them. If you bring them here, be ready to defend them. Bringing them here and expecting them to go unchallenged is not an answer.

[Buzz Clik]

99. Whatever. A clear answer is this:

You're part of the problem.

[Leopolds Ghost]

113. Wait, if religious Dems bring their beliefs here, to the religion forum, be ready to defend them?

Geez, can't we all just get along?

[Goblinmonger]

111. If you don't want beliefs to be questioned

go into one of the Christian echo chambers on this site and I guarantee no atheist will bother you there. This is a forum. For the debate and discussion of religion and theology. Can't handle it; stay out. I don't see you hopping to the defense of atheists when they are disparaged or insulted on here.

[MistressOverdone]

122. Happy and safe spring to you, GB

[Goblinmonger]

144. And to you to

in whatever manner you choose to celebrate it.

[MistressOverdone]

184. well, this year I definitely

didn't dance naked around the altar or anything, but it was a good holiday.

I almost perfected New York crumb buns. But I undercooked them. I will try again.

[AngryOldDem]

79. Yet it you see the tit;le and it's something you know you won't agree with...

...why not just pass it by and save yourself the extra points on your blood pressure? Not every post needs to be opened, nor commented on.

Silence IS, at times, golden. I really don't think the OP's intent was to piss off non-Christians, atheists, agnostics, or whoever else who doesn't subscribe to a certain religious belief.

If this is so out of place on GD, has anyone alerted a moderator to lock it and move it to Religion/Theology? Or would that put a stop to yet another perfectly good anti-religious rant?

[porphyrian]

83. Because the same freedoms apply to all of us here.

If you can post about something, I can post my reaction to it. That's how this works.

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

54. I saw no messages like that until YOU started to whine. Now, you ordered 'em, you got 'em. -nt

[annabanana]

67. *ding*

yup

[Buzz Clik]

74. Look who's bucking for a fight.

Ain't happening.

Happy Easter, and may God bless you and your spaghetti monster.

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

188. Wow, "Look who." I'm famous now?

BTW, FWIW, I feel much less inclined to post in this thread once it got moved here in R/T where it belongs, but there are people answering to posts of mine made while it was in GD, so...

[Coyote_Bandit]

55. "May the Lord be with us all"

is a sentiment that transcends the church and the Easter holiday. Rejecting the church doesn't make someone an atheist or non-religious. It just might be an indicator that they accept responsibility for their own beliefs and spirituality. I am a believer - "Christian" although I refuse to claim the label. I aspire to be nothing like what our popular culture recognizes as "Christian". Kudos to the OP for the expression of faith. Still. I am not going to get all dressed up and suddenly appear in church today to hear a sermon from a guy whose motives I question, whose (political) values I do not share, and whose methods I question. If I were to do so I would be as hypocritical as some of the folks in the congregation who I know to have taken advantage of others. If I had to go I, again, would dress in black.

[MistressOverdone]

106. Our service was lovely this AM

I am pretty sure the priest is a lesbian, but that is neither here nor there. Excellent music. Great flowers, old and treasured words, mimosas afterwards then home for a nap.

Now a good Italian dinner in honor of the Sopranos.

Oh..saw quite a few ladies in black today. Very chic color no matter the season. Personally it makes me look like a matzo ball.

[papau]

147. LOL - peace and good will to you and thank you for responding to the thread n/t

n/t

[Goblinmonger]

108. How is "No thank you" rude?

That was it before your post. The OP subject says "May the Lord be with us all this day." Some portion of "us all" wanted to indicate they weren't interested. Why isn't it rude that the OP included every one of us, Christian or not, in the OP.

You are looking for insult where there is none.

[MistressOverdone]

115. "no thank you"

was not rude, nor was it unpredictable.

[SidDithers]

117. But it was appropriate...nt

Sid

[MistressOverdone]

118. If it was what was in your heart to express in an RT

forum, then I would agree it was appropriate. It was not arugmentative, but got the point over.

[ayeshahaqqiqa]

139. And it was posted in R/T

not in General Discussion or Political Videos. I don't think the intent of the OP was to do anything but wish believers well on a sacred day.

[muriel_volestrangler]

141. It was moved from GD 5 hours after the initial post

see http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x601688

[ayeshahaqqiqa]

143. didn't realize that

the mods were correct in moving it. When I saw it, it was in R/T.

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

186. Yeah, and there were a lot of "Happy Easter" threads that WEREN'T moved.

Of course, THEIR subject line didn't sound like an apopletic revival tent preacher.

