Anyone here heard of the Bible Code?

[lonestarnot]

Well I have, and I find it interesting. I looked at the Digest just for the heck of it and this is what was found on John McCain.

On McCain the President


In addition, we searched for McCain the President and The President McCain. There was only a 0.00235 expected chance of finding those two 11-letter codes. None were found.

On Obama the President

Unlike McCain, when we searched for Obama the President and The President Obama they had a 0.92704 expected number of occurrences, due to the letters occurring more frequently than the letters in McCain's name. We did find one for each of the 10-letter codes, but neither of them had any extensions.


:shrug:

[Beregond2]

1. It's been proven that you can use that same method on any book and

get similar results. It's meaningless.

[lonestarnot]

3. Ugh no, did not work on War and Peace. But I didn't put this thread here to debate the merits

of the Code.

[trotsky]

8. Ugh yes, it's been completely debunked.

If you didn't want a debate or contrary ideas, you should have posted in a group.

Assassinations foretold in Moby Dick Code: http://cs.anu.edu.au/~bdm/dilugim/moby.html

[arKansasJHawk]

38. You know why ...

Some people feel the need to "debunk" stuff like this on DU?

Because believing in stuff like this (and that includes astrology, reading tea leaves, tarot, Nostradumbass (as someone else awesomely called him in this thread) UFOs, John Edwards (the "psychic," not the Senator), Sylvia Browne, that odious walrus mustache clown who's name escapes me at the moment, etc.) is because it seems to reveal, to us, a serious lack of critical thinking skills, and a serious possibility that people who believe in this stuff are more likely to veer off in some loony-toons direction and start doing/saying/posting things that are potentially harmful to the progressive cause.

Someone, for instance, recently posted some nonsense in the GDP thread about retrograde Mercury and how it said some bullshit about something that supposedly meant something about the election. Now, if that person gets some astrology reading that tells them Obama will be assassinated if he's elected president, don't you think that person would hesitate to vote for him just out of simple human concern for his life?

A lot of skeptics walk a very fine line between wanting to respect the beliefs of others and wanting to point out when those beliefs becomes harmful to the larger society. Most of us, I think, feel it's more important to come down on the preventing harm to society side, rather than the don't hurt the poor believer's feelings side.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

39. You're right, it was Moby Dick.

http://cs.anu.edu.au/people/bdm/dilugim/moby.html

[zeemike]

2. Yes I have that program.

But haven't used it in years.
But that is interesting.
Did you try McCain Palin and Obama Biden?

[lonestarnot]

4. No, I didn't try it, I was looking at a website.

I know it is sort of like fortune telling and was not to be used for those purposes, but I'm sinful and couldn't resist. :)

[Dorian Gray]

5. I truly

don't understand what the code signifies or means.

Does that indicate it's more likely for Obama to win? Or is there a deeper "significance" behind the code?

[zeemike]

6. Well it is truly an interesting thing

That if you have time to check it out.
But it goes way back to ancient Jewish scholars of the Torah
It was only with the advent of the computer that they were able to detect how really interesting the idea was.

[lonestarnot]

7. It is a very interesting phenom. I've done quite a bit of reading re the Code.

Would take me too long to run it down entirely, but here it is in a nutshell. There is a code written into 3 dimensional aspects in the Bible. It was discovered by a world renowned mathematician named Eli Ripps, Israeli. Using a computer he searched the Bible for this code using equidistant sequencing. You are in it and I am in it. Google it if you would like more information. What they are saying on this site in the quote that I posted is that it that the search revealed that it is statistically significant that Obama is our next POTUS, but fortune telling is against the rules and can be misleading. Sir Isaac Newton searched for this code as was evidenced in his personal possessions after his death. He had to give up his search because he croaked, but with the advent of the computer, Ripps has figured out some of it. It is quite interesting.

[uberllama42]

9. What does "against the rules" mean?

In what way is fortune tellin against the rules? Whose rules are these?

[trotsky]

11. It's a simple rule, you see.

You can't use it to predict, because if you did, then you (and the bible code) would be proven wrong. You can only use it AFTER the fact to go back and actively search for a "prediction" about something that already happened. Then you'll never be wrong! Same with Nostradumbass, same with everything else.

[Dorian Gray]

12. I still don't get it

at all....

So they purport that there is this code. It has hidden information in it, but it can't be used to predict anything. But it mentions everything in history in it somehow? And when something comes to pass, you can find that something mentioned in the code?

I still don't get it at all.

Sorry.

(I know you weren't the one purporting the code, Trotsky. I just used your post to jump off from because I really really really don't get it at all.)

[trotsky]

14. "But it mentions everything in history in it somehow?"

It sure seems to - but here's the thing. ANY sufficiently large book, when subjected to the methods used in the "Bible Code" can be found to contain just about any message. See my post above about the assassinations "predicted" in Moby Dick. The "Bible Code" is especially flexible because of how Hebrew vowels work. Only consonants have characters in Hebrew writing - vowels are represented by dots or markings on those characters. But when the "Bible Code" is used, those markings are ignored, and the resulting consonants can be put together with the interpreter's choice of vowels as they see fit. It takes a method that's bound to find lots of messages, and enhances it by giving the "interpreter" even more flexibility to pick words.

