Getting ugly in VA

[ProSense]

Black legislators endorse Miller; blast Allen, Webb
By BOB LEWIS
AP Political Writer
April 3, 2006

RICHMOND, Va. -- Several black Virginia legislators endorsed Democrat Harris Miller's U.S. Senate campaign Monday and accused his opponents of having poor track records on issues of diversity and affirmative action.

Miller claimed James Webb, a former Republican, and Republican incumbent Sen. George Allen had both shown insensitivity toward diversity and affirmative action initiatives.

"Jim Webb's views on diversity programs are in line with some of the most radical Republicans out there," Miller said at a news conference flanked by state Sens. Benjamin J. Lambert III and Henry Marsh, both from Richmond, and Del. Lionel Spruill Sr., of Chesapeake.

Miller noted newspaper columns Webb had written from as far back as 1995. In one, from May 2000, Webb wrote that affirmative action "has within one generation brought about a permeating state-sponsored racism that is as odious as the Jim Crow laws it sought to countermand.

"A Soviet-style bureaucracy of political commissars now monitors every level of our society to ensure that racial and gender `diversity' matches preordained models, using the awesome powers of government to make certain that white males are not `overrepresented' in education, employment or government contracts," Webb wrote in a column first published in the Wall Street Journal and now available on his campaign Web site.

more...

http://www.dailypress.com/news/local/virginia/dp-va--miller-webb0403apr03,0,7226382.story?coll=dp-headlines-virginia

[beachmom]

1. For some reason this doesn't please me one bit.

If blood is letted from both sides, then a damaged candidate will emerge with easy talking points for Allen to pick up. Sigh. I wish Miller would be more positive, but I suppose he wasn't getting any publicity being Mr. Nice Guy, yet calling the other guy essentially racist doesn't strike me as being very civil. Sigh again. I become less and less happy about the Senate race here each day.

[WildEyedLiberal]

3. Allen can hardly use this attack against Webb, though

It'd be pretty hypocritical of him to attack Webb for not supporting affirmative action when he himself is violently opposed to it. The way I see it, attacking Webb for being conservative isn't going to matter at all, because if God forbid Webb wins the primary, Allen is going to want to try to pretend Webb is some kind of liberal, so whatever Miller throws at Webb will be ignored.

That all said, I don't live in VA so my opinion may be moot, but Webb seems less and less like an alternative to Allen and more and more like just a slightly-less-sucky Republican every day.

And of course, he's the DailyKos darling. DKos: The Proud Home of the Ideologically Hypocritical.

[fedupinBushcountry]

4. I don't see it that way

Wouldn't you want to know where he really stands on issues like this.

[beachmom]

6. You have a point about the less internet/blog savvy voters

I already know how bad Webb is, but this article will help Democrats who only read the newspaper and maybe only saw him giggling like a school girl on The Colbert Report. Maybe what I am really lamenting is the fact that Webb is in the race at all. Apparently, it was some blogger from the www.raisingkaine.com website who put together the DraftWebb website who is destroying this race. But what upsets me is to Independent or even Republican voters who might be persuaded that Allen is * part Deux and want to get away from that, they're looking at the Democratic primary as an out of control eggfight, and think they better just vote for Allen to be safe.

You're right about the dKos darling bit, WEL. What's good about that fact is Kos's abysmal track record supporting candidates :). DailyKos should be called a "liberal" site, the quotations being the key.

In a related topic, I went over to the Virginia forum yesterday to get more info about the House race in my district and there was a poster lamenting how he/she was still licking his wounds from the "Kerry supporters", and then put a crying face next to the post. So, ah, guys, what happened that you're making someone cry?

[WildEyedLiberal]

8. Oh, I think I know who you're referring to

And it's someone who can't stand being reminded of Webb's Swift Boat lies, and insists even that what Webb said was TRUE - ie, that Kerry accused all soldiers of being war criminals. Needless to say, you don't support Swift Boat lying scum on DU. So I don't particularly care to hear this poster whine when one of us brings up the HARD TRUTH about Webb.

[fedupinBushcountry]

9. Exactly

she does not want to hear anything negative about Webb. She asked me if I lived in Virginia, I said duh, yeah.

That is what happens when you jump on a bandwagon and don't know a damn thing about the candidate.

