Why didn't Satan use women to tempt Jesus in the desert?

[More Than A Feeling]

Is the absence of sex in the temptations the origin of the hypothesis that Jesus was celibate, or the origin of the hypotheses that Jesus was immune to that particular form of sexual temptation, or both?

[grannylib]

1. Maybe because he knew he was really married to Mary Magdalene??

I don't know - never thought about that one before.

[Evoman]

26. ....because you can't seduce a married man with other women. It's impossible!!!!

*grin*

It's the first thing I'd try :rofl:

[Evoman]

27. oops, wrong place to post nt

[BlooInBloo]

2. Does it really matter so much what the *specific* form of the temptation was?

[More Than A Feeling]

3. Seems like it does.

One of the gospels (Matthew?) lists three temptations: stone to bread, power over the kingdoms of the world, and throwing himself off the mountain. Another gospel just says he was tempted (John?). Why would any of the gospel writers bother to list them if it didn't matter?

[BlooInBloo]

10. Alternatively, if it mattered, maybe the authors would've cared enough to get their stories straight

It's been too long since I read it; is there any main *point* of the stories that depends in any *essential* way on the specific contents of the temptations?

[More Than A Feeling]

18. It gives Jesus a chance to quote OT prophecy out of context.

Which is one of Matthew's favorite things to do.

[On the Road]

29. Robert Eisenman Thinks That the Form of the Last Temptation

was written as a slur against Jesus' brother James, whose feud with Paul split the early church. (The Gospels were all written or edited by the Pauline side, and many passages can be read this way.)

Jesus, Matthew says, could have thrown himself down from the temple and angels would have caught him. James, however, was martyred by being forcibly thrown from a high point of the Temple and died. The reader can infer that James did not have God's support the way Jesus did.

The thought process behind the temptation is also interesting -- engaging in an act with fatal results in order to force God's intervention. I have suspected for awhile now that Jesus staged public events like the triumphal entry and confrontations like the cleansing of the Temple in order to make sure he was arrested and sentenced to death. His cry of "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?" shows that he was expecting an intervention that, tragically for him, never came.

[Mountainman]

4. There is no satan and quite possibly no jesus.

This to me is in the realm of superstition.

[More Than A Feeling]

5. Of course there isn't, but somebody wrote the stories.

(and yes, that someone is a person, not a deity). That person surely had something in mind when they were writing.

[msongs]

6. somebody wrote the harry potter books too nt

[More Than A Feeling]

7. Sure, and her fans go crazy trying to suss out all the little nooks and crannies of her books.

Speaking of which, there are probably tons of fanfic opportunities in the Bible going by the wayside.

[uberllama42]

14. Bible fanfic

That might be the best idea I have heard in years.

[cynatnite]

21. Already exists...check it out...

http://www.fanfiction.net/book/Bible/

[uberllama42]

12. And almost every detail in those books has a purpose

If the bible is half as good as I hear it is from some quarters, it should stand up to the same kind of amateur literary analysis as Harry Potter.

[Mountainman]

15. I think the stories were tradition handed down from generation to generation just as

all peoples did. I studied to be a docent at an American Indian cave painting site and learned many of the stories handed down in that tribe. Many are similar to bible stories. There were used to teach things that a person needed to know to survive like how dangerous a rattle snake was. Or how wiley a coyote was. They were also entertainment during long cold winter nights.

[robinlynne]

8. It's way too hot for sex in the desert.

[cynatnite]

9. 'thy has a woody' didn't read well. n/t

[More Than A Feeling]

11. Yeah, but they could have gotten someone to write in the style of Ezekiel 23:20.

Look it up if you don't know it already. It's totally worth it.

[cynatnite]

16. ...

:wow:

[More Than A Feeling]

17. Won't someone please think of the children?????

[cynatnite]

19. Can you imagine a little kid reading that in church?

But it's in the Bible :rofl:

[More Than A Feeling]

20. That gives me an idea...

:evilgrin:

[cynatnite]

22. Please, share...

:evilgrin:

[More Than A Feeling]

23. If someone wanted to pull a Fight Club-style subversive prank

they could do things to pew Bibles that would attract people's attention to that verse.

[Meshuga]

33. It would be great to be in the stand behind a goal in a NFL game

holding a sign "Ezekiel 23:20-21" (you would have to include verse 21 as well).

[tularetom]

25. I think I saw her in Tijuana about 30 years ago

[BlooInBloo]

13. All ur woody are belong to us, sayeth the devil.

[Art_from_Ark]

30. No wonder it didn't read well

The correct King James English for Ancient Times(TM) would have been:

"Thou hast a woodye" or its variant
"Thou hast a woodee"

[Radical Activist]

24. sex outside of marriage was a minor sin at best.