Excellent move by the mods.

[muriel_volestrangler]

187. Ooh, watch out CPD - that might be 'lies' and 'bull'

See posts #170 and #173. :banghead:

[WritingIsMyReligion]

182. Because this isn't a Christian forum.

R/T is a debate hall. Why bother posting it here? Just go to into one of the Christian groups.

[KiraBS]

10. Thank you Papau....

And also with you

[papau]

149. Thank you :-)

:-)

[undeterred]

12. And also with you!

Amen. O8)

[papau]

150. Amen :-)

:-)

[Ian David]

13. Yes, but he was made of chocolate. n/t

[ComerPerro]

78. even better news

[butterfly77]

17. Amen!

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

19. God Bless You As Well. n/t

[shrike]

22. And also with you

Thanks. Sometimes I don't want to be a closet Catholic.

[symbolman]

40. So good

I wrote a BOOK about it :)

Though my book isn't exactly about Christ, he's IN it, along with Mohammed, and Buddha, etc..

Still, I sent a copy of my work to a pal, stuffed in an Easter basket last week for their perusal, be fun when I get to hear what they think, once they've read it.

In case anyone is wondering, "The Jesus Bolt" is the item that holds ALL the blades on the Helicopter TOGETHER, when that falls out, they say the Next person you will be talking to, will be 'Jesus'.. :)

I was witness to Global Warming 30 years ago, and that's in this book as well, as a matter of fact, Global Warming just may have saved my life when I crashed in the Arctic National Wildlife Refuge...

Happy Easter to one and all! Solstice too :)

[Clark2008]

49. What's your book about?

I have a feeling I'll be on complete (instead of partial) bed rest in about another two to three weeks from my pregnancy. I'll be needing LOTS of good reading material as I find TeeVee rather boring, inane and silly.

[symbolman]

58. I wish I could send you a copy

I've had three kids, well, my wives have had them, so I know how a good book can make all the difference when you're miserable :)

It's a fictional representation of an autobiographical period in my life. I lived in Alaska for ten years back starting in 1976, and drove cab, lusted to get on the Pipeline, gold mined for a few summers, etc.. strange days up there then..

Here's what's on the back:

"Fairbanks, Alaska, in 1976 is a town with virtually no women, it’s the heyday of the Pipeline, and Mick Swan is screwed. The local Biker gang has put out a hit on him, so driving cab while dealing drugs is out. No more hanging in bars trying to schmooze a Union card alongside other Pipeline wannabees, to get that big money oil rig job. The psychedelic, never ending summer parties in the surrounding hills, over.

He flees way up north, where the sun never sets, accepting a job in the bush, to collect samples of lakes and streams by helicopter for 18 hours a day in a mobile camp for Los Alamos. Mick’s surrounded by quirky characters, Cookies, the only women in camp, and Vietnam Veteran chopper pilots, who push the edge of the envelope as they hop across the face of Alaska at a furious pace, all summer.

Despite bear attacks, a village lynching, and mosquitoes so thick they run herds over cliffs, Mick finds himself growing ever closer to nature, where he comes face to face with the death and destruction of the animals, the environment, by corrupt oil companies, even witnessing firsthand the effects of global warming.

An intimidating Veteran propels Mick towards an unwitting Spiritual journey deep in the mountains of the Arctic National Wildlife Refuge, where, despite his tendancies as a two fisted Irish born scrapper, he experiences personal growth beyond his wildest dreams."

Got it all, sex, rock n' roll, drugs, bear chases, choppers, death, life, spirituality, ecosystems being destroyed, which I saw firsthand..

Hope those folks in Hollywood looking at it like it, if they do I think it'll make a great film - not going to publish it until I get someone looking at film rights, etc. Figure I can get a lot more from a Publisher that way. Only made 20 copies so far on LULU.com, who did a great Job! Using those twenty copies to reach film folks - anyone know any good film folks? :)

Keep in touch, when I get it published I'll make sure you get a copy, and thanks for your interest, and have a WONDERFUL kid, eh? (without much pain, okay?)

[Clark2008]

60. Sounds interesting!

Aren't you the one who also writes installments of cab stories here? You've changed your avatar, I think and I don't quite recognize whether you're the same person who did or not. Funny how we're still visual and equate folks to their avatars even when we've never seen them.

[symbolman]

61. Naw

that's someone completely different ..

