What is your definition of a "reprimand"?

[stopschoolpaddling]

Are there any teachers out there who can tell me in your own words what this school policy means to you?

As a disciplinary action "teacher/principal reprimand"?

[patrice]

1. Error is defined & described. Correction is mandated. nt

[stopschoolpaddling]

2. Can you give an example of that? Of what it would look like in your classroom?

Your choice of misbehavior. What is the correction?

[patrice]

3. Well, I taught mostly high school seniors. I kept a daily classroom journal organized

by student name, so, assuming that you're talking about a behavioral reprimand, once I had identified something that was problematic going on in the classroom, each subsequent occurrence would result in the deduction of one participant-point from those involved, and Participation was 20% over-all in my grading formula. Of course, any student who had lost participation points could always earn them back again by participating appropriately. If someone was REALLY just persistently obnoxious, parents would get a phone call in which I read my journal notes back for them and asked for their comments/enlightenment. My kids were far from perfect, but they consisted largely of rather ambitious types because I taught mostly advance placement and, because I weighted participation as much as I did, I felt I couldn't be tooooooooooooo restrictive on them, since they needed to feel motivated in order to participate. Also, I taught Psychology, so it was easy to distract them from most distractions by guiding class activity toward things they were interested in.

[Hangingon]

5. This strikes me as wrong.

I think discipline should be handled as discipline. Performance is a separate issue.

[proud2BlibKansan]

8. She isn't grading performance

She's grading participation.

[Hangingon]

9. Is she? I think not.

"assuming that you're talking about a behavioral reprimand, once I had identified something that was problematic going on in the classroom, each subsequent occurrence would result in the deduction of one participant-point from those involved, and Participation was 20% over-all in my grading formula."

Once a behavioral problem is observed, she deducts a grade point from "participation". I also have a problem with this journal. Is it authorized by the school district. Are the students away of these notes before they are used against them? Are they give3n copies of journal notations regarding their behavior? What is the retention instructions on these journal. These sound very much like the equivalent of supervisory un official personnel files.

[proud2BlibKansan]

10. Every teacher gives a participation grade; it's usually about 20%

That's very standard. It's policy in many school districts. I can also remember being graded on participation when I was in college. You can't just show up, take up space and expect to get an A.

That journal is the teacher's private journal. Teachers have to keep notes, especially if you have as many students as high school teachers have. Most of us keep a journal. I have a notebook I jot notes in about particular students nearly every day. It's usually the last thing I do before I leave for the day. And no, it's no one's business but mine so I would never share it with a student. I also wouldn't share it with administration. It is my personal anecdotal records. Often I am asked to write reports on particular students and I use my notebook for the information included in my report. Those reports are often shared with students and parents. But not my notebook.

[Hangingon]

11. Yes I understand class participation.

I agree that it should be part for the final grade. It was in almost every class I have ever taken.

The thread is about reprimands - discipline. The teacher above indicates that she handles inappropriate behavior reprimands by deducting a point from the class participation portion of the final grade. I argue that a point deduction is not a reprimand and is inappropriate. Albiet, the student's participation is impacted by the behavior, but the behavior problem is a matter of classroom discipline.

As to the matter of journals or diaries that discuss student discipline or performance. You consider them private and do not share them with students. You do refer to them when you prepare reports. When you use the journal/diary to prepare a report, it becomes an official document. It was made at the school and it was used in the conduct of official business i.e the report. Therefore, the journal/diary is subject to FOIA and, of course, subject to subpoena. Journals, like "unnofficial" supervisory files or notes are not a good idea. Even if the practice has been used widely for many years.

[proud2BlibKansan]

12. And if anyone ever asks me for my private journal, it goes directly into the trash

I actually do destroy it every year on the last day of school. It's not an official document because no one but me knows it exists and no one has any idea what is and is not in it. No one can subpoena a document they don't know about.

All teachers keep a journal or a file on their kids. It's impossible to remember everything about every kid without keeping notes.