[TZ]

15. So basically..

this is the theological version of people who yammer on about subliminal advertising (the phallic symbols or skulls found in ice cubes of alcoholic advertising) or who talk about the hidden messages in records played backwards....:D

edited for speeeling

[lonestarnot]

16. You are wrong about the comparison of the code with other books. It has not worked the same.

A couple of phrases words found in other books, but not in same manner or such with such precision or abundance.

[trotsky]

19. No, you are wrong.

Not only can you find unlimited messages in large enough books, but as noted, written Hebrew gives a LOT more leeway to find "codes." Of course that's not even mentioning all the bogus "codes" like one that supposedly says Winston Churchill would be assassinated, or any of the multiple blasphemous phrases that many Christians believe prove the "Bible Code" to be the bunk it is. How could god put in blasphemous phrases to be found?

But the real kicker is that Hebrew, unlike most languages, is written and read from right to left. Drosnin and his dupes do all their analysis from left to right!

[lonestarnot]

20. Did I mention Drosnin? I think that was you wasn't it?

What you doubt that God is capable of such a mystery? I have not tried to argue the validity of the code here. And again you are wrong with regard to other books used as a control. "How could God put in blasphemous phrases to be found?" God did not, the blasphemor can find anything he seeks to find. :rofl:

[trotsky]

21. "the blasphemor can find anything he seeks to find"

Brilliant! You yourself have now admitted it's bunk. A person can find anything he seeks to find.

[TZ]

23. And this person has an agenda

Because you disagree you are a "blasphemer". When did Pat Robertson start posting in R/T?

[trotsky]

26. Well, this person also played a mean trick on DU just a few weeks ago.

Teasing and taunting with "news" that ended up of course being a big ol' dud.

[lonestarnot]

28. And you should also add that the WaPo did release the news on the front page 5 pages.

Ommission of facts, isn't that what you're about?

[trotsky]

32. You have nothing left.

Your "bible code" has been exposed for the fraud it is, just like your taunting and teasing with the news that would supposedly bring down the McSame campaign.

You've admitted you can find ANYTHING with the "code," so you've defeated your own position far better than I could have. Thanks for playing!

[Name removed]

33. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[lonestarnot]

27. I have no fucking agenda. I could care less what you think about the BC

[TZ]

22. Proof? Trotsky gave proof of other books having this

When did "Your wrong!" become a valid argument?
BTW, since I believe that there is no god..I find this another shell game by believers to prove the unprovable that god exists.
BTW, if you read the history of the bible its been translated and CHANGED over and over again so this whole bible code thing is complete bunk. Is there a Koran code? A Torah code? How about in aramaic since thats what most of the Bible was written in.

[trotsky]

25. There is indeed a Koran code.

http://www.submission.org/quran/biblecode.html

[lonestarnot]

30. I have not read about Koran codes, but Drosnin is not a mathmetician, he is a writer he wrote a book

He did not discover the code.

[moggie]

35. More than one book

And his Bible Code II book contains the code "THE BIBLE CODE IS A SILLY, DUMB, FAKE, FALSE, EVIL, NASTY, DISMAL FRAUD AND SNAKE-OIL HOAX".

Take a look here for some "negative bible codes" found in the bible, including "Jesus is not God", "there is no Jehovah", and "Satan is Jehovah".

[lonestarnot]

29. And if one jot had been changed, no code discovery.

[uberllama42]

37. That's true. What is the possible point

of this code if it cannot be used to predict? What's the point?

[uberllama42]

36. I wonder if they would accept as evidence against

predictions present of things which didn't happen.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

13. The Bible is not a single-authorship continuous narrative

You're asking me to believe that an unknown number of authors writing over a period of seven hundred years all followed the same code to include prophecies about a presidential election in a country that had not yet been founded on a continent that they didn't know existed.

[lonestarnot]

17. I didn't ask you to believe anything.

[cosmik debris]

10. Which Bible?

Which language? Which version?

[lonestarnot]

18. The Torah. First 5 books was where the discovery was made.

The rest of the Bible has also be confirmed to contain code.

[TZ]

24. The Torah is NOT the Bible

Anymore than the Koran is.

[lonestarnot]

31. I didn't say that, the first 5 Books of the Bible is called the Torah.

[cosmik debris]

34. I was only kidding

And trying to make the subtle point that all versions of the bible have small variation which would destroy any chance of there being an embedded code.

In fact the idea of a bible code is laughable. I'm amazed at the number of suckers who fall for that scam.

[jody]

40. I found the Bible Code less intellectually stimulating than scatology. I could only quick-scan it

under duress because a very dear friend gave me a copy and insisted I read it so we could discuss it over dinner.

Oh well, dinner was delicious and the company fabulous.

[Abaddon865]

41. find and seek

If you look hard enough for something you'll eventually find some way of convincing yourself that it is there.

[edhopper]

42. Here's a test

have the "Bible Code" predict some event that is verifiable. Not some 50/50 thing like McCain/Obama, but something unexpected and unambiguous.
Showing "predictions" in hindsight isn't very compelling.