I've been here a long time, and founded Takebackthemedia.com back in 2000 or so, with our first year being so gangbusters that we pulled in 100 million hits based on political attack ads done in Flash - me and another fellow here, American Stranger, basically invented the political Flash attack ad online in those heady days..

I've been on O'Reilly's show and Scarborough's show Twice, many DU'rs know who I am - a hard core political activist, even got sued by Michael Savage for a half a million bucks..

I beat out over 640 animators worldwide and got a Hollywood award for my flash work "Boy meets Girl" (and the reason I'm known as Symbolman), which can be viewed at http://www.symbolman.com where used international symbols to tell a story..

MoveOn chose us as One of 14 out of 1600 entries in their "Bush in 30 Seconds" contest, and we went to NYC where Michael Moore called our names and we stood up to spotlights and applause,

Not bragging, just always worked hard, and the DU has helped us to go a LONG way, all the good folks here :)

Nope, different guy altogether, sorry :)

Glad you find it interesting, hope a LOT of people do, I'm pretty sure it's damned compelling, heard good things so far, we'll see what the public thinks soon enough I guess..

Happy Easter and make a damned, fine baby :)

[HamdenRice]

42. Recollection of an Easter with Tswana people (of Botswana and South Africa): Morena, O Tsogile!

I remember spending Easter in a very Christian Tswana village in the late 1980s. We had an all night service, and just before sunrise the entire congregation walked, singing, to the village graveyard.

As the sun arose on that Sunday Easter morning over the bushveld, the congregation shouted, "Morena, O Tsogile!" which means "Our Lord, He has arisen!"

The people then spent the morning visiting the graves of their friends, relatives and ancestors.

However much you believe or don't believe the resurrection aspect of Christianity, the traditions of Easter are truly lovely.

Perhaps non-Christians don't realize that it's beauty is in the hope of not just of one's personal resurrection but of reunion, however tenuous, abstract or cosmic, with our departed loved ones.

[SidDithers]

145. That's a lovely recollection...

But what did these Tswana people do before the mid 1800's, when christian missionaries converted them from their historic cultural beliefs to christianity? Is Jesus somehow better than Modimo?

Personally, i feel that religious conversion by missionaries is one of the most despicable acts of modern christianity.

Sid

[HamdenRice]

178. It's a much, much more complicated story than you might think

Before the missionaries arrived, the Tswana lived in big towns (at least one was bigger than Cape Town of the same era) and small villages. Their economy was based on keeping huge herds of cattle, farming, and mining and working copper, tin and especially iron.

Most of the British missionaries who arrived to evangelize the Tswana in the early 1800s were ardent abolitionists. In fact, they went among the Tswana because the Boers (Afrikaners) had left the Cape on the Great Trek because Britain had abolished slavery at the Cape taking away the Boers' slaves. The Boers set out to enslave the Tswana and other northern tribes as a substitute for the slaves they lost at the Cape.

The missionaries went to help the Tswana and Sotho avoid enslavement. A French missionary's work with King Moshoeshoe of Lesotho helped the Sotho people defend their kingdom and through western diplomatic techniques the missionaries taught Moshoeshoe, eventually get protection by the British Crown against the Boers. That's why Lesotho is a country entirely surrounded by South Africa, but not part of it.

Similar things happened among the Tswana. The most famous missionary was David Livingstone who spent his early career among the Tswana of the western Transvaal and Botswana.

Basically, Livingstone illegally imported guns to the Tswana and taught them how to defend themselves, and eventually the British granted protection to the Tswana of Botswana (then called Bechunanaland) from the Boers. Eventually, the Boers raided Livingstone's house, burned it to the ground and drove him deeper north. But the eastern Tswana were armed by then and although they were incorporated into the Boers' Transvaal, they avoided being completely enslaved. Christianity also convinced them to abandon some of their more cruel punishments for crimes.

German missionaries predominated in the mid 1800s. Eventually with the knowledge of markets, literacy, the western system of land ownership and other techniques brought by the missionaries, the Tswana began to buy back the land taken from them at conquest, which eventually resulted in the "homeland" of Bophutatswana. Because they bought their land back with the help of missionaries, rather than having it granted as a reserve, and half of South Africa's platinum was later discovered on their land (and half of the platinum reserves in the world are in South Africa), the Bafokeng Tswana of western South Africa became known as "the richest tribe in Africa."

