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JackBeck Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-18-08 09:54 PM
Original message
Why is this anthropological view never referenced?
Anthropologists Reject “Traditional” definition of Marriage
By Patrick M. Chapman, PhD

A recent article from Focus on the Family’s CitizenLink suggests that “anthropologists agree on traditional definition of marriage.” This statement is true only if they reference what anthropologists consider traditional, not the Focus on the Family opinion that marriage is solely between one man and one woman.

The article also states “There are two definitions of marriage in today’s culture – one of them has been around for centuries; the other is brand new.” Once again, this statement is true. However, Focus on the Family is confused as to which definition has been around for centuries and which is new. Anthropologists, historians and sociologists all recognize the “one man with one woman” definition of marriage to be very recent and not representative of how marriage is or has been expressed throughout the world. For example, in Marriage, a History historian Stephanie Coontz documents the changes that occurred in Western marriages over the last few centuries. Her research demonstrates that what Focus on the Family calls “traditional marriage” developed over the last 200 years, reaching its current form only in the middle of the last century.

Anthropologists often define marriage as a social, political, or economic contract between two individuals and their families – this does not imply monogamy, as a man with five wives has five separate marriage contracts. In fact, approximately 75 percent of the world’s cultures view polygamy as the preferred form of marriage. Furthermore, anthropologists document that cultures on every continent, excluding Antarctica, have accepted and recognized same-sex marriages. For examples, the Azande of Africa used the same rituals and words for same-sex marriages as they did opposite-sex marriages; three percent of all marriages among the Nandi of Kenya were between two women; same-sex marriages were common in Micronesian cultures with the married couple often adopting children and raising them with no ill effects whatsoever.

In 2004 the American Anthropological Association, the largest association of anthropologists in the United States, issued an official statement opposing the proposed federal marriage amendment, indicating:

The results of more than a century of anthropological research on households, kinship relationships, and families, across cultures and through time, provide no support whatsoever for the view that either civilization or viable social orders depend upon marriage as an exclusively heterosexual institution. Rather, anthropological research supports the conclusion that a vast array of family types, including families built upon same-sex partnerships, can contribute to stable and humane societies.

The Executive Board of the American Anthropological Association strongly opposes a constitutional amendment limiting marriage to heterosexual couples.


Suggesting anthropologists support Focus on the Family’s “traditional definition of marriage” is patently, unequivocally wrong.

http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2008/03/05/1579

There are many more links to research done to support what is quoted above. And much of this is all in response to FOF 'research'.

What I find hilarious is anytime I pitch this argument to a pro-civil unions backer, they inform me how difficult the buy-in would be from the rest of America.

Or they just don't read the articles I direct them to.

The more this conversation continues, I'm become increasingly convinced that the most arrogant of the the civil unions backers refuse to stand in our shoes for just one minute, even in the face of loads of research that supports our fight for marriage equality.
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Richard D Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-18-08 10:00 PM
Response to Original message
1. Cultures on Antarctica?????
Huh? Is there something I didn't learn in school?
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JackBeck Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-18-08 10:03 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. What do you mean?
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Richard D Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-18-08 10:05 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. My bad
My eyes saw "excluding" but my brain saw "including".

:dunce: :dunce:
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racaulk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-19-08 08:59 AM
Response to Reply #3
15. LOL!
You know, I did the exact same thing! :rofl:

:dunce:
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bluedawg12 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-18-08 10:05 PM
Response to Reply #1
4. Well, there are gay penguins.
Maybe they need to include those as well?
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bluedawg12 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-18-08 10:13 PM
Response to Original message
5. Seriously, this is a good question and good info.
I think we are cultural chauvinists.

The main themes for our marriage culture seems to derive from European values and we discount "lesser" cultures as being non civilized.

In the Old Testament David had many wives( if I recall correctly).

In certain Islamic cultures polygamy is, or was allowed, am I correct?

I get the impression when people today talk about "traditional marriage" it is based on some European, agrarian model of life. Property, inheritance, titles (nobility vs. commoner), political alliances, and for rural folks the value of large families to work the land.

It just seems like they shun other cultural models as not civilized.
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DarkTirade Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-18-08 10:18 PM
Response to Reply #5
6. Because when conservatives fight for 'traditional' values,
they mean 'their personal traditions'.
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bluedawg12 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-18-08 10:30 PM
Response to Reply #6
8. I think they have a vision of Amerika as some 19th century
little house on the prairie ideal - and this is a different world.


"Aw, gee paw, can't I marry the girl next door."

"Sure Suzie, someday when you grow up, now go do your chores."

:rofl:

Someday soon.
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Jamastiene Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-19-08 01:36 AM
Response to Reply #8
12. Do Blackberry gadgets come in Braille?
Mary could have used one in Braille.

