Ex-Drug Sales Rep Tells All

[Celebration]

http://www.abcnews.go.com/Health/story?id=4438095&page=1

To sell their drugs, pharmaceutical companies hire former cheerleaders and ex-models to wine and dine doctors, exaggerate the drug's benefits and underplay their side-effects, a former sales rep told a Congressional committee this morning.

Shahram Ahari, who spent two years selling Prozac and Zypraxa for Eli Lily, told a Senate Aging Committee chaired by Sen. Herb Kohl, D-Wisc., that his job involved "rewarding physicians with gifts and attention for their allegiance to your product and company despite what may be ethically appropriate."

......................................

"The nature of this business is gift-giving," says Ahari. He claims that he's heard stories about sales reps helping to pay the cost of a doctor's swimming pool and another doctor who was routinely taken to a nightclub where a hostess was paid to keep him company.

.......................................

Included in his prepared remarks, Ahari cites a quote from a senior marketing executive at Parke-Davis: "I want you out there every day selling Neurotonin. Neurotonin is more profitable than Accupril, so we need to focus on Neurotonin. Pain management, now that's money…. I don't want to see a single patient coming off Neurotonin before they've been up to at least 4,800 milligrams a day. I don't want to hear that safety crap, either."

[southern_belle]

1. k & r

[Lasher]

2. It's easy to spot drug sales reps when they come to the doctor's office.

Young, athletic looking, expensive suit, carrying an oversized briefcase kinda thing. Receptionist is tickled to see them and they go right in ahead of the patients who are waiting.

[Mojorabbit]

3. Actually in most practices

they are a pain in the ass as they disrupt the schedule. My husband sees them long enough to get free samples for his patients who can't afford meds, then gets them out of his office.

[Celebration]

5. perfect behaviour

I suspect a lot of doctors do that. However, these tactics must pay off overall or they wouldn't use/tout them.

[Lasher]

9. It's clear the relationships vary.

Good on your husband. On one hand he doesn't have to let them disrupt his schedule, but I'm glad the makes a sacrifice in this respect to get the samples. At his office do the sales reps go straight in ahead of waiting patients who had signed in before the rep got there? That part of it seems tacky.

[Mojorabbit]

10. In my hubby's practice

The receptionist takes them back to the lounge. The rep waits till he is done with the patient he is seeing or if he is running behind cools their heels till he has a minute between patients. He spends probably five minutes if that with them. Sometimes they just come in and go to the back and just leave the samples.

[Lasher]

12. At my doctor's office they go out to lunch with the sales reps.

I know this from seeing the receptionists sometimes chatting with the reps about where they're going to go to eat. I don't know more than that. Maybe everybody goes, but maybe just the receptionists do. It's a smart move on the sales rep's part either way. I know an administrative assistant can be a powerful ally in business relationships.

I've pretty much decided to switch to another doctor after my next checkup. In the past this guy has prescribed some drugs I didn't need. Several, like xanax for instance, are addictive. He didn't tell me that, and I was too dumb to check it out at the beginning so I ended up hooked. I suspect that's what he wanted, since I think some of these doctors get kickbacks on what they prescribe. When I realized I had dependencies I stopped taking the pills. I went through some changes, that's for sure, but today I feel better and I don't take any prescription drugs.

I noticed the article linked in the OP did not mention medical conventions, where the perks can get pretty lavish compared to lunch and a couple of ballpoint pens at the Doctor's office. It also failed to mention that drug companies are able to access information that tells them what drugs each doctor is prescribing.

[Mojorabbit]

18. Well

The most my husband ever got at a convention to get his CMEs was a tote, pens, postits, and a towel with the name of the convention emblazoned on it. I have it covering a rabbit cage. Nothing that is going to sway him. He was pissed when he found out they knew what drugs he was prescribing. I can't imagine why they gave the companies access to that info. And no, they get no kickbacks. At least none I know.

[Lasher]

19. Rabbit cage, huh huh.

Don't mean to wear you out but I think you've got interesting things to say. Please tell me, what does your husband think about single payer universal health care? And what do you think about it yourself?

[Mojorabbit]

21. He is all for it

There is nothing that wears him down more than not being able to get his patients the care they need. He calls speicalists and begs them to see patients for free, we have paid for xrays and meds for people who were desperate.

He can't do his job properly to help people get better or to get a quality diagnoses if people can't afford the tests or treatment. He went into this field to help people.

I am a retired nurse and think it is way past time we had single payor which I am amazed neither of our candidates are for. He was ready to move to France after we saw Sicko. LOL. The situation as it is adds a lot of stress both for him and his patients.