[John Gauger]

43. I don't know, Jesus said it was the only justification for divorce.

[Evoman]

28. Man, I'd be so easy to seduce, it's not even funny.

*somewhere in the desert*

Evoman: Begone Satan! You will not tempt me.

Satan: Pizza pop?

Evoman: Fuck.......




God: Aw crap....now I have to find another messiah.

[Why Syzygy]

31. Because if he had ALL the power and ALL the wealth, as promised, he could have any chick he wanted!!

DUH

[notfullofit]

32. Because

he knew better.

[John Gauger]

44. "Knew better?"

Like what? Like he knew Jesus would turn him down? And he didn't know that Jesus would turn down the other offers? If he correctly thought that Jesus could not be bribed by flesh, why did he incorrectly think that Jesus could bribed with power and wealth?

[notfullofit]

46. Perhaps he thought

'two outta three ain't bad'

[Dorian Gray]

34. I don't know....

Though I would guess a theologist would say that turning against/denying God is a more severe sin than sexual relations.

[Occam Bandage]

35. Because that is not relevant. Jesus was a man of great power and ability, who was on a fast. Satan

tempted Jesus first with abandoning his fast, then with misuse of his power to Earthly instead of Heavenly ends. The purpose wasn't simply to tempt Jesus, it was to tempt Jesus to abandon his mission. Sex would have been sinful, but would not have prevented him from carrying out the redemption of Man, as the other temptations would have.

[cyborg_jim]

37. Since Satan is God's advocate... (see Job)

It makes more sense that this would have been a test by God to determine whether or not Jesus was up to the job.

[John Gauger]

45. Is it necessary the same guy though?

Recall that people often incorrectly assume that the serpent in the garden was Satan (Milton included.) Maybe the Satan in Job and the Satan in the desert with Jay-Chrizzle are not the same guy.

[Occam Bandage]

47. Agreed. Whichever way you want to look at it--

whether it was Satan ensuring Jesus had the mettle, Satan attempting to divert Jesus away from his path, or a combination of both--the tests as written make sense, while adding a seductress to the mix wouldn't particularly.

[greyl]

36. Satan knew Jesus was homosexual. ? nt

[uberllama42]

38. It took almost a day for someone to give that response

I am impressed.

[greyl]

39. I thought about it yesterday. Still impressed?

Is the possibility that Jesus was gay a problem to some people?

[uberllama42]

40. I thought about it immediately

I think we're all mature enough not to be offended by the notion that Jesus might be gay.

[greyl]

41. Hope so.

To be clear, I wasn't making a serious assertion, just a little joke.
I suppose it's quite possible, though.

[John Gauger]

42. That's interesting.

Is there any mention of Jesus's sexuality at all? I don't seem to recall ever hearing about it. What was the stance of the people who wrote about Jesus vs. Satan on his divinity, and what did those people believe about the sexuality of the gods? The Greeks of course had gods just as horny as they did, but I seem to remember reading that the Jews at that time were extremely prudish. Perhaps the very association of Jesus with sex was blasphemous. However, if it was written by somebody who didn't believe that Jesus was God, or by somebody who didn't have a problem with associating sex with God, I can't think of any reason why is should be excluded. Perhaps it was mentioned and scrubbed later.

On a somewhat related note, I read in one of Dinesh D'Souza's works that Jesus didn't command his followers to literally castrate themselves for the sake of heaven. He said everything in the bible is true, but it isn't literally true. I don't know what the distinction between the two is. But it seems unusual for him to commend people for cutting their balls off in order to get into heaven if nobody ever actually did it. So if people actually did it, it seems unusual to say that he is only telling people to do it metaphorically after mentioning that people do it literally. At least, it seems like he should be aware that that could potentially cause some confusion.

[More Than A Feeling]

48. Someone should have told Origen.

If I recall correctly, that particular theologian took that passage VERY literally. How can D'Souza quarrel with such a bad-ass? Yes, it was stupid, but if you'll pardon the expression, it also took a lot of gonads.

[John Gauger]

49. Yeah, he mentioned Origen.

And he said that it was a misinterpretation. Jesus could never actually have meant it that way. But that shows a temporal provincialism. It seems absurd today, but that doesn't mean it wasn't ever believed. It's the same bait-and-switch they always do with their myths. It wasn't literally six days/worldwide flood/talking snake/sun going backwards/earth being flat/three days in the whale's belly/substitute your own absurdity. They never meant it that way.

Further, it must have been a metaphor, because Jesus was a perfect moral teacher. I mean, cut your balls off? It must be metaphorical, otherwise the "Jesus as perfect moral teacher" meme goes out the window.