[beachmom]

10. Obviously, I can't say who it is, but I think I've seen the name before

But I thought you guys would be interested to see that the poster said nothing mean or derogatory about you. He/she just was, well, crying at the Virginia forum and getting a lot of sympathy. I'll probably just use the VA forum more for the House race, since I only want to use it for info purposes, not really for debate. There WERE Miller supporters over there but they were staying quiet. That is so weird about how these Webb supporters are now giving cred to the SBVT. I mean, with all the fractures in the left wing blogosphere, the one thing that united everyone, even the most flaming lefty freeper, was how disgusting those smears against John Kerry's wartime service were. Now, apparently, winning is more important than condemning such immoral campaign tactics.

[fedupinBushcountry]

11. I hate to say this

but it comes out so clear, it is the Deaniac syndrome. You can smear your opponent all you want but don't you dare talk down ours. The blame game comes easy for them.

[karynnj]

12. I suspected it was who it was - I am among the guilty ones

I think I got on her nerves by challanging her on the lies and on the fact that Webb endorsed and contributed to Allen, a very conservative Republican as recently as 2000. I haven't seen specifics on anything he is for or against. Apple pie and motherhood sound pretty similar for both parties. Then I questioned her infuriating insistence that only Edwards out of all the IWR voters really apologized. So, then her retort was "Don't bring up Webb" I also had difficulty with her comment that Kerry needed to learn oratory from someone like Edwards. (Who has said what that will be remembered 30 years later?)

I haven't posted anything on it for a week though.

By the way, WHAT ON EARTH IS CLARK THINKING?

[beachmom]

15. Thank you for mentioning Clark! But wasn't he also a Republican?

It is all very discouraging, when people who you like endorse somebody as horrible as Webb.

[karynnj]

17. In his case though he claimed to have voted both times for Clinton

and for Gore. There was tape of him praising W pre 911. I see no reason to question who he said he voted for. In 2004, I would have questioned the fact that he never ran for anything or publicly worked for anyone - and wanted to be President. After working in 2004 for Kerry and for local candidates since then, I would think it won't be an issue in 2008.

The veteran organization he is supporting is bipartisan.

[whometense]

16. I agree about Clark too.

Wondering the same thing.

The Virginia race gives me a really paranoid, creepy feeling. Webb especially - it's just that if the republicans entered a mole into the race that mole would look and talk a lot like Webb.

I know that probably sounds crazy, but it's like he's giving out two entirely different and contradictory messages at the same time. And who are they aimed at???

[MH1]

19. RaisingKaine blog

also posted some hit pieces on Kerry. On the first one I saw there, I posted a comment that there was no way I would support Kaine after seeing that. They replied that the blog wasn't affiliated with the official Kaine campaign. (So what?)

As soon as Kerry endorsed Kaine I commented on a current piece there (which I believe also bashed JK, iirc) that they'd better change their tune on Kerry now that he was raising money for them, and they said they would and appreciated his support.

But given that history it is not so surprising that the same people pulled a candidate into the VA Senate race who is (apparently) also an asshole who doesn't remotely appreciate what John Kerry has done for this country, and in any case is not above blatant lies to smear someone.

The affirmative action comment seems to fit right in with Webb's persona. If he actually said that - and if it wasn't taken out of context like Webb did to JK's 1971 testimony - then it isn't a smear, it's just a fact that people need to know. IMO.

[karynnj]

20. I agree that if these comments are not out of context

they are not smears. Nor were his comments on women in the military. These are also comments made relatively recently, not in his youth.

It is ironic to me that the Webb supporters whining about this see no problem with Webb smearing Kerry with distortions of what he said in 1971. Shouldn't their logic here, even if one assumed his distortions were true have rejected bashing Kerry on 33 year old comments.

[fedupinBushcountry]

2. Thanks ProSense

You know from the get go I have not liked Webb, and it wasn't just how he talked about Kerry , my gut feeling said this guy is not a Dem, and would do nothing for us in the Senate.

[ProSense]

5. I have the same feeling. n/t

[wisteria]

7. That has been my feeling all along. Although I am not from VA

and I didn't want to offend anyone with my feelings on this guy. The only think I think he is with us on is the war.

[karynnj]

13. which is true of Pat Buchanan too

at least he doesn't claim he's a Democrat.

[whometense]

18. oops

Should have read further before I posted: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=273&topic_id=79399&mesg_id=79421

I guess I'm not the only one.

[sandnsea]

14. That's a primary

Better to find out this stuff now then later. I think it would be good to have more discussion about how we've implemented jobs and education equality programs, but this guy goes a bit over the top with it. I mean we still send young males the message that they're the primary breadwinners, but we aren't acknowledging that we aren't giving them the same help to meet those obligations. On the other hand, it's hardly state-sponsored racism to make sure white males aren't overrepresented, that's just stupid. Sadly, this would appeal to an awful lot of white males in this country, white males who vote.