As far as the inappropriate behavior, I'd want to know more specifics. There's a big difference between talking out without raising your hand and cursing out the teacher. Both are inappropriate and would requires some type of reprimand.

You've never taught, have you?

[Hangingon]

13. If it is FOIAed or subpoened, trashing it is a crime.

Whether anyone knows about the joural or not does not determines if the journal is a record, Its preparation (at school), content (information on students) and use in official business (the report preparation) determine if it is a record. Yes people can and do FOIA and subpoena unknown documents. Many request all documents relating to ... specific subject. By the way, Federal FOIA covers more than just official records in the office file cabinet.

I am not sure all teachers do keep a journal. I agree it is a good idea to document. The documents are also records. The documents should be available to the student/parents. Or does your school believe in "double secret probation"?

No specific behavior has been alleged. I don't know what the inappropriate behavior is being discussed. In the example you give, yes there is a difference. I would think that a professional teacher would apply progressive punishment appropriate to the offense.

Ahh, the old "You've never taught, have you?" Yes, I have.

[proud2BlibKansan]

14. Yet you don't seem to understand participation grades

Or that all teachers keep journals.

Hmmmm.

[Hangingon]

15. No, you are the one who seems to have difficulty with this.

I understand class participation and agree with grading for it. What you don't or can't seem to grasp is that good or bad class performance - varying from never wanting to respond to always wanting to answer the teacher - is different from the disciplinary issues - like disruption the class to cursing out the teacher. Remember this thread is about reprimands. Performance issues should be treated differently than discipline issues. Hmmmmm.... wonder why that is so hard to understand.

All teachers do not keep journals. I didn't. My wife didn't. My daughter doesn't. Most teachers I know no longer keep that type of record.

[proud2BlibKansan]

16. No you don't understand it

If you did, you wouldn't have asked the question in the first place :crazy:

As far as not keeping anecdotal journals, I wouldn't want to be you in a meeting with the administrator and an angry parent. "Well, Mrs. Smith, I think I remember that 3 months ago, your little Bubba called a girl a bitch. At least I think that was him. Then about a month after that, if memory serves, he yelled out 'fuck' in class. At least it SOUNDED like Bubba. Then again today, he was cursing in class. That's why we called you. But I have 120 students and I can't really be sure what happened."

Yep, good luck with that plan.

[Hangingon]

17. There you go again

Reading is difficult I know.

Go back and look. I did not say don't document. I said "personal" journals and diaries are problematic. If it is worth documenting, you should. The document should not be secret. It should be part of a file for parent meetings and a copy should be available to the student and his parents. It would certainly be better to have a file for the parent conference than speaking from a secret journal. (How does it work? Do you hold the journal under the table at the meeting?) I'll bet that impresses administrators and angry parents.

That said, continuing to explain the same points over and over to someone who deliberately misconstrues my position is pointless. So, keep on with the "anecdotal journals" - Dear Diary, Bubba "yelled out 'fuck' in class." Thanks for playing.

[pnwmom]

4. Depends on who is getting reprimanded.

If it's a student, a letter gets sent home to the parents.
If it's a teacher, a letter gets put in his or her file.

:shrug:

[femmocrat]

6. It depends on the grade level, also.

A reprimand in elementary could simply be a warning to stop some misbehavior.

In middle school, I would follow up if the warning was ignored with a write-up or a call to parents.

[noamnety]

7. To me a reprimand implies

documentation of wrongdoing and correction, so that if the person repeats the offense there can't be any excuse that they didn't know better, and the school can document that it's ongoing behavior not a one-time deal.

So if a student plagiarizes something, maybe on the first occurrence they didn't realize that pasting a quote from the internet was plagiarism. You document the discussion, maybe they do or don't get credit for that particular assignment or a chance to redo it. But if it happens again, there's a paper trail showing that they were aware of the policy and willfully decided to ignore it - and I would expect the consequences to become more severe because of the prior reprimand. (Losing credit for a marking period? At the college level, losing credit for a course or even being booted out of the school might be appropriate.)