[Lasher]

22. God bless you and your excellent husband.

I wish more people were just like the two of you.

Lasher

[formercia]

13. I can remember being out of work and not having insurance

and the kindness of doctors who understood my predicament and supplied me with meds from samples. There are good people in this World.

Big pharma gets it all back in the end.

[Celebration]

4. I have observed that!

Lots of flirting laughter between the receptionist and the drug rep. I've been sitting in the waiting room watching this happen......as my daughter and I roll our eyes at each other.

[Sal Minella]

11. Not in the doctor's office I worked in, they didn't -- they were told they could leave any printed

literature they wanted to leave, and the doctor would contact them if he had any questions. The doc instructed me to get rid of them ASAP and I did.

[Warpy]

16. Right, and they leave a wake of tchotchkes as they pass

and the staff is flush with new pens, post-it notes and other crapola featuring the drug of the month. The doc comes back late from lunch smelling of very expensive booze. Everybody has to stay late that day because his schedule's been thrown off.

The good news is that the doc really isn't all that influenced by these guys because of the sheer number of them. What really gets him to prescribe pills to people who don't need them is that they come in clamoring for the latest drug they've seen advertised on TV, the one that lists symptoms in such a general manner that a majority of the population starts thinking they're sick and need the stuff.

Pharmacy detail men are as old as organized medicine. What's really hurting us is the direct advertising to people who are not qualified to self diagnose. That is unethical and needs to be stopped.

[HysteryDiagnosis]

6. Dr. Gupta, beware the company you keep, kicked and recommended

Good job Itsjustme, they had the good doctor on this morning discussing when and if antidepressants should be adminstered. I have never heard the good doctor mention a single supplement for a particular health condition, scratch that, I have heard him warn about them, the dangers and so on. I pity the fool who takes everything that he says as gospel.

Page 1 of 5:Check the following articles HERE ---> http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/sites/entrez?db=pubmed Just enter DHA and depression in the search window. Please note there are positive as well as negative results here.


1:
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Items 1 - 20 of 97

[Celebration]

7. I love DHA

You can do searches for DHA and most anything.

There is now a trial on to see if it prevents Type 1 diabetes.

[HysteryDiagnosis]

8. Key is the immune response, over or under. DHA enhances

cellular respiration due to its curved molecular structure, hydrogenated fats do not. If your nervous system doesn't have enough "healthy fats" to build with, it will make do with hydrogenated and unnatural ones. There's the rub. They don't work well, nor were they ever supposed to exist.

[bluesmail]

14. Business as usual, K & R as usual

[Joanne98]

15. So the doctors are johns too?

[Ayesha]

17. My cousin is a drug rep

There's a reason I never call her. She is engaged to a gerontologist...hmm, I wonder how they met? :eyes: If she would take a respectable job, like telemarketing, debt collecting, or being Eliot Spitzer's next hot "date", I might consider getting back in touch!

[reggie the dog]

20. what these people do is legal

and selling the flowers of the cannabis plant is illegal.

Why was I supposed to respect the war on drugs?????

[Bluestar]

23. Worst story I ever heard was about a "rag" salesman who

turned into a medical devices rep. I knew the guy years ago when I was in the rag (clothing) business. Now mind you no one in the clothing sales business was ever accused of being a Rhodes scholar.

Anyway, after this guy went into medical devices, he came back to brag to his buddies about how the surgeons he sold to didn't know how to use the new equipment. He said that he was allowed to go into the operating room and demonstrate the equipment ON THE PATIENTS! I don't know if this actually happened or not. With the horror stories told about medical and pharma reps, I think it is possible.

[trotsky]

24. "I don't know if this actually happened or not."

But you repeat it anyway, because doctor-bashing is VERY popular in this forum. How responsible.

[Bluestar]

25. I have a lot more first-hand information about my own

experiences with incompetent doctors who prescribe medications with known side effects and DO NOT TELL the patient what the outcome could (and probably will) be. It is definitely "caveat emptor" out there for patients in our health care system. Yet many doctors act like gods who should not be questioned. Do you want me to detail these here? I doubt it. You sound like someone who actually believes that we have the best health care system in the world.

[trotsky]

26. Nice mischaracterization.

I just tire of the endless bashing of doctors (and nurses) in this forum, the lion's share of whom are tireless professionals who really do care about their patients. But no, someone like you comes along with an anecdote and that's taken as "proof" of how horrible those mean old stupid doctors are.

I don't appreciate your mischaracterization. No, I don't think our health care system is the best. But if that's the only way you can argue a point, is to create a strawman by which to bash me, go right ahead.