Thank God that hateful old Harriet Oleson didn't have the internet. We'd have an even bigger fight on our hands, if her busybody ass ever hit the internet. We wouldn't have to worry about Nellie though. She was a dipshit with the intelligence of a chair. She wouldn't even be able to figure out how to use a computer much less get on the internet. Willie would be a computer game FREAK if he ever saw World of Warcraft. Could you imagine?

:rofl:
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madmadmad Donating Member (368 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-18-08 10:19 PM
Response to Original message
7. well, number 1- focus on the family lies...
focus on the family could care less about the truth, they blatantly make up stuff to suit their agenda how ever they see fit.

as for backers of civil unions- to paraphrase the book "he's just not into you", they just don't really care about you. or rather your rights. this is a situation that doesn't affect them personally, and the can't be bothered to be empathetic enough to attempt to understand why this is an important issue to *you* and why this issue might have broader implications in curbing everyone's ability to practice freedom of religion (or freedom FROM religion).

there is also often a bit of residual homophobia even in the most liberal and supposedly "open-minded" of people. just that fact that people go out of their way to state how "open minded" they are, is a residual of homophobia. if we were really equal, wtf would anyone say that?
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bluedawg12 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-18-08 10:36 PM
Response to Reply #7
9. I'm open minded ranks right there with "some of my best friends are gay, but
it's immoral, marriage is a sacred union between ...

a.) Sperm and egg
b.) Man and G-d as in celibate clergy
c.) People just like me and my spouse
d.) the batchelorette
e.) Hef and his harem
f.) cephalopods who mate in clusters sharing gametes wildly
g.) two loving adults, who are committed and responsible

Frakas on the family, what do we expect from a money grubbing psychopath who beats his dog?
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Ellen Forradalom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-18-08 11:45 PM
Response to Original message
10. I anxiously await legalized polyandry
Glad to see the anthropologists are on my side :-)
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Jamastiene Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-19-08 01:30 AM
Response to Original message
11. I would quickly inform anyone who gives any lip about this that if
Micronesia and Kenya are advanced in their thinking enough to perform same sex marriages, then American needs to get with the program too. It's an atrocity that America is not more civilized than it is. I feel as though I am surrounded by cavemen and cavewomen in this country.
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DarkTirade Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-19-08 02:23 AM
Response to Reply #11
13. Cavemen and cavewomen who, ironically, deny the existance of cavemen and cavewomen...
:P
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Jamastiene Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-19-08 04:50 AM
Response to Reply #13
14. It kind of makes you wonder.
Are they so much like cavemen and cavewomen that they cannot see it? Do they not believe in evolution because they haven't evolved yet? They really shouldn't knock until they've tried it. :P
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bluedawg12 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-19-08 10:40 AM
Response to Reply #14
16. Kinda say's it all - doesn't it
some are threatened to their core to imagine that we are a part of nature, evolved from common ancestors over millions of years, and were not sprung from the brow of a creator as fully formed, Caucasian, central Europeans in 16th century attire.

I feel as though we have more in commmon with raccoons than we care to admit. They're smart, warm blooded mammals, with deft hands and very smart at survival and adaptation,I think that's a compliment and not an insult.



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Jamastiene Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-20-08 09:56 AM
Response to Reply #16
21. I love critters.
Any comparison to critters is a compliment. They are above us, imho, in the evolutionary process. They are smart enough to not have wars, small skirmishes maybe, but not wars. They also understand the concept of unconditional love. Humans rarely do.
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Ellen Forradalom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-19-08 12:54 PM
Response to Reply #11
18. that's an insult to Neanderthals everywhere
We're way more backwards than that.
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Jamastiene Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-20-08 09:49 AM
Response to Reply #18
20. Come to think of it,
Edited on Thu Nov-20-08 09:50 AM by Jamastiene
you are right. Neanderthals were most likely way more open minded than America is today.
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Orsino Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-19-08 11:19 AM
Response to Original message
17. The word "traditional" is still just an excuse to perpetuate discrimination. n/t
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Chulanowa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-19-08 02:27 PM
Response to Reply #17
19. It always has been
Edited on Wed Nov-19-08 02:29 PM by Chulanowa
Anything that isn't "traditional" is by their definition, always bad.

I put traditional in quotations because most of them have absolutely no clue what is traditional and what isn't. Most of what they call traditional is really just the conceit of the British upper-middle class and wealthy during the latter portion of the 19th century. The big glamorous wedding? Most people just jumped over brooms. Christmas being a solemn affair? Christmas is traditionally a bawdy, filthy little holiday stretched out over two weeks of drinking, debauchery, and other adults-only entertainment.

Like others have said, they think The Andy Griffith Show and Little House on the Prairie are accurate representations of history (those prairie girls probably would have been effectively married off by the time they had their menses.)
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JackBeck Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-02-08 06:44 PM
Response to Original message
22. Bumping, to complement the other pro-gay marriage threads. n/t
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