By the early 1900s, when African American and West Indian missionaries arrived, many Tswana Christians broke away from the white churches and set up their own independent Christian churches along the lines of the African Methodist Episcopal Church of the US, where they continued to practice a mix of both their indigenous beliefs and Christianity.

So the Tswana are quite happy with what the Christian missionaries did for them. The Tswana weren't passive recipients of the new ideas, but adopted and molded the new ideas to their benefit.

In sum the early 19th century missionaries were gun runners who helped the Tswana defend themselves and define the terms of their incorporation into British South African politics.

[SidDithers]

179. Thanks for the detalied, and very interesting reply...nt

Sid

[papau]

152. Very nice - thank you for sharing - peace be with you :-) n/t

n/t

[deutsey]

44. Threatened by Resurrection

From a poem by South American poet Julia Esquivel. This comes out of the liberation theology movement, I believe, and speaks to how hope is resurrected in the living even as the dark forces in this world kills us.

I wish I could find my copy of it...this excerpt was all I could find online:

We've been threatened with Resurrection
because we've touched their lifeless
bodies
and their souls have penetrated our own
now doubly strengthened.
Because in this Marathon of hope,
there are always replacements to carry on
the strength until we reach that goal
beyond death.
Be with us in this vigil
and you'll know then
how wonderful it is
to be threatened by Resurrection.
To dream, awake,
to watch, asleep to live, dying
and to know yourself already - Risen!

[MistressOverdone]

107. exquisite

[LeftyMom]

45. .

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topics&forum=214

[porphyrian]

51. Until we have peace on earth, there is no messiah. - n/t

[jazzjunkysue]

57. Good news? We're still killing muslims. It's not good news for them.

Let's stop pretending that peace is here. And let's stop pretending that religion, any religion, brings peace.

[Bicoastal]

69. Is it worth pointing out...

...that Martin Luther King was a Reverend from the age of 24 until the day he died? Religion on its own may not do anything, but good people are often encouraged and supported by their religious convictions to change the world for the better.

But I really don't want to get into that. This isn't a political thread. It's someone who wants to wish other DU'ers a happy Easter. I'm a Jew, but I respect her sentiment, and I think you're being insensitive.

[me b zola]

80. No, the person is not wishing a happy easter to everyone

Many non-christians celebrate easter in some fashion or another, as a Pagan celebration, a day to celebrate family, or whatever. Wishing a happy easter to non christians is not what this poster is doing.

[Bicoastal]

88. Who says he NEEDS to wish everyone a happy easter?

So he's wishing only Christian believers a happy easter. I can't believe anyone would actually be offended by that, especially since it's on an internet message board, not a government building or public school.

BTW, would you be offended if I wished you a happy Passover?

[Ian David]

132. I, for one, wasn't offended. But I did load both barrels of my snark-gun anyway. n/t

[MistressOverdone]

110. Depends entirely on your definition of "peace"

world peace, no.

inner peace, at times, for some.

[stray cat]

59. He is risen indeed Happy Easter and best wishes!

[trumad]

63. I'm not religious at all...

but I respect your beliefs and wish you and your family a fine Easter day.

[tkmorris]

64. Some say I should "just not click the link"

And of course, I could do that.

However, I think it is detrimental to us all to foment false hope in mythology while there are so many real, tangible, human problems that need to be fixed.

I don't begrudge anyone their right to practice Christianity, provided they do it as the Bible instructs them to (i.e., keep it to yourself and out of the public eye), but when they start offering it up to my fellow humans I am compelled to stand up and say "Not so fast, I have a better idea".

[pintobean]

68. "keep it to yourself and out of the public eye"

I've never seen that before. Could you tell me where that is in the Bible?

[Matariki]

86. the new testament instructs christians to pray in the closet.

Matthew 6:5-6: "And when thou prayest, thou shalt not be as the hypocrites are: for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and in the corners of the streets, that they may be seen of men....when thou prayest, enter into thy closet and when thou has shut thy door, pray to thy Father which is in secret...."

on edit: how I wish with all my heart that christians would heed this part of the bible.

[MistressOverdone]

112. Thanks so much!

I've been needing a new closet but I can't get my husband to agree that ours is too small. I'm going out to the shed to get the sledgehammer!

I need a bigger place to pray!

Actually, I teach in a closet but I don't to pray publically there, so it's hopeless.

[papau]

155. It also says to share the joy - peace - n/t

n/t

[opiate69]

87. Matthew 6:6

But thou, when thou prayest, enter into thy closet, and when thou hast shut thy door, pray to thy Father which is in secret; and thy Father which seeth in secret shall reward thee openly

On edit: I see Kineta beat me to it, but I second her sentiment.

[WritingIsMyReligion]

183. Matthew 6:6-8.

Very explicit, actually.

[Bicoastal]

70. So if a guy named Martin Luther King came up to you...

...and said "Now is the time to make justice a reality for all of God's children," what would you say?

"Reverend, shut up and take your religion back into the church where it belongs?"

[donco6]

82. I would say, "Do I have to accept Jesus as Lord to do it?"

I wonder what he would say.

[Penndems]

66. And with you as well, papau

:hi:

[papau]

156. Thanks - peace and goodwill always :-) n/t

n/t

[WinkyDink]

75. Thank you. Happy Easter to you and yours. {{papau}}

[papau]

157. Thank you - and may the peace be with you always :-) n/t

n/t

[ComerPerro]

77. does everyone respond like that, with "indeed"??

It just sounds kind of funny, for some reason, the extra "indeed".

Yea, verily

[MistressOverdone]

120. Kind of prayerbood rap

from the 16th C.

[bmbmd]

81. He arose a victory from the dark domain

that's what we sang today. Happy Easter to you.

[papau]

158. Happy Easter - yes, He is risen indeed. and it was truly a victory :-) n/t

n/t

[Greyhound]

84. And all you followers of other, or no, religions go screw yourselves.

Jeez, you guys have a whole forum to talk to each other in, is it too much to ask that you leave your "faith" over there?

[pintobean]

93. We take our faith wherever we go.

Are you saying that no topic that has it's own forum can be discussed in GD?

[Greyhound]

97. No, I'm saying that there are many people that do not subscribe to your

brand of mythology and we don't appreciate you imposing it on us on a day that your religion hijacked in the first place.

But since the moderators have seen fit to move this to where it belonged in the first place, good day.

[Madspirit]

85. Jeeeeeesus Music

As an atheist I feel I get this mythology shoved down my throat enough as it is without expecting to find it in the NON-religious forum at my Democratic Underground. I am offended but will leave you with a song by The Stones....Lee


FAR AWAY EYES
(M. Jagger/K. Richards)

I was driving home early Sunday morning through Bakersfield
Listening to gospel music on the colored radio station
And the preacher said, "You know you always have the
Lord by your side"

And I was so pleased to be informed of this that I ran
Twenty red lights in his honor
Thank you Jesus, thank you lord

I had an arrangement to meet a girl, and I was kind of late
And I thought by the time I got there she'd be off
She'd be off with the nearest truck driver she could find
Much to my surprise, there she was sittin in the corner
A little bleary, worse for wear and tear
Was a girl with far away eyes

So if you're down on your luck
And you can't harmonize
Find a girl with far away
And if you're downright disgusted
And life ain't worth a dime
Get a girl with far away eyes

Well the preacher kept right on saying that all I had to do was send
Ten dollars to the church of the sacred bleeding heart of Jesus
Located somewhere in Los Angeles, California
And next week they'd say my prayer on the radio
And all my dreams would come true
So I did, the next week, I got a prayer with a girl
Well, you know what kind of eyes she got

So if you're down on your luck
I know you all sympathize
Find a girl with far away eyes
And if you're downright disgusted
And life ain't worth a dime
Get a girl with far away eyes

[MistressOverdone]

121. Not sure where the poster

originally intended it to go, but first time R/T posts automatically go to GD.

[Dervill Crow]

89. And also with you.

My deities of choice are the Lord and Lady, but Easter is a nice holiday. The sun is shining here, and my kids are coming over for dinner. You call it Easter, I call it Ostara, and it gives me two weekends to celebrate the coming of spring and rebirth.

It's all good. :hi:

[knitter4democracy]

90. Alithos Anesti!!

I always screw up the English response and keep saying, "Truly He is risen." I have no idea why.

Did you have a good dinner to break the Fast?

[Leopolds Ghost]

123. Do you and yours crack eggs?

Gregorian Easter coincides with Greek Orthodox Easter
(and Passover) this year.

[opiate69]

94. Well.may most of the lord's teaching be with us.. not that "turn the other cheek" bit though, right?

[Ilsa]

95. Thank you for posting! May the Lord be with you! nt

[papau]

154. And with you - peace :-) n/t

n/t

[kwassa]

96. Happy Easter to all. The Lord has Risen, Indeed!

thanks papau, and Happy Easter!

[papau]

159. Thank you - and may the peace be with you always :-) n/t

n/t

[jgraz]

98. Christ is risen? Damn, time to pop him in the oven.

mmm....toasty jesus bread... /homer

[MistressOverdone]

119. No, the Pillsbury Dough Boy is ready to pop in.

You got them mixed up. Jesus was probably kinda rangy and not at all fluffy.

[jgraz]

124. Good point -- why aren't we worshipping that guy?

After all, he's risen a bunch more times than Jeezus. And those crescent rolls? Waaaay better than the silly little wafer thingies.

[MistressOverdone]

142. Admit it

don't you just want to bite his head off?

[Leopolds Ghost]

125. "Hope you enjoy eating me, because once I'm gone... it's your turn to die!"

"...now it's YOUR turn to die!" --The Sacrificial Hamburger, R. Crumb

See the REST of the story at:









HAMBURGER HI-JINX!

[Leopolds Ghost]

135. For those who can't see the images, from HAMBURGER HI-JINX:

HAMBURGERS! (yum, yum!) (drool)

COOK: Right-o, comin'up! Yessiree!

Here y'are, m'man!
Hot'n'hearty'n'plump
as ya please! (Yeah! YEAH!)

CHEESIS K. REIST:

Oh you perty li'l thing!

I'm gonna give ya th' mustard
an' I'm gonna give ya th' ketchup!

Ho HO! Now would'ja take
a look at That Hamburger!

(Wot a beauty!
Wot a winner!)

Li'l Hamburger!

I'm lookin' at you with nothin'
but LOVE, you may believe!

Yep!

AND IT IS NOT WITH MALICE THAT I
TELL YOU, BABY, THAT YOU MUST DIE,
SO'S I MAY LIVE! (Uh huh!)

MUSTARD:

Listen, pal, I'll fill you in!
That burger knows the score!

KETCHUP:

That's right, buddy! Dig right in!
That's what he's waitin' for!

BURGER/CONDIMENTS:

Only keep in mind,
When you've scarfed me down!

That's only half the merry-go-round!

CHEESIS K. REIST:

I GOTCHA, KID! I Gotcha GOOD, I DID! (GLOM)

HAW HAW!!

(MUNCH CHOFF GULP! GLUMPH)

COOK/CONDIMENTS:

Now it's YOUR Turn!
YOUR turn to give yourself up!
YOUR turn to die!

(Wha-?)

CHEESIS K. REIST:

SHADDUP!!!!!

Lemme outa this creepy joint!

No G-ddamn HAMBURGER'S
gonna tell me I gotta do ANY-
thing!

(Watch out, bum!) (Azzhole!) (Stinkin' piece o' ----)

I am not! My Azzhole does not stink! I don't have to--

~~~~~~~~~RUMBLE~~~~~~~~~!! (Yaaah!)

On Edit: Blasphemy not intended -- it's at least as good a version of the Passion story as Matrix Revolutions! Where d'ya think that burger came from, hmm?

[DesertRat]

100. Alleluia!

Peace be with you. :)

[papau]

160. And with you always :-) n/t

n/t

[MistressOverdone]

103. The Lord is Risen Indeed

A blessed Eastertide to you.

[papau]

161. peace and blessing we with you and yours always :-) n/t

n/t

[Leopolds Ghost]

104. After he has destroyed every ruler and every authority and power.

for as all die in Adam, so all will be made alive in Christ. But each in his own order: Christ the first fruits, then at his coming those who belong to Christ. Then comes the end, when he hands over the kingdom to God the Father, after he has destroyed every ruler and every authority and power. For he must reign until he has put all his enemies under his feet. The last enemy to be destroyed is death.

1 Corinthians 15:22-26

Isaiah's prophecy of the new Jerusalem: (after the
anticipated, and permanent, fall of the Kingdom of
Israel to Babylonian invasion) --

But be glad and rejoice forever
in what I am creating:
for I am about to create Jerusalem as a joy,
and its people as a delight.

I will rejoice in Jerusalem,
and delight in my people;
no more shall the sound of weeping be heard in it,
or the cry of distress.

No more shall there be in it
an infant that lives but a few days,
or an old person who does not live out a lifetime;
for one who dies at a hundred years will be considered a youth,
and one who falls short of a hundred will be considered accursed.

They shall build houses and inhabit them;
they shall plant vineyards and eat their fruit.

They shall not build and another inhabit;
they shall not plant and another eat;
for like the days of a tree shall the days of my people be,
and my chosen shall long enjoy the work of their hands.

The wolf and the lamb shall feed together,
the lion shall eat straw like the ox;
but the serpent -- his food shall be dust!
They shall not hurt or destroy
on all my holy mountain,
says the LORD.

Isaiah 65:18-22, 25

The sermon was about the occupying troops of Jerusalem,
patrolling the city looking for agitators
like the police did during the '68 riots.

Yes, we have a cool pastor. :-)

[Ian David]

131. I feel so much better knowing it's a religion of peace

Nice Guy?



or the Devil's Spawn?


He snorted cocaine ... He dodged the draft....His friends knew him as an alcoholic womanizer with a bad temper....a complete failure at business until his wealthy friends bailed him out. Yet within a few short years he was elected Governor of Texas, and quickly catapulted into the White House, in spite of losing the popular vote. He was re-elected with last minute help from Osama Bin Laden, in spite of high disapproval ratings. He still couldn't think his way out of a wet paper bag .....and yet he's declared an endless war and instituted some of the most radical political changes in American history ....

....... How has He done it?

I submit to you that George Walker Bush is the ANTI-CHRIST. The violence and destruction that started when Bush first entered office, is likely to culminate in the apocalypse, just as predicted in the Bible, over 2,000 years ago.

More:
http://www.bushisantichrist.com/

[Leopolds Ghost]

134. Could be, could be. Let's start with doing away with principalities and powers

And then Anti-Christs like Bush (yes, there are supposed
to be many, and "by their fruits shall ye know them" will
not be a problem.

Of course, we Christians believe in nonviolent struggle.

[papau]

162. Interesting! - we just did the Gospel in 5 lanuages so all could have a native reading :-) n/t

n/t

[Lydia Leftcoast]

130. Haec dies quam fecit Dominus

Exultemus et laetemur in ea.
Alleluia.

One of the anthems we sang this morning, the William Byrd setting. :-)

[papau]

163. Very Nice - the singing was such I just closed my eyes and was lifted - it was great! :-) n/t

n/t

[Book Lover]

136. Happy Easter to all who celebrate it

And just remember, next week, there will be room in the pews again! (That's for catholics. Is it the same for orthodox?)

[papau]

164. Of course - the Xmas birth and Easter get overflow crowds - indeed in the EU they say

baptism and your funeral and perhaps each years Easter are the times you are in Church.

Like the US overflow on Xmas and Easter and major drop off on other Sundays.

But the folks I know in the US and in the EU that do not regularly go to Church do tend to read the Bible and says their prayers at home.

[ayeshahaqqiqa]

138. And with His rising comes the promise

and reminder of the sacredness of Life Eternal

[papau]

165. Amen :-)

:-)

[beam me up scottie]

166. This was posted in GD?

That explains a lot.

[greyl]

168. Even more positive news, is that humans aren't born in need of salvation.

The belief that God botched the job when it came to making us, is a poisonous one.

[MistressOverdone]

175. Well, I can't speak for everyone

but I'm pretty much a stinker and am happy for whatever salvation I can get. My not-so-nice side peeped out somewhere around six months, if family stories are correct. And I'm basically a pretty decent person.

I like the way Bono put it:

"I believe in the kingdom come
Then all the colors will bleed into one
Bleed into one
Well yes I'm still running

You broke the bonds and you
Loosed the chains
Carried the cross
Of my shame
Of my shame
You know I believe it...."

[WritingIsMyReligion]

181. I'll pass, thanks all the same.

Easter always struck me as a particularly morbid holiday.

[MistressOverdone]

185. Maybe this would be more acceptable to everyone

Our (mis)Concept of Patriarchal Authority, who, it can be said, inhabits the metaphysical sphere, privileged be your signifier.

May your social structure achieve dominance.

May the enactment of your desire be manifested throughout the physical-metaphysical dichotomy.

Empower us this day with the means of material production,

And refuse to enforce sanctions against our behavior which some see as subversions of a moral perspective, just as we refuse to marginalize the moral perspectives of others who have exerted their individuality.

Don't lead us into situation that some would (mis)understand as detrimental to the full expression of our humanness, but liberate us from the concept of "evil."

For yours is the hegemony, and the dominance, and perceived mystification within the entire continuum of the Western concept of linear time.

Amen